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If you're selling stuff as 'boutique' resins I think them being 35mm (as opposed to 30-32) is not a major issue,

having 'heroes' slightly larger than rank and file is something I'm perfectly OK with, and I'm very unlikely to pay boutique prices for rank and file

so stick to your plans I say, while Azazalx is right about it putting off some they are unlikely to be the people you need to grab (the paint and display crowd) to make a success of this

I will pass because of the 35mm scale.If 35 mm is the new norm, I'm done with buying and collecting miniatures.

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
If you're selling stuff as 'boutique' resins I think them being 35mm (as opposed to 30-32) is not a major issue,

having 'heroes' slightly larger than rank and file is something I'm perfectly OK with, and I'm very unlikely to pay boutique prices for rank and file

so stick to your plans I say, while Azazalx is right about it putting off some they are unlikely to be the people you need to grab (the paint and display crowd) to make a success of this

It really depends on what he's doing. I'd agree that for some heroes, and especially those that are obviously monsters like the Not-Spider-Man Not-Rogues' Gallery there it wouldn't matter at all. For actual humans, it becomes more of a concern. You'd best watch out for The Mouse though - he owns Marvel these days, and he's well known for being litigious...

Regarding the scale, I fully understand that some people will not be interested in these figures simply because of that and I am fine with that, but if someone want to use any of these figures for whatever reason I am fine with that, too, wether it be as a proxy for some other gaming system, for painting or just to because they consider them to be nice miniatures. The mutated faction will, mainly, be more of a creature-influenced design (some would be slightly larger), while the others (initially viking-influenced and asian-influenced) mainly will be human-design and they will be of the 35 mm scale. But, again, I am not really too concerned about if some people are ruled out because of the size. Kingdom Death and Arena Rex, just to mention a few, have influenced the direction of which scale to go for. And I know it's a highly personal opinion of what scale people tend to enjoy.

Regarding Marvel and what-not, all I can say is that people see what they want to see, and not what it actually might be. These characters will be independent characters in a fantasy setting that I am writing. The character concepts that have been showed thus far are for a faction in the world that have been exposed by mutation through many generations - and these mutations have, obviously, changed their bodies, but it has also warped their mind so that they have become something of a twisted faction. There are, of course, influences and inspiration, and some of it comes from Rackham's Confrontation (Drune and Mid-Nor in particular) and Games-Workshop's Fantasy (Chaos in particular), but while those are focused around larger themes, I want to focus on small, skirmish-kind of groups.


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There have been a few people asking for a picture of the actual resin miniature, so this is for you guys that are interested in such things.

I hope you agree with me that the quality looks pretty ace, especially considered it's blown up in size so all possible flaws would be visable.

grefven wrote:
Regarding the scale, I fully understand that some people will not be interested in these figures simply because of that and I am fine with that, but if someone want to use any of these figures for whatever reason I am fine with that, too, wether it be as a proxy for some other gaming system, for painting or just to because they consider them to be nice miniatures. The mutated faction will, mainly, be more of a creature-influenced design (some would be slightly larger), while the others (initially viking-influenced and asian-influenced) mainly will be human-design and they will be of the 35 mm scale. But, again, I am not really too concerned about if some people are ruled out because of the size. Kingdom Death and Arena Rex, just to mention a few, have influenced the direction of which scale to go for. And I know it's a highly personal opinion of what scale people tend to enjoy.

Regarding Marvel and what-not, all I can say is that people see what they want to see, and not what it actually might be. These characters will be independent characters in a fantasy setting that I am writing. The character concepts that have been showed thus far are for a faction in the world that have been exposed by mutation through many generations - and these mutations have, obviously, changed their bodies, but it has also warped their mind so that they have become something of a twisted faction. There are, of course, influences and inspiration, and some of it comes from Rackham's Confrontation (Drune and Mid-Nor in particular) and Games-Workshop's Fantasy (Chaos in particular), but while those are focused around larger themes, I want to focus on small, skirmish-kind of groups.


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There have been a few people asking for a picture of the actual resin miniature, so this is for you guys that are interested in such things.

I hope you agree with me that the quality looks pretty ace, especially considered it's blown up in size so all possible flaws would be visable.

