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There are two things that are destroying the hobby.
1) the community
2) GW's policies


The community is wrecking the hobby mostly by wrecking the tournament scene and by wrecking the independent retailers. This is true. Without independent retailers, there will be no place for people to play at. Yet people want to buy off of ebay and give a big "f$$$ you" to the independent retailers. They do not realize the consequences of their actions. Now also, by wrecking the tournament system with bad behavior, they ruin the only other way to get in games.

There was a big tournament out west recently that did very bad, because of this and other factors. Check it out at http://www.theback40k.blogspot.com/2013/07/gw-financials-2013-first-five-pages.html.


Now there are other factors. GW's policies seem to be intent on blowing everything to pieces, such as when they released 8th edition fantasy and 6th edition 40K.


What are your thoughts on the subject? Does anyone consider this to be a good time in the hobby? Who else feels that the end times for the hobby are coming soon?

I think this is a great time for 40k. They are releasing bigger, better and more detailed models (well, some are better at least) and updating rules even faster than before. Sure ebay may be taking some sales away from retailers, but there are still ALOT of people that buy at the FLGS.

Maybe GW stores will be hit more by the ebay trend than an average gaming or hobby store, but these gaming stores will still hold places to play.

Your link didnt go to a relevant blog, but I remember looking at some of their financial reports elsewhere, and it was standard business. Maybe a little stagnant but still very much alive and in the positive.

I would not say the hobby is getting "wrecked" or "destroyed".

I think a more balanced viewpoint is that there are many other competitive "tabletop miniature games" that are very good.

GW had little or no competition in the past so in this environment their market-share has shrunk.

GW has set their pricing and cut back some of the more immersive experiences so what set them apart from other competitors is gone.

Heck of a way to make a splash for the first post, this has been beaten to death. Good thing is my response is more thoughtful now.

Rather trolling in statements. Look at the other plentiful posts.

If the GW hobby does die eventually: no one will notice because they moved on.

<<edit>> At the moment, I am happy. I get pickup games and have friends that play it. GW is run by management that requires large short term gains so their market is shrinking due to these decisions: it is their choice. I have the choice of picking up a few new SM models so them and I benefit.

Oh boy. Someone else who confuses 'the hobby' of wargaming and GW's little section of that.

People would feel less 'forced' to buy from online retailers if the prices weren't this high to begin with.
I don't buy online because I want to save a few euro on my purchase.
I buy online because even those online prices are ridiculous enough!

Example:
Last week I was thinking about buying a Whirlwind for my BA-army; it is a nice model and it seems fun to try it out.
On the website (and thus in real shops) it's €47 (that is almost 63 USD).
If that model was reasonably priced I would have no problem with buying it in a store I play in, even IF some online retailer had a discount.

Look, almost everyone has some gripe with the way GW is currently running th business. A lot of it is understandable and justifiable. I do feel that soon some changes will need to be made and eyes opened at GW, but that being said, despite our complaints the majority of us continue to buy from GW.

I buy a lot of my stuff from eBay, and I support my FLGS in other ways. They dont stock much GW stuff, but I buy terrain at the FLGS and play there once a week, which I pay for. I dont mind because I get the space, board, scenery and club to play at, so a small fee is ok with me.

As for Tournament behaviour, I havent been to any so I cant comment.

The business is doing very well (at these prices it bloody better be!) and the new releases are more frequent and generally good. the last few codexes are solid and fairly well balanced. Most of the new kits look good (except the new SM Centurions, the look utterly gak, imo)

Your post is a little accusatory of people not supporting their FLGS, and thats not really fair.

I wouldn't say "end times" and "soon" - it feels more like a slow death. And although the community bears part of the blame, I see the main fault with GW. Not because of their policies, but because of their pricing.

Any game requires regular infusions with fresh blood, meaning new players, some of whom eventually develop into new authors and game designers themselves. Yet the ongoing price creep makes it not only hard for existing fans to keep up with or expand the hobby, but even harder for new players to convince themselves and/or their parents to spend such a large amount of money for such a small amount of gaming pieces.

Added to a general decline in tabletop gaming (P&P suffers from this as well) due to virtual media becoming ever more attractive to young audiences as well as a rise in competing wargames that add more options with potentially lower prices, it just seems like exactly the wrong strategy.

