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Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




UK

BloodyDove wrote:


I would also like to know:

Which Summoning? Pink Horrors
Which Sacrifice? Tzeentch heralds on discs
Which Incursion? Plague Drones (Blood Crushers are easier to justify model wise)
Which Possession? Great Unclean One (No on Blood Thirster since he won't be any use for 2 turns due to being a swooping monstrous creature when he arrives)


As I would hope that there is one unit per power which is the "Best" (at least for orks), so that I could then look into making conversions for those units...

Would be cool to make myself a little side-army of "Ork Beasts and Oddboyz". Squigs and hulking ork brutes.



Isnt the great unclean one slow and purposeful? And so very very slow, for an ork army. Especially if you're spawning them in your own backfield.
   
Made in us
Squishy Oil Squig




Niiru wrote:
BloodyDove wrote:


I would also like to know:

Which Summoning? Pink Horrors
Which Sacrifice? Tzeentch heralds on discs
Which Incursion? Plague Drones (Blood Crushers are easier to justify model wise)
Which Possession? Great Unclean One (No on Blood Thirster since he won't be any use for 2 turns due to being a swooping monstrous creature when he arrives)


As I would hope that there is one unit per power which is the "Best" (at least for orks), so that I could then look into making conversions for those units...

Would be cool to make myself a little side-army of "Ork Beasts and Oddboyz". Squigs and hulking ork brutes.



Isnt the great unclean one slow and purposeful? And so very very slow, for an ork army. Especially if you're spawning them in your own backfield.


If you keep summoning units forward starting from your backfield (i.e. weirdboy summons 12 inches in front of him + scatter), pink horrors move/run forward (or hang out in midfield terrain) and summon 12 inches from them, etc...it usually allows for the ability to drop bloodcrushers or great unclean ones mid-field or in the enemy's deployment zone if you're lucky. This makes it so SnP doesn't matter since he should already be most of the way across the field by that point. Additionally he is a great bullet soak and a LoC is usually unnecessary since you already have a decent # of warp charges from Pink Horrors/Heralds

Edit added:
As extremely anecdotal evidence this strategy has worked in the last 7 games I've played with it only losing to a list with nothing but Tau Broadside missle spam with 5 riptides (including the 2 forgeworld ones) and dual flamer crisis suits

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/12/31 20:56:53


 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




UK

Ahh ok fair enough. Taking a look through the demons codex, the models that strike me as being easily "orkified" -

Bloodcrushers - Orks riding beats or boars, easy.

Flesh hounds - Squigs, or boars, orks can have beasts fine.

Nurgle stuff - Nurglings and similar have a certain round and pudgy look, so squigs and giant squigs would seem to fit here pretty easily.


I'll try and post the pictures from the other site onto here, so you guys can get inspired lol.
   
Made in us
Slashing Veteran Sword Bretheren






Plague Drones could be Orky as well. Smelly, nasty Orks riding around on Giant bugs. or flying squigs, as the old saying goes: When Squigs can fly.

DR:80+S++G++MB--IPw40k12#+D++++A++/fWD013R++T(T)DM+

"War is the greatest act of worship, and I perform it gladly for my Lord.... Praise Be"
-Invictus Potens, Black Templar Dreadnought 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




UK

 Icculus wrote:
Plague Drones could be Orky as well. Smelly, nasty Orks riding around on Giant bugs. or flying squigs, as the old saying goes: When Squigs can fly.


   
Made in us
Slaanesh Chosen Marine Riding a Fiend



Maine

It would be a novel idea, but I don't know how great the results would be. If I can get my hands on a third Weirdboy and some Daemon models, I'd have no problems running a summoning list to try it out, just for kicks. Though I have a feeling that the results will always be on the extreme end of the scale. You'll either do amazing, or you're keep suffering perils over and over again, risking losing your Weirdboyz or wounding them continuously.

I also think people are forgetting each Weirdboyz' ability stacks, so you get +3 extra charges if each one of them is close to 10+ other 'Ere We Go models. This gives you a potential of either 10 to 15, not 7 to 15. Not a HUGE deal, but an extra 3 Warp Dice could be helpful (or suicidal!)

Though if I were to make the Weirdboyz take something from the Daemon powers, I'd go Santic for the potential buffs over making a naturally hoard based army even more hoardy by summoning Daemons, though it could be fun to summon big demons as opposed to smaller ones if your power rolls work out for the better.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




UK

Melevolence wrote:
It would be a novel idea, but I don't know how great the results would be. If I can get my hands on a third Weirdboy and some Daemon models, I'd have no problems running a summoning list to try it out, just for kicks. Though I have a feeling that the results will always be on the extreme end of the scale. You'll either do amazing, or you're keep suffering perils over and over again, risking losing your Weirdboyz or wounding them continuously.

