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I'm surprised about your t-cyte reaction, how were you using it that the change makes a big difference?

MC's don't have fire arcs like vehicles do. So you figured out what was the closest unit and shot it 5 times.

Measuring from each gun, your lucky if you can hit any unit more than once, and you'll often not get to fire all 5 guns.

If you had read the White Dwarf issue the RAI was clear, but the RAW allowed for you to use them more effectively.

 adamsouza wrote:

babelfish wrote:

 N.I.B. wrote:
I'm surprised about your t-cyte reaction, how were you using it that the change makes a big difference?

MC's don't have fire arcs like vehicles do. So you figured out what was the closest unit and shot it 5 times.

Measuring from each gun, your lucky if you can hit any unit more than once, and you'll often not get to fire all 5 guns.

If you had read the White Dwarf issue the RAI was clear, but the RAW allowed for you to use them more effectively.

I agree with both your RAW and RAI interpretations, and that hitting a given target with all five guns is better than having to spread them out, and the FAQ is defiantly not the best way it could have gone. I'm not seeing how the nerf really matters. Assuming all 5 at one target, the deathspitters net 15 shots, 5 hits, call it 3 wounds vs T4, thats a dead marine. With either of the upgrades you spend 25 points to get....an alpha strike? I mean, I can see how it could put a bunch of wounds on a squad, but your relying on the DS going well, and having a viable target. I'm not sure that's worth the 25 points.

Biggest reason the Tyrroncyte nerf hurts is that it now takes forever to resolve it's shooting, especially if you use one of the blast weapons.

I'm considering giving genestealer cults another try, now that they can infiltrate again. I am considering several options, but I am thinking about the following list:

Hive Fleet Detachment
Flyrant w/ 2x bld
Flyrant w/ 2x bld
Flyrant w/ 2x bld
5 genestealers w/ Broodlord
5 genestealers w/ Broodlord
5 genestealers w/ Broodlord
Zoanthrope
Zoanthrope
Zoanthrope
Mawlock
Mawlock
Mawlock

Cad
Patriarch
Magus
Disciples
Disciples

Total: 2,000

19 psychic dice, which is really good for Nids. 3 Flyrants and 3 Mawlocks is solid offense, while infiltrating stealers can pin units down, and Zoanthropes give me a little more anti tank shooting. The cult units are there for objective secured, telepathy, and 4 cheap psychic dice. Should be interesting at least. I just need to nab another unit of disciples to test it out.

babelfish wrote:

 N.I.B. wrote:

Tcyte nerfed into the ground, I won't even unpack mine. Extreme derp.

Biovore mines charging the turn they get placed is nice as well. I'm surprised about your t-cyte reaction, how were you using it that the change makes a big difference?

Biovore mines (and Harpy Spore Bomb mines) could always assault after being created, since there never were any rule to prevent them from that (they don't come from reserve). Most people didn't know, because it has very minor effect in games, and the units involved are weak.

Tcyte wasn't great even when ruling it as 360 LOS as all MCs (which is how it was ruled in most areas pre-faq). This was more like the straw the broke the camel's back. There's just no reason for the Tcyte to not being able to fire 360 LOS. It should be assumed that as a living, floating being it can rotate as it fires each cannon at a target.
It just goes against how MCs work. Are we supposed to draw LOS from all MC weapons now? Why should a Flyrant be able to shoot through its ass if the Tcyte cant? Or a Tyrannofex with its enormous gun, spinning on the spot like a break dancer, but not the T-cyte, no no. Why should only the Tcyte draw LOS from their guns? Even a stationary mechanical drop pod have a 360 shooting arc from its rotating turret gun, but a living being that can rotate their whole model only has a 45 degree arc? I mean, wtf GW.

You could do some decent drops with a Barbed Strangler pod. I used to field them with an Egrubbed Tcyte once in a while (before the derp of the Grav weapon Hunter's Eye delete button sillyness) to act as an anti-infantry bomb. 5 S4 pinning large blasts, a S5 flamer and a S6 torrent flamer put a serious dent in any blob. Now you lose 3-4 of those large blasts, enough that it's not worth it.

