Codex: Space Marines [First post updated 27-08-2013 - Leaked White Dwarf images added]

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**KTG17**

Man... that new Tactical Squad looks very blah for $40. Have to say they are taking a step backwards with them. Not crazy about the single old school Beakie either. I don't mind some relic parts incorporated with the new stuff, but that guy looks like he just stepped out of a time machine.

**Redcruisair**

Veteran Sergeant wrote:
Exergy wrote:
Veteran Sergeant wrote:
It's the reason why Space Marines have had the edge over Chaos for so long.

The ability to move through foliage without getting your horns caught on long hanging branches.

Loyalist advantage is that they have numerous well rounded choices in their codex that are all pretty good.

CSM get 1-2 extremely powerful/OP things and a bunch of crap.

GW wants to sell a lot of loyalist marines of all types and a ton of heldrakes but no mutialtors
Apparently the humor ran straight into the language barrier.

I’m sure he understood your jokes just fine. The problem here is us CSM players being stuck in a very deep and sorrowful depression, caused by the total blandness of our CSM codex.

The loyalist got all the good stuff and those of us, who have been forsaken, will see the galaxy burning for it..

**Exergy**

KTG17 wrote:
Man... that new Tactical Squad looks very blah for $40. Have to say they are taking a step backwards with them. Not crazy about the single old school Beakie either. I don't mind some relic parts incorporated with the new stuff, but that guy looks like he just stepped out of a time machine.

I want to see a Beakie Chaplin with a death mask. That would be a sight

**bigboss1o1**

Can someone please post a consolidated list of all the rumors please because for the past ten pages all Im getting are tidbits I would greatly appreciate it.

**mwnciboo**

Exergy wrote:
KTG17 wrote:
Man... that new Tactical Squad looks very blah for $40. Have to say they are taking a step backwards with them. Not crazy about the single old school Beakie either. I don't mind some relic parts incorporated with the new stuff, but that guy looks like he just stepped out of a time machine.

I want to see a Beakie Chaplin with a death mask. That would be a sight

Does this Qualify?

**xxvaderxx**

KTG17 wrote:
Man... that new Tactical Squad looks very blah for $40. Have to say they are taking a step backwards with them. Not crazy about the single old school Beakie either. I don't mind some relic parts incorporated with the new stuff, but that guy looks like he just stepped out of a time machine.

Do we know if they will still be 10 per box or if gw is aiming at breaking the Avengers price hike record of 100%?

**Redcruisair**

Google is your friend.

**Godless-Mimicry**

Redcruisair wrote:
Veteran Sergeant wrote:
Exergy wrote:
Veteran Sergeant wrote:
It's the reason why Space Marines have had the edge over Chaos for so long.

The ability to move through foliage without getting your horns caught on long hanging branches.

Loyalist advantage is that they have numerous well rounded choices in their codex that are all pretty good.

CSM get 1-2 extremely powerful/OP things and a bunch of crap.

GW wants to sell a lot of loyalist marines of all types and a ton of heldrakes but no mutialtors
Apparently the humor ran straight into the language barrier.
I’m sure he understood your jokes just fine. The problem here is us CSM players being stuck in a very deep and sorrowful depression, caused by the total blandness of our CSM codex.

The loyalist got all the good stuff and those of us, who have been forsaken, will see the galaxy burning for it..

It doesn't change the fact that this is a thread about Codex: Space Marines, not Codex: Chaos Space Marines, so take it somewhere else.

Also, it would be nice if those of you dissatisfied stopped lumping all CSM players together or using the silent majority card, because not everyone is so unhappy with it, particularly because some of us aren't hung up on the past, particularly about not getting rules that never actually existed (e.g. complaining about not being able to have all jump Night Lords, something that was never possible).

If you are dissatisfied with C: CSM, instead of hi-jacking unrelated threads to whine, do something productive, like write to GW with feedback, 'cause I'm sure ye must have better things to do with yer lives.

