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 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 th3maninblak wrote:
Not playing with special characters seems a bit silly to me. Theyre a huge part of the game. Its like limiting it to a single detachment and one book all the time.

Good for you. Some of us like to make our own characters, or feel that special characters are a crutch, or have our own armies/fluff in which special characters don't fit.

Or, to put another way, different people like different things. Doesn't make 'em silly (unless they're a furry).

Thank you. Exactly this...I feel that not using SCs is such a common thing, it surprises me every time when people are writing such replies.

 Thud wrote:

 DarthOvious wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 th3maninblak wrote:
Any mention of changes to red thirst/descent of angels? And any word on what the Hammer of Baal does?

Nope. It only has one small image of two pages, one with the Formation's special rules and the other with equipment. The rules for the Hammer of Baal are likely on Karlaen's data sheet.

At least now we are getting some rules that should be in the new codex. The next couple of weeks is going to be a nightmare for me. Especially since I fly out to Thailand for 5 weeks on the 12th of December so the codex will be getting released as I'm on a plane. I am going to try and get the limited edition sent to my local store and see about getting a normal copy of the codex sent to me in Thailand where I am staying.

You could just buy it in Thailand, you know...

I thought about that first but when I checked Games Workshop webstore there isn't an independent retailer in Thailand. I'm sure there used to be though, so I don't know if it's no longer there or just not appearing on the webstore.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Neronoxx wrote:

 Thud wrote:

 DarthOvious wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 th3maninblak wrote:
Any mention of changes to red thirst/descent of angels? And any word on what the Hammer of Baal does?

Nope. It only has one small image of two pages, one with the Formation's special rules and the other with equipment. The rules for the Hammer of Baal are likely on Karlaen's data sheet.

At least now we are getting some rules that should be in the new codex. The next couple of weeks is going to be a nightmare for me. Especially since I fly out to Thailand for 5 weeks on the 12th of December so the codex will be getting released as I'm on a plane. I am going to try and get the limited edition sent to my local store and see about getting a normal copy of the codex sent to me in Thailand where I am staying.

You could just buy it in Thailand, you know...

Coughcoughsupportinglocalbusinesscoughcough

local business is a bit tricky for me. I am going to Thailand to see my wife and son, hence why I am going for 5 weeks and we do actually have a house out there. So it is kind of local depending on what way you want to look at it.

Sounds local enough!

 warboss wrote:
I know, right? It's almost like single book/detachment was like how it was played for 15 years straight, right? Oh, yeah... single book and single detachment was the standard for 15 years back when GW wasn't shrinking year on year in sales.

Except for every previous edition that allowed allies or multiple book armies. Which was all of them...

Has anybody worked out the approximate points costs of the BA and Tyranid forces in the Deathstorm box?

 pretre wrote:

 warboss wrote:
I know, right? It's almost like single book/detachment was like how it was played for 15 years straight, right? Oh, yeah... single book and single detachment was the standard for 15 years back when GW wasn't shrinking year on year in sales.

Except for every previous edition that allowed allies or multiple book armies. Which was all of them...

What was allowed before is nothing compared with now. If you can't see the difference between a grand total of three codex books from 3rd edition allowing allies from completely different codex books into a limited subset of armies and complete and utter "freedom" to take anything from anywhere... well.. there isn't much I can say that will bring you back to reality. Daemon/Witchhunter plus one other imperial codex or using Craftworld Eldar supplement with the Eldar codex are not the same thing as a space marine, dark eldar, Inquistion, ork, tau, and chaos alliance in one army that is possible now both in battleforged and unbound.

 Thraxas Of Turai wrote:
Has anybody worked out the approximate points costs of the BA and Tyranid forces in the Deathstorm box?

Wondering the same here, I know exact values are a no no, but if someone could say if the forces are balanced points wise ?

Someone could probably work out the nids points, but we won't be reliably able to compare the BA until the box lands as DC will probably be having a major overhaul, Termies will probably something in line with the SM dex.

D

 Thraxas Of Turai wrote:
Has anybody worked out the approximate points costs of the BA and Tyranid forces in the Deathstorm box?

