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niv-mizzet wrote:
http://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Contact-Us

Sent in an email letting them know I won't be buying any GW product while the oversight about BA assault marines not being troops exists. Suggested that they could simply errata them to recover me as a customer.

If you are also one of the ones affected, or you just want to chime in because you might be affected by something similar (such as bikes not being troops for white scars, or necron immortals jumping out of troops section, etc,) then here's the only place I found to go to to send them some feedback.

You`ll get a basic run of the mill reply and that`ll be that

Sadly, most of the recent books seem to lose the FOC shifting thing, usually replaced with a special FOC that focuses on that particular slot.

For example, Space Wolves losing "Wolf Guard become troops" on Logan, but then getting the "Champions of Fenris" FOC that focuses on Elites over Troops.

Hopefully Blood Angels see something similar, so Jump Blood Angel armies can play as they want to again.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

SolentSanguine wrote:
So, Heavy Flamers are assault weapons. A BA Tac squad can put out 3 templates (maybe 4 if the sergeant can take 2 hand flamers), fire 7 bolt pistols and then charge at +1S, and if with a priest +1I and +1WS as well?

Assuming there is anything left for them to charge, yes, they could do this and it would be glorious.

These flamer options will make Blood Angels tacticals great at overwatch. 2D3 S3 hits, 1D3 S4 hits and 1D3 S5 hits.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

natpri771 wrote:
1. White Scars take bikes as troops, why aren't you complaining about that?
2. Grey Knights take terminators as troops, why aren't you complaining about that? (They can also take Psyker terminators with 2 wounds as troops)
3. Dark Angels can take terminators AND bikes as troops, why aren't you complaining about that?

Firstly Paladins can no longer be taken as troops.

Secondly I think the rest of the armies need to be REALLY worried. This is the way it is now. We have lost Assault Squads from our troops section and Space Wolves lost the ability to take Wolf Guard as troops (they did however get a supplement that lets them take elite slots as their FOC). I'm guessing that bikes for C:SM and DA will go too as well as the Ravenwing. They will all be put back into their normal FOC slots. Grey Knights survived with termies in tact, but then again they don't have a lot of options in their entire codex anyway.

Solidcrash wrote:

 PastelAvenger wrote:
No one has touched this yet but can Assault Marines take discounted transports? This is all I really care about to be honest. In fact they don't have to discounted I just have a lot of Assault Marines without jump packs.....I know I should have magnetised them.

Yes they can remove jump pack and replace it with transportation for discount or not. ( I haven't done a math yet.)

I saw there are transport unit but haven't look at if they are also use up fast slot or not? Will have a look at later.

This is brilliant news thanks buddy you don't know how happy I am over this.

 streamdragon wrote:
Sadly, most of the recent books seem to lose the FOC shifting thing, usually replaced with a special FOC that focuses on that particular slot.

For example, Space Wolves losing "Wolf Guard become troops" on Logan, but then getting the "Champions of Fenris" FOC that focuses on Elites over Troops.

Hopefully Blood Angels see something similar, so Jump Blood Angel armies can play as they want to again.

Except that what you once got when you bought the codex - and mayhaps was the reason you went for this army above any other - now costs you the price of another codex, since you need the default one and the supplement. If you consider this to be an "ok" state of affairs, i don't know what to say.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 BrotherGecko wrote:
Somewhere in the darkness Ward is smiling.

This is why I fear for the Necron update and is why I built a themeless theme so that the next update won't invalidate what I've acquired over the years (unless stuff gets Pariahed).

Why would he be smiling, since he is no longer employed by GW and likely didn't have a hand in this Codex. And really, the swing back around to Tacticals over Assaults is only going to benefit the current regime.

In other words, someone is making money, and it ain't him.

I think he is smiling because perhaps people now realise that he wasn't as bad as they thought he was. Lets face it, I bet a lot of players now wish that Ward had had a hand in this dex.

Just wanted to pop in and remind everyone that I was right. Everyone ignored me or dismissed me as just being "negative" when I tried to warn you that a BA update wouldn't be what you expected, you ignored the obvious trend with every army update ever since Orks came out, but not only did the codex get the predictable "7th edition sidegrade/blandification treatment", it got kicked way harder in the nuts than even I was expecting.

Congratulations. You're a real hero.

 Sidstyler wrote:
Just wanted to pop in and remind everyone that I was right. Everyone ignored me or dismissed me as just being "negative" when I tried to warn you that a BA update wouldn't be what you expected, you ignored the obvious trend with every army update ever since Orks came out, but not only did the codex get the predictable "7th edition sidegrade/blandification treatment", it got kicked way harder in the nuts than even I was expecting.