**Exergy**

mwnciboo wrote:
Exergy wrote:
KTG17 wrote:
Man... that new Tactical Squad looks very blah for $40. Have to say they are taking a step backwards with them. Not crazy about the single old school Beakie either. I don't mind some relic parts incorporated with the new stuff, but that guy looks like he just stepped out of a time machine.

I want to see a Beakie Chaplin with a death mask. That would be a sight

Does this Qualify?

so close

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Redcruisair wrote:

Google is your friend.

again close but not quite there

**mwnciboo**

Breotan wrote:
Ferrum_Sanguinis wrote:
Jeez, first the PS4, now Space Marines, and Nids apparently come right after! Looks like I might have to file for bankruptcy by the end of the year...
Try getting on the Kickstarter craze. That's when you start to consider selling blood to help pay rent.

Kickstarter is like Gambling on the Roulette wheel at a Casino against the house, where there is a 50% chance the Wheel won't even get spun. The Project failure rate is truly impressive and actually mirrors real business failure rates well....

**Redcruisair**

Exergy wrote:

Redcruisair wrote:

Google is your friend.

again close but not quite there

How is that not close enough? It's a bird skull death mask thingy.

Godless-Mimicry wrote:
It doesn't change the fact that this is a thread about Codex: Space Marines, not Codex: Chaos Space Marines, so take it somewhere else.

Also, it would be nice if those of you dissatisfied stopped lumping all CSM players together or using the silent majority card, because not everyone is so unhappy with it, particularly because some of us aren't hung up on the past, particularly about not getting rules that never actually existed (e.g. complaining about not being able to have all jump Night Lords, something that was never possible).

If you are dissatisfied with C: CSM, instead of hi-jacking unrelated threads to whine, do something productive, like write to GW with feedback, 'cause I'm sure ye must have better things to do with yer lives.

Eeh... I'm sorry?

**Pyriel-**

The ability to move through foliage without getting your horns caught on long hanging branches.

Chaos might get an advantage in tight tunnels though.

**Yodhrin**

lord_blackfang wrote:
Yodhrin wrote:
They realised that if they kept answering questions on Facebook, they wouldn't be able to hold their knowledge over people to force them to listen to their podcast, so they won't speak again until they upload that around the 1st. Hey, it's Romeo, what were you expecting?

Entitlement much (why am I even asking)?

They have the Codex, it's their choice how to use it. I think whoever leaked it to 40k Radio made a poor call if he wanted to get it out to the whole community, but what can you do.

Right, it's official; "entitlement" has joined "irregardless" and "could care less" on my list of Words and Phrases That Irritate the Piss Out of Me Because of Continual Misuse/Nonexistence. Expressing a negative opinion of the way something is being done, and speculating as to why it is being done that way, in no way implies they do not have the right to do it that way.

**Agamemnon2**

mwnciboo wrote:
Kickstarter is like Gambling on the Roulette wheel at a Casino against the house, where there is a 50% chance the Wheel won't even get spun. The Project failure rate is truly impressive and actually mirrors real business failure rates well....

The majority of the miniatures games campaigns that show up on Dakka actually get funded and produce products. Gates of Antares and Thon were the two major exceptions to this in not getting funded at all, and Kings of War in producing lackluster miniatures. Oh, and Avatars of War for taking ages to produce anything.

**Exergy**

Redcruisair wrote:
Exergy wrote:

Redcruisair wrote:

Google is your friend.

again close but not quite there
How is that not close enough? It's a bird skull death mask thingy.

I'm looking for one that is more like the rest of the 40k chaplins

JB

KTG17 wrote:
Man... that new Tactical Squad looks very blah for $40. Have to say they are taking a step backwards with them. Not crazy about the single old school Beakie either. I don't mind some relic parts incorporated with the new stuff, but that guy looks like he just stepped out of a time machine.

They are a nice improvement on the current box set and any of the recent starter set squads. Why do you consider them a step backwards?

