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2014/11/21 20:47:08
Subject: WFB End Times wave III P6 softbackreprints
They do, and they put the novels into Omnibi as well. ET Glottkin SC and ET Nagash SC are on pre-order already on the GW site
It's only campaign fluff and rules, not the Black Library novels. And they aren't even on pre-order, you can buy them right now. And the omnibus (of 1-3, as omnibuses are mostly comprised of 3 books) might even show up somewhere in 2016.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/11/21 21:19:52
2014/11/21 21:20:49
Subject: WFB End Times wave III P6 softbackreprints
Grel777 wrote: Was sold out in less than 10 minutes. Wow.
I was able to order one, I got the confirmation mail but I still have the bad feeling that is not true....
If you have confirmation from GW it should be reliable. There should also be a very limited number of them available at the stores next week end. Got to be there early though.
2014/11/21 21:23:44
Subject: WFB End Times wave III P6 softbackreprints
They do, and they put the novels into Omnibi as well. ET Glottkin SC and ET Nagash SC are on pre-order already on the GW site
It's only campaign fluff and rules, not the Black Library novels. And they aren't even on pre-order, you can buy them right now. And the omnibus (of 1-3, as omnibuses are mostly comprised of 3 books) might even show up somewhere in 2016.
Yep, it takes ages I know
2014/11/21 22:04:32
Subject: WFB End Times wave III P6 softbackreprints
Stayed late at my local GW Store, there were 2 of us waiting plus the 2 store employees.
Two of us got the books and cards, by the time it was the employees turn (10 mins later) they were sold out and they both had to buy the Limited editions to get one and they don't get discount on the limited edition stuff.
Bit bad really, but glad i got mine.
All anyone wants in the world is to be accepted. Except me, i don't give a S%@t.
Armies of Mixer
WHFB-Ogres, WoC, Lizardmen, Tomb Kings, Tzeentch Daemons, OnG
40K- Tau,Guard, Nids, SM, BA, GK, IK, DW
The Hobbit/LOTR- Evil, Angmar, Mordor
2014/11/21 22:12:43
Subject: WFB End Times wave III P6 softbackreprints
Guess I am stuck paying aftermarket prices as I don't have an LGS I can get to. Less money for GW, more money for scalpers I guess.
I guess, softcover should be out in few weeks. Unless you have 1st and 2nd in Hardback formats and want a complete collection But the situation is getting better.. I've seen some people sell their Glottkins for RRP+postage, after softbacks were announced.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/11/21 22:14:07
2014/11/21 22:23:48
Subject: Re:WFB End Times wave III P6 softbackreprints
Im actually wondering about the finality of this End Times expansion in Warhammer...
Do you think that the aftermath of the End Times will be the current state of the Warhammer World when they release 9th edition? Or, do you think they will roll back the story advancement like they did with the Storm of Chaos stuff?
This could be GW contracting the Warhammer range and scope, combining the armies (this was rumored some time ago) that are allying now into the same books...ie, Consolidating Tomb Kings and VC, one book for elves, an alliance of men and dwarves, combined chaos, etc...
From the opening fluff in Nagash, it almost sounds like the Skaven and Chaos Daemons are about to overrun the Lizardmen in Lustria....wonder if they go away? I sure hope no one gets Squat-ed.
Manfred von Drakken wrote: Correct me if I'm wrong, but Caledor isn't actually dead, right? He and his mages are 'trapped' in the vortex keeping it open. If the vortex were to fail, could he not return? And maybe HE could lead the remaining Elves?
As far as I know you are correct. I think someone mentioned that there are three army lists in the book: One is the Malekith/Teclic alliance, the second one is the Tyrion with shiny new (old) sword/Khaine group, and the third one is still kept a secret. It could be related to Caledor and his grumpy old men. I always thought of the modern GW High Elves as the "You kids get off my lawn!" type of faction in the Warhammer universe so it would be interesting so see how the old generation would react after they get introduced back into the world.
Hulksmash wrote: Because adding a faction to a line on life support is a smart business decision....
Personally I'm loving the End Times stuff. I realize rules wise we're probably going to see most of this end up in 9th so the rule portion of these books is meh. But the actual fluff books are awesome and enjoyable.
Now as long as someone doesn't wake up from a dream I'm a happy camper. If someone wakes up from a dream people need to let me know which page it happens on so I can just stop reading right up to it
It wouldn't be on life support. It's been 3 or 4 years since I had a GW army, but I can guarantee that if a Cathy or Nippon force came out, I'd happily throw down a wad of banknotes for it. And I suspect many others would as well.
