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 DarkStarSabre wrote:

 akwing00 wrote:

3- executioners hood- librarian only, unaffected by shadow of the warp

Wait. What? There's a relic specifically to counter Shadow of the Warp? Well, that right there is a giant crock of something. SitW already got slapped hard with 7th edition (since Psychic Tests aren't even Ld based any longer) but now they're telling us that the Blood Angels have a 'relic' - yes, an ancient priceless heirloom from the Heresy designed specifically to counter a unique trait of a species that wasn't encountered for millenia after the Heresy?

Damnit guys, Ward left the company already. You don't call him back in as a consultant!

The fluff is rather clear that the hood was constructed by the Librarius on the spot after Dante took down a neuroceptor. It's a relic because there's only one. Knee jerk overreaction much?

 GreyHamster wrote:

 DarkStarSabre wrote:

 akwing00 wrote:

3- executioners hood- librarian only, unaffected by shadow of the warp

Wait. What? There's a relic specifically to counter Shadow of the Warp? Well, that right there is a giant crock of something. SitW already got slapped hard with 7th edition (since Psychic Tests aren't even Ld based any longer) but now they're telling us that the Blood Angels have a 'relic' - yes, an ancient priceless heirloom from the Heresy designed specifically to counter a unique trait of a species that wasn't encountered for millenia after the Heresy?

Damnit guys, Ward left the company already. You don't call him back in as a consultant!

The fluff is rather clear that the hood was constructed by the Librarius on the spot after Dante took down a neuroceptor. It's a relic because there's only one. Knee jerk overreaction much?

It's still kinda bullgak that it directly counters Shadow in the Warp though.

 Sidstyler wrote:


It's still kinda bullgak that it directly counters Shadow in the Warp though.

Well, then change the story when you play Shield of Baal, making it so the BAs never invent it. Easy.

 Sidstyler wrote:

 GreyHamster wrote:

 DarkStarSabre wrote:

 akwing00 wrote:

3- executioners hood- librarian only, unaffected by shadow of the warp

Wait. What? There's a relic specifically to counter Shadow of the Warp? Well, that right there is a giant crock of something. SitW already got slapped hard with 7th edition (since Psychic Tests aren't even Ld based any longer) but now they're telling us that the Blood Angels have a 'relic' - yes, an ancient priceless heirloom from the Heresy designed specifically to counter a unique trait of a species that wasn't encountered for millenia after the Heresy?

Damnit guys, Ward left the company already. You don't call him back in as a consultant!

The fluff is rather clear that the hood was constructed by the Librarius on the spot after Dante took down a neuroceptor. It's a relic because there's only one. Knee jerk overreaction much?

It's still kinda bullgak that it directly counters Shadow in the Warp though.

This. You can state the 'fluff' all you like. Blood Angels are not Tyranid specialists by any means. So to have them automagically invent something to counter the Shadow in the Warp because oh noes, their shield worlds are being attacked! - The fething Ultramarines couldn't even pull this off and the centre of their beloved empire and homeworld of their chapter and all successors came under direct attack.

Indeed Tigurius has actually come into direct contact with the Hive Mind - but certainly doesn't know enough to build an item to directly counter it.

It is a pointless relic. It is aimed so very much at a single rule that has already been beat in the ribs with 7th edition and makes me wonder what the logic behind it was.

Seriously, the Blood Angels make things pretty and ornate. The Salamanders and Iron Hands are the ones who make them functional. And to be frank the Ultramarines are just as capable of making blinged up armour.

Complete bullgak indeed.

Still, what more do we expect from a 'story' that seems to be paying direct homage to the Wardian fluff of Necrons and Blood Angels allying?

Hey there protectors of humanity. We're only a cold, soulless race that loathes all living beings. Mind being friends with us against these living consumption critters? I mean, sure, we're Xenos, we've committed atrocities and we're sentient and therefore aware of what we have done...and you know, not like it's not your standard protocol to nuke a planet with two Xenos factions fighting from orbit so that no one but you wins....

Just going to throw this out there, even though it's unlikely. What if it's in anticipation of a FUTURE codex. Shadows is useless right now, but I could see it as a bubble of 'needs 5+ to harness a Warp Charge point'. And since Nids have that track record of getting a new codex each edition (I think. I wasn't around in 5th) this might hint at something coming later down the line.

 DarkStarSabre wrote:
It is a pointless relic. It is aimed so very much at a single rule that has already been beat in the ribs with 7th edition and makes me wonder what the logic behind it was.

