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So I'm fiddling with lists to get my Ultramarines dusted off and up and running for this new book and I have run into a conundrum. How should i deploy my Sternguard?

1)Drop Pod. Lots of people immediately jump to drop pod so you can have all 10 special bolters and combi-weapons unloading into the enemy at rapid fire range immediately at the exact target you want dead. But I don't like how it will usually leave them stranded and isolated from the rest of the army and usually swarmed by the enemy and probably assaulted so they never get to shoot again.

2)Rhino. The Rhino then seems like a decent option but rhinos are pretty weak and a promising target for first blood. So it being such an easy first blood target will probably get it blown up and the Sternguard will probably be walking turn 1 so I might as well have not bought a rhino to begin with.

3) On Foot. Which brings me to my third choice which is just leave them on foot. Ya, I wont be able to get rapid firing immediately but they can blend into the rest of the army as far as threat and they will get to bring their guns to bare at 24" (which is better than nothing) and then by mid game they will get some rapid fire shots off.

I know there are other options like Land Raiders and Storm Ravens but when I take those I usually have them full of Terminators so I'm probably not willing to buy another one for my Sternguard.

Please let me know why you think one option over the other.

Always go for the drop pod. It brings your Sternguard into firing range almost immediately and avoids handing out first blood. All you have to worry about is large amounts of interceptor fire.

Also, as Sternguard are expected to be bristling with combi-weapons for a one turn all special weapons all out assault, they usually aren't expected to survive the next turn anyway. Just make sure what you're shooting at is important enough to the enemy to justify the sacrifice of their points.

I dig the pods personally.

Thereis a place for rhinos but if your looking to plop down sternguard a pod is the perferrred method of plopping

I run pods anyhow, so I'm pretty biased. Combat squads can help you make the most of your special weapons, and proper placement can give them a little bit more survivability, but I've seen my fair share of one-turn sternguard too.

So since people seem to be advocating a suicide drop pod squad, do you guys find they usually worth their points for lasting only one or two turns in terms of what they kill and the disruption they cause?

Plus it seems like podding them would put them out of range of Tiggy's awesome powers and i dont really want to put the good old Chief librarian in the pod to die with them when he could hang back and help out the rest of the army for a long time

When I ran BA, I always ran suicide sternguard. They didn't always make back their points (sometimes they did), but they would often leave the enemy's best unit without a transport, so they were always walking and slow. Let me kill off the faster stuff and tackle the good unit at my leisure. Point for point sacrifice? Not always. But always useful and a game changer.

Well, if you run Sternguard, the best vehicle of deliverance is the Drop Pod. This brings the unit in range to unload their combi-weapons.

 wuestenfux wrote:
Well, if you run Sternguard, the best vehicle of deliverance is the Drop Pod. This brings the unit in range to unload their combi-weapons.

With the combi-weapons sternguard going up in points, I'm not as sold on them.

I've actually been more interested in 10 bare bones sternguard and just using their special ammo. Their special ammo is nothing to sneeze at.

Drop pod.

I never put a unit in my list and set it up to be a "throwaway" squad. That means that if I want to avoid that happening with Sternguard I have to support them with plenty of other units that can pose a credible threat and maybe even leave their arrival out of the mandatory first-turn pod wave.

I often have plenty of tactical squads and an Ironclad coming from pods on the first turn, so the Sternguard can subsequently slip on to the board. They will last a lot longer if you don't let them get isolated.

I really like sternguard i just can't get my head around useing them just to die. i have a hard time useinf any model that will die in one trun for little to no gain.

I'm a little curious on this too. I don't like the idea of sacrificing the chapters finest, so what other ways can sternguard be used effectively, without getting killed in the first few turns?

What if you have them come in as your reserve pod unit? have an empty pod or ironclad or something drop in turn 1 then the stern guard can drop in later right where and when you need them. That way they will come in when the armies are a little closer to each other so the Sternguard wont be as isolated from their friends and their threat is lessened a little bit because they will be close to other threatening units and counter charge units. Plus they will be closer to support units like Tiggy to get some more dakka going.