 N.I.B. wrote:

Tcyte wasn't great even when ruling it as 360 LOS as all MCs (which is how it was ruled in most areas pre-faq). This was more like the straw the broke the camel's back. There's just no reason for the Tcyte to not being able to fire 360 LOS. It should be assumed that as a living, floating being it can rotate as it fires each cannon at a target.
It just goes against how MCs work. Are we supposed to draw LOS from all MC weapons now? Why should a Flyrant be able to shoot through its ass if the Tcyte cant? Or a Tyrannofex with its enormous gun, spinning on the spot like a break dancer, but not the T-cyte, no no. Why should only the Tcyte draw LOS from their guns? Even a stationary mechanical drop pod have a 360 shooting arc from its rotating turret gun, but a living being that can rotate their whole model only has a 45 degree arc? I mean, wtf GW.

You could do some decent drops with a Barbed Strangler pod. I used to field them with an Egrubbed Tcyte once in a while (before the derp of the Grav weapon Hunter's Eye delete button sillyness) to act as an anti-infantry bomb. 5 S4 pinning large blasts, a S5 flamer and a S6 torrent flamer put a serious dent in any blob. Now you lose 3-4 of those large blasts, enough that it's not worth it.

You should post this on the Facebook page. They have been receptive to well thought out and logical responses (see the GS Cult - AoC change). What you're saying makes sense, why should this one unit be an exception to all of the Monstrous Creature rules?

I don't want to join facebook. But I think I understand why the rule writers made it like this - looking at the model it seems illogical that a gun pointing out can shoot backwards. They simply forgot that MC's have 360 LOS and they wrote themselves into a corner with the wording.

Hey hive mind,

So I posted this over in the army section to see what the general populous said, but I would love to see what the nid players of the world think as well.

It's genestealer cult with a hint of deathleaper.


CAD 1 780
HQ 180

Patriarch Ghosar 115
Magus Orthan Trysst 65

Troops: 330
The Faithful throng 110
The Faithful throng 110
The Faithful throng 110

Elite: 90
The purestrain princelings 30
The purestrain princelings 30
The purestrain princelings 30

CAD 2 690
HQ 75
Primus Vorgan Trysst 75

Troops: 255
The favored disicples 85
The favored disicples 85
The favored disicples 85

Elite: 360
The brothers aberrant 120
The brothers aberrant 120
The brothers aberrant 120

Deathleaper Assassin brood 380


I would love to hear feedback from you all.

You can take Genestealer Cult units in a CAD?

Alcibiades wrote:
You can take Genestealer Cult units in a CAD?

Is there anything says you can't? They are a white dwarf codex just like sisters for so long, they have traditional HQ, troop, elite designations. The bummer is the HQ units are all unique currently, so the awsome formation prevents you from utilizing a CAD and vice versa.

Alcibiades wrote:
You can take Genestealer Cult units in a CAD?

You definitely can. All 3 HQ's are unique, but the troops aren't.

We'll have a real genestealer cult codex before too long, but in the meantime you can definitely use the CAD or Allied detachment if you want.

 seapheonix wrote:
Hey hive mind,

So I posted this over in the army section to see what the general populous said, but I would love to see what the nid players of the world think as well.

It's genestealer cult with a hint of deathleaper.


CAD 1 780
HQ 180

Patriarch Ghosar 115
Magus Orthan Trysst 65

Troops: 330
The Faithful throng 110
The Faithful throng 110
The Faithful throng 110

Elite: 90
The purestrain princelings 30
The purestrain princelings 30
The purestrain princelings 30

CAD 2 690
HQ 75
Primus Vorgan Trysst 75

Troops: 255
The favored disicples 85
The favored disicples 85
The favored disicples 85

Elite: 360
The brothers aberrant 120
The brothers aberrant 120
The brothers aberrant 120

Deathleaper Assassin brood 380


I would love to hear feedback from you all.

Looks like a fun list to play, but I can't say for sure how competitive it would be. Honestly, I don't have any experience with the GSC. Looks like it will play MSU-style with decent ObSec and will have good/bad matchups. I'm not sure how it will deal against armor-heavy lists (drop pods, Imperial Knights) and it'll probably get run over by decent assault lists (Daemons, wulfen lists, fast deathstars), but the MSU-nature and in-your-face infiltration of the armies might give more traditional lists some problems.

If you run it, let us know how it went. I, for one, would be interested in hearing the results. Thanks, and good luck.