It's as if GW noticed lower sales and, instead of making the hobby more attractive, decided to compensate with just raising their prices. Short term, this might make investors feel more confident about the company. Long term, it leads to this.

The pricing issue is connected to the death of independent retailers, too. If the minis cost that much that, when buying an army, even a discount of 3-5% lets you save several hundred bucks, you'd have to be either insane or just filthy rich to still buy at a local store. Not to mention the offers you can get on e-bay, or a swap shop such as dakka has.

Although there will always be people who go for the lowest price no matter what, more reasonable pricing could at least lower the gap between the offers and make local retailers more attractive for people who are on the fence about it because they'd like to go there, but simply cannot reconcile this with their conscience - not in the current economy, at least.

Not to mention that sometimes you don't even have the option to buy from anywhere but ebay ... try getting the current legal rules for Sisters of Battle from GW, or the Banner Bearer mini, I dare ya.

And I don't even think that this is some sort of malice on GW's part, just ... weird, short-sighted business decisions that make them look like they got their financial advisors from the banking sector.

I think everything is fine for the most part.

The community ruining the hobby argument is really dependent on your local gaming scene. I drop in on several GWs in my area (4) and each has people regularly buying directly from GW and engaging in games/painting.

For those who do buy online, I bet they do alternate between in store purchases as well. It really doesn't matter if people buy online either as the vast majority of buyers play within their own private clubs or a friend's house. I'd bet only a tiny percentage of 40k players actually drop into their local store for a game.

Moving on to GW's policies.... you can analyze their strategies all you want. The truth is none of us have the inside story. We can spend hours sifting through the financial reports, but we still are missing the market information and consumer data - we can only speculate. I think GW is doing a good job as the company is still alive and remains on top.

It isn't hard to look at GW with our basement MBA's and go oh they should cut prices by 20% - people would buy more. Or GW should give us the release schedule for the next 2 years so that when they make a schedule change we can all whine that our army isn't getting updated in July like they said it would.

It is extremely difficult being the company with the largest share of a given market -> there is hardly anything to gain and almost everything to lose to the little risk taking companies out there.

GW is fine, the hobby is fine, my paints paint, my glue glues, my Tau shoot stuff.

I wouldn't be quite so optimistic as to say it's a golden age, but it seems pretty damn close. I think the overall community is decidedly toxic and stupidly negative, and GW makes a fair share of boneheaded moves, but 40k is in a healthy place from a playing perspective, I've found a group I love gaming with, and while not every new release and model has been great, they've generally been pretty solid.

So yeah, we're good.

We are doing better than we have in quite awhile. I would not say that we are at a Golden Age yet but given some time we might be there. Better things are coming out, armies are being revamped, 6th edition was not just a giant bandaid fix to the game. As far as community goes. You will always see the donkey-caves before you see the good people, and if you look hard enough you will find more than one decent group of players in your area.

Honestly its about the same now as it has been for ~5 years now. The "high point" of the game was mid-early 5th (about BA) for my area. We used to see 55 people in tourneys. Now we only see 30-45, but recently we have seen an influx of new people at the LGS. No "golden age" but its not like we are searching for people to play. I have been regularly teaching newer players and its been a good time.

Flying Toaster wrote:
We are doing better than we have in quite awhile. I would not say that we are at a Golden Age yet but given some time we might be there. Better things are coming out, armies are being revamped, 6th edition was not just a giant bandaid fix to the game. As far as community goes. You will always see the donkey-caves before you see the good people, and if you look hard enough you will find more than one decent group of players in your area.

Hello flying toaster,


But what would one say to the charge of band wagoning? GW seems to be invalidating every new book with the next new book in an attempt to encourage people to buy a new army in order to gain unfair advantage on the table top? What would one say to that?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 gossipmeng wrote:
I think everything is fine for the most part.

The community ruining the hobby argument is really dependent on your local gaming scene. I drop in on several GWs in my area (4) and each has people regularly buying directly from GW and engaging in games/painting.

For those who do buy online, I bet they do alternate between in store purchases as well. It really doesn't matter if people buy online either as the vast majority of buyers play within their own private clubs or a friend's house. I'd bet only a tiny percentage of 40k players actually drop into their local store for a game.

Moving on to GW's policies.... you can analyze their strategies all you want. The truth is none of us have the inside story. We can spend hours sifting through the financial reports, but we still are missing the market information and consumer data - we can only speculate. I think GW is doing a good job as the company is still alive and remains on top.