I hope I don't come off as an ass, but if I do, so be it.

1) Your concepts need more work. Much more work. Right now, "medieval versions of spiderman villains" is the only thing I see. There is nothing unique about them, and it seems like you just took some well known concepts and tweaked them. In a business where IP is everything, this is dangerous.

2) The sculpt does in no way justify the scale. I'm sorry if I'm being rude, but it's just not a very good sculpt. The details are very rough (the pattern on the hip armour), the muscles aren't well defined, the eyes are crooked, there's visible file marks around him, and the "loincloth" leather straps seem very thick. The teeth could be much better as well, seeing as they are a central focal point of the model. This would be a great amateurs project. I would not pay money for this model, in this day and age, where you can get amazing sculpts that are standard 28 mm. Just look at some coolmini models, Rackham, etc. You have to realize that you are competing against quality and a level of detail like this:



Once again, I'm not trying to be rude, but if you want to succeed in this (even as a hobby-business), you NEED to have great, unique concepts and/or great executions of said concepts. Right now, you have neither. If I were you, I'd team up with a great sculptor, and redefine the concepts, before sinking any more money into what seems to me, is a tweaked rip off of spiderman villains.

Just my 2 cents.

I have to agree with the lack of interest in non28mm models. I'm always on the lookout for cool sculpts that I can put into an Inquisitor warband, or use for unique or special characters in my armies. The 35mm models, while nice enough, are not useful to me on their own. If there is no way for me to use them for another game, then they better be part of a killer game system of their own.

In short, if they were 28mm I could buy and use them right now, until your system comes out (providing funding for you to flesh out further creatures and the game). At 35mm, I look, and then move on.

 GuitaRasmus wrote:

I hope I don't come off as an ass, but if I do, so be it.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion, so don't worry about it.

 GuitaRasmus wrote:

1) Your concepts need more work. Much more work. Right now, "medieval versions of spiderman villains" is the only thing I see. There is nothing unique about them, and it seems like you just took some well known concepts and tweaked them. In a business where IP is everything, this is dangerous.

As I wrote above, you see what you want to see and that's alright with me. There will be influences and inspiration no matter where you look (Zombicide comes to mind - One person see a copy of another character or famous person while others see them simply as survivors). Honestly, I am not looking for something unique that will find a new market, but rather something that would cater to an existing one.

 GuitaRasmus wrote:

2) The sculpt does in no way justify the scale. I'm sorry if I'm being rude, but it's just not a very good sculpt. The details are very rough (the pattern on the hip armour), the muscles aren't well defined, the eyes are crooked, there's visible file marks around him, and the "loincloth" leather straps seem very thick. The teeth could be much better as well, seeing as they are a central focal point of the model. This would be a great amateurs project. I would not pay money for this model, in this day and age, where you can get amazing sculpts that are standard 28 mm. Just look at some coolmini models, Rackham, etc.

Here I disagree with you, but bear with me a bit, I am a bit biased obviously. Anyway, the picture is blown up to, what, 5-6 times the actual size, and that would obviously mean that a lot of details look different than what they would on the actual miniature when you have it in hand. The miniature is sculpted by Roberto Chaudon, who is, in my opinion at least, one of the best traditional miniature sculptors on the market right now. I couldn't possibly be more happy about it.

 GuitaRasmus wrote:

You have to realize that you are competing against quality and a level of detail like this:

Spoiler:

You do realize that that particular figure you just showed is huge, right? It might be in a "28 mm scale" but a huge one and larger than the one I just showed.

 GuitaRasmus wrote:

Once again, I'm not trying to be rude, but if you want to succeed in this (even as a hobby-business), you NEED to have great, unique concepts and/or great executions of said concepts. Right now, you have neither. If I were you, I'd team up with a great sculptor, and redefine the concepts, before sinking any more money into what seems to me, is a tweaked rip off of spiderman villains.

You are not rude at all, so no need to apologize for it. There will be several great sculptors working on this project, so I have no fear in the quality of it. Roberto Chaudon, Juan Navarro Perez, Patrick Masson, Jody Siegel, Luc Pinganaud just to mention a few.

 GuitaRasmus wrote:

Just my 2 cents.

