The Strengths of the NEW Tyranids - Foundation for Competitive Tyranids (Eldar Tactica p.318 & 319)

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**Redemption**

Verviedi wrote:
In addition, how do I deal with a PaladinStar? The frigging things never die thanks to 2 wounds, 2+ Sv, 5+ Invul, 5+ FNP, and IWND.

How are the Paladin gaining IWND?

**Verviedi**

Sinful Hero wrote:
In m opinion? These units are probably the best things to spud in.
5. Warriors- Synapse, Shadows, Objective Secured, and guns. Can also be kitted out with a decent CC loadouts if that's your thing.
4. Dimachaeron- Giant CC monster. Won't make an immediate impact on the board, but his assault capability may make up for it.
3. Termagants- Objective secured and a high number of low strength shots. Good for clearing out infantry or putting a few glances on a transport.
2. Tervigon- Synapse, Shadows, and a Psyker.Can throw out a template or two(Miasma Cannon), and/or a couple shots/Large Blast. Can be Objective Secured. Can instantly drop more units in the backfield, effectively giving it a cover save/assault deterrent.
1. Carnifex- 12 Twinlinked Str 6 shots right where you want them, and tank-crushing assault power to boot. Can be kitted out for all melee if that's your thing.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Verviedi wrote:
I just got the Exocrine kit. How would I go about magnetizing it?
Where do I get WH40k magnets?
And most of all, should I bother? I like the Haruspex, but will it be viable with Tyrannocites?

Hobby Stores or amazon. Sometimes even RadioShack. You need to get small Rare Earth magnets. I always think it's good to magnetize- the next codex/edition may change some things around and make a subpar unit competitive again.

In addition, how do I deal with a PaladinStar? The frigging things never die thanks to 2 wounds, 2+ Sv, 5+ Invul, 5+ FNP, and IWND.
Unit comp is 1 Daemonhammer, 1 Halbred, Nemesis Banner, Psycannon, Apothecary, and Terminator Libby for invis/VoD

Kill everything but. Try to kite It around or tarpit it.

Haha yah. I achieved self sustaining tarpit on it last game I played. I parked a Tervigon near it and kept puking out moar gaunts to aid the tarpit.

Turn 2-
20 Termagants charged 10 man strike squad after killing 5 with Devourer fire. Killed 1 in CQC, lost 7 Gaunts.
Turn 3- Moar Gaunts that the Tervigon had spawned last turn charged. +12 Gaunts. Tervigon spawned 12 more. Paladins charged into the tarpit and killed 6 more Gaunts.
Turn 4- Termagants killed 0 things, newly spawned Termagants failed charge. Paladins swept the tarpit.

When my opponent saw me ruthlessly charging wave after wave of littlebugs into the Tarpit he said that I didn't know how to see the big picture and that I was wasting all my most important models. I LOL'd.

**NightWrench**

Eldercaveman wrote:
Thinking about running this list

Flyrant devourers, electrogrubs
Flyrant devourers, electrogrubs

Malonthrope

Mucolid
Mucolid

Gargoyles x 13 Adrenals
Dima in a Pod

Mawloc
Mawloc

Bastion, Comms relay

Lord of Change Lvl 3

11 Horrors
11 horrors

How many summons do you want to get off a turn? Realistically it takes 5 dice to be successful. You have 11 warp charge +your d6 so an average of 14-15 a turn. You should be able to get 2 a turn and one or two other bug powers off. Personally...I would drop the second set of horrors for two single brood zoans and bring horrors in as one of your summons. You can still take the primaris from maelific when they are summoned. With the LOC you only have one forward summoning unit as the horrors will disappear in the open pretty quickly.

**jy2**

jifel wrote:
Wilson wrote:
So if we had to make a top 5 units list to go in a tyranocyte- what would go where?

5. 3 Zoanthropes (with Neurothrope maybe?)

