Explosion reported near Boston Marathon

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**BaronIveagh**

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/04/19/dzhokhar-tsarnaev-boston-bombing/2095953/

The surviving Boston bomb suspect has been identified as Dzhokhar A. Tsarnaev, 19, of Cambridge, Mass., a federal law enforcement official told USA TODAY.

Police have identified Tsarnaev's older brother, Tamerlan Tsarnaev, 26, as the other bombing suspect, killed during the manhunt at MIT.

The brothers had been living together on Norfolk Street in Cambridge. An uncle, Ruslan Tsarni of Montgomery Village, Md., told The Associated Press that the men lived together near Boston and have been in the United States for about a decade. They came from the Russian region near Chechnya, which has been plagued by an Islamic insurgency stemming from separatist wars.

Tsarnaev was a wrestler at the Cambridge Rindge and Latin School in Cambridge, Mass. He was named a Greater Boston League Winter All Star in 2011.

Cambridge Rindge and Latin School did not immediately respond to USA TODAY's phone calls. Many Boston-area schools were closed Friday.
None

This surveillance photo released via Twitter by the Boston Police shows the second Boston Marathon shooting suspect entering a convenience store.(Photo: AP)

In May of 2011, as a high school senior, Tsarnaev was awarded a $2,500 City Scholarship from the City of Cambridge to pursue higher education.

Before moving to the United States, he attended School No. 1 in Makhachkala, the capital of Dagestan, a predominantly Muslim republic in Russia's North Caucasus that has become an epicenter of the Islamic insurgency that spilled over from Chechnya.

His profile on the Russian social networking site Vkontakte says, he lists his languages as English, Russian and Nohchiyn Mott (a Chechen language). His world view is described as "Islam" and he says his personal goal is "career and money."

A "joke" posted on the profile page, translated from Russian, says: "There is a car... in the car sits a Dagestani, a Chechen and an Ingush. Question - who is driving? The answer: - The Police."

This is an old joke that has been told with a myriad of ethnic "passengers", meant to imply that if a certain ethnic person is in the car, the only reason would be because they had been arrested, says Andrea McCarren of WUSA-TV in Washington, D.C., who had the posts translated.

The father of the suspects in the Boston Marathon bombing claims that his son who is still on the loose is a smart and accomplished young man.

Anzor Tsarnaev spoke with The Associated Press by telephone from the Russian city of Makhachkala on Friday after police said one of his sons, Tamerlan, had been killed in a shootout and the other, Dzhokhar, was being intensely pursued.

"My son is a true angel," the elder Tsarnaev said. "Dzhokhar is a second-year medical student in the U.S. He is such an intelligent boy. We expected him to come on holidays here."

This really doesn't add up.

**kronk**

Older brother talked his younger brother into something insane?

**BaronIveagh**

kronk wrote:
Older brother talked his younger brother into something insane?

Eh... possible, but both really don't have any clear motive. What seems even stranger is that the older brother was killed by a combination of bullet wounds and shrapnel. If the story that they were throwing bombs at them from a car is true, that doesn't make sense.

Thn again we have Elvis Impersonators mailing the President ricin so... insanity reigns?

**Soladrin**

May have fumbled one of the explosives?

**kronk**

One report said he had an explosive on his body, which is why they believe the other suspect might also have a strapped-on explosive, as the police blotter said.

Maybe it was hit by a bullet and went off?

As for motive, people do dumb things for many reasons. I don't doubt that these gentlemen were picked on for being "different" their whole lives. The older brother dropped out of college to become a boxer, but that appears not to have worked for him. Mad at the world?

I don't know. I think we'll find out more if they catch the younger brother alive.

**whembly**

Ahtman wrote:
I don't think it would have been any better if it had been a non-religiously motivated reason. The same events occur either way, and the people doing it are still so far off the reservation that their views are pretty marginlized to begin with.

"I don't like taxes, so I killed people" is stupid.
"I don't believe in private ownership of the means of production so I killed people" is stupid.
"My god wants people to act the way I think he thinks he wants them to act so I killed people" is stupid.