Agree with you about the dream idea. I've got an uneasy feeling that GW are going to do a Dallas on the end times.
By god I hope they do, they've already killed off/destroyed about a third of my favourite parts of the setting and there's still two whole books to go by all accounts. If they end up with a Warhammer World without Kislev, Tilea, Estalia; half of the Empire(including most of the interesting cities) gone, half of Bretonnia gone, loads of interesting characters dead, and a lot of factions eliminated/combined together, it's not even actually the Warhammer World any more is it. It's particularly galling that they went with the gak-hurling chimp strategy when, as you point out, half of the existing world was almost completely unexplored in terms of the game, and barely fleshed out in terms of the fluff - Cathay, Nippon, Araby, Estalia, Tilea, the Border Princes, the Southlands, bringing back Dogs of War, doing multiple Imperial Armour/Stormclaw-style campaigns with tons of detail and a narrower focus, doing Heresy-style historical campaigns - there were tons of ways for them to refresh and expand the setting without tearing up huge chunks of it.
I hope they destroy everything about the world of warhammer including most, if not all the character. Put Warhammer fantasy on the shelf for a year or two, revamp their whole lines and do a massive relaunch of the "New Age". New rules, characters, lore etc...
Serious question; if you dislike essentially everything about Fantasy, why not play one of the numerous other high-fantasy wargames on the market, rather than hoping for something that would ruin the game for loads of other people? I've never understood this mentality of "I don't like this thing, so rather than finding something I do like, I'll argue that/demand the whole thing should be changed into something I do like". If I don't like Football, I go and watch/play Rugby or Tennis instead, I don't sit there hoping the rules of Football will be completely changed to suit my own tastes.
Fantasy is selling poorly and needs to be cut down in size and scope. Introducing new factions or expanding old ones is the opposite of what they want to do, from the looks of it. That's why "tearing up huge chunks" is their best option.
No, Fantasy is selling poorly and GWbelieve it needs to be cut down in size and scope. Whether that belief, and thus their chosen solution, are valid depends entirely on whether they actually understand the reasons why Fantasy is selling poorly. They're making the exact same mistakes they made with Specialist Games; sales were down because of inconsistent model releases, poor event support, and failure to address evident flaws in the rules, they responded by further slowing and eventually altogether stopping model releases, cutting all event support, dropping all the fan-supported publications, and finally abandoning the rulesets altogether, which unsurprisingly failed to generate the big spike in sales they wanted. This time around they're trying a different solution by gutting the background material, releasing a few new-shiny large models, and compressing the army lists down, but once again I'd contend that they're solving a problem that didn't exist and failing to address the actual issues most people have with Fantasy; lack of support/new content(note that "new" does not have to mean "advancing the whole plot on a global, world-ending scale"), issues with the rules, and the abhorrent cost of fielding the large blocks of infantry the game revolves around. It doesn't matter how much of the background they cack all over, how many factions they delete/compress, or how small they make the focus of the future storyline; if they fail to address the actual barriers people have to them buying more Fantasy products, this whole End Times mess will amount to a temporary sales-spike due to the new models(which I freely admit are quite nice, Nagash aside), and then they'll be right back where they started, only this time having nuked the whole setting from orbit they'll be in an even worse position to actually build Fantasy back up to its past levels of popularity.
The reason is not to gak on the people who still enjoy it. The reason is to breath new life into it, I grew up on WH:F. I grew up on Warhammer, with a collection of books, miniatures, and nearly every edition codex for WoC and Elves, but it has become stale. The world never advances the characters and models become old. Why would I watch the exact same episode of a tv show for 20 years over and over and over again and not want to see progression?.
Games Workshop has a chance to revamp and rethink how their game plays out. The End Times has been the best set of releases they have ever done for Fantasy. They are moving it into a new direction why not usher in a new era? My gaming group and I have abandoned the official Warhammer Fantasy rules for Kings of War.
40k has the same issue... it is always 40k... What would the 40k universe look like as 50k? Who would not want new characters, new lore, new life into their favorite universe? I say let those who are do not want anything to change keep playing with what you have and never look forward, it would be no different than what you do today.
Why are people like you so afraid of change? Do you not want to see a new balanced rulebook, new character and units?
This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2014/11/22 00:45:26
2014/11/22 00:41:01
Subject: WFB End Times wave III P6 softbackreprints
I'm a little annoyed. They only allotted 2 of them to my local store....And the store owner ordered two more via pre-order but that's it and I'm not one of the first 4....
