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Hello one and all. A rules question/interpretation for you.


Pedro Kantor: Chapter Tactics (Imperial Fists)
Captain Lysander: Chapter Tactics (Imperial Fists)

RAW 1: A Space Marine detachment chosen from this codex that has one set of Chapter Tactics may ally with another Space Marine detachment chosen from this codex that has a different set of Chapter Tactics.

RAW 2: Note that you may field models from two different Chapters that have the same Chapter Tactics in the same detachment - these Chapters are so closely affiliated that they count as a single army on the battlefield.

Statement 1: This means I can field both Kantor (Warlord) and Lysander together in the same detachment. Any models in that detachment who I nominate as 'Crimson Fists' benefit from that detachment benefit from 'Oath of Rynn' and 'Hold the Line'

- So Crimson Fist Sternguard re-rolling to hit and wound against Orks (Preferred Enemy) using Special Ammunition (While Chapter Tactics: Imperial Fists states that it doesn't affect Special Ammunition, Pedro's Oath of Rynn is used instead)

So that's a re-rollable:
2+ to wound on Hellfire Rounds, Vengeance Rounds and the other ammunition against Orks?

Statement 2: Lysander is able to run in the same detachment but as an Imperial Fist with a retinue of Imperial Fist Terminators, sharing the FOC with the Crimson Fists (so the primary detachments x3 Elite slots are shared in 1999pt lists) But do not benefit from Oath of Rynn themselves as they are Yellow rather than Blue daba de daba di.

Statement 3: Sergeant Telion may only be included as an upgrade for a scout in a detachment with Chapter Tactics: Ultramarines. In an allied detachment, I am able to add Telion (So Primary Detachment: Imperial Fists / Crimson Fists, Allied Detachment: Ultramarines) With Captain Sicaruis as that detachments HQ. The allied detachment using Chapter Tactics Ultramarines. Telion sitting on an Aegis line with an Icarus Lascannon / Quad gun re-rolling all rolls of 1 to hit (for a turn)

Statement 4: Imperial Fists, Crimson Fists and Ultramarines are Battle Brothers. All Crimson Fist Sternguard and all Troops count as Scoring from both detachments.


So, my question: Are each of my above statements correct? - as in, have I understood the rules for list building, ability effect and use of each unit?

Yes, all sort of correct (see below regarding #2)

For your allied detachment of Ultramarines you do not NEED to take a named Ultramarine HQ though. Any generic HQ given the Chapter Tactic : Ultramarines will make your allied detachment Ultramarines and allow you to take the Sgt Telion upgrade.

As to Crimson Fists/Imperial Fists, they are all Imperial Fists. If Kantor is your Warlord, they're Crimson Fists (CT : Imperial Fists). Lysander's rules become irrelevant to the rest of the army in this case as he would not be your warlord. All your primary detachment would benefit from Oath of Rynn as they are ALL Crimson Fists since Kantor is your Warlord (Lysander himself does not lead any of your army, he'd just be an extra HQ model with his own personal benefits).

Awesome! Thanks for the reply, I was worried I was missing bits out (so many rules!)

Would this mean that Lysander is able to start the game attached to a squad of Terminators / Deep Strike with them in the same group? (Probably a more obvious question that I'm failing to find an answer to in the BRB)

RAW: Battle Brothers are treated as 'friendly units' from all points of view. This means, for example, that Battle Brothers: Can be joined by allied Independent Characters

I'm guessing that if this is the case, Lysanders friends benefit from 'Oath of Rynn' while Lysander himself doesn't?

 Wulfmar wrote:
Awesome! Thanks for the reply, I was worried I was missing bits out (so many rules!)

Would this mean that Lysander is able to start the game attached to a squad of Terminators / Deep Strike with them in the same group? (Probably a more obvious question that I'm failing to find an answer to in the BRB)

RAW: Battle Brothers are treated as 'friendly units' from all points of view. This means, for example, that Battle Brothers: Can be joined by allied Independent Characters

I'm guessing that if this is the case, Lysanders friends benefit from 'Oath of Rynn' while Lysander himself doesn't?

Because Lysander and Pedro are in the same detachment with the same chapter tactics, for rules purposes they are not allies to each other. Lysander and Pedro can freely attach and ride in transports and if Pedro is the warlord, Lysander would benefit from Oath of Rynn. You can have the models painted differently for hobby purposes, but rules wise they are both Imperial Fists in the same detachment.

That's even better than I had expected / understood!


Thanks to you both for the clarification