It isn't hard to look at GW with our basement MBA's and go oh they should cut prices by 20% - people would buy more. Or GW should give us the release schedule for the next 2 years so that when they make a schedule change we can all whine that our army isn't getting updated in July like they said it would.

It is extremely difficult being the company with the largest share of a given market -> there is hardly anything to gain and almost everything to lose to the little risk taking companies out there.

GW is fine, the hobby is fine, my paints paint, my glue glues, my Tau shoot stuff.

Hello dude,

So what if we carry that arguement a little further. Are independent retailers necessary? If they are not, then do people seriously want a garage or spare room to be the best place that they can play in? Yes, there are indy GT's but those do not happen every week. What should people do if they play a lot but want somewhere nice to play. and the thing about playing at someones house is that you have to be invited where at a store, if someone does not like you, you can still show up.

No, tabletop wargaming isn't on its way out. If anything I'd say it's in better health than ever.

However, you could end up believing it's all doom and gloom if you spend time online, where the typical reaction to anything one dislikes or thinks is "wrong" is to run around like the sky's falling and generally act in a way that no right-thinking adult would dream of behaving like in real life.

 Fezman wrote:
No, tabletop wargaming isn't on its way out. If anything I'd say it's in better health than ever.

However, you could end up believing it's all doom and gloom if you spend time online, where the typical reaction to anything one dislikes or thinks is "wrong" is to run around like the sky's falling and generally act in a way that no right-thinking adult would dream of behaving like in real life.

To fezman,

Good point. However, would you not credit the doubters with at least some truth? Or do you truly believe that there is absolutely nothing to worry about and everything is okay?

Baneblade10000 wrote:

 gossipmeng wrote:
....

The community ruining the hobby argument is really dependent on your local gaming scene. I drop in on several GWs in my area (4) and each has people regularly buying directly from GW and engaging in games/painting.

For those who do buy online, I bet they do alternate between in store purchases as well. It really doesn't matter if people buy online either as the vast majority of buyers play within their own private clubs or a friend's house. I'd bet only a tiny percentage of 40k players actually drop into their local store for a game.
....

Hello dude,

So what if we carry that argument a little further. Are independent retailers necessary? If they are not, then do people seriously want a garage or spare room to be the best place that they can play in? Yes, there are indy GT's but those do not happen every week. What should people do if they play a lot but want somewhere nice to play. and the thing about playing at someone's house is that you have to be invited where at a store, if someone does not like you, you can still show up.

In other countries around the world, we do not have stores as our first option. Store space is horribly expensive, and we're lucky to get a store with more than 1 table for gaming.
So, playing at clubs is normal, and at home has always been an option, if not just the way more people start gaming.

As for gaming in general, there are more games out there than ever before. There are more choices in Models, and if you read up on the impact of the GW Vs Chapterhouse court case, we're likely to see more.
The only problem I see is that too much choice often means too many players who cannot find an opponent for their choice of game.

Baneblade10000 wrote:

Flying Toaster wrote:
We are doing better than we have in quite awhile. I would not say that we are at a Golden Age yet but given some time we might be there. Better things are coming out, armies are being revamped, 6th edition was not just a giant bandaid fix to the game. As far as community goes. You will always see the donkey-caves before you see the good people, and if you look hard enough you will find more than one decent group of players in your area.

Hello flying toaster,


But what would one say to the charge of band wagoning? GW seems to be invalidating every new book with the next new book in an attempt to encourage people to buy a new army in order to gain unfair advantage on the table top? What would one say to that?

Very fair argument. For me personally I have never viewed Warhammer 40k to be a tournament based game. I feel it is more of a laid back hobby focused on models that just happen to have fluff and rules to play with. This so called power creep isn't something that I focus on. I do believe the sixth edition books are trying to even the playing field and when each new one comes out it looks to be more powerful then the past edition army rules because the current Codex(s) (however it is said in plural form) are made for 6th edition. I think there is less power creep in this edition then there has been in the previous editions so that leads me to believe GW is aware of this as a problem and is trying to fix it.

Baneblade10000 wrote:

 Fezman wrote:
No, tabletop wargaming isn't on its way out. If anything I'd say it's in better health than ever.

However, you could end up believing it's all doom and gloom if you spend time online, where the typical reaction to anything one dislikes or thinks is "wrong" is to run around like the sky's falling and generally act in a way that no right-thinking adult would dream of behaving like in real life.