I also think people are forgetting each Weirdboyz' ability stacks, so you get +3 extra charges if each one of them is close to 10+ other 'Ere We Go models. This gives you a potential of either 10 to 15, not 7 to 15. Not a HUGE deal, but an extra 3 Warp Dice could be helpful (or suicidal!)

Though if I were to make the Weirdboyz take something from the Daemon powers, I'd go Santic for the potential buffs over making a naturally hoard based army even more hoardy by summoning Daemons, though it could be fun to summon big demons as opposed to smaller ones if your power rolls work out for the better.


It would only be a horde-y ork army if you ran it as one though. You dont need 10 boyz per weirdboy, so you could have all 3 weirdboyz in one blob of boyz, somewhere relatively safe... This would be about 400 points, which is a pretty large chunk of army true.

But then you can have artillery, warbikes, MANz... pretty much whatever elite style models you want for the rest of your list, as the rest of your hordes will be (hopefully) getting summoned in for free.

Its true though, if you are running a green tide, there's probably not much point in summoning even more hordes... though a few big nasties like unclean ones and the like might be good.


Largely this is the kind of thing I would run for fun though. Make my opponent keep guessing.
   
Made in us
Slaanesh Chosen Marine Riding a Fiend



Maine

Niiru wrote:
Melevolence wrote:
It would be a novel idea, but I don't know how great the results would be. If I can get my hands on a third Weirdboy and some Daemon models, I'd have no problems running a summoning list to try it out, just for kicks. Though I have a feeling that the results will always be on the extreme end of the scale. You'll either do amazing, or you're keep suffering perils over and over again, risking losing your Weirdboyz or wounding them continuously.

I also think people are forgetting each Weirdboyz' ability stacks, so you get +3 extra charges if each one of them is close to 10+ other 'Ere We Go models. This gives you a potential of either 10 to 15, not 7 to 15. Not a HUGE deal, but an extra 3 Warp Dice could be helpful (or suicidal!)

Though if I were to make the Weirdboyz take something from the Daemon powers, I'd go Santic for the potential buffs over making a naturally hoard based army even more hoardy by summoning Daemons, though it could be fun to summon big demons as opposed to smaller ones if your power rolls work out for the better.


It would only be a horde-y ork army if you ran it as one though. You dont need 10 boyz per weirdboy, so you could have all 3 weirdboyz in one blob of boyz, somewhere relatively safe... This would be about 400 points, which is a pretty large chunk of army true.

But then you can have artillery, warbikes, MANz... pretty much whatever elite style models you want for the rest of your list, as the rest of your hordes will be (hopefully) getting summoned in for free.

Its true though, if you are running a green tide, there's probably not much point in summoning even more hordes... though a few big nasties like unclean ones and the like might be good.


Largely this is the kind of thing I would run for fun though. Make my opponent keep guessing.


Dat blob would be ripe for DS destruction or pie plate dropping XD

I spose one could play a more elitey Ork army in this case, just not sure how well it would go. I'd probably play more armored Wall, use BWs to fire off plates with Boyz holding the front, or like you said, play a lot of Artillery or Fliers to hold stuff off long enough until you succeed.
   
Made in us
Battlewagon Driver with Charged Engine





Niiru wrote:
Would be cool to make myself a little side-army of "Ork Beasts and Oddboyz". Squigs and hulking ork brutes.


I am seriously considering kitbashing nurglings and give them choppas...JUST BECAUSE.

   
Made in us
Squishy Oil Squig




Niiru wrote:
Melevolence wrote:
It would be a novel idea, but I don't know how great the results would be. If I can get my hands on a third Weirdboy and some Daemon models, I'd have no problems running a summoning list to try it out, just for kicks. Though I have a feeling that the results will always be on the extreme end of the scale. You'll either do amazing, or you're keep suffering perils over and over again, risking losing your Weirdboyz or wounding them continuously.

I also think people are forgetting each Weirdboyz' ability stacks, so you get +3 extra charges if each one of them is close to 10+ other 'Ere We Go models. This gives you a potential of either 10 to 15, not 7 to 15. Not a HUGE deal, but an extra 3 Warp Dice could be helpful (or suicidal!)