Best Painted (2015 Adepticon 40k Champs)
They Shall Know Fear - Adepticon 40k TT Champion (2012 & 2013) & 40k TT Best Sport (2014), 40k TT Best Tactician (2015 & 2016)
2014/11/22 00:42:06
Subject: WFB End Times wave III P6 softbackreprints
Hulksmash wrote: I'm a little annoyed. They only allotted 2 of them to my local store....And the store owner ordered two more via pre-order but that's it and I'm not one of the first 4....
Screw that guy ordering two.
I was at my shop before the graphic even finished changing, signed in and going to preorder--only to be told "Sorry, you cannot purchase this item".
2014/11/22 00:50:38
Subject: WFB End Times wave III P6 softbackreprints
He ordered two for his customers. He's losing money on them. It was 100% to take of his customers. Don't say screw a good store owner. Say screw GW for artificially creating a shortage...
Guess I'll be waiting at my GW on Saturday morning and hope they have one to pick up...I really want this one in hardback too. Since I've got Nagash and Glotkin.
Best Painted (2015 Adepticon 40k Champs)
They Shall Know Fear - Adepticon 40k TT Champion (2012 & 2013) & 40k TT Best Sport (2014), 40k TT Best Tactician (2015 & 2016)
2014/11/22 01:08:46
Subject: WFB End Times wave III P6 softbackreprints
Hulksmash wrote: He ordered two for his customers. He's losing money on them. It was 100% to take of his customers. Don't say screw a good store owner. Say screw GW for artificially creating a shortage...
Guess I'll be waiting at my GW on Saturday morning and hope they have one to pick up...I really want this one in hardback too. Since I've got Nagash and Glotkin.
GW doesnt create a virtual shortage... in the printing business, you need to order months before. I'm thinking for the End Time, they was supprise by the popularity...
2014/11/22 01:34:55
Subject: Re:WFB End Times wave III P6 softbackreprints
Hulksmash wrote: He ordered two for his customers. He's losing money on them. It was 100% to take of his customers. Don't say screw a good store owner. Say screw GW for artificially creating a shortage...
Guess I'll be waiting at my GW on Saturday morning and hope they have one to pick up...I really want this one in hardback too. Since I've got Nagash and Glotkin.
GW doesnt create a virtual shortage... in the printing business, you need to order months before. I'm thinking for the End Time, they was supprise by the popularity...
I know a lot about how game books get printed and you're dead on... however... i would say that this is a habit of theirs. They did it with the Tau book, and i believe the eldar book. I'm sure they weren't quite expecting this level of enthusiasm for the fluff shakeup, but still, selling out as quickly as they are is also bizarre.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/11/22 01:36:17
Hulksmash wrote: He ordered two for his customers. He's losing money on them. It was 100% to take of his customers. Don't say screw a good store owner. Say screw GW for artificially creating a shortage...
Guess I'll be waiting at my GW on Saturday morning and hope they have one to pick up...I really want this one in hardback too. Since I've got Nagash and Glotkin.
GW doesnt create a virtual shortage... in the printing business, you need to order months before. I'm thinking for the End Time, they was supprise by the popularity...
Is 3 months enough lead time to get another print run? Because they had that between Nagash and now Khaine...And it'll be even longer for books 4 and 5....
Best Painted (2015 Adepticon 40k Champs)
They Shall Know Fear - Adepticon 40k TT Champion (2012 & 2013) & 40k TT Best Sport (2014), 40k TT Best Tactician (2015 & 2016)
2014/11/22 01:54:38
Subject: Re:WFB End Times wave III P6 softbackreprints
The reason is not to gak on the people who still enjoy it. The reason is to breath new life into it, I grew up on WH:F. I grew up on Warhammer, with a collection of books, miniatures, and nearly every edition codex for WoC and Elves, but it has become stale. The world never advances the characters and models become old. Why would I watch the exact same episode of a tv show for 20 years over and over and over again and not want to see progression?.
Games Workshop has a chance to revamp and rethink how their game plays out. The End Times has been the best set of releases they have ever done for Fantasy. They are moving it into a new direction why not usher in a new era? My gaming group and I have abandoned the official Warhammer Fantasy rules for Kings of War.
40k has the same issue... it is always 40k... What would the 40k universe look like as 50k? Who would not want new characters, new lore, new life into their favorite universe? I say let those who are do not want anything to change keep playing with what you have and never look forward, it would be no different than what you do today.