I can see sternguards shifting from a anti-elite/vehicle role to a anti-troop role: don't like those Tau hiding behind the ADL? Or the pathfinders in that ruin? Plop down some sterns and roast them with a HF or some anti-cover rounds. When the combis were cheaper it was worth taking the risk and dropping them close to a high threat unit but now with the amount of interceptor out there and the rise in combi prices I don't think it's as good as it was.
I can see the sterns in more of a deterrent role: drop them (or drive them) on a isolated enemy troop or to secure an uncontested objective somewhere midfield and shred any troops that try to get close, use the most adequate ammo needed without spending too many points on combis. You can use a 5-man squad to support one of your tacticals efficiently.
For a more "impactfull" "up close" drop unit you could go with a plasma command squad with a artificer armored captain or techmarine to soak up wounds.

If you're taking myltiple rhinos, a rhino is a decent option. Keep in mind that if you're going first you cab deploy on the edge of your deployment zone, moce 12" & flat out 6" and into cover / behind LOS blocking terrain. Then T2 move 6", disembark 6" and pew pew. If going second do as above but deploy behind some LOS blocking terrain so you don't get popped. This works best if you've got multi rhinos in the list and send them all up.

D

If vets died as fast in fluff as they do on the table ther be no vets left in a chapter

Rhino if you have LR's other tanks to run it behind.

Otherwise dropood (not suicide if you have multiple droppods to support/overload).. never on foot they will get taking out asap.

For Ultras and most other chapters, drop pod will usually be the best way to go.

For Raven Guard I like scouting Rhinos behind a midfield Aegis. Not a conventional choice, but keeps the vets from getting fried from interceptor

 Creeping Dementia wrote:
For Raven Guard I like scouting Rhinos behind a midfield Aegis. Not a conventional choice, but keeps the vets from getting fried from interceptor

That's a nifty idea actually, helping to keep them alive at close range.

 stargasm wrote:
I'm a little curious on this too. I don't like the idea of sacrificing the chapters finest, so what other ways can sternguard be used effectively, without getting killed in the first few turns?

They don't know any Fear, so why would them being sent in a Suicide Operation bother them? The Key thing with Sternguard is that they are doing a one-way strike to even the odds "That others may live", they didn't become the Chapters Finest by shirking the hard missions or by debating the "Lose - Lose Flow Diagram". They get it done even if it's seems hopeless.

A single drop pod is easily overwhelmed, three is the minimum and odd numbers used to be better than even numbers of pods. Tactical Squads in Drop Pods are viable, I quite like HW's on the drop - Heavy Bolters give you 3 shots hitting on 6's.

Also if you are paranoid about losing your Sternguards or squads to CC, grab Heavy Flamers for the Sternies, and normal / Combi-flamers for Tac's. This way the enemy has to shoot you off the drop pod's or accept the Flamer hits if they go in for CC. (Sternies get 2A base too!).

 Creeping Dementia wrote:
For Ultras and most other chapters, drop pod will usually be the best way to go.

For Raven Guard I like scouting Rhinos behind a midfield Aegis. Not a conventional choice, but keeps the vets from getting fried from interceptor

I was thinking similar, but I was trying to decide if a 5 man squad with a Razorback would be viable.

 d-usa wrote:

 Creeping Dementia wrote:
For Ultras and most other chapters, drop pod will usually be the best way to go.

For Raven Guard I like scouting Rhinos behind a midfield Aegis. Not a conventional choice, but keeps the vets from getting fried from interceptor

I was thinking similar, but I was trying to decide if a 5 man squad with a Razorback would be viable.

Razorbacks were barely viable before, so I'd wager that going up 15pts for nothing made them less than viable.

I run a 5 man Sternguard on foot whenever I run Sternguard at all. I'd usually spend whatever leftover points I had on their combi's but I ran them bare bones as often as not.

In my army, their role was to bolster the firing line and be a general problem solver. So I'd put them where they were needed most and bring their special ammo to bear on enemy units. I run enough other threats in my army that they didn't usually get singled out, and when they did, it was like any other unit that got singled out, where the enemy wasn't shooting at something else in my force, giving them breathing room.