Well, clearly to make it easier for the Blood Angels to win, because that tells a better narrative. As the Tyranid player it's your job to spend hundreds of dollars collecting Tyranid models, just to throw at the Blood Angels player and let him have tons of fun killing them in droves and watching the bodies pile up, because you're effectively the NPC "bad guy". But the models and dice don't move themselves, so...

 Sidstyler wrote:

 DarkStarSabre wrote:
It is a pointless relic. It is aimed so very much at a single rule that has already been beat in the ribs with 7th edition and makes me wonder what the logic behind it was.

Well, clearly to make it easier for the Blood Angels to win, because that tells a better narrative. As the Tyranid player it's your job to spend hundreds of dollars collecting Tyranid models, just to throw at the Blood Angels player and let him have tons of fun killing them in droves and watching the bodies pile up, because you're effectively the NPC "bad guy". But the models and dice don't move themselves, so...

Yeah, because Tyranids, a race of psychically linked BUGS is the most original idea to appear in a Sci-Fi setting since forever.

 angelofvengeance wrote:
Saves on space though eh?

I have a few GW books on my iPad mini, it does save space, but it's just not the same to me. I can handle it though, and there is a benefit I've heard for having iBooks, if there are updates or changes that need to be made the changes are added to your digital book.

Anyway, I'm very interested in both of the Baal Campaign books, however right now $120 and change for two books... Soft cover at that. Can anyone who owns them give us a rating on content and such please? I've read a little and they seem excellent.

If you search on youtube for "Rob Baer" (the spikey bits guy), he has a video review where he goes over some details. I can't say I've ever seen him actually dislike anything as he seems to be the eternal optimist (if someone gave him a pile of fresh doggy poop to review he'd likely say that the consistency was nice and soft and it was also pleasantly warm) so take the actual review with a grain of salt.

I picked mine up this morning, managed to get the one copy they allotted to my FLGS. But I have family in town, haven't had a chance to look at much except scan the formations in the rulebook. I did the same with Leviathan. The quality of the book sets is undeniable, especially the hardback. They do tend to rely more heavily on composed model shots vs actual artwork, as can be seen in most of their other publications as of late. I've read a little of the fluff from Leviathan, and am really enjoying it. If you are already a hard core fan of the Blood Angels, or one of the other factions showcased I'd say it's worth it. For me, I'm still not sure it was quite worth the $150 plus tax I paid for both...even though I really like them a lot. I'd say the hardback versions are worth $50, maybe $60 each.

Ok, thanks for that, I'll go over and watch his video.

Can anyone give a small idea of what the fluff with Sisters is in the second Shield of Baal book is? Apparently there are still a few Sisters in this book, but I cannot expect them to not frown upon an alliance with Necrons.

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
Can anyone give a small idea of what the fluff with Sisters is in the second Shield of Baal book is? Apparently there are still a few Sisters in this book, but I cannot expect them to not frown upon an alliance with Necrons.

Hopefully picking mine up later so will be able to confirm but if anyone else has the info please share

 Frankenberry wrote:

 Sidstyler wrote:

 DarkStarSabre wrote:
It is a pointless relic. It is aimed so very much at a single rule that has already been beat in the ribs with 7th edition and makes me wonder what the logic behind it was.

Well, clearly to make it easier for the Blood Angels to win, because that tells a better narrative. As the Tyranid player it's your job to spend hundreds of dollars collecting Tyranid models, just to throw at the Blood Angels player and let him have tons of fun killing them in droves and watching the bodies pile up, because you're effectively the NPC "bad guy". But the models and dice don't move themselves, so...

Yeah, because Tyranids, a race of psychically linked BUGS is the most original idea to appear in a Sci-Fi setting since forever.

...the feth? How does that have anything at all to do with my post? Who said anything about originality?

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
Can anyone give a small idea of what the fluff with Sisters is in the second Shield of Baal book is? Apparently there are still a few Sisters in this book, but I cannot expect them to not frown upon an alliance with Necrons.

Well luckily for the Blood Angels the Flesh Tearers are nearby to take care of that little problem before the Inquisition hears about it. *cough*

 SharkoutofWata wrote:
Just going to throw this out there, even though it's unlikely. What if it's in anticipation of a FUTURE codex. Shadows is useless right now, but I could see it as a bubble of 'needs 5+ to harness a Warp Charge point'. And since Nids have that track record of getting a new codex each edition (I think. I wasn't around in 5th) this might hint at something coming later down the line.

You'd have thought we'd have gotten a new codex already if that was the case.