I just played a 1850 game against a tough guard mob list and just decimated him with:

2 CADS Tyranids
3Flyrants(EG/2xDiv)
4 single Zoanthropes
Brood of 3 Zoanthropes w Nero
2x 10 Brood of Termigaunts
3 Rippers w DS
2 single Mucilids

Ghosar Quintis Formation

The princelings kamakazied doing a good job tieing up his main HQ squad and source of orders (which he thought would be safe far in the back) for the first round)
The flyrants did their thing pritty much deleating a 10 man squad apease each round.

I love how Ghosar's formation puts very resilient units right in the enemies face and gives threat overload with the Flyrants first turn.
I had tons of WC and dominated the psychic phase. With 2 chances at invis and psychic scream on infiltrating units I had psychic nastyness from the get go plus the
nerothrope squad was able to really get a good run on blasts(though I crapped out on spirit leach)

Timeshadow wrote:
I just played a 1850 game against a tough guard mob list and just decimated him with:

2 CADS Tyranids
3Flyrants(EG/2xDiv)
4 single Zoanthropes
Brood of 3 Zoanthropes w Nero
2x 10 Brood of Termigaunts
3 Rippers w DS
2 single Mucilids

Ghosar Quintis Formation

The princelings kamakazied doing a good job tieing up his main HQ squad and source of orders (which he thought would be safe far in the back) for the first round)
The flyrants did their thing pritty much deleating a 10 man squad apease each round.

I love how Ghosar's formation puts very resilient units right in the enemies face and gives threat overload with the Flyrants first turn.
I had tons of WC and dominated the psychic phase. With 2 chances at invis and psychic scream on infiltrating units I had psychic nastyness from the get go plus the
nerothrope squad was able to really get a good run on blasts(though I crapped out on spirit leach)

I've played that same list -2 Mucolids -1 Zoey +1 Malantrhope, but that was back when they were BB. It always worked pretty good. I was worried it couldn't deal with BC, but I really liked how it did against a Min / Maxed Eldar list.

tag8833 wrote:

Timeshadow wrote:
I just played a 1850 game against a tough guard mob list and just decimated him with:

2 CADS Tyranids
3Flyrants(EG/2xDiv)
4 single Zoanthropes
Brood of 3 Zoanthropes w Nero
2x 10 Brood of Termigaunts
3 Rippers w DS
2 single Mucilids

Ghosar Quintis Formation

The princelings kamakazied doing a good job tieing up his main HQ squad and source of orders (which he thought would be safe far in the back) for the first round)
The flyrants did their thing pritty much deleating a 10 man squad apease each round.

I love how Ghosar's formation puts very resilient units right in the enemies face and gives threat overload with the Flyrants first turn.
I had tons of WC and dominated the psychic phase. With 2 chances at invis and psychic scream on infiltrating units I had psychic nastyness from the get go plus the
nerothrope squad was able to really get a good run on blasts(though I crapped out on spirit leach)

I've played that same list -2 Mucolids -1 Zoey +1 Malantrhope, but that was back when they were BB. It always worked pretty good. I was worried it couldn't deal with BC, but I really liked how it did against a Min / Maxed Eldar list.

I find I don't need the melenthrope as the Ghosar formation gets stealth/shrouded 1st turn and takes a lot of attention off my flyrants.

Just brought myself Deathwatch codex and study it..

I think our problem with deathwatch detachment, they can buy one model per unit. There are no limit for unit in detachment but HQ limit to 3 unit.

Flyrant with two twin link brain leech would be overkill on single model... Spilt target on up to two model per game turn is not enough, brood full of termagant shoot at single model?

Terminator cyclone missile with assault cannon going be too much for our minion, and they are single model per unit with deep strike...

Great news for us that we can gain extra victory point per unit we destroy, 20 unit of a single model destroyed = 20 VP easy.