Why are people like you so afraid of change? Do you not want to see a new balanced rulebook, new character and units?
The best way to explain my trepidation about the "End Times" is, ironically, using your example.
You say 40K is always 40K...What would it look like as 50K?
We don't have to want 40K to stay 40K to not want GW to skip TEN THOUSAND YEARS.
The fact that the background has not had much advancement doesn't mean that it now needs to be radically changed in almost every aspect. We could want to see development and change without the death of gods, the resurrection of Nagash, the fall of multiple cities and countries, the alteration of magic, etc.
In fact, the very fact that GW has been unable to meaningfully advance the Warhammer world for the last 25 years would be a very strong argument for the position that they won't do a good job of it over a few months.
Not only this, but it also makes a lot of their own backlist increasingly irrelevant. Who cares about WFRP when everything in those books is no longer relevant. Who wants to buy ebooks of older BL novels, when no characters, locations, or situations in them are still relevant?
I might lament that the pasta served doesn't have enough tomato. That isn't an invitation to drown the remaining pasta in tomato paste.
I looked forward to development and change in Warhammer Fantasy. I didn't look for throwing out most of the setting and changing almost everything over the course of a few game years.
On top of all that, there is the insistent, obviously hyperbolic, branding of this as "the End Times". This is one of the worst habits of GW in regards to 40K, immediately displaced over to Fantasy. EVERYTHING important happens in the last year or two of the 41st millennium. Armageddon, Necron awakenings, Tau expansion, Tyranid incursions, Rynn's World disaster, Leviathan on course for Baal, Ork attacks on Knight worlds, etc. The game universe has a tremendous history and scope, but GW seems unable to do anything BEFORE or AFTER M40.999. That doesn't make me confident that the Fantasy End Times will advance the storyline.
Hulksmash wrote: Because adding a faction to a line on life support is a smart business decision....
Personally I'm loving the End Times stuff. I realize rules wise we're probably going to see most of this end up in 9th so the rule portion of these books is meh. But the actual fluff books are awesome and enjoyable.
Now as long as someone doesn't wake up from a dream I'm a happy camper. If someone wakes up from a dream people need to let me know which page it happens on so I can just stop reading right up to it
It wouldn't be on life support. It's been 3 or 4 years since I had a GW army, but I can guarantee that if a Cathy or Nippon force came out, I'd happily throw down a wad of banknotes for it. And I suspect many others would as well.
Agree with you about the dream idea. I've got an uneasy feeling that GW are going to do a Dallas on the end times.
By god I hope they do, they've already killed off/destroyed about a third of my favourite parts of the setting and there's still two whole books to go by all accounts. If they end up with a Warhammer World without Kislev, Tilea, Estalia; half of the Empire(including most of the interesting cities) gone, half of Bretonnia gone, loads of interesting characters dead, and a lot of factions eliminated/combined together, it's not even actually the Warhammer World any more is it. It's particularly galling that they went with the gak-hurling chimp strategy when, as you point out, half of the existing world was almost completely unexplored in terms of the game, and barely fleshed out in terms of the fluff - Cathay, Nippon, Araby, Estalia, Tilea, the Border Princes, the Southlands, bringing back Dogs of War, doing multiple Imperial Armour/Stormclaw-style campaigns with tons of detail and a narrower focus, doing Heresy-style historical campaigns - there were tons of ways for them to refresh and expand the setting without tearing up huge chunks of it.
I hope they destroy everything about the world of warhammer including most, if not all the character. Put Warhammer fantasy on the shelf for a year or two, revamp their whole lines and do a massive relaunch of the "New Age". New rules, characters, lore etc...
Serious question; if you dislike essentially everything about Fantasy, why not play one of the numerous other high-fantasy wargames on the market, rather than hoping for something that would ruin the game for loads of other people? I've never understood this mentality of "I don't like this thing, so rather than finding something I do like, I'll argue that/demand the whole thing should be changed into something I do like". If I don't like Football, I go and watch/play Rugby or Tennis instead, I don't sit there hoping the rules of Football will be completely changed to suit my own tastes.
Fantasy is selling poorly and needs to be cut down in size and scope. Introducing new factions or expanding old ones is the opposite of what they want to do, from the looks of it. That's why "tearing up huge chunks" is their best option.