It is all stupid.

Agreed...

Automatically Appended Next Post:

djones520 wrote:
BaronIveagh wrote:
djones520 wrote:

Which just goes to show how scary the brainwashing can be...

I'm gonna assume you're joking on this. Ten years is more than enough time for most brain washing to lose a lot of effectiveness. Or are you talking about the Russians brainwashing themselves to not care about human life, which I will agree, can be pretty scary on occasion.

I'm dead serious. You've got two people who were basically living the American dream, turned into stone cold mass murderers. They didn't just wake up one day and decide to do this. There were outside influences from somewhere.

The older brother was here for about 10 years... the younger was only here for about a year.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

BaronIveagh wrote:
kronk wrote:
Older brother talked his younger brother into something insane?

Thn again we have Elvis Impersonators mailing the President ricin so... insanity reigns?

Wasn't that debunked?

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Kilkrazy wrote:
How would the Immigration Bureau have been able to tell ten years ago that this particular guy was going to become a terrorist in ten year's time?

Considering he was about 10-12 years old at the time, he probably might have been 'turned' by experiences he received inside the US, in which case any prior method of detection would be useless.

I think the older brother was here for about ten years... that'd place him at age 16/17 when he immigrated. The younger brother was only here for a year.

**Dreadclaw69**

kronk wrote:
I don't know. I think we'll find out more if they catch the younger brother alive.

That may be a pretty big if given that they've shoot at Police and thrown explosives

**Kilkrazy**

How does that refute my point?

The guy was in the USA for 10 years. How was the IB suppose to know 10 years ago, that his younger brother would be able to persuade him to become a terrorist in 10 years time?

**whembly**

Kilkrazy wrote:
How does that refute my point?

The guy was in the USA for 10 years. How was the IB suppose to know 10 years ago, that his younger brother would be able to persuade him to become a terrorist in 10 years time?

It doesn't (at least I don't think it does).

Suspect 1 was 26 years old and immigrated 10 years ago or so...

Suspect 2 was the younger brother at 19 immigrated a year ago...

Because there's 10 year gap, this leads me to believe that this was planned long ago, rather than some rapid radicalization...

**djones520**

Something big is going down right now. Anyone hearing anything on the scanners?

Ambulences showed up, they've got the SWAT vehichles blocking off camera views, gunshots were heard.

**BaronIveagh**

whembly wrote:

It doesn't (at least I don't think it does).

Suspect 1 was 26 years old and immigrated 10 years ago or so...

Suspect 2 was the younger brother at 19 immigrated a year ago...

Because there's 10 year gap, this leads me to believe that this was planned long ago, rather than some rapid radicalization...

I'm gonna ask where you got the fact that suspect 2 came to the US in the last two years. Everything I'm reading has them coming to the US 10 years ago.

And I've seen some long term games, but waiting ten years in a plan to blow up the Boston Marathon seems unlikely to me, as it's an annual event.

**CptJake**

whembly wrote:
Kilkrazy wrote:
How does that refute my point?

The guy was in the USA for 10 years. How was the IB suppose to know 10 years ago, that his younger brother would be able to persuade him to become a terrorist in 10 years time?

It doesn't (at least I don't think it does).

Suspect 1 was 26 years old and immigrated 10 years ago or so...

Suspect 2 was the younger brother at 19 immigrated a year ago...

Because there's 10 year gap, this leads me to believe that this was planned long ago, rather than some rapid radicalization...

It probably wasn't planned 'long' ago (unless within the last year is a long time) and these kids probably did go through a radicalization process that did take a couple of years. What will be interesting is the support network (if it exists and I suspect it does). How much training did they get (and where)? Did they do the recon and mission planning? Who got them their weapons?

**whembly**

BaronIveagh wrote:
whembly wrote:

It doesn't (at least I don't think it does).

Suspect 1 was 26 years old and immigrated 10 years ago or so...

Suspect 2 was the younger brother at 19 immigrated a year ago...