But the rumour mill is buzzing about Necrons so I think Tyranids basically got a bunch of stand ins for at least 6-8 months.

And even if it is in case SitW does change? Doesn't make sense for one army to get a relic that completely negates it. Seriously, imagine if Tyranids got an item that negated a 24" bubble of ATSKNF. SM players everywhere would be screaming bloody murder - how dare we get an item that seemed to specifically negate a special rule that was pretty unique to their army.

Or, you know, a 24" bubble that negated AM orders...or AS faith powers....or the Daemon special rule.

 DarkStarSabre wrote:

 SharkoutofWata wrote:
Just going to throw this out there, even though it's unlikely. What if it's in anticipation of a FUTURE codex. Shadows is useless right now, but I could see it as a bubble of 'needs 5+ to harness a Warp Charge point'. And since Nids have that track record of getting a new codex each edition (I think. I wasn't around in 5th) this might hint at something coming later down the line.

You'd have thought we'd have gotten a new codex already if that was the case.

But the rumour mill is buzzing about Necrons so I think Tyranids basically got a bunch of stand ins for at least 6-8 months.

And even if it is in case SitW does change? Doesn't make sense for one army to get a relic that completely negates it. Seriously, imagine if Tyranids got an item that negated a 24" bubble of ATSKNF. SM players everywhere would be screaming bloody murder - how dare we get an item that seemed to specifically negate a special rule that was pretty unique to their army.

Or, you know, a 24" bubble that negated AM orders...or AS faith powers....or the Daemon special rule.

Oh, you mean like Supporting Fire? Or, you know, Shadow in the Warp negatively affecting psykers in the first place?

Again, because Tyranids are the player-controlled NPC race. You aren't playing a "real" army like the glorious SPEHSS MAHREENS, you aren't supposed to form any kind of personal attachment to the background or the models that you built and lovingly painted, and you most definitely aren't supposed to win any games. Your "job" is to roll pointless dice and pull models off the table as the SPEHSS MAHREEN player makes pew-pew noises with childlike excitement and forms images in his head of the super original narrative of small, elite-trained squads of space soldiers hunting and killing biomechanical alien horrors that stalk the shadows in far greater numbers.

Wait, I've seen that movie...nah, this idea is way more original, because the space soldiers wear these suits of powered armor, too, and have ridiculously powerful infantry-sized weaponry. Wait, I think that might have been in a book...uh...well these ones also traverse the stars in space ships that have to be piloted by these weird "navigators" and they worship a God Emperor-wait, that was a series of books and got made into a couple movies...okay, these guys are totes like warrior monks, too, and they all wear bright colors. So HA! Original. And the whole thing takes place in a bleak, dystopian future where mankind is ruled by a corrupt bureaucracy and ordinary people live miserable lives and there's constant conflict, death, and hardship.

Originality.

DarkStarSabre wrote:SM players everywhere would be screaming bloody murder - how dare we get an item that seemed to specifically negate a special rule that was pretty unique to their army.

I would certainly hope no one bitches about a relic like that, considering how often you see people complain about how ATSKNF is overrated or "doesn't matter" anyway.

 DarkStarSabre wrote:
And even if it is in case SitW does change? Doesn't make sense for one army to get a relic that completely negates it. Seriously, imagine if Tyranids got an item that negated a 24" bubble of ATSKNF. SM players everywhere would be screaming bloody murder - how dare we get an item that seemed to specifically negate a special rule that was pretty unique to their army.

Or, you know, a 24" bubble that negated AM orders...or AS faith powers....or the Daemon special rule.

The difference is this:
A Relic like that would be an auto-take for Tyranids because you have a gigantic chance of facing Space Marines.
Do you really think anyone is going to take this anti-Tyranid Relic for the 1 in 100 chance you'll face Tyranids?

 Sidstyler wrote:
Again, because Tyranids are the player-controlled NPC race. You aren't playing a "real" army like the glorious SPEHSS MAHREENS, you aren't supposed to form any kind of personal attachment to the background or the models that you built and lovingly painted, and you most definitely aren't supposed to win any games. Your "job" is to roll pointless dice and pull models off the table as the SPEHSS MAHREEN player makes pew-pew noises with childlike excitement and forms images in his head of the super original narrative of small, elite-trained squads of space soldiers hunting and killing biomechanical alien horrors that stalk the shadows in far greater numbers.

