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Having to be within 12" of 2 Teleport homers is a bit tougher. And since I don't think they work inside a transport (hopefully I'm wrong) that makes it even tougher. It's not a no brainer choice but it's still interesting. Especially for larger games.

I didn't realize that angel's fury storrmraven formation required 3 of them as it was blurry on the first page. I just figured people were taking 3 in their sample army lists because it was more efficient to specialize and spam, not because they had to. I've only got one stormraven and I have no plans on getting more so I guess that is out for me.

So what do you guys think is best setup for the Angel's Wrath force? 5 man all 3 squads and set the 2 Assault Squads up for melta duty? Max size them all and use them to fill the enemy backfield with a melee marine swarm?

Right, so having looked through the digital codex...

The Angel's Wrath formation is actually fairly useful.

Figure my list will turn into the following

LoW - Seth
HQ - Corbulo (counts as) or Sanguinary Priest
HQ - Librarian

Elites - 15ish Death Company
Elites - Lemartes
Elites - 7 Sternguard with a Rhino

Troops - 10 Tactical Marines
Troops - 10 Tactical Marines
Troops - 5 Scouts

Heavy Support - 6 Devastators

Formation - Angel's Wrath

8 Vanguard
8 Assault Marines
8 Assault Marines

Mmm, yes, Angel's Wrath is going to become the go to formation for Assault Marines.

Leaves slots opens for Bikes if you fancy such things and takes some of the pressure off our poor Elites section. (Seriously, this thing is way too overcrowded now. Death Company, Terminators, Command Squads, Veterans, Lemartes, Sanguinary Guard...ugh. This thing is just way, way too crowded to be comfortable.)

Mind you the Archangels Strike Force from Exterminatus might also have been an option as an allied detachment if the requirement that allied detachments had a different Faction wasn't there. Boo.

Guess we can only really hope for more detachments to allow further flexibility, right?

But it's not an allied detachment. Allied detachment is specifically the 1 HQ 1 troop thing in the book.

I am thinking the teleport homer should work just like a banner would. When embark on a vehicle, and we need to measure the distance from the embark unit, we use the hull of the vehicle.

 BrokenRecord wrote:

Fireraven wrote:

 Redemption wrote:

 BrokenRecord wrote:
Can anyone read the Angel's Fury Spearhead Force Formation? That picture is waaaaayyyyy too blurry for me. About all I managed to make out was that some part of it gets Objective Secured... I think...

I am specialised in reading blur. Here's what I could make of it:

Formation:
X Tactical Squads
X Stormraven Gunships

(can't make out the numbers for sure, sorry. But I think it's 3 of each; the picture also supports that)

Restrictions:
Each Tactical Squad must include 10 models. The Sergeant of each Tactical Squad in this Formation may take a teleport homer as a free upgrade. This Formation's Tactical Squads cannot take Dedicated Transports, and must begin the game embarked in the Stormraven Gunships from this Formation.

Special Rules:
Augur Triangulation: If a friendly unit with the Blood Angels Faction arrives from Deep Strike Reserves within 12" of at least one model from this Formation equipped with a teleport homer, then it does not scatter and can charge in the same turn it arrives.

Objective Secured: All Troops units from this Formation have the Objective Secured special rule.

Spearhead Strike Force: When making Reserve Rolls, make a single roll for the entire Formation, which you may choose to re-roll. If successful, all units arrive from this Formation. You can make a Reserve Roll for this formation from the start of Turn 1.

Wait a Minute Stop the dam press. If this is true this could be the most powerful thing done to 40k of any army currently. Lets take a count here: assault terminators , Terminators, DEATH COMPANY, Sang Guard, Command squad, Dante, have to have the rules for DC dread in pods but omg man this is crazy.

Yep, and here we were all worried that our Codex sucked!

To fair the codex does suck, these formations are separate and would have made the old one better too.

Mavnas wrote:
But it's not an allied detachment. Allied detachment is specifically the 1 HQ 1 troop thing in the book.

Curious. So, in theory...

Can you take a Combined Arms detachment AND the Archangel's Strike Force?

If so that's a huge amount of pressure off our force org chart.

Also gives me ideas. However, looking at it the Battleforged rules specifically state only CAD, Allied and Formations.

And most of these variant detachment structures seem to state taking one instead of the CAD.

 Hulksmash wrote:
True, but in this case I'd be tempted to rock a formation based list. You'd also have enough points for the mandatory 2 troops and HQ and still fit in 1-2 solid hitting assault squads.

