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Scipio Africanus wrote:

Paradigm wrote:I've used them a couple of times in the past, and both times it's been GW-related orders. They took 2 weeks both times, so I won't be using them again.

Just as a word of general advice, buying GW from discounters almost always involves waiting a long time. Wayland and Total Wargamer both have a couple of weeks as a minimum wait for GW, but when I've ordered Mantic stuff it's arrived in days. I've yet to find anywhere that does GW cheap and fast, although I hear DarkSphere are quite good.

Regarding Pre-orders, there have been cases in the past where GW have supplied their own stores and orders first and retailers have got the 'second wave' of production and shipping. I don't know if this is still an issue, but it may well be.

There's a pattern here. People take a long time to get GW orders from stockists. Is this not an attempt by GW to make stockists inconvenient and force them out of more income?

Indeed. Games Workshop has been waging a war on the indy-stores (freeloaders, as they call them) for years now. They would much rather see you pay full retail price at their own webshop than get a slight discount elsewhere.

I disagree. When something is in stock, it is listed as in stock, with the number of units they have. If it's not in stock, it is listed as either available or unavailable, depending on, well, availability...

Seems clear enough to me.

 Eggs wrote:
I disagree. When something is in stock, it is listed as in stock, with the number of units they have. If it's not in stock, it is listed as either available or unavailable, depending on, well, availability...

Seems clear enough to me.

^this

Available just means they can get them in from GW, not that it's in their stock. Usually this is items that are not commonly sold (HQ's, vehicles, etc) I presume.

 Eggs wrote:
I disagree. When something is in stock, it is listed as in stock, with the number of units they have. If it's not in stock, it is listed as either available or unavailable, depending on, well, availability...

Seems clear enough to me.

Not entirely clear to me, I must admit.

As I see it, you either have a product available for order (though with a delay if you don't have it stocked) or you don't have it on your webpage.

Perhaps it's just that English is not my native language, but when I see "available" I think "in stock and ready to ship". If it was not, then I would expect there to be an "no stock currently available - x days delivery" marker instead.

Of course, once you've gotten used to Wayland's shop it starts to make a bit more sense. But I can understand why people might find it confusing at first.

f2k wrote:
As I see it, you either have a product available for order (though with a delay if you don't have it stocked) or you don't have it on your webpage.

This exactly. The reason "Available" is silly is because why would you list things the customer cannot purchase?
So really you should have 2 stock levels - In Stock, or Out of Stock. You could be nice and put Backorder for things that are Out of Stock that someone has ordered as well.

I have been ordering the new dwarf releases from wayland, since well... you get a 40% discount comparing my Swedish stores.

I've recived good customer service, the only thing that irks me is the delay for shipping.
First order was 6 days and now the second order is 7 Days and encounting.
But, as long as it is within their specified amount of time (9 Days) I find it acceptable.

If they breach that timeframe im gonna drop them like a bag of rocks.

 Nicky J wrote:
Over a week later I had heard nothing from them...

Had heard nothing to let me know what was going on.

Heard nothing back from them today.

Personally I found this to be the most annoying issue when dealing with Wayland, and the thing that had the most negative impact on my level of satisfaction.

I think that I (along with most other people) understand that delays happen, and am willing to forgive and wait patiently for an order. However! that is only the case when I know what is going on and feel I'm being kept in the loop.

In my dealings with Wayland, I often had this uneasy feeling that I had just been forgotten about, or that there was some huge problem with my order that they weren't telling me about, or that they just weren't interested in sorting out my order and were going to make me wait indefinitely, or that it had been lost in the post weeks ago and I just didn't know.

I'm not saying any of this is true, but when you don't hear anything it is disconcerting. I don't want to have to keep raising a ticket just to reassure myself that Wayland hasn't forgotten about me, or that they care about my order. I would like them to at least 'seem' like they are doing everything they can to get my order out. Maybe they are, but when I don't hear anything I just imagine them goofing off and generally being incompetent and it makes me feel angry.