Yes I want a cookie.

You're really evil, you know that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HTJwhS0-Y7U

Happy Sanguinala everyone!

 Tannhauser42 wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Crimson wrote:
They can either play unbound or get that single box of tacticals they claim they do not have. No big deal.

Really? "Play unbound" is your solution?

Unfortunately, that IS GW's solution. It's why we don't have all the force org changing characters in these new books anymore. :(

I have to say I fail to see why it's an issue. If you're going to play with people who will refuse your army that is exactly the same as it has been for the last however many years just because it's now Unbound (so actually losing ObSec bonuses it has up until Saturday) then I think you need to look at who you are playing.

It's irksome if you have no Tacs/Scouts and want to use the new detachment, but no one's army is going to be unplayable against any reasonable human being.

 DarthOvious wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 BrotherGecko wrote:
Somewhere in the darkness Ward is smiling.

This is why I fear for the Necron update and is why I built a themeless theme so that the next update won't invalidate what I've acquired over the years (unless stuff gets Pariahed).

Why would he be smiling, since he is no longer employed by GW and likely didn't have a hand in this Codex. And really, the swing back around to Tacticals over Assaults is only going to benefit the current regime.

In other words, someone is making money, and it ain't him.

I think he is smiling because perhaps people now realise that he wasn't as bad as they thought he was. Lets face it, I bet a lot of players now wish that Ward had had a hand in this dex.

I will laugh when people start wishing for the good ol' days when Ward was writing codices.

The game is changing. It's becoming about a much tighter, more focused core with a myriad variable options. That's just the nature of things. Whether or not it's for you is what you need to figure out.

 Las wrote:
The game is changing. It's becoming about a much tighter, more focused core with a myriad variable options. That's just the nature of things. Whether or not it's for you is what you need to figure out.

I didn't know that less options were actually "More" options... Nothing got added in to this codex, it just had stuff taken away and shifted into really bad places...

I wish Matt Ward had written this dex, the fluff might've been worthy of many facepalms, but at least his rules were excellent.

 PlaguelordHobbyServices wrote:
I wish Matt Ward had written this dex

Oh how the world turns!

 pretre wrote:

 PlaguelordHobbyServices wrote:
I wish Matt Ward had written this dex

Oh how the world turns!

I actually liked the Matt Ward dex, as I bought it the day it was released and fell in love with it. Sure, his fluff was bad, but his rules were good, you cannot deny that.

 PlaguelordHobbyServices wrote:
Sure, his fluff was bad, but his rules were good, you cannot deny that.

Sure, I can. I liked both the fluff and rules. Take that!

I just find it funny that we've come so far that people want Ward back.

There are Baal strike force detachment, to gain red thirst special rule.. Other two are same as CAD. ( re-roll warlord trait and ObSec )

So far, I like it! There are picture of sanctuary priest with full power armour look good! Gonna buy that.

 Las wrote:
And the only reason it was their thing to begin with (for ONE book I might add) was because of a much maligned codex author with a propensity for writing poor fluff and mono build codeces. This is a fix imo.

Does the reason matter?
Let's look at the facts instead of arguments, opinions and reasons.
The fact is that I own 5 Boltgun Tactical Marines because the rest of them are used as Death Company or Devastator Squads: I have 40 JP-Troops at the moment.
Another fact is that many people sold their Tactical Marines because to them the Blood Angels are about Jump Pack-Troops.

Most people don't "complain" because Blood Angels lost their ASM-troops.
Most people "complain" because they have a crapload of models that they can't really use any more AND because they now need to play units they don't want to play.
The last time I played a Tactical Marine was three years ago, I decided that I didn't like them and I got rid of it.

Another thing is that everybody was happy we'd finally have a cost-reduction on ASM.
In fact they were made more expensive since we have a Troop-tax now.
It's a crappy way of GW to promote Unbound and push their new sales.
It gets even worse when people are actually hoping for a 40 euro supplement to fix this nonsense.

And the worst part of all: People telling you that you shouldn't be whining when GW just invalidated half your army and forces you to spend another €34 on models you don't actually want.

You sure about the Baal Strike Force having ObSec? That would be huge.

Can we just accept that some people are unhappy about losing ASM as troops (rightly so, imo) and leave it at that? There's like 20 pages of this same argument back and forth.

