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I've noticed that several people complain that the wolves don't have any flyers. I believe there is a fluff agreeing reason for this. It is the same reason wolf guard terminators can't deepstrike and being a skyclaw isn't really a reward. Russ fought on foot it was good enough for him its good enough for them. If they took to fighting in the skies, when Russ returns it would not be the right situation for him to fight.

It more likely because its a dex the predates flyers, I cant see GW missing a chance to make a wolf fighter or wolf bomber when the dex is redone.

Of course if you look at any piece of SW fluff they're depicted using Thunderhawks and various other flying transports... in fact, they prefer fliers because it gets them closer to the enemy, quicker.

 Andilus Greatsword wrote:
Of course if you look at any piece of SW fluff they're depicted using Thunderhawks and various other flying transports... in fact, they prefer fliers because it gets them closer to the enemy, quicker.

Not to mention that unless they are engaging an enemy who happens to have landed on their home world, they already used a ship to get to the fight, and then had to use somethingto get them on the ground in front of their enemy.

 Jubear wrote:
It more likely because its a dex the predates flyers, I cant see GW missing a chance to make a wolf fighter or wolf bomber when the dex is redone.

Pretty much.

And it's almost guaranteed to be awful looking.

 Veteran Sergeant wrote:

 Jubear wrote:
It more likely because its a dex the predates flyers, I cant see GW missing a chance to make a wolf fighter or wolf bomber when the dex is redone.

Pretty much.

And it's almost guaranteed to be awful looking.

I, for one, can't wait to see how they drape wolf-skins on it.

It's not that they can't have fiiers. It's that the Codex predates fliers (I think--but it certainly predates most Marine fliers).

The confusion, arises, I think, from the fact that Space Wolves view things like jump packs, bikes, and teleportation as needlessly risky and foolish. They are willing to let the 'cubs' like Blood Claws risk their necks on bikes and in jump packs, but, with the exception of a few reckless Wolf Guard, most older Wolves don't generally use those things.

Given that they are a pre-flyer codex, and have a prejudice against jump packs, it kind of seems like they have a prejudice against flying. I don't think that they will eschew fliers, any more than they have a prejudice against Drop Pods. It's fine to use a vehicle to get to the battle, to the Wolves, so when they are updated, I suspect you will see them being able to use most Marine Fliers. However, I think you will probably still see them only allowing Blood Claws to deploy via jump packs (I hope, as it's something different that I like about the Wolves)

I'm curious to see how they handle Land Speeder transports for Scouts, given that their scouts are grizzled loners, and not marines-in-training. I could certainly see them disallowing them for Wolf Scouts, or explaining that Wolf Scouts are so unorthodox anyhow that they use Speeders regardless of what the Long Fangs think about it.

Important note, most Marine Flyers made by Forge World are available to the Space Wolves.

I may have caused a small misunderstanding. I understand it predates flyers and that's the main reason and i am not saying they do not use flying transport. I was more saying that it seems to go against a fair of fluff that they would develop an air force type great company for example.

I really don't know of anything that says that Space Wolves are against using mechanized flyers and vehicles. They just prefer to fight the enemy with their feet firmly on the ground when it comes down to that. Their superstition is basically limited to how they basically don't use teleportation as it's seen by them as "Sorcery", and jump packs are seen as far too flamboyant and risky, and maybe even cowardly.


They mostly see Thunderhawks and the like as a means to an end; to get them face to face into the enemy.

Simple answer. They drank too much the previous night to fly straight.

 Bloody Adair wrote:
Simple answer. They drank too much the previous night to fly straight.

Any Sm faction that takes the time to develop a beer so powerful that it can overcome even a SMs defences and allows them to get drunk is ok with me.

bigginhouse wrote:
I may have caused a small misunderstanding. I understand it predates flyers and that's the main reason and i am not saying they do not use flying transport. I was more saying that it seems to go against a fair of fluff that they would develop an air force type great company for example.

I have read the ragnar books, and i cannot remember any stuff (even in their older codex fluff) that they have something against flyers, probably they have their thralls pilot the flyers so they can have some fun fighting the enemy.