Just wanted to post an update.

I mentioned a couple of days ago I was waiting on Dropzone stock.

I have since been contacted directly and explained that the delay was due to there being a new rulebook coming out and I have been automatically upgraded to get that.

So while it would have been nice to know this sooner, I can hardly blame Wayland for it, I should have done my research and worked it out for myself too.

Still happy with the communication and looking forward to buying more from Wayland when the shipping to NZ isn't insane (again, not Waylands fault, NZ is pretty isolated).

 Smacks wrote:

 Nicky J wrote:
Over a week later I had heard nothing from them...

Had heard nothing to let me know what was going on.

Heard nothing back from them today.

Personally I found this to be the most annoying issue when dealing with Wayland, and the thing that had the most negative impact on my level of satisfaction.

I think that I (along with most other people) understand that delays happen, and am willing to forgive and wait patiently for an order. However! that is only the case when I know what is going on and feel I'm being kept in the loop.

In my dealings with Wayland, I often had this uneasy feeling that I had just been forgotten about, or that there was some huge problem with my order that they weren't telling me about, or that they just weren't interested in sorting out my order and were going to make me wait indefinitely, or that it had been lost in the post weeks ago and I just didn't know.

I'm not saying any of this is true, but when you don't hear anything it is disconcerting. I don't want to have to keep raising a ticket just to reassure myself that Wayland hasn't forgotten about me, or that they care about my order. I would like them to at least 'seem' like they are doing everything they can to get my order out. Maybe they are, but when I don't hear anything I just imagine them goofing off and generally being incompetent and it makes me feel angry.

I get the impression that you fellers are emailing Wayland, why not call them?

Emails while instantaneous in delivery are not differant than traditional mail; if there lots it needs to be cleared. Call and get imediate answers. I often call them (mostly to check availability before driving there) and the Wayland team are always very helpful.

To dismiss their staff as incompetent is wildly inaccurate and the diametric opposite of all my experiences using Wayland. Hell I can't think of any other companies that regularly post on forums to deal with issues raised.

Ranor wrote:

 Eggs wrote:
I disagree. When something is in stock, it is listed as in stock, with the number of units they have. If it's not in stock, it is listed as either available or unavailable, depending on, well, availability...

Seems clear enough to me.

^this

Available just means they can get them in from GW, not that it's in their stock. Usually this is items that are not commonly sold (HQ's, vehicles, etc) I presume.

We generally have a lot more stock than indicated, we have on site on average at any point over the last year nearly £750,000 of stock at cost price. Its just its allocated to orders already. If there is a specific number then there is unallocated stock available that if ordered should dispatch by the next day. We do have stock errors, but they are a very small % of the items we stock. An item might have been picked wrongly or put away in the wrong place. Mistakes do and will always happen, especially where only a fraction of the items in this industry do not have proper product codes or barcodes.

 Eggs wrote:
I disagree. When something is in stock, it is listed as in stock, with the number of units they have. If it's not in stock, it is listed as either available or unavailable, depending on, well, availability...

Seems clear enough to me.

Its funny, but I would have thought this too. Only I ordered FoW stuff that was all listed as "in stock" making sure to only select "in stock" items as I wanted them quickly and NONE of them were actually in stock!

rich1231 wrote:

Ranor wrote:

 Eggs wrote:
I disagree. When something is in stock, it is listed as in stock, with the number of units they have. If it's not in stock, it is listed as either available or unavailable, depending on, well, availability...

Seems clear enough to me.

^this

Available just means they can get them in from GW, not that it's in their stock. Usually this is items that are not commonly sold (HQ's, vehicles, etc) I presume.