Can anyone confirm if the Sang Priests can get TDA? I saw someone mention they got access to the Special Wargear list, is TDA on that?

 PlaguelordHobbyServices wrote:

 pretre wrote:

 PlaguelordHobbyServices wrote:
I wish Matt Ward had written this dex

Oh how the world turns!

I actually liked the Matt Ward dex, as I bought it the day it was released and fell in love with it. Sure, his fluff was bad, but his rules were good, you cannot deny that.

Matt ward rightfully caught a lot of flakk for his fluff (which was awful) and his 5th ed grey knights (which were worse than the abortion that is the current eldar). His rules in 5th ed space marines, BA, and necrons were actually really cool and strong.

But lets not get ahead of ourselves here. Losing assault marines as troops seems to be the only real negative thus far. Granted, its big, but having an army that has old furious charge, and half of it with FNP, is gonna be awesome. I cant think of a non daemon prince unit that can take a charge from death co or sanguinary guard. Hell, if you run the math, a tac marine squad with flamer+combi+heavy flamer can shoot into a squad of thunderwolves and then stand a good chance of WINNING combat when they charge.

Thats right. Our tac marines beat thunderwolves in a fight.

 Paradigm wrote:
Can anyone confirm if the Sang Priests can get TDA? I saw someone mention they got access to the Special Wargear list, is TDA on that?

Terminator armor is never on that list. It's always its own selection.

 pretre wrote:
I just find it funny that we've come so far that people want Ward back.

And by "people" you of course mean "that one guy who said it", right?

I see it as a cry for help. No one really wants Ward back, they just don't want Cruddace and Kelly to keep messin' up army books.

 th3maninblak wrote:

But lets not get ahead of ourselves here. Losing assault marines as troops seems to be the only real negative thus far. Granted, its big, but having an army that has old furious charge, and half of it with FNP, is gonna be awesome. I cant think of a non daemon prince unit that can take a charge from death co or sanguinary guard. Hell, if you run the math, a tac marine squad with flamer+combi+heavy flamer can shoot into a squad of thunderwolves and then stand a good chance of WINNING combat when they charge.

Thats right. Our tac marines beat thunderwolves in a fight.

I want to see your math on that.

 DO IT TO IT wrote:

 Paradigm wrote:
Can anyone confirm if the Sang Priests can get TDA? I saw someone mention they got access to the Special Wargear list, is TDA on that?

Terminator armor is never on that list. It's always its own selection.

Hence why I asked two questions. I'd like to know if a) it's been added to the list, b) the option is there but not mentioned, or c) the option is gone.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 pretre wrote:
I just find it funny that we've come so far that people want Ward back.

And by "people" you of course mean "that one guy who said it", right?

I see it as a cry for help. No one really wants Ward back, they just don't want Cruddace and Kelly to keep messin' up army books.

No, I've seen a couple other posts here and elsewhere that people have mentioned it. As for C&K, they've been messin' up army books for what... 20 years now? It's not messing up anymore, it is just people expect something different than they have always provided.

 Crimson wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Crimson wrote:
They can either play unbound or get that single box of tacticals they claim they do not have. No big deal.

Really? "Play unbound" is your solution?

Actually use the rules of the game! Shocking suggestion, I know!

The problem is caused by the house rule of not allowing unbound, not by GW. And as long as you're house-ruling, you might as well house rule the assault marines into troops anyway.

Ok, so, play Unbound? Cool.

How do I get ObSec on my ASM squads then?

You know, like they've had since ObSec became a thing.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 pretre wrote:
I just find it funny that we've come so far that people want Ward back.

And by "people" you of course mean "that one guy who said it", right?

I see it as a cry for help. No one really wants Ward back, they just don't want Cruddace and Kelly to keep messin' up army books.

I really want Ward back, but I want his writing to be limited to rules development, not fluff.

I own exactly 0 tactical marines, and 0 scouts... this hurts me as now I need to pay a troop tax to get my assault marines and DC...

Also, the Reclusiarch is gone, an HQ choice I almost EXCLUSIVELY ran because of his badassery alone. Now my Metal Chaplain's paint job doesn't make any sense.

 Azreal13 wrote:
Ok, so, play Unbound? Cool.

How do I get ObSec on my ASM squads then?

You know, like they've had since ObSec became a thing.

Stop whining Az. I lost a specific play-style borne of a special character that never got a model, and that's totally the same thing as having the entire structure of your army that's been in place for 5+ years removed for no other reason than to push a new Tactical Marine kit!