Because there's 10 year gap, this leads me to believe that this was planned long ago, rather than some rapid radicalization...

I'm gonna ask where you got the fact that suspect 2 came to the US in the last two years. Everything I'm reading has them coming to the US 10 years ago.

And I've seen some long term games, but waiting ten years in a plan to blow up the Boston Marathon seems unlikely to me, as it's an annual event.

Multiple sources... but do take with grains of salt... all this is speculation.
EDIT: Here's a source:
http://livewire.wcvb.com/Event/117th_Running_of_Boston_Marathon

Automatically Appended Next Post:

CptJake wrote:
whembly wrote:
Kilkrazy wrote:
How does that refute my point?

The guy was in the USA for 10 years. How was the IB suppose to know 10 years ago, that his younger brother would be able to persuade him to become a terrorist in 10 years time?

It doesn't (at least I don't think it does).

Suspect 1 was 26 years old and immigrated 10 years ago or so...

Suspect 2 was the younger brother at 19 immigrated a year ago...

Because there's 10 year gap, this leads me to believe that this was planned long ago, rather than some rapid radicalization...

It probably wasn't planned 'long' ago (unless within the last year is a long time) and these kids probably did go through a radicalization process that did take a couple of years. What will be interesting is the support network (if it exists and I suspect it does). How much training did they get (and where)? Did they do the recon and mission planning? Who got them their weapons?

Don't you think it's possible that they've acted alone?

**djones520**

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/04/19/surviving-boston-marathon-bombing-suspect-hails-from-overseas-been-in-us-for/

Here's a source on the 1 year thing.

Correction: At least 1 year.

Edit 2: Their uncle said both came to the US about a decade ago.

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/04/19/bombing-suspects-uncle-says-hes-shocked/

**reds8n**

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2013/04/19/twitter-feed-for-fugitive-terrorist-authentic-or-a-cry-for-attention/

A little over two hours ago, someone opened a Twitter account for Dzhokhar A Tsarnaev, one of the two brothers still at large as of this writing and responsible for the Boston Marathon Bombing. The profile picture is of the fugitive but is cropped from a picture available online.

The last tweet is in Russian and is a translation of the previous tweet:

Boston Police Dept. ✔ @Boston_Police
#WANTED: Suspect identified as 19 year-old Dzhokhar Tsarnaev of Cambridge. Suspect considered armed & dangerous. pic.twitter.com/jFdHLGsrGc
Dzhokhar A. Tsarnaev @Dzhokhar_A

@Boston_Police I will kill you all as you killed my brother Tamerlan Tsarnaev #watertown one killed i think one injured;;;; gooooo hell
1:42 PM - 19 Apr 2013

The rest of the tweets are variations of “I will kill you.”

Right now, there are over four thousand following the account and Fox has labeled it as “internet intelligence.”

It seems unlikely that an angry and presumably panicked 19 year old being hunted by thousands of heavily armed men would take the time to tweet about it and is more likely a sad cry for attention.

.. Life gets more like "Kick Ass" every day.

.

**CptJake**

whembly wrote:

Don't you think it's possible that they've acted alone?

Possible yes. Probable no.

They got training somewhere. Some of the skills they have shown are hard to self teach. The level of radicalization they got to is indicative of outside influence. The resources they have displayed over he last 13 hours are another indicator of a support mechanism.

But, I do not know. It COULD have been just them. We'll see. I just know that the indicators being reported seem to show they were not completely alone in this.

**Kilkrazy**

It's not that hard. Me and a friend at school were making electrically detonated pipe bombs with fertilizer and sugar at the age of 12, in the early 1970s.

We just used basic physics and chemistry out of textbooks, no specialist knowledge or training at all.

I think by the age of 26 we might have graduated to timer or radio detonation if we hadn't stopped because it was illegal.

**BaronIveagh**

CptJake wrote:
whembly wrote:

Don't you think it's possible that they've acted alone?

Possible yes. Probable no.

