Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Greetings all and it's time for another CONTEST!!!!! Katana needs a logo and though I have some fun ideas I though I would submit it to the community as we did this before here on Dakka and had great results in th past.. So here's the rules:
-No IP infringement on another company.
-The rights to the logo/artwork will become sole property of Katana War of the Oni.
-No hand drawn logos, all must be done digitally.
-The contest ends on Sept 20th 2013 at 1159pm EST.
-You can enter as many entries as you like.
-Team entries are allowed but only one winning gift will be provided.
- the winner will be selected by the whole Katana team and will be announced by Oct 1st.

-The winner will receive one of the rare launch gifts for the team as well as a bunch of cool Katana swag upon launch, AND be credited in the book for their artwork.
SWAG Includes: Company Tshirt, faction stater of your choice, a Rare 12inch (ish) resin sculpt of one of our characters, and all sorts of other random stuff, as well as a LIFETIME 35% discount on Katana miniatures.

Please send all concepts to battleroadgames(at)yahoo(dot)com

As usual I look forward to seeing what the members of Dakka come up with.

Some sort of link to information on the game would probably be helpful for those interested in participating...

 insaniak wrote:
Some sort of link to information on the game would probably be helpful for those interested in participating...

That's the beauty of it as we haven't released any yet. This is just straight up imagination at its best. The game is Japaniese Steampunk.

 Empchild wrote:

 insaniak wrote:
Some sort of link to information on the game would probably be helpful for those interested in participating...

That's the beauty of it as we haven't released any yet. This is just straight up imagination at its best. The game is Japaniese Steampunk.

...
No website.
No product.
No concept art.
Not even a mission statement.
Yeah, no, not going to happen. We'll talk when you have something to actually talk about.

I don't know... "Japanese Steampunk" is a pretty good starting point, but normally I have a little more to go on for concept logo work. Can we at least get a "Pitch it in 15 words or less" version?

 Fafnir wrote:

 Empchild wrote:

 insaniak wrote:
Some sort of link to information on the game would probably be helpful for those interested in participating...

That's the beauty of it as we haven't released any yet. This is just straight up imagination at its best. The game is Japaniese Steampunk.

...
No website.
No product.
No concept art.
Not even a mission statement.
Yeah, no, not going to happen. We'll talk when you have something to actually talk about.

Ya we've actually shown a lot of it on both Tabletop Gaming News as well as Battleroad Games Facebook, and here on Dakka. I do appreciate the attempt to derail but this is a logo contest nothing more. For those who have been on dakka more then a day you will have seen the concepts etc as we actually release a lot of those here. Now this is our new game and a separate business entity from my other webstore battleroadhobbies.com and it's a chance to do something fun but if you don't have the skills hey that's fine believe me we have already received plenty of killer concepts and that's what this is about.

Oh and Fafnir since you don't have time to look http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/490376.page https://www.facebook.com/pages/Battleroad-Games-Hobbies/183586988326551

@Grav: Nope that's the fun of this because you have the name to go off of and in the past we have had great results this way (in fact our battleroad logo was done this way). This is whatever you can come up with and have no limitations.

You have sparked my interest at least . To clarify the name we would be trying to make a logo for is "Katana, War of the Oni" ?

 thegrav wrote:
You have sparked my interest at least . To clarify the name we would be trying to make a logo for is "Katana, War of the Oni" ?

Correct

 Empchild wrote:

Ya we've actually shown a lot of it on both Tabletop Gaming News as well as Battleroad Games Facebook, and here on Dakka.

Then why aren't you showing that same information in the very thread meant to promote the contest that your entire branding is based upon?

I do appreciate the attempt to derail but this is a logo contest nothing more.

Derail? The only thing I'm doing is pointing out that there's absolutely nothing contained within the opening post to give any credibility to the contest itself.

For those who have been on dakka more then a day

2008/12/08

you will have seen the concepts etc as we actually release a lot of those here.

Now why are you not showing them in this thread, or at the very least, linking to it in the opening post? Not everyone follows you or your company with the same enthusiasm you do, or expect them to.

Nbut if you don't have the skills hey that's fine believe me we have already received plenty of killer concepts and that's what this is about.

Throwing out insults like this is not a way to develop a professional relationship in the slightest.