We generally have a lot more stock than indicated, we have on site on average at any point over the last year nearly £750,000 of stock at cost price. Its just its allocated to orders already. If there is a specific number then there is unallocated stock available that if ordered should dispatch by the next day. We do have stock errors, but they are a very small % of the items we stock. An item might have been picked wrongly or put away in the wrong place. Mistakes do and will always happen, especially where only a fraction of the items in this industry do not have proper product codes or barcodes.

If it's allocated to orders already I'd say it's slightly disingenuous to call it "stock".
Or do you mean the allocated stuff doesn't make an item show up as "In Stock"? If that's the case then never mind.

 notprop wrote:

I get the impression that you fellers are emailing Wayland, why not call them?

Emails while instantaneous in delivery are not differant than traditional mail; if there lots it needs to be cleared. Call and get imediate answers. I often call them (mostly to check availability before driving there) and the Wayland team are always very helpful.

To dismiss their staff as incompetent is wildly inaccurate and the diametric opposite of all my experiences using Wayland. Hell I can't think of any other companies that regularly post on forums to deal with issues raised.

Calling isn't always an option. Wayland like many companies operate their phone lines during normal hours of business which also coincide with any working individual's hours of employment plus travel. I actually find the Wayland staff to be some of the best I've dealt with and I cannot fault their customer service once I get in touch with them, but it's the getting in touch with them that's part of the issue. Once I place an order I expect the company to process that order without me sitting over their shoulder badgering them about the status of said order. Once the window of time to be expected has been exceeded with no information then people will start to feel uneasy even more so if the item they ordered is marked 'Available'. A simple rule should be that unless you can pick an item off the shelf and drop it in a box or are otherwise expecting the item to be delivered in a forthcoming stock delivery (within 7 days) then the item isn't 'Available' it's 'Available to Order (typically 7-21 working days)'.

What most are asking for is an email update should the expected time window elapse (ie. order not dispatched/arrived at Wayland within 3-9 working days) and from Rich's answers and request this seems to be an issue with their automated email system.

I will say that since my previous post my order was confirmed to have arrived at Wayland and I received it the next working day (thanks Rich for sending the parcel via next day, it was very much appreciated).

So after 2 weeks of waiting for wayland to ship me dwarfs im officially done with them. Isnt there a reliable EU based webstore out there?

Dark sphere was mentioned, so maybe a alternative?

 Bla_Ze wrote:
So after 2 weeks of waiting for wayland to ship me dwarfs im officially done with them. Isnt there a reliable EU based webstore out there?

Dark sphere was mentioned, so maybe a alternative?

Nothing but good things from Triple Helix and Element games here, more limited choice and still takes a while but it got here.

 Bla_Ze wrote:
So after 2 weeks of waiting for wayland to ship me dwarfs im officially done with them. Isnt there a reliable EU based webstore out there?

Dark sphere was mentioned, so maybe a alternative?

Surely this isn't possible - you were of course emailed about the delay, right?

I've just received an email telling me that the order for some bases I placed almost twelve days ago is not actually in stock right now, and that sadly, this means I won't be receiving my item within the usual 3-9 working days.

I can't say I'm impressed. Considering I need these for Adepticon, I'm genuinely hoping that they arrive on time.

Ranor wrote:

 Bla_Ze wrote:
So after 2 weeks of waiting for wayland to ship me dwarfs im officially done with them. Isnt there a reliable EU based webstore out there?

Dark sphere was mentioned, so maybe a alternative?

Nothing but good things from Triple Helix and Element games here, more limited choice and still takes a while but it got here.

Another for Triple Helix here.

 Bla_Ze wrote:
So after 2 weeks of waiting for wayland to ship me dwarfs im officially done with them. Isnt there a reliable EU based webstore out there?

Dark sphere was mentioned, so maybe a alternative?

Troll Trader. But then they don't stock GW, so this advice may be of zero use to you.

Hi Guys Jake from Wayland here.

Just to clarify some points here.

