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This kinda should go here



GW will forever rue the day they lost Ronnie Renton....

Yah. Not really.

 PsychoticStorm wrote:
The question is what next, at what point their paranoia, cause I do not think this is sane will move to a much more disruptive stage.

GW isn't Nazi Germany in 1938. Their demands are not escalating, and appeasing them would give us peace for our time. All the community would need to do to achieve this is stop allowing leaks being publicized, discussed or forwarded. Fulfil that criterion, never pubicly speculate about unreleased models and GW doesn't care what you do with your youtube channel.

 Agamemnon2 wrote:
All the community would need to do to achieve this is stop allowing leaks being publicized, discussed or forwarded. Fulfil that criterion, never pubicly speculate about unreleased models and GW doesn't care what you do with your youtube channel.

That all sounds a bit "thought police", and probably not a legal ask either, in most of the world.

we should help GW track down a leak in their own warehouse

then they'd have to stop supplying themselves for 6 months

and everybody would be happy!

 Azazelx wrote:

 Agamemnon2 wrote:
All the community would need to do to achieve this is stop allowing leaks being publicized, discussed or forwarded. Fulfil that criterion, never pubicly speculate about unreleased models and GW doesn't care what you do with your youtube channel.

That all sounds a bit "thought police", and probably not a legal ask either, in most of the world.

I'm not even saying it's desireable, but this idea that GW is steadily growing crazier and soon they will destroy all individual stockists, etc, is a bit silly. GW only wants to control product information, though granted their methodology for this has gone from hamfisted to demented, but in no way are they preparing for a purge.

 Agamemnon2 wrote:

 PsychoticStorm wrote:
The question is what next, at what point their paranoia, cause I do not think this is sane will move to a much more disruptive stage.

GW isn't Nazi Germany in 1938. Their demands are not escalating, and appeasing them would give us peace for our time. All the community would need to do to achieve this is stop allowing leaks being publicized, discussed or forwarded. Fulfil that criterion, never pubicly speculate about unreleased models and GW doesn't care what you do with your youtube channel.

I view it in a more spherical way than just their demands in silencing the leaks their internal security is unable to find.

Using contract to press were law is not allowing them is unethical at best and does not fill me with optimism to the extends they intend to use in enforcing their agenda.

More importantly though, they show that their recent legal adventures have taught them nothing (well maybe except use their contracts instead of their layers to get what they want).

In reality, games workshop IP is something made from every trope existing under the sun and frankly I do not blame them, there is nothing original and too many awesome ideas to not use, the problem is they claim they own it and not only that they enforce this notion my threatening everybody using ideas they think its theirs, I would rather have the wargame hobby a place were a game designer or a company can name something in their product "Space Marine" without thinking twice because they know GW will send them CND letters regardless of their product having no connection to their IP whatsoever, likewise, I feel a massive amount of common ideas, shapes, tropes are in this minefield.

I would not mind GW doing their thing, succeeding or failing from their decisions, falling from been the industry leader or becoming again the edge of design and technology, as long as they did not negatively affect the hobby, as is they do affect it negatively, they put pressure on many companies, dictate to an extend what products can be released, for example the RH Lamasu and I really view them as a dark cloud casting a shade over the industry.

The BOW incident is not in isolation, does indicate an escalation in what they do the past years and illustrates the pressure they put in the industry at the expense of everybody else.

 PsychoticStorm wrote:

 Agamemnon2 wrote:

 PsychoticStorm wrote:
The question is what next, at what point their paranoia, cause I do not think this is sane will move to a much more disruptive stage.

GW isn't Nazi Germany in 1938. Their demands are not escalating, and appeasing them would give us peace for our time. All the community would need to do to achieve this is stop allowing leaks being publicized, discussed or forwarded. Fulfil that criterion, never pubicly speculate about unreleased models and GW doesn't care what you do with your youtube channel.

I view it in a more spherical way than just their demands in silencing the leaks their internal security is unable to find.

Using contract to press were law is not allowing them is unethical at best and does not fill me with optimism to the extends they intend to use in enforcing their agenda.