Now Fafnir this is a contest meant to entice and give a chance so at the moment you are going out of your way to derail. So I would say please let's get back on and since its not your thing then don't post it's that simple.

What I'm trying to do is give someone a chance to be a part of this game. I can easily say the guy who design my BRGH logo was just ecstatic when he saw his design blown up at our booths. This is a chance for any random person to be a part of a game that had been two years in development. Now like I said being your attitude from the get go has been negative then it's not for you so go elsewhere and let others enjoy because already many people disagree with you. Other then that have a nice day and if you have any legitimate questions please feel free to pm me and I will answer them for you.

Emp, I know your stuff from the other threads here and elsewhere and I also agree with Fafnir and TheGrav that you should have put at least a link to the Katana stuff in the OP.

I can see both points. In a more formal client to developer role I would say I needed more. This is sort of more like designing a tattoo where the client is saying.. "I want it to be <this> size and I like <these > things.." but then leaves the design in the hands of the artist.

It is interesting enough and enough info has been given to really see a HUGE breath of designs come in, without any number of them following a very small strict set of guidelines and potential all ending up very similar.

 Cyporiean wrote:
Emp, I know your stuff from the other threads here and elsewhere and I also agree with Fafnir and TheGrav that you should have put at least a link to the Katana stuff in the OP.

Cy normally I would agree but not this time. I want innovation not anything from our existing concept work otherwise I would have just told our artist to do it for us and not tried to do something fun like this. Now I would say we have gone way off track so if anyone has a question about it then ask otherwise let's be respectful a d stick on the topic at hand.

Grav gets it as the point is to be open with no real restrictions.

If some people do not think Empchild has provided enough info, and he doesn't want to provide more info, I can only suggest that those people do not enter the competition.

Empchild may receive enough entries to satisfy his requirements. If not, presumably he would run the competition again with more briefing provided.

 Empchild wrote:

 Cyporiean wrote:
Emp, I know your stuff from the other threads here and elsewhere and I also agree with Fafnir and TheGrav that you should have put at least a link to the Katana stuff in the OP.

Cy normally I would agree but not this time. I want innovation not anything from our existing concept work otherwise I would have just told our artist to do it for us and not tried to do something fun like this. Now I would say we have gone way off track so if anyone has a question about it then ask otherwise let's be respectful a d stick on the topic at hand.

Actually, Faf makes a fair point. You need some pointers where to go with ideas - in this case, I didn't have a clue if I the logo is for a historical armies, or fantasy with demons, or scifi with robots game, skirmish or large scale, 9 mm or 28 mm etc..

If you want a logo for a product concept, and are going to pick the best suited logo considering your product, it's not just necessary but also fair to give a ballpark idea what your product is. Someone might spend a lot of time and effort in creating a cool historical samurai logo, and then you dismiss it saying "oh it's cool, you would have taken the prize but sorry, we were looking for something more steampunk."

So, please give us a few words about what the game is like, plus a couple of miniature pics as well so we get the setting.

 prowla wrote:

 Empchild wrote:

 Cyporiean wrote:
Emp, I know your stuff from the other threads here and elsewhere and I also agree with Fafnir and TheGrav that you should have put at least a link to the Katana stuff in the OP.

Cy normally I would agree but not this time. I want innovation not anything from our existing concept work otherwise I would have just told our artist to do it for us and not tried to do something fun like this. Now I would say we have gone way off track so if anyone has a question about it then ask otherwise let's be respectful a d stick on the topic at hand.

Actually, Faf makes a fair point. You need some pointers where to go with ideas - in this case, I didn't have a clue if I the logo is for a historical armies, or fantasy with demons, or scifi with robots game, skirmish or large scale, 9 mm or 28 mm etc..

If you want a logo for a product concept, and are going to pick the best suited logo considering your product, it's not just necessary but also fair to give a ballpark idea what your product is. Someone might spend a lot of time and effort in creating a cool historical samurai logo, and then you dismiss it saying "oh it's cool, you would have taken the prize but sorry, we were looking for something more steampunk."

So, please give us a few words about what the game is like, plus a couple of miniature pics as well so we get the setting.