I highly doubt we'll see deathwatch going with single model spam. Gotta use a CAD to do that, and if they're giving up Deep Strike that's fine with me. Plus, they're expensove and don't have good damage output for their points, so im less than scared. They'll pick HQs every time against us, but rerolling 1s to hit on 6s is barely a buff at all so again, not impressed. Overall I don't see Deathwatch making a splash in the competitive scene, and I don't see them affecting us whatsoever.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I highly doubt we'll see deathwatch going with single model spam. Gotta use a CAD to do that, and if they're giving up Deep Strike that's fine with me. Plus, they're expensove and don't have good damage output for their points, so im less than scared. They'll pick HQs every time against us, but rerolling 1s to hit on 6s is barely a buff at all so again, not impressed. Overall I don't see Deathwatch making a splash in the competitive scene, and I don't see them affecting us whatsoever.

Once the Flyrants are in the air, deathwatch will have a very difficult time to take them out (as most armies currently do), but don't underestimate access to divination for re-rolls to hit on stalker bolter sniper teams.

the deathwatch are also well suited to take out any of the ground units tyranids can field - with ammo that ignores cover or wounds on a 2+, the swarms and the big gribblies are both at risk.

 tetrisphreak wrote:
Once the Flyrants are in the air, deathwatch will have a very difficult time to take them out (as most armies currently do), but don't underestimate access to divination for re-rolls to hit on stalker bolter sniper teams.

the deathwatch are also well suited to take out any of the ground units tyranids can field - with ammo that ignores cover or wounds on a 2+, the swarms and the big gribblies are both at risk.

And Frag cannons are a thing that can rip apart most of the swarm as well.

 LordRogalDorn wrote:

 tetrisphreak wrote:
Once the Flyrants are in the air, deathwatch will have a very difficult time to take them out (as most armies currently do), but don't underestimate access to divination for re-rolls to hit on stalker bolter sniper teams.

the deathwatch are also well suited to take out any of the ground units tyranids can field - with ammo that ignores cover or wounds on a 2+, the swarms and the big gribblies are both at risk.

And Frag cannons are a thing that can rip apart most of the swarm as well.

The sad thing is, I don't even consider that a problem because in a competitive conversation for Tyranids, our swarms don't even make a ripple to me. It's just impossible for me to justify taking a unit in our codex in any size over "the smallest possible". In my current lists, I literally have one unit that is composed of multiple models, and it's 3 rippers. Deathwatch have some cool tricks but are completely lacking in AA, and so competitively I just don't see them posing a threat.

Playing with a list idea for a semi-competitive Nid army:

CAD:
Hive Tyrant w/ wings, TL Devs
Hive Tyrant w/ wings, TL Devs
1 Squad 10 Termagaunts
1 Squad 10 Termagaunts
1 Mawloc

CAD:
Hive Tyrant w/ wings, TL Devs
Hive Tyrant w/ wings, TL Devs
1 Squad 10 Termagaunts
1 Squad 10 Termagaunts
1 Mawloc
3 Gargoyle Brood

This is basically just three Start Collecting boxes, an extra Tyrant, and 2 Mawlocs. I could also add the Warriors for synapse. Any suggestions?

 Retrogamer0001 wrote:
Playing with a list idea for a semi-competitive Nid army:

CAD:
Hive Tyrant w/ wings, TL Devs
Hive Tyrant w/ wings, TL Devs
1 Squad 10 Termagaunts
1 Squad 10 Termagaunts
1 Mawloc

CAD:
Hive Tyrant w/ wings, TL Devs
Hive Tyrant w/ wings, TL Devs
1 Squad 10 Termagaunts
1 Squad 10 Termagaunts
1 Mawloc
3 Gargoyle Brood

This is basically just three Start Collecting boxes, an extra Tyrant, and 2 Mawlocs. I could also add the Warriors for synapse. Any suggestions?

The only concern I have are the Termaguants. It will come down to wether you think you will have sufficient synapse coverage for them. Dominion will help, but tyrants should be up field taking the fight to your opponent. What I use instead are rippers with deepstrike. 5 points cheaper, but with more deployment options. Plus they are fearless. Worst case, they take a wound from failed synapse, but they won't run. With the 20 points you save, you can buy 2 electroshock grubs for your Tyrants.

Good call on the Rippers, will definitely go in that direction (less models to paint too!). Are Ripper swarms still ObSec inside the CAD?

 Retrogamer0001 wrote:
Good call on the Rippers, will definitely go in that direction (less models to paint too!). Are Ripper swarms still ObSec inside the CAD?

Yes they are.