4. Tyrannofex with Electroshock Grubs

3. Termagants with Devourers

2. Dimachaeron

1. Carnifex with Devourers

The violet text is my take on it personally. I will be skipping the Dimachaeron because I'm just personally not a fan of it, but in a Pod I will recognize it as a very viable choice. For me, my Pods will be Carnifex and Tyrannofex.

I'd go with this as well.

Verviedi wrote:
I just got the Exocrine kit. How would I go about magnetizing it?
Where do I get WH40k magnets?
And most of all, should I bother? I like the Haruspex, but will it be viable with Tyrannocites?

In addition, how do I deal with a PaladinStar? The frigging things never die thanks to 2 wounds, 2+ Sv, 5+ Invul, 5+ FNP, and IWND.
Unit comp is 1 Daemonhammer, 1 Halbred, Nemesis Banner, Psycannon, Apothecary, and Terminator Libby for invis/VoD

I can't tell you how to magnetize the exocrine.

However, against the paladinstar, you've got 2 options:

1. Try to tarpit it with lots of gribblies or screen them out.

2. Ignore it and kill everything else.

**Redemption**

Dakkafex as number one for the pod? At the base cost of 225 for the pod and the 'fex, why not spend 5 points more and get a Winged dakka'rant?

**jifel**

Redemption wrote:
Dakkafex as number one for the pod? At the base cost of 225 for the pod and the 'fex, why not spend 5 points more and get a Winged dakka'rant?

Oh please, I'll be doing that too!

But, it adds to the pressure and gives me a viable assault option while also lending 15 strength 5 shots to the Rear armor of whatever I need dead. Also, my area is less friendly towards multiple CADs, so I max out at two Flyrants. (They already allow FW/Formations, so I'm not going to be too pushy on the multiple CAD thing, I don't feel I need it really). I do agree that a Flyrant is the best unit in our codex (outside of the FW Malanthrope), but 2 is enough for me. Now, I just can't wait for December when I can start playtesting all of our fun new toys...

**tag8833**

Verviedi wrote:
I just got the Exocrine kit. How would I go about magnetizing it?
Where do I get WH40k magnets?
And most of all, should I bother? I like the Haruspex, but will it be viable with Tyrannocites?

Magnetizing the Exocrine was one of my better decisions. It really magnetizes well, and switching between the two units is easy. I will post a picture of how I magnetized it and a little step by step tomorrow.

The Haruspex isn't viable today, but might become so in the not to distant future.

As far as magnets go. You can buy them from your local hobby shop, but if you buy them from ebay you will get them at 1/8th the price in my experience. For MC's I generally use 5 mm x 2 mm, N52 disc magnets (N52 is the strength, N50 is ok, but avoid N35).
If you can wait 2 weeks for delivery, You can buy 50 of them for $5.59:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Lot-50pcs-Strong-Round-Disc-Disk-Magnets-5mm-x-2mm-Rare-Earth-Neodymium-N52-/290999352681?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item43c0e9bd69

Then you've just got to find a drill bit that is about 5mm, and I would also recommend a starter bit that is significantly smaller (Say 3mm, because that is a good magnet size for non-MCs). Something like a Pin Vice might help you out:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/MANWAH-HOBBY-Model-Tools-Hand-Drill-with-Drill-Bit-Set-1-8-3-0mm-Head-Pin-Vice-/121433594126?pt=Model_Kit_US&hash=item1c4601990e but for the 5mm you will probably want either a dremmel or a proper drill.

**SHUPPET**

For starters, it requires extra FoC which comes with costs of its own and isn't allowed everywhere. For second, pod comes with a significant 5 Venom Cannons for just 20 points more than the Flyrant. 3rdly, DS Carnifex cover your AT really really well, which is a major hole for Nids.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
my post was in response to:

Redemption wrote:
Dakkafex as number one for the pod? At the base cost of 225 for the pod and the 'fex, why not spend 5 points more and get a Winged dakka'rant?

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Shooting comparisons aside, there is big advantages that come with dumping a few Carnifexs into the middle of your opponents army that aren't quite as awesome from a Tyrant. Same with 10 VC blasts guaranteed to do a bit of damage !