IIRC, that was only really applied to their Terminators with regards to deep striking (and lets face it, SW Termis would be more than happy to footslog it to the enemy anyway). While they have deviated from the Codex Astartes by quite a margin, I can't see them utterly handicapping themselves by ignoring flyers completely. They'd have some pilots, same as any other Chapter, and they'd have to use Thunderhawks to turn up to most battles in the first place (as has been said).

IRL? They're still in line for an update. Don't worry, eventually they'll get their Wolf Fang Skyclaw equipped with Wolf Shielding, Wolf Talisman, Wolf Jaws (for Vector Strikes), and Twin-linked Wolf Launchers, which will launch wolves equipped with slightly smaller Wolf Launchers, who will in turn launch etc etc...

 Zed wrote:


IRL? They're still in line for an update. Don't worry, eventually they'll get their Wolf Fang Skyclaw equipped with Wolf Shielding, Wolf Talisman, Wolf Jaws (for Vector Strikes), and Twin-linked Wolf Launchers, which will launch wolves equipped with slightly smaller Wolf Launchers, who will in turn launch etc etc...

Cluster-wolves! Or maybe Recursive Cluster-Wolves!

Sadly, the "the codex predates flyers" argument doesn't hold water for one simple reason. Death from the Skies gave Stormravens to Codex:SM and Black Templars, while conspicuously excluding Space Wolves.

I'd be fine with getting Stormravens. I'll rip the Blood Angel FW doors off of mine, replace them with Wolves ones, and repaint my BA ones tomorrow if GW adds them to the codex.

We just have to hope that Vetock writes the book, so the Wolves don't get a second coming of Codex CSM.

If GW does come out with SW fliers, judging by the Chaos codex they'll look something like this...

I have a feeling that the Stormraven won't be given to the Space Wolves, which is a shame, since an assault vehicle that can carry a Dreadnought and serve as solid anti-air would be just what the doctor ordered.

On the other hand, it gives them a chance to make a cool new flyer for them.

On the other other hand, it gives them a chance to screw it up and make a poor unit. The SR is pretty solid and proven, so it's safe, while something new could end up on the wrong end of the power curve.

In my view, it's all down to stubbornness. They flat out won't teleport because dammit, that's dodgy - never mind what thousands of years of use by other Chapters has shown. No, drop pods will do us fine as they always have done, thank YOU.
Likewise, Russ fought on foot, why do we need jump packs? Here, let's give them to the new guys that don't know any better yet. We'll stay either on foot or in our tanks, thank you very MUCH.

In a similar vein, I wouldn't expect Space Wolves to *fight* from a flyer, because dammit, that's not what Russ did and it's not how we do things NOW GET OFF MY LAWN.

...*but*...

...they probably don't have any issues using flyers to GET to the battle in the first place... so Stormtalons? Not happening. Stormravens? Not likely. A lighter flying transport? More likely.

Super Ready wrote:In my view, it's all down to stubbornness. They flat out won't teleport because dammit, that's dodgy - never mind what thousands of years of use by other Chapters has shown. No, drop pods will do us fine as they always have done, thank YOU.

Your interpretation is supported by the Index Astartes in White Dwarf #304.

"Although teleportation can be far from accurate, it is often the best way to get Terminators into the thick of the fighting quickly. Teleporiation is a barely understood science and the technology is far from perfected. Many chapters of Space Marines - such as the Space Wolves - have a healthy distrust of such things and refuse to use it."

I see it as less a calculated assessment of risks and more as largely driven by superstition, befitting their simplistic lifestyle and culture.
Might explain why they dislike fliers, too.

Well, teleportation goes through the warp, so I can imagine the SW wouldn't be too keen on that.

They might even go so far as to think of teleportation like how some theorists think it's used in Star Trek, in that the original being is destroyed, while the result is an all new person. Obviously, traveling through the warp means the original isn't destroyed, but I could see SW thinking that daemons grab people teleporting and replace them, or something like that.

DogofWar1 wrote:They might even go so far as to think of teleportation like how some theorists think it's used in Star Trek, in that the original being is destroyed, while the result is an all new person.

Yeah, that's what I concluded when pondering Trek transporters, too. Isn't it pretty much the only conclusion? You are effectively de-atomised, and what pops up on the other end is a copy made from the prior scan. In one episode, they even had this result in two Rikers. Murderous, I say!