Not sure what you don't like about the beakie. Is that not the classic MKVI armor?

If the rumors are correct, there should be more weapons on the frames. That plus the new poses will complement the existing boxed set so folks starting new marine armies should pick up a few of the current sets now before the new set is released.

I don't plan on using the new bare heads but they look fine.

**tomjoad**

I'm really looking forward to seeing how the sprues for the sternguard and tac squad shakes out. If I can get enough combi-weapons to turn the sterns into my sgts and enough special weapons out of the tac box to have option for all my tac squads, I'll be very very happy with these releases. Even if the options end up disappointing me, the minis look good and I'll definitely be adding some to my collection.

**BrassScorpion**

Right, it's official; "entitlement" has joined "irregardless" and "could care less" on my list of Words and Phrases That Irritate the Piss Out of Me Because of Continual Misuse/Nonexistence.

I'd add "definately" to that list, I see it on this forum and elsewhere all the time now. Definitely has the root word "finite" in it as do definite, indefinite, infinite, infinity, etc. There's no letter "a" in any of that. The middle syllable is a soft "i", not a "schwa" sound, so where's the problem?

Someone said the new Tactical Squad looks bland for $40. Really? It's the same great box set most Space Marine collectors have liked and enjoyed for years with a few new bits added and thankfully only a slight price hike from $37.25 to $40.00 US. Now about that Dire Avenger price increase earlier this year...

**FlingitNow**

I don't plan on using the new bare heads but they look fine.

Save up all the new bare headed Mohawk bits. Whack them on your scouts and bask in the nostalgia!!! Who's with me?

Automatically Appended Next Post:

BrassScorpion wrote:
Right, it's official; "entitlement" has joined "irregardless" and "could care less" on my list of Words and Phrases That Irritate the Piss Out of Me Because of Continual Misuse/Nonexistence.
I'd add "definately" to that list, I see it on this forum and elsewhere all the time now. Definitely has the root word "finite" in it as do definite, indefinite, infinite, infinity, etc. There's no letter "a" in any of that. The middle syllable is a soft "i", not a "schwa" sound, so where's the problem.

How about "then" which the internet seems to think means "than". Why? Just why?

**Brother SRM**

KTG17 wrote:
Man... that new Tactical Squad looks very blah for $40. Have to say they are taking a step backwards with them. Not crazy about the single old school Beakie either. I don't mind some relic parts incorporated with the new stuff, but that guy looks like he just stepped out of a time machine.

How are they a step backward? They look like the existing Marines with some cooler new details, but without the metric buttload of superfluous details that every other model gets these days.

**ClockworkZion**

From 40k Radio:

Q: Is it true that what you guys have is an early playtest material, not the actual printed C:SM codex?
A: I have the final print copy.

Q: Are their any new Special Characters?
A: No.

Q: Is honour guard still 3-10 models, or only available as 5 models similar to command squads or BA honour guard?
A: 3-10

Q: Is relic blade still S+2 AP3 two-handed?
A: Yes

Q: Do Legion of the Damned get Soulblaze like in Apoc?
A: No

Q: Can the LotD still Deep Strike?
A: Yes

Q: Does the LotD still have Slow and Purposeful?
A: Yes

Q: Can the LotD be joined by characters?
A: No

Q: Does Cassius have the Zealot rule?
A: Yes

Q: Do the AA tanks have an alternate fire mode that lets them shoot at ground targets?
A: No, only one firing mode

Q: Can child chapters take the SCs of their parent chapters?
A: No (those are unique to their chapter)

Q: Can Pedro and Lysander be in the same army without using allies?
A: No (CF is one chapter, IF is another)

Q: Are Techmarines slotless HQs like the DA book?
A: Yes

Q: Can Captains still take Artificer Armor?
A: Yes

Q: Do Sternguard combi-weapons still cost 5 points?
A: No, they're 10 points

Q: Does Helbrecht have any other special rules besides the once a game rule that gives fleet/hatred?
A: No

Q: What is the cost of a five man scout squad with a Vet Sergeant?
A: 65 Points

Q: Any changes on Kantor's rules?
A: Basically the same (will be covered on show)

Q: Do bikes and centurions get combat squads rule?
A: Bikes yes, Centurions no.