Wait, I've seen that movie...nah, this idea is way more original, because the space soldiers wear these suits of powered armor, too, and have ridiculously powerful infantry-sized weaponry. Wait, I think that might have been in a book...uh...well these ones also traverse the stars in space ships that have to be piloted by these weird "navigators" and they worship a God Emperor-wait, that was a series of books and got made into a couple movies...okay, these guys are totes like warrior monks, too, and they all wear bright colors. So HA! Original. And the whole thing takes place in a bleak, dystopian future where mankind is ruled by a corrupt bureaucracy and ordinary people live miserable lives and there's constant conflict, death, and hardship.

Originality.

Think we get it now, mate

Just wanted to reiterate that I wasn't the one who started going on about originality. But since it came up...

Anyway...someone please tell me the Sisters didn't get chopped up by supposedly loyalist Flesh Tearers. Again. I was just joking before.

Kangodo wrote:
Do you really think anyone is going to take this anti-Tyranid Relic for the 1 in 100 chance you'll face Tyranids?

Well, considering this is meant to be played as a campaign where you know you have a 100% chance of facing lots of Tyranids...maybe?

 Sidstyler wrote:

DarkStarSabre wrote:SM players everywhere would be screaming bloody murder - how dare we get an item that seemed to specifically negate a special rule that was pretty unique to their army.

I would certainly hope no one bitches about a relic like that, considering how often you see people complain about how ATSKNF is overrated or "doesn't matter" anyway.

I'm also a Chaos player. You know why I love Cypher (well, apart from the double tapping, full BS overwatch shots with a plasma pistol)? ATSNKF. The fact it is given to a unit the character joins is hilarious. Plant him in a blob of Chosen or Chaos Terminators and you can laugh all day long. Hey, since Infiltrate works that way....

Give me ten minutes, I need to go make a list with outflanking combi-plasma Chaos Terminators and Cypher.

But to address another quote.

The difference is this:
A Relic like that would be an auto-take for Tyranids because you have a gigantic chance of facing Space Marines.
Do you really think anyone is going to take this anti-Tyranid Relic for the 1 in 100 chance you'll face Tyranids?

For a while it was 'nids cropping up in droves in tournaments. Necrons have had their glory days, as have Orks, as have Dark Eldar. A 'gigantic chance of facing Space Marines'. Really? It all very much depends on what the current Flavor of the Month is for the meta - Space Marines are not always guaranteed. But the moment they start making items like this? That's a very, very bad sign.

Because the moment 'nids crop up in the meta again? (Say they redo SitW and it becomes Holy feth Balls Amazing!) Then you have given one army a guaranteed way to counter that. Which means that diversity will get chucked out the window and the game starts becoming Paper, Scissors, Rock. Army X beats Army Y, Army Y beats Army Z. And that is a very, very toxic approach to a gaming system and one that will never turn out well.

Oh, you mean like Supporting Fire? Or, you know, Shadow in the Warp negatively affecting psykers in the first place?

AlmightyWalrus - Supporting Fire is, sadly part of the Taudar problem. That brief glitch in 6th edition where Codex Creep cropped up (Tau, Eldar) before promptly being smacked right back down in all following codexes. It's like people using Wraithknights as comparisons for their Monstrous Creatures. Unfortunately those two books stand out because of the simple fact that someone probably lost the plot in terms of balanced design before being brought into an office and told off over it once the books were published.

With regards to SitW affecting Psykers? Well, to be perfectly blunt that was a general overall thing. It didn't target an army's special rules in particular.

Still, may as well just wait to see what comes next at this rate. The fact that Blood Angels literally became a codex that had to be patched up to be 'good' through formations is painful. It's what happened with Tyranids in the first place - codex comes out, everyone pans it. DLC comes out (ebooks, supplements, White Dwarf formations) and suddenly it becomes amazing.

 Sidstyler wrote:
Just wanted to reiterate that I wasn't the one who started going on about originality. But since it came up...

Anyway...someone please tell me the Sisters didn't get chopped up by supposedly loyalist Flesh Tearers. Again. I was just joking before.

No they are not -

 Sidstyler wrote:

 Frankenberry wrote:

 Sidstyler wrote:

 DarkStarSabre wrote:
It is a pointless relic. It is aimed so very much at a single rule that has already been beat in the ribs with 7th edition and makes me wonder what the logic behind it was.

Well, clearly to make it easier for the Blood Angels to win, because that tells a better narrative. As the Tyranid player it's your job to spend hundreds of dollars collecting Tyranid models, just to throw at the Blood Angels player and let him have tons of fun killing them in droves and watching the bodies pile up, because you're effectively the NPC "bad guy". But the models and dice don't move themselves, so...