More importantly though, they show that their recent legal adventures have taught them nothing (well maybe except use their contracts instead of their layers to get what they want).

In reality, games workshop IP is something made from every trope existing under the sun and frankly I do not blame them, there is nothing original and too many awesome ideas to not use, the problem is they claim they own it and not only that they enforce this notion my threatening everybody using ideas they think its theirs, I would rather have the wargame hobby a place were a game designer or a company can name something in their product "Space Marine" without thinking twice because they know GW will send them CND letters regardless of their product having no connection to their IP whatsoever, likewise, I feel a massive amount of common ideas, shapes, tropes are in this minefield.

I would not mind GW doing their thing, succeeding or failing from their decisions, falling from been the industry leader or becoming again the edge of design and technology, as long as they did not negatively affect the hobby, as is they do affect it negatively, they put pressure on many companies, dictate to an extend what products can be released, for example the RH Lamasu and I really view them as a dark cloud casting a shade over the industry.

The BOW incident is not in isolation, does indicate an escalation in what they do the past years and illustrates the pressure they put in the industry at the expense of everybody else.

So, this is just a hate-in, now? What relevance does it have if you think GW's IP is "made from every trope existing under the sun" to them enforcing the rules of their trade account contracts? I went in a Games Workshop store once and it had a funny smell, so therefore I believe what they've just done is just the first step on the road to banning all models that aren't glued with citadel glue, etc

Because GW appear to have altered their trade terms in order to allow themselves to manipulate other companies in a way that the law wouldn't support?

I mean, how could anyone have an issue with that!

"Just hate in"

Really? No my entire post had no hate in it and valid worries about the actions GW does the past years, were they can lead and how they affect and can affect the industry.

GW did not "enforce its trade terms", GW altered their trade terms in order to enforce what the law did not allowed them the past 5 years and then enforced them.

I find that at least unethical, I also I find suing companies and individuals for public domain stuff they claim its theirs, at least unethical.

Is this hate? I do no think so, but it is something that worries me.

The grasp tightens...

Things can only get better

They confiscated their equipment? That's such a dickish thing to do, that's low even for GW. Tom Kirby is mr. burns.

What the actual feth.

What the actual gakking feth.

They had their camera and other equipment confiscated by GW security.

They paid good money to come to the Games Day, others were there using cameras and yet BoW had their stuff taken away?


I don't even.

Has Putin bought the company out or something? I eagerly await the hastily constructed defense of this action from the 'usual suspects' here on dakka, step forward ye shining knights of yore and spin this one into gold... I fething dare you.

Maybe they were going to photograph the bad food?

Did they actually sell 40k or not? Because it's one thing to leak someone else's product in order to boost your own sales, it's another to randomly threaten a fansite.

GW clearly don't care about *leaks* so much, since dakka et al don't get death threats from GW HQ. But if you want to sell their products, you should respect their rules. That's just business. And leaking *their* new products, in order to generate traffic, is going to piss them off a fair bit.

xruslanx wrote:
Did they actually sell 40k or not? Because it's one thing to leak someone else's product in order to boost your own sales, it's another to randomly threaten a fansite.

GW clearly don't care about *leaks* so much, since dakka et al don't get death threats from GW HQ. But if you want to sell their products, you should respect their rules. That's just business. And leaking *their* new products, in order to generate traffic, is going to piss them off a fair bit.

Yeah commercial business hates free advertising, almost as much as they hate positive word of mouth, that can just kill a business...

If GW was not so insular, maybe they could see how their protection of their own IP can actually stunt their growth.

 Crablezworth wrote:

xruslanx wrote:
Did they actually sell 40k or not? Because it's one thing to leak someone else's product in order to boost your own sales, it's another to randomly threaten a fansite.

GW clearly don't care about *leaks* so much, since dakka et al don't get death threats from GW HQ. But if you want to sell their products, you should respect their rules. That's just business. And leaking *their* new products, in order to generate traffic, is going to piss them off a fair bit.