Q: Is there is any vehicle able to get grav weapons?
A: No

Q: Are neophytes of crusade squad an independent squad that can join the main unit as it was rumoured, or crusade squads are a full unit option?
A: No, like last BT Dex.

Q: Is there option for crusade squads of getting two special weapons?
A: No.

Q: If one crusader squads takes a CLR as transport, it has any point cost reduction?
A: I don't have the BT Dex to check.

Q: Have black templars access to biker scouts?
A: Yes. They have access to everything except Librarians.

Q: Marneus Calgar "God of War" rule is still in there? Has it been replaced by the 3 warlord traits rule?
A: It's different and cool (will be covered on the show).

Q: How many points cost a grav-gun as special weapon on a tac squad?
A: 15 points.

Q: How many points are the lascannon and missle launcher upgrades on the Centurion Devastators?
A: Lascannon is 10, Missile is 10

Q: How much do Relic Blades Cost?
A: Chapter Master and Captain get it for 25 points.

Q: Does the codex include a Power Field Generator (DA Wargear that generates a 4++ for a unit)?
A: No

Q: Can Tactical Marines take a Special Weapon at 5 models?
A: A Squad of 5 can have a special weapon or heavy weapon.

Q: Can Calgar still take up to 3 units of Honor Guard?
A: Yes

Q: Additionally, does his still have the rule that lets him choose to pass or fail morale checks at will?
A: Yes (more in the show)

Q: Are Black Templar Characters required and/or accept challenges?
A: Not required, but they will be sick in challenges

Q: Bikes squads that can be made troops, a minimum of 5 models or 5 models max? there is some conflicting sounding information so people just want to confirm.
A: At least 5 (max 9 with Attack Bike) and if your Captain or Chapter Master is on a bike you make take them as troops.

Q: So Chapter Masters on bikes can unlock bike squads of at least 5 models as troops too?
A: Yes.

Q: Do LotD still have their 3++ save?
A: Yes

Q: Can the Bikers take the grav gun options?
A: Yes

Q: Can Scout Squads take locator beacons or teleport homes?
A: Teleport Homers.

Q: Does Shrike have any other rules?
A: No.

Q: Do Chapter Tactics cost anything?
A: No.

Q: The Stalker, does it have 4 shots total that it can split fire with or does each gun fire 4 shots each?
A: 4 shots each (this will be covered on the show)

Q: Do any of the SC's have Stubborn or Fearless?
A: No

Q: Does the Emperor's Champion take up an HQ slot?
A: Yes

Q: Does Sicarius still re-roll his Sieze Initiative attempts?
A: No

Q: Any change to Razorbacks?
A: I believe they went up 5 points

Q: Does the Ultramarines Tactical Chapter Tactic affect Sternguard special ammo?
A: I believe so.

Q: Also, are bike upgrades for Space Marine Captains cheaper?
A: I think the upgrade stayed the same.

Q: Are normal bikes cheaper?
A: Yes

Q: Are all these answers from an early rendition or playtest and subject to change? Or are these concrete answers from a full codex?
A: The book I have looks like the final. If this is a fake then a ton of effort has gone into this.

**MajorWesJanson**

KTG17 wrote:
Man... that new Tactical Squad looks very blah for $40. Have to say they are taking a step backwards with them. Not crazy about the single old school Beakie either. I don't mind some relic parts incorporated with the new stuff, but that guy looks like he just stepped out of a time machine.

I'll take a $2.50 price hit in return for the added grav guns, proper Mk VIII with gorget and armored cables, much better variety of parts from various armor marks, and little touches like a shouldered bolter, a reloading bolter, and potentially a decent variety of options for the sergeant. And a Missile launcher with a proper backpack loader.