Though if I were to make the Weirdboyz take something from the Daemon powers, I'd go Santic for the potential buffs over making a naturally hoard based army even more hoardy by summoning Daemons, though it could be fun to summon big demons as opposed to smaller ones if your power rolls work out for the better.


It would only be a horde-y ork army if you ran it as one though. You dont need 10 boyz per weirdboy, so you could have all 3 weirdboyz in one blob of boyz, somewhere relatively safe... This would be about 400 points, which is a pretty large chunk of army true.

But then you can have artillery, warbikes, MANz... pretty much whatever elite style models you want for the rest of your list, as the rest of your hordes will be (hopefully) getting summoned in for free.

Its true though, if you are running a green tide, there's probably not much point in summoning even more hordes... though a few big nasties like unclean ones and the like might be good.


Largely this is the kind of thing I would run for fun though. Make my opponent keep guessing.


Moreso you gain flexibility.

lot of 3+ saves? Send some bloodcrushers with lots of ws5 s5 ap3 attacks
2+ saves? Daemonettes going first with rending or some other big bad daemon
Need that objective that is 12 inches away and no one else can get to it? Summon a unit and run towards it if you scatter (+3 inches to your run ftw)

Dat blob would be ripe for DS destruction or pie plate dropping XD


I'd be happy if my opponent dropped a pie plate on some free daemons instead of my boyz

Edited for a mispelling

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/12/31 22:10:17


 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




UK

Melevolence wrote:

Dat blob would be ripe for DS destruction or pie plate dropping XD

I spose one could play a more elitey Ork army in this case, just not sure how well it would go. I'd probably play more armored Wall, use BWs to fire off plates with Boyz holding the front, or like you said, play a lot of Artillery or Fliers to hold stuff off long enough until you succeed.


Depending on deployment you can minimize deepstrike issues. Pie plates are always going to be an issue for orks anyway.

May be better to seperate the weirdboyz into three seperate smaller blobs, but that wont really change much. At least if its one blob you can add a single painboy or big mek for FNP or KFF buffs. FNP probably better for the perils rolls.

I'm sure there are ways to play it to minimize losses. I expect someone on here would come up with ways and means, I'm no expert lol.

I doubt it would ever be a top-tier army list, I think we are just trying to come up with ways to make it fun and competitive in friendly games.
   
Made in us
Slaanesh Chosen Marine Riding a Fiend



Maine

Spoiler:
BloodyDove wrote:
Niiru wrote:
Melevolence wrote:
It would be a novel idea, but I don't know how great the results would be. If I can get my hands on a third Weirdboy and some Daemon models, I'd have no problems running a summoning list to try it out, just for kicks. Though I have a feeling that the results will always be on the extreme end of the scale. You'll either do amazing, or you're keep suffering perils over and over again, risking losing your Weirdboyz or wounding them continuously.

I also think people are forgetting each Weirdboyz' ability stacks, so you get +3 extra charges if each one of them is close to 10+ other 'Ere We Go models. This gives you a potential of either 10 to 15, not 7 to 15. Not a HUGE deal, but an extra 3 Warp Dice could be helpful (or suicidal!)

Though if I were to make the Weirdboyz take something from the Daemon powers, I'd go Santic for the potential buffs over making a naturally hoard based army even more hoardy by summoning Daemons, though it could be fun to summon big demons as opposed to smaller ones if your power rolls work out for the better.


It would only be a horde-y ork army if you ran it as one though. You dont need 10 boyz per weirdboy, so you could have all 3 weirdboyz in one blob of boyz, somewhere relatively safe... This would be about 400 points, which is a pretty large chunk of army true.

But then you can have artillery, warbikes, MANz... pretty much whatever elite style models you want for the rest of your list, as the rest of your hordes will be (hopefully) getting summoned in for free.

Its true though, if you are running a green tide, there's probably not much point in summoning even more hordes... though a few big nasties like unclean ones and the like might be good.


Largely this is the kind of thing I would run for fun though. Make my opponent keep guessing.