Exactly this. With the amount of time and effort I put into the work I do, I'm not just going to ballpark it. And I feel that any self-respecting artist would do the same. Especially if the 'client' is willing to insult you for questioning their lack of information.

I'm only concerned about the treatment of the people who are going to be actually working on this project.

As a working artist and graphic designer with a few years of freelance under my belt there are more clients that ask or suggest as little or even less than Emp. Saying a statement like "any self respect artist...." is sort of near sighted and offensive. It also assumes that you might be approaching your clients as if you are somehow superior to them. In this case we, as the potential artists asked for more information and the client, Emp, said "it is covered by an NDA and I can't divulge any".

This is sort of standard stuff, and you either gracefully decline the job or you accept those terms and shut up. I would hope Fafnir that you would never get into this sort of argument with a traditional "paying" client. If anything what you seem to be doing is expressing yourself in away that, in my opinion, no self respecting business person ever should.

As far as Emp getting a lot of work and potentially throwing most of it out, or saying it doesn't meet their vision. This stuff happens all the time in normal jobs. I might create 25 thumbnail designs for a client and after the presentation have to go right back in and make 25 more. There is, in my mind at least, a sort of beautiful simplicity in this approach.

And gak, a bunch of free stuff? A larger hand made model? Discounts for life? My name in a published book? An opportunity to show my abilities and work ethic to a company that is involved in creating things for my favorite hobby? Sure I can set aside 8 hours over the next week for a chance at that.

That's what this is about.

 thegrav wrote:
As a working artist and graphic designer with a few years of freelance under my belt there are more clients that ask or suggest as little or even less than Emp. Saying a statement like "any self respect artist...." is sort of near sighted and offensive. It also assumes that you might be approaching your clients as if you are somehow superior to them. In this case we, as the potential artists asked for more information and the client, Emp, said "it is covered by an NDA and I can't divulge any".

Except he never said anything so politely. Instead, he insulted me.

This is sort of standard stuff, and you either gracefully decline the job or you accept those terms and shut up.

Except barely any actual terms are outlined. The fact that there was not even an actual explanation about who he, his company, or his product are was even included in the opening post added nothing to help. There's a difference between giving a loose set of terms (and I've done jobs where I've had an open set of criteria to work with), and having all the organization of a kid posting on a forum thinking he's got the hottest gak. All I was asking for was a reasonable opening post.

I would hope Fafnir that you would never get into this sort of argument with a traditional "paying" client. If anything what you seem to be doing is expressing yourself in away that, in my opinion, no self respecting business person ever should.

The pretext of professionalism was lost with Empchild's insulting remark.

As far as Emp getting a lot of work and potentially throwing most of it out, or saying it doesn't meet their vision. This stuff happens all the time in normal jobs. I might create 25 thumbnail designs for a client and after the presentation have to go right back in and make 25 more. There is, in my mind at least, a sort of beautiful simplicity in this approach.

Which is a standard approach. But that time adds up, and I want to at least know that there's a direction. Even with a million thumbnails, they need to be tailored to fit the vision of the person your working for. And if they won't share even a basic idea with you, you're essentially shooting in the dark. But maybe that's where we differ, I like to get in as much consultation as possible.

And gak, a bunch of free stuff? A larger hand made model? Discounts for life? My name in a published book? An opportunity to show my abilities and work ethic to a company that is involved in creating things for my favorite hobby? Sure I can set aside 8 hours over the next week for a chance at that.

That's what this is about.

And that's not what I took issue with, at all. I'm actually totally okay with the proposed prizes, and getting your work out is always a good thing.

 thegrav wrote:
As a working artist and graphic designer with a few years of freelance under my belt there are more clients that ask or suggest as little or even less than Emp. Saying a statement like "any self respect artist...." is sort of near sighted and offensive. It also assumes that you might be approaching your clients as if you are somehow superior to them. In this case we, as the potential artists asked for more information and the client, Emp, said "it is covered by an NDA and I can't divulge any".

This is sort of standard stuff, and you either gracefully decline the job or you accept those terms and shut up. I would hope Fafnir that you would never get into this sort of argument with a traditional "paying" client. If anything what you seem to be doing is expressing yourself in away that, in my opinion, no self respecting business person ever should.