Used Army-builder, no rules or stats listed:

BA points, no real idea, given that they are currently way off from the new SM standards.
135+ for the captain (TDA Captain with Thunder Hammer)
215 for a Terminator squad with heavy flamer and chainfist
260 currently price for that DC squad (packs, 1 PF, 1 TH, 1 PW, 1 Infernius Pistol). I'd guess closer to 210 in the new book (call it 20 base, +5 for packs, weapons stay the same)
140 currently for DC dread with talons and magna grapple. I'd guess talons will go to a 5 or 10 point per arm upgrade, so somewhere in the 150-160 range in the new book.

Tyranid points:
60+ points for a named Broodlord HQ Probably closer to 90-100
144 points for 8 genestealers with Scytals
185 for Warriors with 1 Venom cannon, 1 lashwhip/bonesword, 1 dual boneswords, and adrenal glands
145 (165) for carnifex with H Venom cannon and spine banks (+20 more as he looks like he has bioplasma)

As shown, the BA look to have something like a 150 point advantage, assuming pricing changes in the new book, but the Carnifex and warriors as well as Death Company can all rapidly get more expensive depending on builds.

 Theophony wrote:
A switch to 32mm just seems like a you to all the companies out there like dragonforge design, secret weapons and others who have all these custom 25mm bases set up. They've gone after every other company that gets sales off of their goods trying to make them jump through hoops.

Oh gak, I think you're on to something here. Wow.

 the_Armyman wrote:

 Azreal13 wrote:
Blood Yell?

Blood. Yell.

Even if this is some mistranslation and it's Blood Shout or some thing, I mean, srsly?

Why is this even a surprise at this point? Sometimes, I like to imagine that the writers in the Studio have a running bet as to who can slip the most uses of a given buzzword past management. Hearty guffaws and more than a few quid are exchanged down at the local pub every time a new codex makes it to the printers.

But then I look at a campaign boxed set named "Deathstorm" and I realize that we're the ones being laughed at over a pint.

Are we sure sure it's not a misprint of "Bloody 'ell!"?
Maybe Karlean saw the price of the new codex...

 Paradigm wrote:
Are we sure sure it's not a misprint of "Bloody 'ell!"?
Maybe Karlean saw the price of the new codex...

Very droll, Sir

Sorry but from which pic did "Blood Yell" come from originally?

 Quarterdime wrote:

 Theophony wrote:
A switch to 32mm just seems like a you to all the companies out there like dragonforge design, secret weapons and others who have all these custom 25mm bases set up. They've gone after every other company that gets sales off of their goods trying to make them jump through hoops.

Oh gak, I think you're on to something here. Wow.

That makes the most sense regarding why GW has released new base sizes. Have no idea if it is true or not, but it fits in the way I see GW conducting business.

 LutherMax wrote:

 Paradigm wrote:
Are we sure sure it's not a misprint of "Bloody 'ell!"?
Maybe Karlean saw the price of the new codex...

Very droll, Sir

Sorry but from which pic did "Blood Yell" come from originally?

I will have to find the page number later, but it is a very tiny image at the bottom of the page in WD.


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 Thraxas Of Turai wrote:
Has anybody worked out the approximate points costs of the BA and Tyranid forces in the Deathstorm box?

I am getting somewhere in the realm of 800 pts for the BA using the old rules. The numbers change if you use some of the rules from C:SM for the Captain and Terminators though. The Termies have at least two chainfists and a heavy flamer. DC have a thunder hammer, a power fist, a power sword, and an inferno pistol. DC Dread has blood talons and a magna grapple.

 Carnage43 wrote:

DarthOvious wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
Blood Talons appear to be AP 2. It is really small writing, hence why I am unsure if it is Blood Yell as well.

So let me correct myself. Blood Talon is Strx2, AP2 , Melee, Shred, Specialist Weapon.

Sweet, then I am OK with that rule. We lose all the extra attacks when we cause wounds but at least it is now at a good AP and we can re-roll wounds.

Paradigm wrote:So they're a straight upgrade to the fists: you lose nothing and gain Shred. Seems fair if the cost is right.