All opinions are valuable to me, even if I disagree with most of them. Thanks for letting me know anyway!

I do agree that the eyes on the "Not-Venom" (What should we call him?) are a little off. Other than that, no complaints. But since Venom can't morph his limbs, I'd think it'd be more a "Not-Carnage".

Just my comic-nerd two cents.

The eyes, teeth and tongue are what contribute to looking like Venom. The teeth and tongue may be fine by themselves but if you add in the eyes, the first thing that comes to mind is Venom. You could technically keep the eyes and change the mouth and it would look less like Venom. Although the eyes just don't make sense to me from a creature standpoint. Is he mutant, human, why are his eyes like that? I know it can be argued that with Venom it doesn't make sense either which is true but it was a suit that surrounded someone, where your design is obviously just the skin.

grefven wrote:
As I wrote above, you see what you want to see and that's alright with me. There will be influences and inspiration no matter where you look (Zombicide comes to mind - One person see a copy of another character or famous person while others see them simply as survivors). Honestly, I am not looking for something unique that will find a new market, but rather something that would cater to an existing one.

Influences and inspiration are understandable. In the case of Zombicide, they weren't influenced or inspired by the original creatures, those are flat out parodies. There is a difference when you parody something vs becoming influenced/inspired by something. Personally I like the sculpt but I don't see anything that could be done with 35mm that couldn't be done with 28-30mm scale (just look at Infinity miniatures for the details accomplished). If you are trying to cater to an existing one, then you would need to be in the 28mm (normal) - 32mm (heroic) range rather than 35mm. If you are trying to cater to an existing market, what market are you targeting with your miniatures?

 Dark Severance wrote:


[...]

grefven wrote:
Honestly, I am not looking for something unique that will find a new market, but rather something that would cater to an existing one.

If you are trying to cater to an existing one, then you would need to be in the 28mm (normal) - 32mm (heroic) range rather than 35mm. If you are trying to cater to an existing market, what market are you targeting with your miniatures?

Thanks for your opinion.

The quote above is taken slightly out of context, or rather, I should have been more clear with what I was refering to. Anyway, let me explain what I was meaning when I wrote that I wanted to reach an existing market to target: I wasn't talking about the miniatures themselves, but the opinion raised by another user was that the concepts were nothing unique and offered nothing new and special. To this comment I replied that I am not trying to find the "next big thing" when it comes to new ideas, new styles, new settings, etc. When I wrote that I was targeting an already existing market with these concepts, I was trying to say that I am targeting the "general fantasy market". That is the target - those that enjoy fantasy in general.

 Dark Severance wrote:

Personally I like the sculpt but I don't see anything that could be done with 35mm that couldn't be done with 28-30mm scale (just look at Infinity miniatures for the details accomplished).

Thanks. I like the sculpt too, and I think that Roberto Chaudon has done an amazing job with it. Anyway, yes, there is nothing that couldn't have been done with it in the 28-30 mm scale, I totally agree (not only Infinity, but RBG is an even better example, which I am a huge fan of), and if I wanted to reach the larger market I should have gone with that scale. But this is the vision I have of it, so I will have to stay on its course. And as a most personal opinion, I favour the slightly larger scale to the slightly smaller. Yes, again, not the best decision seen from a business point of view, but to be honest, I am just happy if I see this tiny project to get out there.

And, even though I am working on the game mechanics for a small, easy-to-learn and fast-to-play skirmish game, I would be more than happy if only a handful of painters and a handful of collectors would want to pick up one or two miniatures of the small range I am aiming to get done.

@grefven I really like and support what you are doing. The mini is nice looking and dynamic enough for what people usually want imo, also the picture of the resin version shown above gives me the impression that the photo is probably either not taken well and/or the surfaces haven't been completely smoothed. The larger the scale, the more detail the sculptor can put on the model like GuitaRasmus and other people very well know, I don't know what the size of the other mini pictured is, but if they are not the same size then the comparison is unjust. In addition, what I'm more interested when comparing 2 similar-sized products (like the ones in the pictures shown, although this might have simply been a bad example, I'm not familiar with either of these) is
1. How true to the Concept Artwork the final sculpts have been
2. What the final presentation of the models will be (professionaly painted, well photographed, if possible with either 360 degree view or multiple pics from various angles)
3. What the final miniatures that land in my hands really looks like
4. How easy it is (even from reviews or comments from other people) to assemble and paint these minis (if everyone says it's easy and I don't, then the fault probbaly lies in me ;-) )
5. And last -but not least- what the price of each one is.