I think you're missing the point here. If there was a NDA - and I couldn't be included in it - sure, I could respect it and work onwards from that. But as Emp never said "sorry I cannot give more details", I think the case is more that Emp is sitting on a pile of information that could be shared, but he's afraid it might somehow make all the entries alike and destroy the whole creative process. There's no fear of that, though!

The client often isn't a design professional - you are, and your job is also to bring a professional design process with you. As the client might not know how the whole process works, it's often your job to squeeze all the possible information out of the client, as well as informing the client what he's going to get with these details.

Hey Emp, if all this sounds strange to you, I'd be happy to hop in and consult you about managing this little contest, from a designer standpoint

Didn't we have almost this exact same argument last time, so can't we just move on?

 SilverMK2 wrote:
Didn't we have almost this exact same argument last time, so can't we just move on?

Good idea - let's do that.

I don't think asking for a mission statement, or some artwork and a brief description is off topic or derailing.
Actually even with your 4000+ post doesn't make this any less sketch. I suggest hiring a graphic artist for a cheap logo 150-300 and get him on an NDC/NDA. That what I'd do if I was a game designer.

 5deadly wrote:
I don't think asking for a mission statement, or some artwork and a brief description is off topic or derailing.
Actually even with your 4000+ post doesn't make this any less sketch. I suggest hiring a graphic artist for a cheap logo 150-300 and get him on an NDC/NDA. That what I'd do if I was a game designer.

So last post on this, No it is not and had I been asked in that manor then sure I would gladly have linked it but I wasn't. Fafnir you went on the attack and were insulting right off the bat so why would I show you any form of respect from there. Now had you actually just asked for something politely I would have gladly given it but you didn't as you fired the first shot.

Now some of you are asking for artwork etc and I have posted links but honestly if you have to ask for a direction then it probably is not a contest you should enter. This is something fun that is meant to give no limitations and is going to show what you can do with very little. I have two artist currently on staff who are pushed to their limits atm and we are actually about to hire a third and possibly fourth as the guys are working on the first years releases as well. I want creativity that's all without me having to define anything because if I have to then I might as well just save the money and have one of my salary guys do it.

Now honestly if you as a designer or artist need more direction then this is probably not the thing for you to be blunt. Believe it or not but this simple contest can lead to a LOT of work down the road (not saying a word beyond that). What I look for is creativity and imagination because to me people who can create something from nothing are the people I want to work with.

Simply put if you look at this as a chance to be creative with no restraints then enter please but if you are harping on more facts etc then this is not a contest for you simple and to the point.

P.S Their are no NDA's for this part of the project the only people who had to head that route were the play testers to which we received close to 100 applications and chose 10.

Last time:

Kilkrazy wrote:If some people do not think Empchild has provided enough info, and he doesn't want to provide more info, I can only suggest that those people do not enter the competition.

Empchild may receive enough entries to satisfy his requirements. If not, presumably he would run the competition again with more briefing provided.

Alpharius wrote:

 SilverMK2 wrote:
Didn't we have almost this exact same argument last time, so can't we just move on?

Good idea - let's do that.

I would add this and with my best foot forward.

With so many people going ¿whats this? You might want to consider this as a game/company your first exposure to the masses. Its a good chance to do a little PR rub elbows with the public and it will set you image in alot of people's minds.

Now this isn't to be mean. But my first impression is "unprofessional DIY gamer fan project"
You should change my impression post taste... asap.

Steam punk samurai sounds great. Show me why o should spend time designing a logo. Let me see what I'm designing for, is it worth my time.

Matter of fact note me your email man I have alot of info for you and plethora of artist and designers. I promise you won't be disappointed.

 5deadly wrote:
I would add this and with my best foot forward.

With so many people going ¿whats this? You might want to consider this as a game/company your first exposure to the masses. Its a good chance to do a little PR rub elbows with the public and it will set you image in alot of people's minds.

Now this isn't to be mean. But my first impression is "unprofessional DIY gamer fan project"
You should change my impression post taste... asap.

Steam punk samurai sounds great. Show me why o should spend time designing a logo. Let me see what I'm designing for, is it worth my time.

Matter of fact note me your email man I have alot of info for you and plethora of artist and designers. I promise you won't be disappointed.