They got training somewhere. Some of the skills they have shown are hard to self teach. The level of radicalization they got to is indicative of outside influence. The resources they have displayed over he last 13 hours are another indicator of a support mechanism.

But, I do not know. It COULD have been just them. We'll see. I just know that the indicators being reported seem to show they were not completely alone in this.

I disagree. People with training would have left town within an hour of the bombing, the devices were very poorly built, and only idiots get into extended car chases with the police.

**CptJake**

I'm not talking about just the bomb making though. You are right, and as I have pointed out Inspire has the 'recipe' for that type.

I am talking about the reports they used grenades against the cops. I am taking about the way they fought the one engagement where the one kid got capped. And other things.

**whembly**

CptJake wrote:
whembly wrote:

Don't you think it's possible that they've acted alone?

Possible yes. Probable no.

They got training somewhere. Some of the skills they have shown are hard to self teach. The level of radicalization they got to is indicative of outside influence. The resources they have displayed over he last 13 hours are another indicator of a support mechanism.

But, I do not know. It COULD have been just them. We'll see. I just know that the indicators being reported seem to show they were not completely alone in this.

Okay... fair enough.

fething hell... we need to show our appreciation for all the LEO, FBI, EMT, Docs, & Samanitarians... they're all fething heroes.

We need to setup a website somehow that accepts donations to be used to buy "rounds" for these folks at their favorite pubs/resturants.

**BaronIveagh**

CptJake wrote:
I'm not talking about just the bomb making though. You are right, and as I have pointed out Inspire has the 'recipe' for that type.

I am talking about the reports they used grenades against the cops. I am taking about the way they fought the one engagement where the one kid got capped. And other things.

That has not yet been confirmed, and it could just have easily been pipe bombs. Though I suspect before this is all over that we find out the cops were also using grenades, but that might just be my cynicism about anyone being taken alive in all this.

Point of fact it can be quite easy to teach those skills. The US Army has entire handbooks on it.

**CptJake**

BaronIveagh wrote:
CptJake wrote:
whembly wrote:

Don't you think it's possible that they've acted alone?

Possible yes. Probable no.

They got training somewhere. Some of the skills they have shown are hard to self teach. The level of radicalization they got to is indicative of outside influence. The resources they have displayed over he last 13 hours are another indicator of a support mechanism.

But, I do not know. It COULD have been just them. We'll see. I just know that the indicators being reported seem to show they were not completely alone in this.

I disagree. People with training would have left town within an hour of the bombing, the devices were very poorly built, and only idiots get into extended car chases with the police.

You assume they think like you and would unass the AO. Having more devices is indicative of wanting to carry out more attacks. Not going suicide is indicative of having more mission to carry out. Staying local to the area you know makes a lot of sense, (out bound travel was VERY tightly watched after the event) especially if you assume your support structure may help you (bad assumption, any support structure will go deep under ground).

But, what do I know.

**whembly**

CptJake wrote:
BaronIveagh wrote:
CptJake wrote:
whembly wrote:

Don't you think it's possible that they've acted alone?

Possible yes. Probable no.

They got training somewhere. Some of the skills they have shown are hard to self teach. The level of radicalization they got to is indicative of outside influence. The resources they have displayed over he last 13 hours are another indicator of a support mechanism.

But, I do not know. It COULD have been just them. We'll see. I just know that the indicators being reported seem to show they were not completely alone in this.

I disagree. People with training would have left town within an hour of the bombing, the devices were very poorly built, and only idiots get into extended car chases with the police.

You assume they think like you and would unass the AO. Having more devices is indicative of wanting to carry out more attacks. Not going suicide is indicative of having more mission to carry out. Staying local to the area you know makes a lot of sense, (out bound travel was VERY tightly watched after the event) especially if you assume your support structure may help you (bad assumption, any support structure will go deep under ground).

But, what do I know.

CptJake... where are you seeing they had grenades? And Baron... I'm sure the LEO can distinguish a grenade vs pipebomb....

**CptJake**

whembly wrote:
CptJake wrote:
BaronIveagh wrote:
CptJake wrote:
whembly wrote:

Don't you think it's possible that they've acted alone?