**luke1705**

xttz wrote:
Tomorrow night I have a game arranged at my club against a guy wanting to try out his new Chaos Warhound. He has specifically asked for my "most overpowered list" to try it against, so I'm looking for ideas. He normally plays Nurgle/Khorne-heavy CSM+daemons, and we're playing 2k pts. I expect he'll run it as a Nurgle Warhound using the rules in IA13, leaving ~1200pts to fill.

The question is what I run against him. While the obvious choice is Skyblight, I don't own any Crones or Harpies and don't really like the idea of proxying them (I have enough models I rarely get to use). What I do have to pick from is:

Harridan
1 Flyrant
Hierophant
Both kinds of Hierodule
Tons of C-Fexes and T-Fexes
3 'Tyrannocytes'
7 Zoans
6 Hive Guard
3 Malanthropes
Pretty much anything else

A harridan is, surprisingly, the most durable of all our gargantuan creatures. Better yet, it should kill his war bound in three turns. You could go a little cheaper and stick a Barbed Hierodule in ruins with a Malanthrope/Venomthrope nearby. Let that dude rock 2+ cover and hope he doesn't get a lucky 6. If you want to go man mode against him, definitely take the Hierophant with the acid blood upgrade. In cc, each wound that it takes causes a wound with only invul saves allowed in return (and FNP) but most importantly it does D3 glancing hits to any vehicle. That warhound will be so sad, especially since you can run twice if you really want to book it to close combat. Always remember that your cover saves are your best friend against strength d. Take that 3+! Don't forget night fighting! Also important is that strength 10 AP 3 (which is the gun you'll be taking regardless of which LOW you choose) is the magic number for daemon princes. That's the "take a jink save or die" gun. Or in the case of our guns, probably "take 3-6 jink saves or die". Even that Nurgle Prince isn't going to enjoy that

**Sinful Hero**

Redemption wrote:
Dakkafex as number one for the pod? At the base cost of 225 for the pod and the 'fex, why not spend 5 points more and get a Winged dakka'rant?

In addition to the other reasons posted it's two seperate MCs as well. Targeting two different units, contesting two objectives, generally harder to remove two units, and all the other bonuses for two units over one. Basically you're trading mobility for more firepower and seperate MCs.

**SHUPPET**

luke1705 wrote:
xttz wrote:
Tomorrow night I have a game arranged at my club against a guy wanting to try out his new Chaos Warhound. He has specifically asked for my "most overpowered list" to try it against, so I'm looking for ideas. He normally plays Nurgle/Khorne-heavy CSM+daemons, and we're playing 2k pts. I expect he'll run it as a Nurgle Warhound using the rules in IA13, leaving ~1200pts to fill.

The question is what I run against him. While the obvious choice is Skyblight, I don't own any Crones or Harpies and don't really like the idea of proxying them (I have enough models I rarely get to use). What I do have to pick from is:

Harridan
1 Flyrant
Hierophant
Both kinds of Hierodule
Tons of C-Fexes and T-Fexes
3 'Tyrannocytes'
7 Zoans
6 Hive Guard
3 Malanthropes
Pretty much anything else

A harridan is, surprisingly, the most durable of all our gargantuan creatures. Better yet, it should kill his war bound in three turns. You could go a little cheaper and stick a Barbed Hierodule in ruins with a Malanthrope/Venomthrope nearby. Let that dude rock 2+ cover and hope he doesn't get a lucky 6. If you want to go man mode against him, definitely take the Hierophant with the acid blood upgrade. In cc, each wound that it takes causes a wound with only invul saves allowed in return (and FNP) but most importantly it does D3 glancing hits to any vehicle. That warhound will be so sad, especially since you can run twice if you really want to book it to close combat. Always remember that your cover saves are your best friend against strength d. Take that 3+! Don't forget night fighting! Also important is that strength 10 AP 3 (which is the gun you'll be taking regardless of which LOW you choose) is the magic number for daemon princes. That's the "take a jink save or die" gun. Or in the case of our guns, probably "take 3-6 jink saves or die". Even that Nurgle Prince isn't going to enjoy that

Yeah basically when someone tells you "bring your most overpowered list" and you own a Harridan, you bring the Harridan. Then just build cost effective units, Flyrants Mawlocs and Living Artillery is your best bet here.