Does 40k teleportation really go through the Warp, by the way? I could imagine it to work this way, with the Immaterium basically being an alternate plane, but was this ever touched upon in a GW source? I'm kinda curious about the details now...

Also, I really like the idea of fearing people might be "grabbed" during teleportation. Makes it sound almost like one of those old myths a la Scylla & Charybdis, and thus certainly fitting to SW Chapter culture (even though the Odyssey is Greek and would thus be better for the Ultramarines ... but I have no idea if Viking lore has something similar).

Still praying they just move the Caestus Assault Ram to the SW dex. Somehow.

 Lynata wrote:

DogofWar1 wrote:They might even go so far as to think of teleportation like how some theorists think it's used in Star Trek, in that the original being is destroyed, while the result is an all new person.

Yeah, that's what I concluded when pondering Trek transporters, too. Isn't it pretty much the only conclusion? You are effectively de-atomised, and what pops up on the other end is a copy made from the prior scan. In one episode, they even had this result in two Rikers. Murderous, I say!

Does 40k teleportation really go through the Warp, by the way? I could imagine it to work this way, with the Immaterium basically being an alternate plane, but was this ever touched upon in a GW source? I'm kinda curious about the details now...

Also, I really like the idea of fearing people might be "grabbed" during teleportation. Makes it sound almost like one of those old myths a la Scylla & Charybdis, and thus certainly fitting to SW Chapter culture (even though the Odyssey is Greek and would thus be better for the Ultramarines ... but I have no idea if Viking lore has something similar).

I was wondering about it myself so I looked on Lexicanum. They said astropaths opened up safe paths through the warp that people hopped through.

 lucasbuffalo wrote:
Still praying they just move the Caestus Assault Ram to the SW dex. Somehow.

Now THIS, this, I can get behind. The ramming part seems pretty good for SW too. They may need to change the rules for it though, that front armor 13, if it gets 3 HP, would make killing it really hard since most anti-air stuff, not including other flyers, is at S7.

"What do you mean we're too drunk to fly? Who cares, this thing has a ram on the front, anything I hit will just get out of the way! Now stop sniveling and get in the suppression clamp. Also, here's a paper bag. I tried to go shot for shot with Canis last night, which meant I had to drink EVEN MORE this morning to avoid the hangover." *takes swig from flask*

Though I can't quote any sources right now, yes, teleporting in 40k does use the Warp for multiple armies. For Space Marines it's a possible explanation for a mishap in-game ("something catastrophic has happened!"). Grey Knights are touted as being safe from at least the daemonic perils of using it, hence why Interceptors and Dreadknights can shunt. Orks wind up any which way when they do it because of the chaotic nature of the Warp itself, and Warp Spiders' warp jumps are extremely dangerous because they are vulnerable, which is why they only make relatively tiny jumps with their personal kit.

Codex: Daemonhunters has a fluff story that talks about sending some GK to a target, via teleportarium, and goes on to describe, at length, that they'll be moving through the Immaterium.

Thanks, I'll keep that in mind. It's a cool detail that opens up a lot of possibilities in terms of mishaps - and lets any reluctance to use this technology seem all the more valid.

There are a few reasons as to why Wolves might not get Flyers.
1) if you have someone piloting, they are not fighting with their feet on the ground.
2) as pointed out it is easy to run, snarling headlong into your enemy when plastered. It is relatively easy to drive a car while plastered (not that I ever have {furtive glance}). Flying a plane while smashed? Forget about it. You may as well take Ork Burna-Bommers. Those are at least somewhat likely to stay in the air.
3) You can get in a good Krumpin (pardon my Orkish) if you're flying around above the battle.

 Happyjew wrote:

3) You can get in a good Krumpin (pardon my Orkish) if you're flying around above the battle.

I don't get it.

 lucasbuffalo wrote:
Still praying they just move the Caestus Assault Ram to the SW dex. Somehow.

But... You can already use the assault ram for the wolves. I do all the time. Other than the one time It got blown up by a lucky shot on turn one, careened into another unit, killing all the passengers but one and the entire ground unit of long fangs, it's always been great.