Possible yes. Probable no.

They got training somewhere. Some of the skills they have shown are hard to self teach. The level of radicalization they got to is indicative of outside influence. The resources they have displayed over he last 13 hours are another indicator of a support mechanism.

But, I do not know. It COULD have been just them. We'll see. I just know that the indicators being reported seem to show they were not completely alone in this.

I disagree. People with training would have left town within an hour of the bombing, the devices were very poorly built, and only idiots get into extended car chases with the police.

You assume they think like you and would unass the AO. Having more devices is indicative of wanting to carry out more attacks. Not going suicide is indicative of having more mission to carry out. Staying local to the area you know makes a lot of sense, (out bound travel was VERY tightly watched after the event) especially if you assume your support structure may help you (bad assumption, any support structure will go deep under ground).

But, what do I know.

CptJake... where are you seeing they had grenades? And Baron... I'm sure the LEO can distinguish a grenade vs pipebomb....

Scanner last night. And no, cops having anything thrown at them in the dark, especially if it goes BOOM may call the object grenades. We will find out the truth later.

But, again, the TTPs they followed from the original bombing through right now, and other things indicate to me a support structure of some type. Maybe limited. I maybe completely wrong (and actually hope I am), but I have a tiny bit of experience in this type of thing and I am calling it as understand it based on what we are hearing and seeing.

**Dreadclaw69**

whembly wrote:
fething hell... we need to show our appreciation for all the LEO, FBI, EMT, Docs, & Samanitarians... they're all fething heroes.

We need to setup a website somehow that accepts donations to be used to buy "rounds" for these folks at their favorite pubs/resturants.

Huge +1 on this

**BaronIveagh**

CptJake wrote:

You assume they think like you and would unass the AO. Having more devices is indicative of wanting to carry out more attacks. Not going suicide is indicative of having more mission to carry out. Staying local to the area you know makes a lot of sense, (out bound travel was VERY tightly watched after the event) especially if you assume your support structure may help you (bad assumption, any support structure will go deep under ground).

But, what do I know.

It's not actually that hard. (And within an hour the police would still have been setting up roadblocks. You really don't appreciate how large a metropolitan area like Boston is until you try to cordon it off.)

And so far I have not heard anything confirmed about additional devices.

I can say that people of my acquaintance have passed through police road blocks and check points by the simple expedient of stealing a news van and waving a press pass at the police officers. And they came up with that one on the spot rather than planned it.

This is how I would have done it:

Acquire fake ID, set up a safe house and two vehicles. Buy a hair cut kit and hair dye. Store my devices etc off site at a storage locker under an assumed name. Make me some RDX. Carry out the small bombs and then ambulance blast plan I outlined earlier. Exit scene and cut my hair, and shave. Use hair dye (in my case easy because I'm light brown haired). Put on an egragariously American Tshirt and jeans, drive away. Have papers in order if stopped. Cross into Canada, or drive to Mexico. Fly away. (OR, if i have other targets in mind: leave town until heat is off. Recover devices at storage locker after two months or so if they are not yet found and hit target.)

**CptJake**

We'll see. I stand by my analysis. So far I've been on the mark.

**KalashnikovMarine**

Dreadclaw69 wrote:
whembly wrote:
fething hell... we need to show our appreciation for all the LEO, FBI, EMT, Docs, & Samanitarians... they're all fething heroes.

We need to setup a website somehow that accepts donations to be used to buy "rounds" for these folks at their favorite pubs/resturants.

Huge +1 on this

Concur, especially for Boston cops, those boys like their beer.

**BaronIveagh**

CptJake wrote:
We'll see. I stand by my analysis. So far I've been on the mark.

It'd not a bad analysis, but you're jumping to conclusions much the way I was looking at it as most likely domestic. (though we don't yet know their actual motives, so it might still be domestic.)

**KalashnikovMarine**

So far my favorite theory is that this is a false flag operation initiated by Putin to unite the U.S. and Russia in common hatred of Jihadis.