To fezman,

Good point. However, would you not credit the doubters with at least some truth? Or do you truly believe that there is absolutely nothing to worry about and everything is okay?

Well, I know that a lot of stuff to do with our hobby is subjective, from whether you like a new kit to whether it's worth putting certain units in your list. So even when I completely disagree with other people on these matters I can at least respect their opinion.

An example would be the Space Marines thread in News and Rumours. Seems like most people there don't like the new Centurions. Now I don't mind them, so that doesn't matter to me. What I'm disappointed to see is that hardly anyone's speculating on other stuff like rules, or looking forward to the other kits (which in fairness sound like they're going to be pretty good for the most part), or even mentioning things that a lot of people will be happy to see like the return of Black Templars. I know there's more chance of discussion when we actually have solid material to discuss, like the pictures of the Centurions, but the page after page of negativity is a bit wearing. At the end of the day I think it's often seen as more fun to pick holes in something.

That said, I agree with you that there are some trends I dislike. For example, with GW, having to pay more money for fewer models with every release and the idea they seem to have that bigger is better.

So my answer is: it depends.

I would very much love to see how many players truly play at a competitive level. One thing I've noticed over the years is that players love list building and creating spam lists - on "paper".

These internet spam lists then create all then negativity and moaning that follows. I find it very hard to believe that many of these players have the models or budget necessary to even make half these lists.

Sure some people have massive collections and can swap out units and wargear at will or they have a substantial hobby budget. However, I'd say only 1 in 10 players actually builds those lists. The players I've encountered couldn't be bothered to buy and build 3 riptides, helldrakes, etc...

There are some of us who attend tournaments and these lists will actually show up in great numbers because "its serious business" all of a sudden. Realistically most players will play many more casual games than in a tournament. Warhammer is geared towards a group of friends throwing around some dice with their favourite miniatures and seeing how the battle unfolds. It is not designed to have two WAAC players try to break the limits in order to win a tournament.

If you want GW to balance the game for a competitive setting, they would need to cut some races, remove much of the flavour that differentiates armies and probably simplify the rules. The term competitive is 100% relative to your own gaming scene. You could bring a "trash" army and have it be "competitive" if your opponent's list is sporting similar power levels.

Believe it or not 40k on a competitive level is only a small % of the hobby. It is hardly reasonable to judge to current state of 40k as a hobby based on tournaments.

 gossipmeng wrote:
I would very much love to see how many players truly play at a competitive level. One thing I've noticed over the years is that players love list building and creating spam lists - on "paper".

These internet spam lists then create all then negativity and moaning that follows. I find it very hard to believe that many of these players have the models or budget necessary to even make half these lists.

Sure some people have massive collections and can swap out units and wargear at will or they have a substantial hobby budget. However, I'd say only 1 in 10 players actually builds those lists. The players I've encountered couldn't be bothered to buy and build 3 riptides, helldrakes, etc...

There are some of us who attend tournaments and these lists will actually show up in great numbers because "its serious business" all of a sudden. Realistically most players will play many more casual games than in a tournament. Warhammer is geared towards a group of friends throwing around some dice with their favourite miniatures and seeing how the battle unfolds. It is not designed to have two WAAC players try to break the limits in order to win a tournament.

If you want GW to balance the game for a competitive setting, they would need to cut some races, remove much of the flavour that differentiates armies and probably simplify the rules. The term competitive is 100% relative to your own gaming scene. You could bring a "trash" army and have it be "competitive" if your opponent's list is sporting similar power levels.

Believe it or not 40k on a competitive level is only a small % of the hobby. It is hardly reasonable to judge to current state of 40k as a hobby based on tournaments.

I agree with you. Proxing is a very stupid aspect to our hobby and the "competetive" people engage in it more then others do. Like seriously, buying 3 riptides just to win a few games is very lame.

I think that warhammer is also designed for fun play, not tournaments. that seems to be where things are going. the rules are so badly written, that it is not possible to play with them in a tournament without a lot of abuse.

Baneblade10000 wrote:
There are two things that are destroying the hobby.
1) The community is wrecking the hobby mostly by wrecking the tournament scene and by wrecking the independent retailers. This is true. Without independent retailers, there will be no place for people to play at. Yet people want to buy off of ebay and give a big "f$$$ you" to the independent retailers. They do not realize the consequences of their actions.