I'm sure that if your miniature/-s have these points covered with what else -similar- may be out there, then tread carelessly and with a wide&broad smile on your face. Just my opinion :-)

Thanks Shieldwolf! Your opinion and thoughts are very valuable. You guys know yourself the process and difficulties that one is going through when it comes to something like this kind of small project. I will get a few other pictures of the resin miniature along with some size differences of some other well-known miniatures for scale. But it'll take a few more days for that.

On another note, I just read on Kickstarter that launching projects with that platform will now be available from Sweden. I've been on the fence regarding how to exactly approach the funding bit, but with KS finally being an option, I will launch a small campaign of my own to see if there are enough interest in this project to have it funded. It would, obviously, be a very small project that I aim to have fullfilled smoothly and quickly to build up some track-record within the community.

I liek what you've shown so far - cool stuff!

I'd love to have a medieval fantasy not-Mysterio and not-Jack-O'Lantern!

Personally I do see some influences from certain comic characters and I do prefer 30mm myself, however I like what you are doing here and overall I like it and as to the 35mm issue seems to be a few games heading into that scale.

So good luck with your project

 xXWeaponPrimeXx wrote:
But since Venom can't morph his limbs, I'd think it'd be more a "Not-Carnage".

Just my comic-nerd two cents.

Venom most certainly can morph his limbs, he just chooses not to most of the time. He did it pretty regularly in the 90's comics while living in San Francisco. His decision to keep humanoid limbs had mostly to do with Eddie's desire to be seen as a hero and not a monster.


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grefven wrote:
Regarding Marvel and what-not, all I can say is that people see what they want to see, and not what it actually might be.

I think it's more that you have a different connection to the artwork and thus subconsciously choose not to see it. I think the fact that so many people are making that connection should clue you in to them being closer to that interpretation than you'll allow yourself to see.

That said, there's nothing wrong with having obviously inspired models. I think the idea of Fantasy Sinister Six and other such things is awesome.

If you hit Swedish KS when it goes live I'm certainly in for some of these (maybe all, depends on the costs)

 Platuan4th wrote:

 xXWeaponPrimeXx wrote:
But since Venom can't morph his limbs, I'd think it'd be more a "Not-Carnage".

Just my comic-nerd two cents.

Venom most certainly can morph his limbs, he just chooses not to most of the time. He did it pretty regularly in the 90's comics while living in San Francisco. His decision to keep humanoid limbs had mostly to do with Eddie's desire to be seen as a hero and not a monster.

So he does. Huh.... Didn't know that.

 Malika2 wrote:
Really digging the miniature, and your project/ambition is pretty cool!

Two things that kinda worry me:

1) Name: Corvus Corax might be part of GW's IP, and might end up working against you eventually. I'd try to go for another name.

2) Scale: I'm not fully convinced yet with the 35mm size. Why wouldn't it be possible to give the same level of attention/detail to a miniature of about 30-32mm (modern "28mm scale" stuff tends to be around 30mm to 32mm tall)? Using a more conventional scale will mean the miniatures will have a wider appeal. I don't think you can (or should want to) stop people from wanting to use your miniatures as proxies for other ranges. That's just how these things go I guess.

Beyond that, keep up the good work!

As a note, putting them together might be trouble, however...

Corvus Corax is the latin for Common Raven.

Corvus being the latin name for the Genus that it belongs to, Corax being the appendix to that name to denote the species.

It isn't faux latin or anything, just GW using already established names.

My project is slowly soldiering on; I've got the goal of which I want to achive in my sight, albeit it is still quite in the far distance. Not much progress to show in terms of news, but I figured I could show another painted WIP of the mutated with claw character. It looks pretty darn awesome, in my opinion, and I love to see how these miniatures turn out painted.

Oooh, that looks pretty damn great. Nice!