**jy2**

Redemption wrote:
Dakkafex as number one for the pod? At the base cost of 225 for the pod and the 'fex, why not spend 5 points more and get a Winged dakka'rant?

That's assuming you've already maxed out on your flyrants in the first place.

**xttz**

Yeah the Harridan is clearly a no-brainer. I'm more curious about to to support it with in the absence of Skyblight.

Just thinking further on what I said earlier about Zoanthropes... with a mark of nurgle this thing will be a Daemon with a 5++ save and IWND. That means that after passing a psychic test, not getting denied and hitting on 3+ there's still a chance that 1 in 3 hits will be stopped.
Instead I could drop 6 Hive Guard with Shockcannons at point blank, and thanks to the size of the titan they almost cannot miss. It's likely they'll strip about 4-5 HP a turn before saves, which seems a bit more reliable than jumping through all the hoops for Warp Lance.

The obvious drawback though is a lack of synapse. I could go unbound to get more Elites, but that leaves me with very little on the table, especially on the first turn.

**jy2**

If you (the generic you) are running the harridan, you should definitely consider running 20 gargoyles as well. That's....

1) 20 fleshborer shots from the harridan each and every turn,

2) a unit that can assault/tarpit the turn your harridan goes into Hover mode, and

3) helps to protect the harpy the turn it hovers. You hover, gargoyles can charge the Warhound to tie it up and then next turn, the harridan can safely charge the Warhound without eating a turn of shooting from it.

**pinecone77**

trindaros wrote:
So i'm kind of new here, been lurking here for a few days in this thread to see what Tyranids where up too and I was very surprised to see GW releasing new models and even giving us back our mycetic spores! I shelfed my tyranids shortly after the 'new' dex was released, and now I want to give them a shot again, first on a non competitive level, and maby attend a few small tourny's after I refined my list.

Currently, this is what I want to run:

1750 total
HQ
flyrant with double BL dakka and electroshock grubs 240pts

Elite
Hive guard 2x 110pts

Vthrope 2x 90pts

Zthorpe 50pts

Troops
Horma's 15x 75pts

Terma's 30x 120pts

Tervigon with crushing claws and electroshock grubs 220 pts

warriors with barbed strangler (3x) 100 pts

Fast attack
Give crone 155 pts

Heavy
Exocrine 170pts

Toxicrene 160 pts + Tyrannocyte 75 pts

Tyrannofex acid spray, electroshock grubs 185 pts

The units I'm not completely sure of are the Tervigon and the full brood of terma's, as i'm not sure if that unit would work well with the rest. I want to play a bit on the aggresive side, walking up the tyrannofex and horma's, the rest following. I could also take out 10 terma's, the tervigon and exocrine and add 20 gargoyles and 2 dakka fexes (this leaves me currently with 10 points to spare). I don't want to build a list accommodating only for the toxicrene, but i really like the rules and model, so a list in which it is an addition would be cool.

Feedback would be nice

Well...Tervigons are not terrible, but they are a little over costed.

So yes, you'll likely be happier if you swap them out for something else. And Dakkafexen are a very good choice.

**felixcat**

2x Flyrant - Dual Devs - EG - 480

Venomthrope - 45

Tervigon - TS - AG - 220
Tyrannocyte - Heavy Venom Cannons - 100
30 Termagants - 7 Devourers - 148

20 Gargoyles - 120

Harridan - 735

This come in at just under 1850.

**Tyran**

I have a question, how would you dealt with this lists?

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/609539.page

**Zach**

Volume of fire, focusing down your FMC's with my three Tyrants and keeping the rest of my guys castled up for the most part with their cover saves against your weak shooting.

**pinecone77**

Verviedi wrote:
I just got the Exocrine kit. How would I go about magnetizing it?
Where do I get WH40k magnets?
And most of all, should I bother? I like the Haruspex, but will it be viable with Tyrannocites?