Yeah commercial business hates free advertising, almost as much as they hate positive word of mouth, that can just kill a business...

I'm not saying that GW's policy of announcing things one week before they're released is good, but if it is there policy then retailers should abide by it.

How did they know they were the BoW guys? Did they show up in full BoW gear, decked out like paparazzi?

Well, I've never met him, but I'm pretty sure I'd recognise Warren, on the grounds he appears in videos on a very popular wargaming site.

I can't think its any more complex than that...

 azreal13 wrote:
Because GW appear to have altered their trade terms in order to allow themselves to manipulate other companies in a way that the law wouldn't support?

I mean, how could anyone have an issue with that!

Perfect opportunity for a quote like this:

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
They had their camera and other equipment confiscated by GW security.

They paid good money to come to the Games Day, others were there using cameras and yet BoW had their stuff taken away?

Are property rights really so limited in the UK that private security (IOW, not the police) are allowed to confiscate property? Obviously they're allowed to throw BoW out of the event, but I don't see how confiscating their property isn't just setting themselves up for an easy lawsuit and criminal charges.

As long as they give it back when they exit the event it should be perfectly legal.

So BOW will still have 40k stuff up? Im confused, What is the problem.

 loki old fart wrote:
Things can only get better

Serious as a heart attack, that "Games Day" is lacking in people. that room for all get out is empty. I was remembering one up in Chitown that was darn near standing room only. THAT?! is paltry in the amount of people. THEN this icing on the gak cake?



How exactly did it come to this, by a bang or a whimper?

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
So BOW will still have 40k stuff up? Im confused, What is the problem.

The problem is they've been forced to cut ties to their retail partner because GW's new retail agreement includes "if you associate with anyone who talks about leaks we won't sell to you". GW are paranoid about anyone seeing information from non-GW sources and ruining the impulse buy, so this is just another round of bullying aimed at the people GW should be working with to promote their products. It's the kind of short-sighted policy that only happens if you have a company run by incompetent idiots who are completely out of touch with their customers.

Contrast this with how WOTC gives fansites new cards to preview before each MTG set is released and the problem is pretty obvious.

Hmm, they're seeming more sensible than when they had the other mental eejit babbling about rubbish and illegal tactics. They seem more coherent. Hmm.... might actually have to visit their webpage.

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

Has Putin bought the company out or something? I eagerly await the hastily constructed defense of this action from the 'usual suspects' here on dakka, step forward ye shining knights of yore and spin this one into gold... I fething dare you.

I'm by no means a fan of GW, but it probably said something like "no recording equipment will be allowed into the venue" on the back of the ticket, bit like every concert ticket ever. Handily, I actually have a concert (not a GD as I don't go any more) ticket handy and it has this "restricted items, including the following are prohibited from being brought into the arena..............all forms of audio/video recording or transmitting devices"

Now, it depends on the security on the day but it is the gamble one takes when turning up to events with this sort of equipment. No big GW IS GOING TO GET YOU evil there.

Fenrir Kitsune wrote:

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

Has Putin bought the company out or something? I eagerly await the hastily constructed defense of this action from the 'usual suspects' here on dakka, step forward ye shining knights of yore and spin this one into gold... I fething dare you.

I'm by no means a fan of GW, but it probably said something like "no recording equipment will be allowed into the venue" on the back of the ticket, bit like every concert ticket ever. Handily, I actually have a concert (not a GD as I don't go any more) ticket handy and it has this "restricted items, including the following are prohibited from being brought into the arena..............all forms of audio/video recording or transmitting devices"

Now, it depends on the security on the day but it is the gamble one takes when turning up to events with this sort of equipment. No big GW IS GOING TO GET YOU evil there.

And yet others were taking videos and photos without any problem, as the hundreds of images that appeared here whilst the event was on testify. Do a youtube search for gamesday 2013 and you will find 50+ videos of it, indeed, in the clip warren shows, they even include one of the other youtubers right there (the guy whos Massacre Book they open), and yet only BoW (whom a lot of the designers know and even admit to watching) had their equipment confiscated.