As we are not a manufacturer we do have to reply upon a supply chain for items to fulfil orders. Sometimes Restrictions in Trade Terms, production delays or even items having to wait to clear customs can cause delays. Unfortunately if this does happen then your orders may be delayed. We do work closely with manufacturers and suppliers to minimise these delays, but they can still happen. It's not a perfect system and to be honest I don't think it ever will be, but we do everything in our power to make this as flawless as possible.

The automated email system is there to keep you up to date with your order. We feel it is better, as I am sure everyone would agree, to keep customers updated instead of letting them feel like they are sitting in the dark. We always welcome being contacted regarding orders, to either remove items to speed up the delivery or just to ask what items are missing. We will always do out best to answer any question as quickly and efficiently as possible.

I welcome anyone to contact us if they have a question regarding their order.
http://waylandgames.freshdesk.com/support/home

Regards
Jake

If the automated email service doesn't respond to tell me items are not in stock until nearly a fortnight after the order has been placed, it's a pretty poor system.

 Ketara wrote:
If the automated email service doesn't respond to tell me items are not in stock until nearly a fortnight after the order has been placed, it's a pretty poor system.

Yup. Simply hiding behind a third party email system (and making literally impossible claims) is clouding the already annoying issue about how they tag things available or not.

Clearly if something doesn't meet the 3-9 day window it should be changed to unavailable, right? Are those bases still listed as available?

 Ketara wrote:
If the automated email service doesn't respond to tell me items are not in stock until nearly a fortnight after the order has been placed, it's a pretty poor system.

The automatic email system will email you once the advised nine working days has passed. Within that timeframe we would still fully expect to be able to get the product out to you. We are looking at improving our communication even further by having the email let you know exactly what items are missing from your order.

rigeld2 wrote:

 Ketara wrote:
If the automated email service doesn't respond to tell me items are not in stock until nearly a fortnight after the order has been placed, it's a pretty poor system.

Yup. Simply hiding behind a third party email system (and making literally impossible claims) is clouding the already annoying issue about how they tag things available or not.

Clearly if something doesn't meet the 3-9 day window it should be changed to unavailable, right? Are those bases still listed as available?

If an item has not been delivered to us by our suppliers within the usual 3-9 working days it does not meant that it is unavailable, it has simply been delayed and the customer would have been sent an email to that effect. If an item is no longer in production or has been discontinued this is when it will be set to unavailable. Also any customer that is affected by an item becoming unavailable will be emailed directly and an alternative or refund provided.

Take the painted river set by Pegasus Hobbies for example. We do not currently have that product in our warehouse so it is not listed as Available (X Ready to Ship!). Not only that but it has to arrive via quite a convoluted supply chain and so is not set as Available (Typically ships in 3-9 working days) either. Instead we have given it the Special Order Item (Shipping Times May Vary) indicator.

We really do try and make things as clear to customers as we can, and yet even in this thread we have claims that things were listed as 'In Stock'. That description is not one we use. The closest to 'In Stock' would be the Available (X Ready to Ship!) which tells you we have available stock in our warehouse. But such is the quality of our supply chain and the excellent relationships we have with most of our suppliers that the Available (Typically ships in 3-9 working days) is in many cases just as reliable an indicator. This is evidenced by the hundreds of orders we pack and ship daily to our many satisfied customers.

We actively get involved in forums because this is the place that a vocal minority wish to communicate their thoughts (both positive and negative). But don't confuse the handful of commentators here as being a proportionate sample of our customers as a whole or we would have suffered the same fate as Maelstrom long ago.

We are one of the largest tabletop games retailers in the world and with that comes a responsibility to strive to improve the customer experience. By working hard to connect with our customers and being open and honest about learning from mistakes we have made, we aim to do just that. If this industry proves one thing, its that arrogance and complacency are guaranteed one way tickets to misfortune.