I am assuming you say that because of the silly CAD requirement tournaments are still hung up on otherwise why not just take the other formation with VV and 3 AS? Seems to me they were meant to be paired.

@Legions

The problem with that is that I can't seem to find that anywhere in the rules anymore. It used to be in the actual rules in 6th. Hopefully I'm just inept and haven't seen it

 Red Corsair wrote:


To fair the codex does suck, these formations are separate and would have made the old one better too.

Tyranids 2.0.

As a Tyranid player the fact my Flesh Tearers are getting the same 'WOAH, What the Feth is this organisation?' codex treatment accompanied by Formations that suddenly make us viable and good has me laughing.

 Red Corsair wrote:

 Hulksmash wrote:
True, but in this case I'd be tempted to rock a formation based list. You'd also have enough points for the mandatory 2 troops and HQ and still fit in 1-2 solid hitting assault squads.

I am assuming you say that because of the silly CAD requirement tournaments are still hung up on otherwise why not just take the other formation with VV and 3 AS? Seems to me they were meant to be paired.

Yeah, if they don't require CAD I'd be tempted to run a formation based army. If they did require CAD there are enough points for it to still get some good CC units.

 Hulksmash wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:

 Hulksmash wrote:
True, but in this case I'd be tempted to rock a formation based list. You'd also have enough points for the mandatory 2 troops and HQ and still fit in 1-2 solid hitting assault squads.

I am assuming you say that because of the silly CAD requirement tournaments are still hung up on otherwise why not just take the other formation with VV and 3 AS? Seems to me they were meant to be paired.

Yeah, if they don't require CAD I'd be tempted to run a formation based army. If they did require CAD there are enough points for it to still get some good CC units.

Plus, you know, the bubble of damage around the Assault squads DSing is so much better than the Warp Talons' somewhat erratic blind effect. (Hey guys, take an initiative test in a largely I4+ meta. Totes worth paying a bucket load of points for this unit when you could have a Heldrake instead!)

It would also be funny to use the elites formation (forgot name) To avoid the troop tax and get 3 death company dreadnoughts attached to those ravens that arrive turn 1 angry dubstep dreads will smash face turn 2.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Hulksmash wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:

 Hulksmash wrote:
True, but in this case I'd be tempted to rock a formation based list. You'd also have enough points for the mandatory 2 troops and HQ and still fit in 1-2 solid hitting assault squads.

I am assuming you say that because of the silly CAD requirement tournaments are still hung up on otherwise why not just take the other formation with VV and 3 AS? Seems to me they were meant to be paired.

Yeah, if they don't require CAD I'd be tempted to run a formation based army. If they did require CAD there are enough points for it to still get some good CC units.

I honestly don't understand why there are restrictions anymore, it has long since passed the point where it is fruitful and I believe it's making things more out of balance.

 Red Corsair wrote:
It would also be funny to use the elites formation (forgot name) To avoid the troop tax and get 3 death company dreadnoughts attached to those ravens that arrive turn 1 angry dubstep dreads will smash face turn 2.

Except the Archangel's SF only has a set list of things you can take in it. No Death Company.

If it wasn't restricted then I'd be all over that as a primary deatchment - As that would mean my Terminators, 2 squads of 10 Death Company, Death Company Dreadnought, Lemartes, Vanguard and Sternguard could all be slotted into one detachment and I could probably use formations to pad out the rest.

I honestly don't understand why there are restrictions anymore, it has long since passed the point where it is fruitful and I believe it's making things more out of balance.

Tell me about it. Trying to even think of organising local tournaments is ridiculous.

Standard Rulebook Battleforged is, in theory, as follows.

Combined Arms Detachment (or substitute detachment - Codex Supplements, Campaign Supplements)
Allied Detachment
Formations

But then people started asking if it there were caps on the numbers of different types of detachments - as an AM army could essentially take a Veteran tax for a CAD and flood the board with allied detachments or formations.

And then you have to realise Imperials get even sillier with their detachments.

A standard 'Imperial' battleforged is....

CAD
Allied Detachment
Formations
Optional Inquisition detachment
Optional Knight detachment
Optional LotD detachment

And again, the same AM army could go to town for a minimal CAD with spammed allies from all different codexes and bonus detachments.

Still - nice to see some formations that really help buffer the Codex impact.

Though I suspect the Angel's Wrath formation is practically mandatory as a 'free' Assault squad bubble with some extra pressure off the Elite's section.