People have been decrying the end of brick and mortar stores since ebay and online store discounters hit the scene in the 90s. The simple fact is that most game stores go out of business because they are run by gamers and not business people and not because people are buying minis online for cheaply. My FLGS makes more each month selling sodas and snacks in his store than he does selling Flames of War minis, heck even more than minis sold for the big 3 games that happen in the store regularly. Those of us who play in the store regularly buy plenty of product, but he still sells many more snacks and sodas. Magic the Gathering is what brings in the lion's share of the store's income. Mini gaming barely shows on his monthly income pie charts and that is with the majority of those playing games in the store buying all of their minis for those games there. So you can stop panicking about that. It hasn't happened yet. In fact my FLGS doesn't want to sell me GW products. He doesn't want to carry them because they barely sell these days. So he has to get them from a middle distributor which cuts into his profit margin and means that any newly released items will not get to his customers until multiple weeks after the release. So my buying any 40k stuff these days from the Warstore has ZERO impact on his business model at all because GW game sales are not in his business model. He still has a Dark Vengance box and a Limited Edition Hobbit box on the shelf that have both been there since their release and haven't been touched.

Skriker

Don't you think though that if people stopped buying from ebay completely, only bought from independent retailers, that would make a difference?


I think one of the problems is that warhammer is a small hobby and it is not a hobby that can support stores in small towns.

Baneblade10000 wrote:
Don't you think though that if people stopped buying from ebay completely, only bought from independent retailers, that would make a difference?


I think one of the problems is that warhammer is a small hobby and it is not a hobby that can support stores in small towns.

If people stopped buying from Ebay that would have little impact on the amount of people buying from their local stores. I can just as easily purchase models directly from Forge World and Games Workshop from my computer than having to deal with a local store that might or might not get the order in a timely manner.

I think we are in the midst of an ongoing golden age for table top miniatures gaming. There are so many options these days and many of them are of very high quality. GW is making itself increasingly irrelevant to this hobby generally. At most, GW continues to be most people's first brush with scifantasy war gaming. If that remains the case going forward, I think it will be because of GW's licensed video games and BL novels rather than Citadel miniatures. If GW went under completely, I don't think the hobby would be crippled. It would be a hard blow to brick and mortar stores, however.

Baneblade10000 wrote:
There are two things that are destroying the hobby.
1) The community is wrecking the hobby mostly by wrecking the tournament scene and by wrecking the independent retailers. This is true. Without independent retailers, there will be no place for people to play at. Yet people want to buy off of ebay and give a big "f$$$ you" to the independent retailers. They do not realize the consequences of their actions.

People have been decrying the end of brick and mortar stores since ebay and online store discounters hit the scene in the 90s. The simple fact is that most game stores go out of business because they are run by gamers and not business people and not because people are buying minis online for cheaply. My FLGS makes more each month selling sodas and snacks in his store than he does selling Flames of War minis, heck even more than minis sold for the big 3 games that happen in the store regularly. Those of us who play in the store regularly buy plenty of product, but he still sells many more snacks and sodas. Magic the Gathering is what brings in the lion's share of the store's income. Mini gaming barely shows on his monthly income pie charts and that is with the majority of those playing games in the store buying all of their minis for those games there. So you can stop panicking about that. It hasn't happened yet. In fact my FLGS doesn't want to sell me GW products. He doesn't want to carry them because they barely sell these days. So he has to get them from a middle distributor which cuts into his profit margin and means that any newly released items will not get to his customers until multiple weeks after the release. So my buying any 40k stuff these days from the Warstore has ZERO impact on his business model at all because GW game sales are not in his business model. He still has a Dark Vengance box and a Limited Edition Hobbit box on the shelf that have both been there since their release and haven't been touched.

Edited: One final thought, your FLGS is not only in competition with online retailers selling similar products at a discount. They are in direct competition with any business that is seeking to part you from the disposable leisure part of your income. That 160gb iPod classic I buy is $300 or so I am not spending at my FLGS. Should I not make that purchase so that my FLGS doesn't fail? Should I not buy any books from the book store down the block so that my FLGS doesn't fail? Such an approach is just not even remotely feasible to maintain or follow through on in the least, so it is silly to point at and blame on-line retailers as the only threat to an FLGS. If they are smart the store owner will do what they need to do to make their store successful. That involves giving customers reasons to be there and reasons to buy product from them. It does not involve figuring out how to make every other business that relies on leisure dollars in the area go out of business so that they can have all the monies. It involves giving people a reason to be in the store, to buy higher mark up items like snacks and sodas while they spend all their time in the store. It also involves being sure to offer plenty of events for those games that do help support the store financially, while at the same time giving those who play games which don't bring in as much a place to play too.