Moreso you gain flexibility.

lot of 3+ saves? Send some bloodcrushers with lots of ws5 s5 ap3 attacks
2+ saves? Daemonettes going first with rending or some other big bad daemon
Need that objective that is 12 inches away and no one else can get to it? Summon a unit and run towards it if you scatter (+3 inches to your run ftw)

Dat blob would be ripe for DS destruction or pie plate dropping XD


I'd be happy if my opponent dropped a pie plate on some free daemons instead of my boyz

Edited for a mispelling


I was actually talking about the blob of boyz and Weirdboyz. It's a super idea target that ruins the entire list if it falls, which shouldn't be too difficult since...well...they are Boyz XD

I'm not saying it wouldn't be fun, but blobbing the Weirboyz up only makes it easier to rid the field of them, having 3 20 Boy blobs or something would force them to split forces/gunfire instead of just charging in off a deep strike of forcing YOU to charge, thus denying your abilities to summon (As I don't beleive you can summon while in CC)


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Niiru wrote:
Melevolence wrote:

Dat blob would be ripe for DS destruction or pie plate dropping XD

I spose one could play a more elitey Ork army in this case, just not sure how well it would go. I'd probably play more armored Wall, use BWs to fire off plates with Boyz holding the front, or like you said, play a lot of Artillery or Fliers to hold stuff off long enough until you succeed.


Depending on deployment you can minimize deepstrike issues. Pie plates are always going to be an issue for orks anyway.

May be better to seperate the weirdboyz into three seperate smaller blobs, but that wont really change much. At least if its one blob you can add a single painboy or big mek for FNP or KFF buffs. FNP probably better for the perils rolls.

I'm sure there are ways to play it to minimize losses. I expect someone on here would come up with ways and means, I'm no expert lol.

I doubt it would ever be a top-tier army list, I think we are just trying to come up with ways to make it fun and competitive in friendly games.


Way too much investment for a tactic that is far too unpredictable :( A painboy, maybe. But I wouldn't also add a KFF Mek, even in a leisurely game. Too many points. Far too many.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/12/31 22:18:31


 
   
Made in us
Squishy Oil Squig




Melevolence wrote:
Spoiler:
BloodyDove wrote:
Niiru wrote:
Melevolence wrote:
It would be a novel idea, but I don't know how great the results would be. If I can get my hands on a third Weirdboy and some Daemon models, I'd have no problems running a summoning list to try it out, just for kicks. Though I have a feeling that the results will always be on the extreme end of the scale. You'll either do amazing, or you're keep suffering perils over and over again, risking losing your Weirdboyz or wounding them continuously.

I also think people are forgetting each Weirdboyz' ability stacks, so you get +3 extra charges if each one of them is close to 10+ other 'Ere We Go models. This gives you a potential of either 10 to 15, not 7 to 15. Not a HUGE deal, but an extra 3 Warp Dice could be helpful (or suicidal!)

Though if I were to make the Weirdboyz take something from the Daemon powers, I'd go Santic for the potential buffs over making a naturally hoard based army even more hoardy by summoning Daemons, though it could be fun to summon big demons as opposed to smaller ones if your power rolls work out for the better.


It would only be a horde-y ork army if you ran it as one though. You dont need 10 boyz per weirdboy, so you could have all 3 weirdboyz in one blob of boyz, somewhere relatively safe... This would be about 400 points, which is a pretty large chunk of army true.

But then you can have artillery, warbikes, MANz... pretty much whatever elite style models you want for the rest of your list, as the rest of your hordes will be (hopefully) getting summoned in for free.

Its true though, if you are running a green tide, there's probably not much point in summoning even more hordes... though a few big nasties like unclean ones and the like might be good.


Largely this is the kind of thing I would run for fun though. Make my opponent keep guessing.


Moreso you gain flexibility.

lot of 3+ saves? Send some bloodcrushers with lots of ws5 s5 ap3 attacks
2+ saves? Daemonettes going first with rending or some other big bad daemon
Need that objective that is 12 inches away and no one else can get to it? Summon a unit and run towards it if you scatter (+3 inches to your run ftw)

Dat blob would be ripe for DS destruction or pie plate dropping XD


I'd be happy if my opponent dropped a pie plate on some free daemons instead of my boyz

Edited for a mispelling


I was actually talking about the blob of boyz and Weirdboyz. It's a super idea target that ruins the entire list if it falls, which shouldn't be too difficult since...well...they are Boyz XD

I'm not saying it wouldn't be fun, but blobbing the Weirboyz up only makes it easier to rid the field of them, having 3 20 Boy blobs or something would force them to split forces/gunfire instead of just charging in off a deep strike of forcing YOU to charge, thus denying your abilities to summon (As I don't beleive you can summon while in CC)


Ah OK, my bad. Yeah definitely not ideal to bunch them all up, that's why I like one with backfield grots and one attached to mek gunz.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




UK

Yeh, if you were gonna seperate them into 3 boyz blobz, then you wouldnt bother with painboyz as you would need 3 of them. Is a shame to lose the FNP against the inevitable perils, but its not the end of the world. Maybe.