Yeah, because Tyranids, a race of psychically linked BUGS is the most original idea to appear in a Sci-Fi setting since forever.

...the feth? How does that have anything at all to do with my post? Who said anything about originality?

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
Can anyone give a small idea of what the fluff with Sisters is in the second Shield of Baal book is? Apparently there are still a few Sisters in this book, but I cannot expect them to not frown upon an alliance with Necrons.

Well luckily for the Blood Angels the Flesh Tearers are nearby to take care of that little problem before the Inquisition hears about it. *cough*

Now that I look back on this, I really don't know what I as getting at, apologies.

It's fine. That was kinda funny really, I was legitimately confused.

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Sidstyler wrote:
Just wanted to reiterate that I wasn't the one who started going on about originality. But since it came up...

Anyway...someone please tell me the Sisters didn't get chopped up by supposedly loyalist Flesh Tearers. Again. I was just joking before.

No they are not -

Spoiler:

Quite a few escape on transport and of those on planet some at least surive to the end of the 2nd book fighting alongside the Flesh Tearers and see the Tryanids erased from the world they protect

Ah you got to read it before i read the thread. Pretty pleased with the end for sisters:

Apparently there is a new boxed set coming out for Blood Angels called the Sanguine Strike Force. It contains the following:

1x Blood Angels Terminator Librarian
5x Blood Angels Assault Terminators
1x Furioso Dreadnought
1x Stormraven Gunship

It is supposed to cost about 20% less than retail, which is a pretty awesome deal, all in all. The funny thing is, you can run this little formation all self contained. The Termies and Librarian ride inside the Stormraven and the Furioso rides in the rig in the back. This set combines quite well with Strike Force Deathstorm too. Runs you a little under 1500 pts. That is pretty cool. It is too bad I already have what I am going to run for BA locked up, otherwise I would probably have bought this.

Has anybody got this book yet? GW said they shipped mine a week ago but still no sign.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
Apparently there is a new boxed set coming out for Blood Angels called the Sanguine Strike Force. It contains the following:

1x Blood Angels Terminator Librarian
5x Blood Angels Assault Terminators
1x Furioso Dreadnought
1x Stormraven Gunship

It is supposed to cost about 20% less than retail, which is a pretty awesome deal, all in all. The funny thing is, you can run this little formation all self contained. The Termies and Librarian ride inside the Stormraven and the Furioso rides in the rig in the back. This set combines quite well with Strike Force Deathstorm too. Runs you a little under 1500 pts. That is pretty cool. It is too bad I already have what I am going to run for BA locked up, otherwise I would probably have bought this.

Wow! That would be a pretty awesome (useful) mix. I don't have the new librarian yet (I use Calistarius from SH), and I only have 2 stormravens (I want 3). I have enough Dreadnoughts, but I wouldn't mind building it as a Dreadnought librarian, and hell, I only have like, 100 unpainted terminators, so what's 5 more

I only have 1 box of the cool new BA ones, though, so I could live with it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Has anybody got this book yet? GW said they shipped mine a week ago but still no sign.

I picked it up, but frankly, between squeezing in a gaming night with a bunch of friends, painting, and all the holiday stuff, I haven't even opened the shrink wrap. I hope it's good -- I paid $75 CAD for it, and it's two softcovers that are quite thin.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Has anybody got this book yet? GW said they shipped mine a week ago but still no sign.

Picked it up a week ago from my FLGS. They got it in late due to an apparent order mix up.

 BlackTalos wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Sidstyler wrote:
Just wanted to reiterate that I wasn't the one who started going on about originality. But since it came up...

Anyway...someone please tell me the Sisters didn't get chopped up by supposedly loyalist Flesh Tearers. Again. I was just joking before.

No they are not -

Spoiler:

Quite a few escape on transport and of those on planet some at least surive to the end of the 2nd book fighting alongside the Flesh Tearers and see the Tryanids erased from the world they protect

Ah you got to read it before i read the thread. Pretty pleased with the end for sisters:

Spoiler:

it seem quite a lot got through it. Don't forget, from our point of view:
Quite a large part of the Sisters force got on the leaving transports, end of book 1. This "escape fleet" in Book two seems to make it: It looks like they left no Void-Capable ships behind, which means the ones that could, Warped away. These "left-overs" (i'm sure Sisters would have checked Void-capability of their Ships) are then collected by a BA force.
THEN the ones left on-planet get "rescued", where they're down to about 90%+ Losses it seems. And escape with their Flesh Tearers pals