Oops quoted instead of edited...hehehe...

Skriker

Baneblade10000 wrote:
Don't you think though that if people stopped buying from ebay completely, only bought from independent retailers, that would make a difference?
I think one of the problems is that warhammer is a small hobby and it is not a hobby that can support stores in small towns.

Stop buying from ebay? Or say kijiji? Kinda a straw-man argument for something that has no reason to stop.
It is a tool for getting what you want and someone who may not want their models to off-load them.
What is the incentive?

I do like to support my local stores.
That said, they are not exclusively getting it all, no supplier does.
They would be foolish to have 40k as the main money maker (Magic the gathering is the #1 bread winner in the closest large town).
No one hobby can support a store, the varying tastes of it's patrons decide what is the money maker.
My local hobby store (in a small town) has: remote control cars/boats and planes, trains, rockets, models, hobby supplies and no tabletop games.
He just expanded.

What is the purpose of this? How to make the local store thrive? Go ask them. Demo a game there. Buy stuff and hang out.

I understand why people who play at LGS want to support them. What I don't get is why those folks demand that the rest of us support LGS. My experience of LGS is that they can't take the risk of carrying anything but "entry level" stock. So it strikes me that the LGS is great for people just getting started in 40k or maybe WM/H, folks who want to get the basic product and meet people to play, but not so great for everyone else.

Baneblade10000 wrote:
Don't you think though that if people stopped buying from ebay completely, only bought from independent retailers, that would make a difference?


I think one of the problems is that warhammer is a small hobby and it is not a hobby that can support stores in small towns.

People won't stop buying from ebay completely, so it is pointless speculation. Some people don't even have a "local" game store to go to either. The key is for retailers to get what money they can from customers. For my FLGS it is snacks and drinks. Play all you want, bring whatever minis you want, but as long as you are snacking and drinking while in the store he is making money off of you anyway. Besides as my original post said people have been crying the death knell for brick and mortar stores since the mid 90s and there are still plenty out there alive and kicking and not panicking about ebay or online sales.

Skriker

Not even slightly.

In the totality of "nerd hobbies", war-gaming is a very small slice of the pie. You will find far more people willing to spend $50 a book on a given RPG (like Pathfinder, D&D, Dark Heresy, whatever) than you will find people willing to spend $50 on a Codex and then $700 on miniatures to build an army. Even the cheaper wargames don't attract the numbers that a dice-and-paper game does.

This is, I think, caused by a mix of factors. One of them is certainly the costs involved. For almost any RPG, I can buy, at worst, 3 core books (for sake of argument, I will use the D&D titles for these books... that would be the Player's Handbook, the Dungeon Master's Guide and the Monstrous Manual) and a set of dice. I've spent less than $200 and I can now play this game forever. I have everything I *need* to play this game until the day I drop dead (or decide to upgrade to a new edition). Three core books seems to be the norm for RPGs, though the forms and exact titles of these books might vary (for Dark Heresy, a 40K RPG, I would say these 3 books are Dark Heresy core rulebook, the Inquisitor's Handbook and Ascension).

The second factor is time. Once I have the books in my possession, me and a group of friends can sit down for an afternoon, walk through character creation, run a few test combats, a few test RP Interaction scenes, and pretty much get a good handle on how the game-system works and how the game runs. With 40K? This is a game with a *steep* learning curve, and you will be playing quite a long time before you can said to be "good" at it.

Lastly? There are other, better wargames for competitive, tournament play, with stronger internal balance, units that are better-balanced against other units in other armies, and more streamlined rules. 40K tournaments are generally either house-ruled into compliance (and to establish some sort of fair chance for most) or (depending on edition) feature armies that are decidedly superior to forty percent of any of the other options available (at least), and so the winner is declared more by luck of the dice against an opponent playing a near-identical army.

You guys should read the financial statement I liinked to at the start of the post. GW is sinking fast.

GW is one company in the hobby. If they go under? The hobby itself is not lost. Someone will buy the IP, and 40K products will continue to ship to stores.