I'm tempted to try and come up with a house rules Ork summoning list. Reduce the perils rolls, but limit the choices. Make it balanced but fun and orky.

Obviously would only be a house-rules friendly game thing with my friends, but would be a laugh to have a few little mobs of squigs running in.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
Niiru wrote:
Yeh, if you were gonna seperate them into 3 boyz blobz, then you wouldnt bother with painboyz as you would need 3 of them. Is a shame to lose the FNP against the inevitable perils, but its not the end of the world. Maybe.

I'm tempted to try and come up with a house rules Ork summoning list. Reduce the perils rolls, but limit the choices. Make it balanced but fun and orky.

Obviously would only be a house-rules friendly game thing with my friends, but would be a laugh to have a few little mobs of squigs running in.



Problem with this, is grots dont have 'ere we go, so no bonus warp charges.
[Thumb - squigherd.jpg]

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/12/31 22:25:31


 
   
Made in us
Squishy Oil Squig




Niiru wrote:


Problem with this, is grots dont have 'ere we go, so no bonus warp charges.


They just have to be within 12 inches of 10 models with 'ere we go which is really only necessary turn 1 and pretty easy to do as after that Pink horrors should be casting all your powers
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




UK

BloodyDove wrote:
Niiru wrote:


Problem with this, is grots dont have 'ere we go, so no bonus warp charges.


They just have to be within 12 inches of 10 models with 'ere we go which is really only necessary turn 1 and pretty easy to do as after that Pink horrors should be casting all your powers


Ahh well see, its things like this that are helpful. This is why I'm no good at this game yet
(In fairness to me I only came back a couple weeks ago after an absence of years lol)


I'm looking at the Warhammer fantasy Orcs and Goblins figures... And some of these things would be perfect for an ork summoning list (in my warped mind). Nurgle daemons, and the khorne hounds. The last one is very bloodlettery.

[Thumb - amangler.jpg]

[Thumb - atroll.jpg]

[Thumb - AzhagtheSlaughtererNEW01.jpg]

   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




UK

Oh, and a great unclean one for you :

[Thumb - aColsquigcloseup1.jpg]

   
Made in us
Raging Ravener



San Francisco

Summoning is super powerful in general.. Really only kill points is where it's a hindrance. Bring the models and summon every turn you can!

20k+
10k+
 
   
Made in us
Slaanesh Chosen Marine Riding a Fiend



Maine

iNcontroL wrote:
Summoning is super powerful in general.. Really only kill points is where it's a hindrance. Bring the models and summon every turn you can!


It can be, for anyone not Orks. :p Our low leadership is what really kills it as a potential play style in a serious environment, Most Psykers are rocking L10 while we lowball it at 7, meaning it's SUPER easy for Orks to pooch to the Warp.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




UK

As I understand it (from something I have read online so it may be incorrect) when a unit of pink horrors is summoned, they are immediately able to use a psychic power? Although... I guess its too late to add their warp charges to the pool?


edit: oh... I dont think they can summon, as summoning takes place before the deepstrike "phase"... maybe... I'm not sure. They can use witchfires it seems. Not sure how useful that is.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/01/01 00:19:14


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





summoned units cannot immediately summon more units. They also do not add any WC to the pool as that part has already passed..

Summoning is good, not powerful- if it was powerful there would be more people running summoning lists than knights/riptides/waveserpents/wraithknights..

Summoning is not so good for armies that have the extra chance to perils. Orks peril a lot summoning, and give our HQ slots contain valuable things like painboyz, meks with kff, or warbosses with lukky stikks is it really worth giving up those spots for a weirdboy that is going to have a good chance to just blow itself up?

Most of the powers require 3 WC, sacrificie lets you summon a herald for 1 WC but causes you to pretty much lose a model, and the herald can't do much until next turn. This would be a decent way to make a Tzeenetch herald farm that would be useful for summoning, but it assumes you get a lot of 'sacrifice' powers. Each weirdboy that is rank 2 psyker will have a ~30% chance to get sacrifice, so assume if you have 6 that 2 of them will get it. If you have 4 or less, you will on average have one with sacrifice.