No, Fantasy is selling poorly and GWbelieve it needs to be cut down in size and scope. Whether that belief, and thus their chosen solution, are valid depends entirely on whether they actually understand the reasons why Fantasy is selling poorly. They're making the exact same mistakes they made with Specialist Games; sales were down because of inconsistent model releases, poor event support, and failure to address evident flaws in the rules, they responded by further slowing and eventually altogether stopping model releases, cutting all event support, dropping all the fan-supported publications, and finally abandoning the rulesets altogether, which unsurprisingly failed to generate the big spike in sales they wanted. This time around they're trying a different solution by gutting the background material, releasing a few new-shiny large models, and compressing the army lists down, but once again I'd contend that they're solving a problem that didn't exist and failing to address the actual issues most people have with Fantasy; lack of support/new content(note that "new" does not have to mean "advancing the whole plot on a global, world-ending scale"), issues with the rules, and the abhorrent cost of fielding the large blocks of infantry the game revolves around. It doesn't matter how much of the background they cack all over, how many factions they delete/compress, or how small they make the focus of the future storyline; if they fail to address the actual barriers people have to them buying more Fantasy products, this whole End Times mess will amount to a temporary sales-spike due to the new models(which I freely admit are quite nice, Nagash aside), and then they'll be right back where they started, only this time having nuked the whole setting from orbit they'll be in an even worse position to actually build Fantasy back up to its past levels of popularity.
The reason is not to gak on the people who still enjoy it. The reason is to breath new life into it, I grew up on WH:F. I grew up on Warhammer, with a collection of books, miniatures, and nearly every edition codex for WoC and Elves, but it has become stale. The world never advances the characters and models become old. Why would I watch the exact same episode of a tv show for 20 years over and over and over again and not want to see progression?.
Games Workshop has a chance to revamp and rethink how their game plays out. The End Times has been the best set of releases they have ever done for Fantasy. They are moving it into a new direction why not usher in a new era? My gaming group and I have abandoned the official Warhammer Fantasy rules for Kings of War.
40k has the same issue... it is always 40k... What would the 40k universe look like as 50k? Who would not want new characters, new lore, new life into their favorite universe? I say let those who are do not want anything to change keep playing with what you have and never look forward, it would be no different than what you do today.
Why are people like you so afraid of change? Do you not want to see a new balanced rulebook, new character and units?
A; As I've pointed out, repeatedly, there's no need to change the background so substantially in order to fix the actual problems with the game; rules and prices/unit size.
B; The reason why you can't grasp where I'm coming from, and why I find your perspective alien, is because we're evidently coming at this from completely different angles - you want, as you say, a TV show that feeds you new content on a schedule and rotates the cast of characters to create the illusion of change(because they just end up using the same character tropes and story themes over and over again with extremely minor variation anyway), I want a sandbox with very broadly defined but pretty much static limits in which I can tell my own stories - did you know I've run campaigns set in the future in both Fantasy and 40K? I have, because it's an interesting "what if?" subject, but I still think GW doing either is a crappy idea, because their idea will inevitably tread on a lot of people's toes by invalidating armies and stories players have put huge amounts of effort into, End Times being a perfect example; half the Old World gone, half the Empire gone, so what happens to people who liked those parts of the world, who were running campaigns set in them, armies based in or from them? Me and a few mates put a LOT of effort into our "future Fantasy" material, we essentially rewrote the whole Storm of Chaos debacle from scratch, now that work was completely pointless since half the character involved are dead, some of the cities where major plot points happened are gone, and entire nations which played a major role have been wiped out in a quarter page afterthought blurb. You may think that's all a price worth paying for such literary masterpieces as Super Saiyan Franz, I don't.
"Your society's broken, so who should we blame? Should we blame the rich, powerful people who caused it? No, lets blame the people with no power and no money and those immigrants who don't even have the vote. Yea, it must be their fething fault." - Iain M Banks
-----
"The language of modern British politics is meant to sound benign. But words do not mean what they seem to mean. 'Reform' actually means 'cut' or 'end'. 'Flexibility' really means 'exploit'. 'Prudence' really means 'don't invest'. And 'efficient'? That means whatever you want it to mean, usually 'cut'. All really mean 'keep wages low for the masses, taxes low for the rich, profits high for the corporations, and accept the decline in public services and amenities this will cause'." - Robin McAlpine from Common Weal
Who wants to buy ebooks of older BL novels, when no characters, locations, or situations in them are still relevant?
Following this logic the Horus Heresy novels should never have been able to sell. Just because the plot advanced doesn't mean people don't like reading the older books.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/11/22 10:41:54
Morat Noob 
30k 
But the situation is getting better.. I've seen some people sell their Glottkins for RRP+postage, after softbacks were announced.