The "Blood fists" server literally zero purpose now though if talons are as stated. They are just straight up better in every respect.

Not to mention watered down as hell.

We are missing information here, or the rules represents here are for "Blood Fists" and not talons.

Something doesn't seem quite right, but then this is GW we're talking about.

The Muderfang is S7 AP2 with it's claws, and this would be the first claw to double strength ?

Shred seems kinda pointless on S10, as you're only really re-rolling 1's.
Depending on the cost of claws vs fists, you're only ever going to take one or the other. Cheap and you'll always take claws. Expensive and you'll always take fists.

I am not discounting the possibility of the Blood Talon being +2 not ×2.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
I am not discounting the possibility of the Blood Talon being +2 not ×2.

And furiosos are S6 base right? So S8 ap2. Pretty cool. Depends on the price really though. Shred in this case would only be useful against high T units like MCs, so maybe...

That makes more sense if Blood fists remain x2 S.

D

There is a greater version of the Wolf Claw that is Stx2, AP 2, Melee, Specialist, Shred in the wolf codex. Murderfangs claws are different.

Sounds like the Blood Talon will match the super Wolf Claw rather than Murderfang's Murderclaws.

Jefffar wrote:
There is a greater version of the Wolf Claw that is Stx2, AP 2, Melee, Specialist, Shred in the wolf codex. Murderfangs claws are different.

Sounds like the Blood Talon will match the super Wolf Claw rather than Murderfang's Murderclaws.

You forgot "of Murder"....

Either way I am planning on getting the Box Set I can use everything, even the Terminators. The Dread will also make a good Proxy for Murderfang. The Nids will just go to the Nid Player.

 warboss wrote:

 pretre wrote:

 warboss wrote:
I know, right? It's almost like single book/detachment was like how it was played for 15 years straight, right? Oh, yeah... single book and single detachment was the standard for 15 years back when GW wasn't shrinking year on year in sales.

Except for every previous edition that allowed allies or multiple book armies. Which was all of them...

What was allowed before is nothing compared with now. If you can't see the difference between a grand total of three codex books from 3rd edition allowing allies from completely different codex books into a limited subset of armies and complete and utter "freedom" to take anything from anywhere... well.. there isn't much I can say that will bring you back to reality. Daemon/Witchhunter plus one other imperial codex or using Craftworld Eldar supplement with the Eldar codex are not the same thing as a space marine, dark eldar, Inquistion, ork, tau, and chaos alliance in one army that is possible now both in battleforged and unbound.

I wasn't saying it was exactly the same as before; I said that allies existed and hence your declarative statement was incorrect 'single book/detachment was how it was played for 15 years...'. Because it was.

And I said it was the standard, not that it was impossible to play otherwise. You may be surprised to find that rules/statements can have minority exceptions and yet still be true. In any case, it's derailing the thread so I'm done discussing it.

That's right, run...

Anyone got more info on the SOB detachments yet?

Whatever, It's more unusual when this thread stays on topic.

 pretre wrote:

Anyone got more info on the SOB detachments yet?

Is it confirmed that there are SOB detachments in it? I saw someone post some SOB art though.

Not that I've seen. There's sob missions and fluff though.

There was no datasheets or detachments in Shield of Baal: Leviathan except for Tyranids.

Missions? There definitely are some Sisters ones in there, and the fluff book has quite a bit about the Sisters.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

Good for you. Some of us like to make our own characters, or feel that special characters are a crutch, or have our own armies/fluff in which special characters don't fit.

Or, to put another way, different people like different things. Doesn't make 'em silly (unless they're a furry).

Sure. And no one is forcing you to use special characters. You are free to use them or not to use them, and so should your opponent.

Oh lord, take the special character talk to PMs if you all want to make a fuss about who does what or doesn't do what. Unless you live by each other and play each other it doesn't matter, you have no impact on each other.

So, to swing us back, pre-orders go up tomorrow (about 18 hours from now), right?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
So, to swing us back, pre-orders go up tomorrow (about 18 hours from now), right?

Friday night GMT it should be. I'm still in two minds if I should pick it up or not.