Any deployment tactic will work if you synergize it to your game plan. I can see running them in a Rhino or Razorback working quite well if you already use transports and have proper target saturation. Or the Drop Pod tactics working pretty well too if you play it right.

Foot Sternguard definitely have a place though.

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:

 d-usa wrote:

 Creeping Dementia wrote:
For Ultras and most other chapters, drop pod will usually be the best way to go.

For Raven Guard I like scouting Rhinos behind a midfield Aegis. Not a conventional choice, but keeps the vets from getting fried from interceptor

I was thinking similar, but I was trying to decide if a 5 man squad with a Razorback would be viable.

Razorbacks were barely viable before, so I'd wager that going up 15pts for nothing made them less than viable.

I've had good luck with them in the past, but I think you have to provide target saturation to keep them alive.

I'm thinking of running barebones sternguard in a Raven guard list as well, with scout I can get them to an advantageous firing position and I really like the idea of a midfield ADL.

Firstly, Stern Vets are not cheap. Even barebones they are a massive investment in points and they take up a valuable Elite FOC. Most of the weapons they are commonly equipped with incur an additional point, and the Drop Pod will commonly bring the level with or even over the point cost of a squad of Terminators.

No one unit will win the game for you, and any player who places too high a tactical role on the shoulders of a single unit is not a very gifted player. Vets should never be deployed alone. Vets embody the "shock troop" style of play the Space Marines as an army favor. In that style of play, you should be using multiple Drop Pod units and dropping in AT LEAST 2 dops on your first turn, maybe 3. The rest will arrive later for support.

By having more than one target for your enemy to deal with in turn one, they are forced to divide their attacks. Even if minimally, this will help.

Not necessarily Sternguard, but I want Rhino Rush to work again.

In 6th, the only thing I can think of it is running 3 Drop pods. 2 for turn1 and 5 Rhinos going Flat Out to reinforce. The 2 pods help apply enough pressure to take some off the Rhino's advance.

But Rhinos are scary. So fragile.

With Sternguard, even with the new dex, the combi-cide will work.
Just gotta be smarter with the placement, and probably take 6-7 combi's in the squad, drop, pop UM tactical doctrine, and re-roll all those ones on your combat squadded meltas to destroy vehciles, and plasmas to avoid gets hot, and fry the tasty innards, add another two squads to rinse and repeat.

I am trying a 9 man with lvl 2 libby in pod tomorrow. the idea is to drop them somewhere near cover, deploy close to it, flat out my razorback and bike squads to harrass, snipe the nearest unit NOT targeted by the sterns, and tfc the next nearest.

I find that using a 10 Sternguard squad+ Drop pod to slag a LR is a waste, you are looking at a negative Trade in points even if successful, at least combat squad if you can and have one Combat squad slag vehicles and the other 5 with Plasma's try to kill or decimate another hardcore unit. Too many Melta's means you take down one unit for another, and often over kill.

From 5th - still haven't got points from 6th available.

10 Sternies + Drop pod = 285pts (NO COMBI'S!)

1 x LR = 250pts.... So if you want to kill this, you need to spend even more pts.

Drop and Kill Troops, by the swarm, especially nid's or orks.
Drop on those Shoota boys and murder them with Plasma and Hellfire.

Taking out troops and objective holders is the key, that's why the TFC is great, you can just kill the core troops especially eldar and tau. Next thing you know, they have one maybe two scoring units left.

I really cannot get over the obsession with killing vehicles with Sternies - Drop a Dread with a MM and another shooty weapon. Sternies are Infantry killers, not pseudo one shot tank hunters. Spend the same pts on Hunter Killers and leave the Sternies to excell at doing what they do best, killing infantry.

zilka86 wrote:
If vets died as fast in fluff as they do on the table ther be no vets left in a chapter

They're not necessarily dying, just taken out of the fight: Knocked out, lost an arm, helmet's visor got covered in opp's blood, distracted by battlefield loot (Orks), etc.

Unless your marine got hit by a Krak missle or ran over by a DeffRolla, they're probably not dead.