 DarkStarSabre wrote:

Mavnas wrote:
But it's not an allied detachment. Allied detachment is specifically the 1 HQ 1 troop thing in the book.

Curious. So, in theory...

Can you take a Combined Arms detachment AND the Archangel's Strike Force?

If so that's a huge amount of pressure off our force org chart.

Also gives me ideas. However, looking at it the Battleforged rules specifically state only CAD, Allied and Formations.

And most of these variant detachment structures seem to state taking one instead of the CAD.

You could take a Baal Strike Force, 2 Combined Arms Detachments, 3 Archangel's Strike Forces, 4 Angel's Fury formations and 5 Angel's Wrath formations and still be a legal Battleforged army, as long as you meet the requirement of each specific detachment. It's just house rules and tournaments that apply their own arbitrary restrictions.

So teleport homers should work inside of the transports so you don't have to get out. Found the wording I was looking for under embarking.

So that's a solid formation.

Guys, just to remind you. Please don't cry, rage or explode if your all Elite, or whatever shenanigans army gets invalidated by the next codex *searchcover*

rhavien wrote:
Guys, just to remind you. Please don't cry, rage or explode if your all Elite, or whatever shenanigans army gets invalidated by the next codex *searchcover*

The current pattern seems to be screw over folks who paid $50 for the codex and then give them back some of the utility they lost with an additional $45 purchase?

 Hulksmash wrote:
So teleport homers should work inside of the transports so you don't have to get out. Found the wording I was looking for under embarking.

So that's a solid formation.

wow, that is crazy. Hulk, would you toss me a page # for this? I am at work, not working but not willing to blatantly slack by firing up the rulebook pdfs.

I have a digital copy but it's the 1st paragraph after Embarking. Last sentence.

Hulksmash wrote:@Legions

The problem with that is that I can't seem to find that anywhere in the rules anymore. It used to be in the actual rules in 6th. Hopefully I'm just inept and haven't seen it

Hulksmash wrote:So teleport homers should work inside of the transports so you don't have to get out. Found the wording I was looking for under embarking.

So that's a solid formation.

Hulksmash wrote:I have a digital copy but it's the 1st paragraph after Embarking. Last sentence.

Yes it is under embarking under transport. It is page 80 of the mini rulebook.

That the sentence I was going for. Therefore I can use my telport homer while embarked on a vehicle. Unless someone else can find a page that say I can not do that, or a Faq.

Thanks for backing me up on this Hulksmash!

No problemo. I wanted to find it too. And I'd say that since other area things specify when they dont' measure from the hull (KFF and Power Field) that I can't see any problem with it.

 DO IT TO IT wrote:
So what do you guys think is best setup for the Angel's Wrath force? 5 man all 3 squads and set the 2 Assault Squads up for melta duty? Max size them all and use them to fill the enemy backfield with a melee marine swarm?

Didn't it say that all three Tac squads had to be full 10-man squads embarked on Ravens?I think 5-manning them has to be done at deployment, how would you do that per the rules exactly?

 Fango wrote:

 DO IT TO IT wrote:
So what do you guys think is best setup for the Angel's Wrath force? 5 man all 3 squads and set the 2 Assault Squads up for melta duty? Max size them all and use them to fill the enemy backfield with a melee marine swarm?

Didn't it say that all three Tac squads had to be full 10-man squads embarked on Ravens?I think 5-manning them has to be done at deployment, how would you do that per the rules exactly?

Angel's Wrath is the Vanguard-Assault Squad formation.

I'm probably going to go with a slightly bigger amount myself. 8-8-8. Because Flesh Tearers should clearly use khornate numbers. Honest.

You could also add a locator beacon to one or so of the storm ravens and have a no scatter deep strike, that way you never miss the "within 12" of two" part due to scatter....

Seems good

 Forcast wrote:
You could also add a locator beacon to one or so of the storm ravens and have a no scatter deep strike, that way you never miss the "within 12" of two" part due to scatter....

Seems good

Am i missing something? if you via deep strike arriving within 2 homers, you dont scatter in that formation anyway

Also guys inside drop pods coming in via deep strike would count as deep strike right?

Suddenly T1 assault dreads YEAH!

Homer has to be on the table at the start of the turn, generally.

Oops I'm dumb, I was thinking that you still scattered but were able to assault. But now that I read more carefully its both, so even better!

 pretre wrote:
Homer has to be on the table at the start of the turn, generally.

But its not using the homer for the homer

the formation rules only say that you have to arrive within 12" of 2 nothing about using it as a homer.