Regards
Jake @ Wayland

 Jake-Wayland wrote:
Take the painted river set by Pegasus Hobbies for example. We do not currently have that product in our warehouse so it is not listed as Available (X Ready to Ship!). Not only that but it has to arrive via quite a convoluted supply chain and so is not set as Available (Typically ships in 3-9 working days) either. Instead we have given it the Special Order Item (Shipping Times May Vary) indicator.

Even if it's a direct supply chain, how many times does the 3-9 working day (two week) window have to be missed for a specific product before it slips from Available to Special Order (which, in reality, is what all of the 3-9 day products are)?

We actively get involved in forums because this is the place that a vocal minority wish to communicate their thoughts (both positive and negative). But don't confuse the handful of commentators here as being a proportionate sample of our customers as a whole or we would have suffered the same fate as Maelstrom long ago.

Oh, I'm not. At all. Never said that. The fact that you're in business shows that the forums are a vocal minority.
That doesn't mean that I should just let silly things like your stock status and literally impossible email claims pass by though.

I think a lot of the frustration is that buying things listed as Available (regardless of the caveats) shouldn't be a gamble, and right now it is.
You have no idea when it's going to arrive at Wayland so the 3-9 working days is a "best guess" and a consumer has to just hope.
To me, that's dishonest. Not in a "Steal all the monies!" way, so please don't take it like that.

rigeld2 wrote:

We actively get involved in forums because this is the place that a vocal minority wish to communicate their thoughts (both positive and negative). But don't confuse the handful of commentators here as being a proportionate sample of our customers as a whole or we would have suffered the same fate as Maelstrom long ago.

Oh, I'm not. At all. Never said that. The fact that you're in business shows that the forums are a vocal minority.
That doesn't mean that I should just let silly things like your stock status and literally impossible email claims pass by though.

I think a lot of the frustration is that buying things listed as Available (regardless of the caveats) shouldn't be a gamble, and right now it is.
You have no idea when it's going to arrive at Wayland so the 3-9 working days is a "best guess" and a consumer has to just hope.
To me, that's dishonest. Not in a "Steal all the monies!" way, so please don't take it like that.

The 3-9 Working days is not a best guess, though you may seem that way, It is based on Sales Data and experience from thousands of previous orders and transactions. We aim to keep a standing stock of all main and most popular ranges, we would love to have the space and funds to keep everything in stock at all time. As this is not possible the typically ships in 3-9 workings days status is required.

We do not aim to be dishonest in any way, and feel that we are one of, if not the most approachable and open company in this market. Again if anyone has any questions regarding their order, we welcome them to contact our helpdesk system (http://waylandgames.freshdesk.com/support/home) and we will be happy to answer them as quickly and efficiently as possible.

Regards
Jake @ Wayland

I've had pretty good experience with Wayland. I recently had to make a couple of arrangements regarding my order with the customer service, and they were responded the next day and handled well.

If I'd make some suggestions, Wayland could be a bit more active in splitting the order in two packages if some of the stuff is delayed. I faced the situation that half of my order was in stock, while other half was delayed over the usual 3-9 days. I'd also like to see 'usual stocking delay' per manufacturer, as mentioned for GW in this thread. For example, FoW has experienced some stock supply issues lately, so it would be nice to see what can be expected and if there's a situation that's unusual.

Also, thanks to Wayland staff for taking time to answer questions on a forum such as this, I'm always happy to see there's communication between staff and customer base.

 Jake-Wayland wrote:

 Ketara wrote:
If the automated email service doesn't respond to tell me items are not in stock until nearly a fortnight after the order has been placed, it's a pretty poor system.

The automatic email system will email you once the advised nine working days has passed. Within that timeframe we would still fully expect to be able to get the product out to you. We are looking at improving our communication even further by having the email let you know exactly what items are missing from your order.