In addition, how do I deal with a PaladinStar? The frigging things never die thanks to 2 wounds, 2+ Sv, 5+ Invul, 5+ FNP, and IWND.
Unit comp is 1 Daemonhammer, 1 Halbred, Nemesis Banner, Psycannon, Apothecary, and Terminator Libby for invis/VoD

GW doesn't make magnets, if they did they would be "chapter approved, and cost 7$ each.

You should be able to find good ones on e-bay, or your local store.

The simplest answer to a Paladin star is to Tarpit, then kill everything else.

So a big Brood of Gaunts is likely to be a very good solution.

Mawlocs like Paladins as well, they are spicy, yet meaty.

**Tyran**

Iechine wrote:
Volume of fire, focusing down your FMC's with my three Tyrants and keeping the rest of my guys castled up for the most part with their cover saves against your weak shooting.

The problem would be the cover save, a 2+ rerolleable is incredibly tough.

**tag8833**

Tyran wrote:
Iechine wrote:
Volume of fire, focusing down your FMC's with my three Tyrants and keeping the rest of my guys castled up for the most part with their cover saves against your weak shooting.

The problem would be the cover save, a 2+ rerolleable is incredibly tough.

Shoot at whatever doesn't have the 2+ reroll. They can't get that on everything. Once you've got 1 or 2 DP's down, you throw all the dice you have at denying one of the defensive buffs, and focus down whatever isn't buffed.

Basically, you are greatly overestimating the ability of 7th edition armies to cast many, many buffs in the psychic phase. You are getting 3-4 major buff off + the Grimoir. Just ignore wherever those buffs go. As Warp dice go away, so do the number of successful buffs. Also, the damage output of that army isn't all that high except in assault.

**Tyran**

tag8833 wrote:
Tyran wrote:
Iechine wrote:
Volume of fire, focusing down your FMC's with my three Tyrants and keeping the rest of my guys castled up for the most part with their cover saves against your weak shooting.

The problem would be the cover save, a 2+ rerolleable is incredibly tough.
Shoot at whatever doesn't have the 2+ reroll. They can't get that on everything. Once you've got 1 or 2 DP's down, you throw all the dice you have at denying one of the defensive buffs, and focus down whatever isn't buffed.

Basically, you are greatly overestimating the ability of 7th edition armies to cast many, many buffs in the psychic phase. You are getting 3-4 major buff off + the Grimoir. Just ignore wherever those buffs go. As Warp dice go away, so do the number of successful buffs. Also, the damage output of that army isn't all that high except in assault.

The thing is that the buff is the shrouding, which works in a 6" bubble.

**Eldercaveman**

NightWrench wrote:
Eldercaveman wrote:
Thinking about running this list

Flyrant devourers, electrogrubs
Flyrant devourers, electrogrubs

Malonthrope

Mucolid
Mucolid

Gargoyles x 13 Adrenals
Dima in a Pod

Mawloc
Mawloc

Bastion, Comms relay

Lord of Change Lvl 3

11 Horrors
11 horrors

How many summons do you want to get off a turn? Realistically it takes 5 dice to be successful. You have 11 warp charge +your d6 so an average of 14-15 a turn. You should be able to get 2 a turn and one or two other bug powers off. Personally...I would drop the second set of horrors for two single brood zoans and bring horrors in as one of your summons. You can still take the primaris from maelific when they are summoned. With the LOC you only have one forward summoning unit as the horrors will disappear in the open pretty quickly.

This list was sort of more theory crafting than anything else. I have yet to pick up the Daemon codex so just knocked this up from what I could guess at with Battlescribe and interwebz..

My idea for this army is all the Nids castle first turn and then hit hard turn 2 with Mawlocs and Pod coming in, and Flyrants having rushed up. The Daemons are there to throw out ground troops and help me dominate the board with the Nids doing the majority of damage.

I don't need to be summoning a load of units turn 1-2 and can happily have a more slow go summoning, whether or not this will work I don't know?