It's not as outright impressive as a new kit as the Vanguard and especially Sternguard vets, but compared to the previous $37.50 Tac squad box, sculpted in 1998 and recut in 2004, it is light years ahead.

And being a new kit means mold lines ought to be cut way back- the Tac marine mold is getting old.

**Nosebiter**

Jeez, talk about limiting what SC's you can take. So if i want Kantor i HAVE to use crimson fists? Not even imperial fists? And diy chapters get nada SC's?

**Lobokai**

Nosebiter wrote:
Jeez, talk about limiting what SC's you can take. So if i want Kantor i HAVE to use crimson fists? Not even imperial fists? And diy chapters get nada SC's?

EDIT: Nevermind... makes sense though, I'm fine with it (I use both CF and IF).

**ClockworkZion**

Lobukia wrote:
Nosebiter wrote:
Jeez, talk about limiting what SC's you can take. So if i want Kantor i HAVE to use crimson fists? Not even imperial fists? And diy chapters get nada SC's?

No, I think its the first founding chapters you choose from (might be wrong)... so Pedro would be IF... or am I the one who's off?

It looks like you can't use SCs who don't explicitly belong to your chapter...though I AM asking about count-as to see if there is any wiggle room on that.

**tomjoad**

Obviously you can counts-as. Not being able to counts-as the SCs would be insane and only jerks would try to enforce such a rule. I've noticed some confusing wording in some of 40K radio's answers, and I don't know what they actually meant by this, but I'm positive it'll be cleared up.

**MajorWesJanson**

ClockworkZion wrote:
Lobukia wrote:
Nosebiter wrote:
Jeez, talk about limiting what SC's you can take. So if i want Kantor i HAVE to use crimson fists? Not even imperial fists? And diy chapters get nada SC's?

No, I think its the first founding chapters you choose from (might be wrong)... so Pedro would be IF... or am I the one who's off?

It looks like you can't use SCs who don't explicitly belong to your chapter...though I AM asking about count-as to see if there is any wiggle room on that.

It means you can only use characters that match the chapter trait, and apparently Pedro has Chapter Trait: Crimson Fists (see Imperial Fists trait for rules)

**Ferrum_Sanguinis**

Damn, so now sternguards with combi-weapons are now 2 points more, sucks...

**MajorWesJanson**

Ferrum_Sanguinis wrote:
Damn, so now sternguards with combi-weapons are now 2 points more, sucks...

Yeah, kind of annoying, but since I only ran 4-5 combi weapons in a full squad, I come out about even. People who ran 10 combis in a 10 man squad may be suffering a tad though. Especially now that you can fit Pedro in a pod with them anymore.

**ClockworkZion**

tomjoad wrote:
Obviously you can counts-as. Not being able to counts-as the SCs would be insane and only jerks would try to enforce such a rule. I've noticed some confusing wording in some of 40K radio's answers, and I don't know what they actually meant by this, but I'm positive it'll be cleared up.

Homebrew count-as sure, I mean Count-As in other armies. Like a Count-As Vulkan in an Iron Hands army.

MajorWesJanson wrote:
ClockworkZion wrote:
Lobukia wrote:
Nosebiter wrote:
Jeez, talk about limiting what SC's you can take. So if i want Kantor i HAVE to use crimson fists? Not even imperial fists? And diy chapters get nada SC's?

No, I think its the first founding chapters you choose from (might be wrong)... so Pedro would be IF... or am I the one who's off?

It looks like you can't use SCs who don't explicitly belong to your chapter...though I AM asking about count-as to see if there is any wiggle room on that.

It means you can only use characters that match the chapter trait, and apparently Pedro has Chapter Trait: Crimson Fists (see Imperial Fists trait for rules)

Possibly. We might be stuck waiting until their 1 Sept show to know more.