Actually we've had numerous exposures to the masses with detailed work showing everything from concept to finish and the reviews are great. This is just a small portion of what we are doing and as I said is a chance to see some great imagination from people. I can very easily say you will see a lot more though in the coming months as two years of work is starting to pull together piece by piece and we have some very well known people working on this game (to be named later). Now in a PR sense well that will begin in late Oct early Nov as we have a list of podcasts that have requested interviews with the designers and I am granting them. Be mindful though dakka is large it is still just one small piece of the puzzle and we post on a bunch of other News sites and even here on Dakka. Heck I look on dakka everyday and miss some things because of how fast the news flows so if you haven't seen it personally then just ask and I will show it but being I have already posted links to follow several posts up I'm not going to harp anymore on this as it's just going in circles.

I will say again projects like these aren't for everyone as some people just don't fit the bill but that's ok. We are looking for creativity etc BTW my own avatar is a concept sketch for the game.

 Fafnir wrote:

No website.
No product.
No concept art.
Not even a mission statement.
Yeah, no, not going to happen. We'll talk when you have something to actually talk about.

At first I felt like oh maybe give this a chance but I'm getting a real weird DIY garage set-up vibe from this one. It’s connected to a bits store op. No real info with the excuse that it will change the direction of art… No art posted or anything tangible to show me my prize or what I’m working for.
This sort of “I won’t post it because you didn’t ask nicely” not becoming of an up and coming gaming company.
I’m cool… Besides I dug up the concepts and some 3D renders and I’m really not impressed. 35% off of something I wouldn’t buy isn’t worth 1 hour Much less 8.
The Name lacks greatly “katana: war of the oni”
that pretty Meh on the creativity level to me. (“Sword: War of the demon -or ogre-”)
I was giving some thought to helping out with this one and no way…. Shoddy models, very bland Make shift steampunk “I have Pipes on my back and a gear in my chest I’m STEAM PUNK!” Meh.
(Boring… Steam Punk Again _Yawns_)
I feel you Fafnir.

 5deadly wrote:

 Fafnir wrote:

No website.
No product.
No concept art.
Not even a mission statement.
Yeah, no, not going to happen. We'll talk when you have something to actually talk about.

At first I felt like oh maybe give this a chance but I'm getting a real weird DIY garage set-up vibe from this one. It’s connected to a bits store op. No real info with the excuse that it will change the direction of art… No art posted or anything tangible to show me my prize or what I’m working for.
This sort of “I won’t post it because you didn’t ask nicely” not becoming of an up and coming gaming company.
I’m cool… Besides I dug up the concepts and some 3D renders and I’m really not impressed. 35% off of something I wouldn’t buy isn’t worth 1 hour Much less 8.
The Name lacks greatly “katana: war of the oni”
that pretty Meh on the creativity level to me. (“Sword: War of the demon -or ogre-”)
I was giving some thought to helping out with this one and no way…. Shoddy models, very bland Make shift steampunk “I have Pipes on my back and a gear in my chest I’m STEAM PUNK!” Meh.
(Boring… Steam Punk Again _Yawns_)
I feel you Fafnir.

It's not for everyone and that's the beauty of the industry I would say. Their are plenty of games and models that I don't like and others do. Thankfully many others disagree with you but that's the nature of the beast. So I will say this since you claim it's a DIY well all games are to start BUT I will gladly tell you about the team. The Digital Artist is out of the UK and has done work for Soda Pop, and Kingdom of Death (just to name a few). The casting crew is out of the U.S and actually works for Gale Force 9. The writers have worked on Shadow Runs and the Editor is a professional magazine editor. I am just one cog in the machine and handle th financing aspect and distribution so if you want to think it's some shoddy DIY then please feel free as that's your opinion and you are welcome to it but you would be wrong. Anyways best of luck and as said it's not for everybody so thanks anyways.

Seriously - if you aren't interested in taking part in this contest, and you can't bring yourself to stay on topic and polite, then please don't post in this thread.

It really is that simple.

 5deadly wrote:

The Name lacks greatly “katana: war of the oni”
that pretty Meh on the creativity level to me. (“Sword: War of the demon -or ogre-”)

Gotta second this. Its a really bland and generic name that feels like a madlib. You might consider something that indicates steampunk as well. just my 2 cents. Good luck.