**tag8833**

Tyran wrote:
tag8833 wrote:
Tyran wrote:
Iechine wrote:
Volume of fire, focusing down your FMC's with my three Tyrants and keeping the rest of my guys castled up for the most part with their cover saves against your weak shooting.

The problem would be the cover save, a 2+ rerolleable is incredibly tough.
Shoot at whatever doesn't have the 2+ reroll. They can't get that on everything. Once you've got 1 or 2 DP's down, you throw all the dice you have at denying one of the defensive buffs, and focus down whatever isn't buffed.

Basically, you are greatly overestimating the ability of 7th edition armies to cast many, many buffs in the psychic phase. You are getting 3-4 major buff off + the Grimoir. Just ignore wherever those buffs go. As Warp dice go away, so do the number of successful buffs. Also, the damage output of that army isn't all that high except in assault.

The thing is that the buff is the shrouding, which works in a 6" bubble.

You are planning to play demons clustered around a 6" bubble? If so I guess I just ignore you score objectives and win the game. With all that energy focused on defensive abilities, you aren't put out much offense, and by keeping everything clustered up you are putting out much scoring. I've never played a demon player who clustered up like that, but I'm not sure if I'm too worried about one. Summoning and Biomancy is what gives me fits. Every time I've played demons who roll on telepathy, the game has been fairly easy. Usually there is a DP or something that manages to stay invisible, and thus not take fire, but the rest of the army goes down quickly.

**roxor08**

tag8833 wrote:
Tyran wrote:
tag8833 wrote:
Tyran wrote:
Iechine wrote:
Volume of fire, focusing down your FMC's with my three Tyrants and keeping the rest of my guys castled up for the most part with their cover saves against your weak shooting.

The problem would be the cover save, a 2+ rerolleable is incredibly tough.
Shoot at whatever doesn't have the 2+ reroll. They can't get that on everything. Once you've got 1 or 2 DP's down, you throw all the dice you have at denying one of the defensive buffs, and focus down whatever isn't buffed.

Basically, you are greatly overestimating the ability of 7th edition armies to cast many, many buffs in the psychic phase. You are getting 3-4 major buff off + the Grimoir. Just ignore wherever those buffs go. As Warp dice go away, so do the number of successful buffs. Also, the damage output of that army isn't all that high except in assault.

The thing is that the buff is the shrouding, which works in a 6" bubble.
You are planning to play demons clustered around a 6" bubble? If so I guess I just ignore you score objectives and win the game. With all that energy focused on defensive abilities, you aren't put out much offense, and by keeping everything clustered up you are putting out much scoring. I've never played a demon player who clustered up like that, but I'm not sure if I'm too worried about one. Summoning and Biomancy is what gives me fits. Every time I've played demons who roll on telepathy, the game has been fairly easy. Usually there is a DP or something that manages to stay invisible, and thus not take fire, but the rest of the army goes down quickly.

I agree with Tag. My answer would be: 2 Mawlocs.... Make them pay for clustering. Sure the Mawlocs don't hit Fliers, but you sure can force them out of the bubble as per TftD rules....

**Tyran**

tag8833 wrote:
Tyran wrote:
tag8833 wrote:
Tyran wrote:
Iechine wrote:
Volume of fire, focusing down your FMC's with my three Tyrants and keeping the rest of my guys castled up for the most part with their cover saves against your weak shooting.

The problem would be the cover save, a 2+ rerolleable is incredibly tough.
Shoot at whatever doesn't have the 2+ reroll. They can't get that on everything. Once you've got 1 or 2 DP's down, you throw all the dice you have at denying one of the defensive buffs, and focus down whatever isn't buffed.

Basically, you are greatly overestimating the ability of 7th edition armies to cast many, many buffs in the psychic phase. You are getting 3-4 major buff off + the Grimoir. Just ignore wherever those buffs go. As Warp dice go away, so do the number of successful buffs. Also, the damage output of that army isn't all that high except in assault.