I'm sorry Jake. It's still poor customer service however you put it. Why? Because in a nutshell, it took you a week and a half after taking my money to tell me that you do not have the goods that I have just bought from you, and informed me of this in a highly impersonal way. It's as simple as that. Allow me to illustrate a similar experience I had with one of your competitors, Dark Sphere. About a year ago, I ordered a batch of GW Imperial Guard kits from them. Four days later, I had a polite gentleman ring me up, and tell me that half of my order was not in stock. He apologised profusely for the inconvenience, and gave me a range of options. He asked me if I wanted them to ship out what they had now and the rest later, ship it all together, or for them to refund me for what they did not have at the time.

I chose to wait for the whole batch, but I was a happy customer. Why? Because I was kept informed, the business seemed to care about retaining my custom, and I got offered a choice of ways to resolve the situation to my satisfaction. Comparatively speaking, Wayland has so far waited a week and a half, and then sent me an automated email.

Now this might be a one off, and so I've placed a second order with you chaps for roughly the same value as the first (around the sixty pound mark each). I'm interested to see if I hit the same snag. If so, I'll just order elsewhere in future, and will recommend to my friends that they do the same. Having said that, I do appreciate you engaging with me here on this Jake, but unfortunately, in the world of commerce, actions speak louder than words. Hopefully my second order will come through fast and with no problems, and then I can post to that effect.

Although I am planning on using my stuff over at Adepticon, so if I'm unable to get it dispatched within the next week or so, I'll simply have to cancel my order, request a refund, and buy elsewhere.

Excellent and speedy dispatch of items to the great white north! I ordered from them some Perry Mini's and some Hasslefree, no problems however a day later Wayland had a Heavy Gear sale, and I could NOT miss that one!
They ship fast and package well [A+++ and all that], both orders arrived within 2-3 days of each other + customs fee's for the Heavy Gear because the post office thought I was greedy, oops.

I find the store easy to navigate, excluding that stupid, GIGANTIC! drop-down menu that I always accidentally open, which blocks my view of what I'm looking at or even worse, makes me click on something that I don't want to.
Otherwise, they're great.

I previously posted in this thread with a rather positive leaning opinion of Wayland Games, but as I've just been told that having waited several months for a weekend based event till February at its gaming branch, only to be to told it was postponed to this weekend, and then have it postponed with no new date listed and with no explanation, I am extremely disappointed with Wayland.

The issue I have also extends to the fact that the managing of the event before it occurred was a joke - there was no PDF, only an event description with a basic outline of the overly complicated and unusual principle behind the campaign, missing information that is practically mandatory for running an event, such as the full extent of the permissions - for instance, there was no comment on whether data slates were allowed, and I only found out they weren't after I received a reply quite some time after I asked.

This is the second part of the event. You can see how poor the information is given quite clearly.

http://tabletopnation.simpletix.com/EventDetails/103/Time/91/

Your will need to bring your own troops; each army should consist of primary force of 1,500 points, with a secondary/reserve force of another 1,500 points.

From this you would never ascertain that all losses were permanent, and that all models in the secondary force would be rolled for to join the first - this is unexplained, and not well thought out, since there is no clause telling you that you can't exploit this to add a unit from the reserve force of greater points than what was lost, for example.

And call me blind and stupid, but 2-3 months ago I failed to attend a Kill Team event because at no point in the entire event description (essentially copy and pasted from GW's PDF) or event title was the 3 letter abbreviation "SAT" for saturday, or the word itself. Because of immense stress from unrelated circumstances at the time I then went on to miss the event, having fabricated the misconception that it was on a sunday on the same weekend instead.

There's another one right here with a duplicate description as well, to illustrate that I am not kidding.

http://tabletopnation.simpletix.com/EventDetails/108/Time/96/

At no point in the description does it tell you the day, just the date.

Frankly this is unacceptable.

You are correct OP, fayland games are indeed literally useless.

The delivery times are just terrible. I have made 3 orders with this company, each time I payed more for delivery than from most other retailers. The order took at least half a month to come. I particular my last order was made on 24th December and came on 24th man, both items in it were in stock at fayland. I currently have an order made last week that the shop appears to have no interest in sending me.