Real talk: Why isnt the Toxicrene reviewed in the main post? o.O

Arkengate wrote:
Real talk: Why isnt the Toxicrene reviewed in the main post? o.O

Probably because we reviewed every unit as a thread a bit after the 'Dex came out. And then... that was it lol. When new rules were released, we kinda just looked at the good ones and used them without ever having the actual organization to review them. I've never used one personally, but the rules leave me less than impressed.

 jifel wrote:

Arkengate wrote:
Real talk: Why isnt the Toxicrene reviewed in the main post? o.O

Probably because we reviewed every unit as a thread a bit after the 'Dex came out. And then... that was it lol. When new rules were released, we kinda just looked at the good ones and used them without ever having the actual organization to review them. I've never used one personally, but the rules leave me less than impressed.

Im still relatively new. Are any of the fast attacks good, yet? (Shrikes, Ravener, Sky-Slashers?)
Exocrine/Haruspex for that living artillery / a melee option?
Is there ever a reason to have more than 1 Tervigon?
Or field a Tyrannofex?

Thanks!

Arkengate wrote:

 jifel wrote:

Arkengate wrote:
Real talk: Why isnt the Toxicrene reviewed in the main post? o.O

Probably because we reviewed every unit as a thread a bit after the 'Dex came out. And then... that was it lol. When new rules were released, we kinda just looked at the good ones and used them without ever having the actual organization to review them. I've never used one personally, but the rules leave me less than impressed.

Im still relatively new. Are any of the fast attacks good, yet? (Shrikes, Ravener, Sky-Slashers?)
Exocrine/Haruspex for that living artillery / a melee option?
Is there ever a reason to have more than 1 Tervigon?
Or field a Tyrannofex?

Thanks!

Well, "good" is kinda a tricky question with Tyranids. We have one great unit, the Flyrant. Anything beyond that in this codex is a tax to allow us to take more flyrants, a shrouded buffer to keep flyrants alive, or a unit you're using to fill points because you ran out of Flyrants. If you're not looking for a competitive list though, we have many options. In a friendly game, most of the units you listed are competitive. I am actually a huge fan of Shrikes, I can usually keep the firepower off of them and use them as a countercharge unit. Very fun. If you're playing a friendly game, then Tervigons, Tyrannofex, Biovores, Tyrannocytes, Exocrines, Gargoyles, Shrikes, etc. all become fairly competitive.

I guess what I'm asking is, Given i can do the 5 FHT thingy, thats fine.

Of those, are there specific uses that something is used for? Like, would there be a reason to bring a 2nd Tervigon? or add a Tyrannofex to my army? (I have one, buying the gun still!)

What exactly is the role of Exocrine, Haruspex? We have Dimachaeron, so where does Haruspex fit in? Would I ever feasibly field one? Exocrine seems to be long ranged tank killer, though. Is that Living Artillery worth actually using?

Im glad to hear shrikes are good :-)


Lastly; Have GW stated anything about Genestealers and fixing their ally issue? I know the FAQ isnt final yet, and it seems there was an uproar about it a while ago (Before i started)

Arkengate wrote:
I guess what I'm asking is, Given i can do the 5 FHT thingy, thats fine.

Of those, are there specific uses that something is used for? Like, would there be a reason to bring a 2nd Tervigon? or add a Tyrannofex to my army? (I have one, buying the gun still!)

What exactly is the role of Exocrine, Haruspex? We have Dimachaeron, so where does Haruspex fit in? Would I ever feasibly field one? Exocrine seems to be long ranged tank killer, though. Is that Living Artillery worth actually using?

Im glad to hear shrikes are good :-)


Lastly; Have GW stated anything about Genestealers and fixing their ally issue? I know the FAQ isnt final yet, and it seems there was an uproar about it a while ago (Before i started)

The Tyrannofex with the stock Acid Spray and Electroshock Grubs in a Tyrannocyte is still pretty awesome.

I personally use the Living Artillery Node all the time (well, back when I played my Nids) and it has done awesome. It also helps that they clarified finally that you reroll everything as far as the scatter dice are concerned from the formation, and for the barrage you can reroll just the subsequent scatter die rolls.

Haruspexes are just pretty bad, imo.

Shrikes are, pardon my French, garbage. I'm sure they have their niche in an all deep-strike-oriented list, but otherwise, gross.