The thing is that the buff is the shrouding, which works in a 6" bubble.
You are planning to play demons clustered around a 6" bubble? If so I guess I just ignore you score objectives and win the game. With all that energy focused on defensive abilities, you aren't put out much offense, and by keeping everything clustered up you are putting out much scoring. I've never played a demon player who clustered up like that, but I'm not sure if I'm too worried about one. Summoning and Biomancy is what gives me fits. Every time I've played demons who roll on telepathy, the game has been fairly easy. Usually there is a DP or something that manages to stay invisible, and thus not take fire, but the rest of the army goes down quickly.

I agree that the army is a death star army. But unlike most death stars armies it is made of 2 death stars that are quite mobile, they are not that easy to ignore.

**jy2**

Tyran wrote:
I have a question, how would you dealt with this lists?

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/609539.page

Daemon summoning is really good. I recently played against a semi-summoning Daemon army. He brought 4 Lvl monsters. What did I bring? Deathleaper and 5 lictors.

In that game, he summoned 850-pts of units against me....and that is only with 2 psykers summoning!!! I swear, I could do nothing to stop him and he was making his summoning rolls. In any case, here is my take against a summoning army:

1. You have to play the position game here. Try to force him to summon away from the objectives. Make sure you place your units in positions close to the objectives. Basically, I deepstruck my units - mawloc, dimachaeron in tyrannocyte, lictors - into his backfield to force him to summon units to deal with them. Now I lost everything (well, almost everything) in his backfield, but it served to prevent him from spreading out onto the other objectives. Basically, my strategy was to control the Movement phase by forcing him to summon units where I wanted, not where he wanted.

2. Target priority is crucial. Take out his mobility and his summoners. Oftentimes, they are one and the same. However, take out the easier targets first. Kill what you can more efficiently kill. In other words, ignore the 2++ re-rollable ones.

3. Pray he doesn't get the good powers or that he fails to cast the powers when he needed it most. Really, you need a little luck when playing against a Daemon summoning army.

**Verviedi**

Redemption wrote:
Verviedi wrote:
In addition, how do I deal with a PaladinStar? The frigging things never die thanks to 2 wounds, 2+ Sv, 5+ Invul, 5+ FNP, and IWND.

How are the Paladin gaining IWND?

Nem Banner

**Redemption**

Verviedi wrote:
Redemption wrote:
Verviedi wrote:
In addition, how do I deal with a PaladinStar? The frigging things never die thanks to 2 wounds, 2+ Sv, 5+ Invul, 5+ FNP, and IWND.

How are the Paladin gaining IWND?

Nem Banner

Am I missing something? It only gives Fearless, +1 attack and makes Daemons treat everything as dangerous terrain as far as I can tell.

**tag8833**

On Saturday I played an enlightening game against a very talented Grey Knight player.

My List:

Spoiler:

His list:

Spoiler:

He actually won thanks to a few rolls going his way at critical times (For instance the game ending on 5). We were playing BAO #2, Kill points primary, and Maelstrom secondary.

The most notable thing was how he systematically deconstructed my army.
Turn 1, he lit up my gargoyles and gants. Mainly this was Cleansing Flame on his Librarian which deep struck on turn 1, but his bolters helped a bit.
Turn 2, he finished my gribblies (My rippers scattered 11", mishapped, and died), and started on my mid weight stuff like my Zoey, Malanthrope, and Crone (Cleansing Flame)
Turn 3, he finished my mid weight stuff, and started on my Barbed Heirodule
Turn 4, he finished my Barbed heirodule (in Assault).
Turn 5, he took pot shots at my Flyrants.

I was doing quite a bit of damage back to him. At the end of turn 5, he had 2 Terminators and the Dread Knight left, while all 3 of my flyrants were all doing just fine. Starting turn 2, he was outscoring me on Maelstrom, because I had little board control left, and he kept rolling the same 2 objectives, but despite all of his combat squads, we tied on kill points. I had 1st blood, warlord, and could have gotten line breaker. He had linebreaker, and I needed to kill the dreadknight to deny it to him.