I agree that in context of the large spread of spiderman-inspired characters, it looks a bit less original than the single model. I'm all for taking inspiration where you find it, but the immediacy with which they were recognizable might be threatening as the basis for your setting.

Interesting stuff, I'll be paying attention to this...

(first post in thread edited with new pictures, too)

I know I've been slow with some actual new information or any new pictures, but here I've got a second character ready to be shown. I hope you guys like it, personally I find it very enjoyable (but then again, I really should, shouldn't I? :p).

Anyway, this is another character for the Outcast faction. This character, in particular, features huge muscles and incredible strength and is a sheer force to be reckon with in battle. However, the mutation has taken a heavy toll on his mind, and dumbed him considerably to the degree that he is a liability for the rest of the tribe. This has led to that he is chained, with wicked spikes driven into his body to secure them, only to let loose in times of conflict, where his anger brings great authority to the battle.

This is an image of the resin copy without any cleaning done to show the quality, which I think is really good.

Anyway, I hope I will have a painted version ready to show in a while.

That's a nice, meaty brute; I like him! My first impression was that he kind of looks like a Roman gladiator gone Hulk, but some elements look a bit more sci-fi, so I'm not exactly sure how to place him.

There are a few details that look slightly rough (is that a nipple?). Is this Roberto Chaudon like your other mini?

I like these minis but throwing money at the screen isn't working. How can I get these two mutant dudes guys?

I like how the mini didn't use the bizarre sci-fi elements in the concept art for the most part. Looks at place as some sort of d&d Frankenstein's monster. I dig it.

 Trodax wrote:
That's a nice, meaty brute; I like him! My first impression was that he kind of looks like a Roman gladiator gone Hulk, but some elements look a bit more sci-fi, so I'm not exactly sure how to place him.

There are a few details that look slightly rough (is that a nipple?). Is this Roberto Chaudon like your other mini?

The setting of the "world" that I am working on is a low fantasy-world, quite dark and gloomy, that is more heavily leaning towards beasts than high elves and wizards. That is a nipple indeed that you are seeing, but bear in mind that the picture is blown up quite a bit. It doesn't look rough in person.

This one has been sculpted by Luc Pinganaud (I'll have another one done by him to show, and I also have another one by Roberto Chaudon - can possibly get one or two photos up by next week).

 Lockark wrote:
I like these minis but throwing money at the screen isn't working. How can I get these two mutant dudes guys?

I like how the mini didn't use the bizarre sci-fi elements in the concept art for the most part. Looks at place as some sort of d&d Frankenstein's monster. I dig it.

I am possibly leaning towards a very small and limited kickstarter either later this year or possibly early next year, but not sure how well it would fare. The problem with such a small project like this kind is that the development is extremely slow as all fund has thus far come out of my normal wage (and to no surprise to anyone, life as we know it comes with expenses of its own). A successful kickstarter would allow me to advance the project a bit faster. But I don't know yet how to approach it the best. I can't say I am too experienced with that part of the business.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I've recieved a few painted copies of some pre-production casts, and I wanted to show you how this particular figure can look painted up. I hope you guys enjoy, and hopefully stay tune and I'll post some other pictures over the coming nearest time.

Very interesting! Thanks for sharing the pics... I think the camera angle is playing tricks on my eyes as his left arm (so on the right side of the front-view pics) looks too short... but I think it's just bent and blending in in the photo.

It does look very nice painted up; would make a fine flesh golem or somesuchthing for D&D. I'm interested!

 Ken Oakley wrote:
I will pass because of the 35mm scale.If 35 mm is the new norm, I'm done with buying and collecting miniatures.

I am curious what the big issue is with 35mm miniatures? After picking up Wild West Exodus and some Knight Miniatures, I'm not seeing anything that makes them better or worse than the 28-32mm range. They also still work with existing terrain.

I actually hope Grevfen will make these up to 40mm - it's a perfect size for someone with failing eyesight and arthritis.

Regarding of scale, I got a question earlier for a reference shot. This is the master sculpt, but in greyscale, so the image is a bit dark, but I hope it's good enough to give a decent idea of the size, at least. I'll get around of getting some better scale shots eventually.