For a WC 1 power(sacrifice), if you use 2 WC, the chance to roll a double is 1/6.

the chance to roll a double on 5 dice is ~69%. 5 dice averages 2.5 successes, so really you want to roll 6 dice to get a 50% chance to succeed on a WC 3 power. the chance to roll a set of doubles on 6 dice is close to 75%.

so yes you will have a good chance for the power to manifest, but your LD7 psykers will most likely explode on turn 2 from summoning. The failures also will probably either hurt the units they are in, drain your WC for summoning, or just make the psyker lose summoning powers ontop of rapidly losing wounds.

its highly unreliable.


This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/01/01 00:53:11


 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




UK

blaktoof wrote:


its highly unreliable.



THIS IS ORKA!

   
Made in nz
Longtime Dakkanaut





New Zealand

I second the idea of orky daemon models rather than the standard daemon models.

Fluff-wise, it makes sense that any ork-summoned daemons would themselves have an orky theme.

And model-wise, there's so much potential, using mutated ork/orc/goblin/grot models from right through the 40K/WHFB lines. As with any conversions, make an effort to keep your models about the same size as the standard models, and visually a rough match to the relevant daemon's stats.
   
Made in gb
Lead-Footed Trukkboy Driver





though i think that converted models are bad ass for the orks, the main reason for summoning demons is that i have always wanted to have the models because i love them and they are awesome sauce. so personally, i would use the standard models.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




UK

Yeh I have to admit to liking the standard daemon models too. At least, some of them.

However I've been doing some research, and some of the fantasy orc models (giant squigs, shamans, warboss on wyvers, goblins on giant spiders) are also cool, and very fitting. I may use a mixture.

It wouldn't be much of a hardship to pick one of the gods to replace the models with Orc models, and then use standard daemons for the other gods.
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

Go for it if you want.
But beware that each time you are summoning Horrors or whatnot according to the primary power, the Weirdboy will suffer a warp attack.
A friend of mine tries this with two CSM Sorcerers and he gave up doing this as it was not effective enough.

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Longtime Dakkanaut




UK

 wuestenfux wrote:
Go for it if you want.
But beware that each time you are summoning Horrors or whatnot according to the primary power, the Weirdboy will suffer a warp attack.
A friend of mine tries this with two CSM Sorcerers and he gave up doing this as it was not effective enough.


What? No... you will only be guaranteed to suffer one warp attack if you roll 7 dice, which you don't actually have to do. It just means you are guaranteed to succeed. The perils table is not in your favour, but the most likely result is that you lose 1 wound... on a 2 wound model that cost 70pts. And you would have summoned a 90pt squad of horrors, which can proceed to summon without any of the perils issues. And your weirdboy is likely to be still alive, and can carry on providing warp charges.

Or you can use your 1 remaining wound, and turn your 70pt weirdboy (that already produced more than its points cost in horrors) into a greater daemon.

Are CSM sorcerers mastery level 3? I would have assumed they would only be level 2, and so wouldn't be producing enough charges with just 2 of them to guarantee a summon.


This is all how I am understanding how this works btw, I may be wrong. But I think you need to be putting out 10+ warp charges consistently to have it work.
   
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Auspicious Daemonic Herald





Sorcerers can be level 3
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

Niiru wrote:
 wuestenfux wrote:
Go for it if you want.
But beware that each time you are summoning Horrors or whatnot according to the primary power, the Weirdboy will suffer a warp attack.
A friend of mine tries this with two CSM Sorcerers and he gave up doing this as it was not effective enough.


What? No... you will only be guaranteed to suffer one warp attack if you roll 7 dice, which you don't actually have to do. It just means you are guaranteed to succeed. The perils table is not in your favour, but the most likely result is that you lose 1 wound... on a 2 wound model that cost 70pts. And you would have summoned a 90pt squad of horrors, which can proceed to summon without any of the perils issues. And your weirdboy is likely to be still alive, and can carry on providing warp charges.

Or you can use your 1 remaining wound, and turn your 70pt weirdboy (that already produced more than its points cost in horrors) into a greater daemon.

Are CSM sorcerers mastery level 3? I would have assumed they would only be level 2, and so wouldn't be producing enough charges with just 2 of them to guarantee a summon.


This is all how I am understanding how this works btw, I may be wrong. But I think you need to be putting out 10+ warp charges consistently to have it work.

A Weirdboy will on average die at turn two after summoning a second unit of Horrors.
Rolling six dice for each summoning will on average suffice.

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 CrownAxe wrote:
Sorcerers can be level 3


ah ok, but they'll still produce less powers than 3 weirdboys cos of the waaagh energy rule.

And yeh your weirdboy is probably gonna take a wound in the process of summoning, but as long as the the summoning succeeded (which is almost guaranteed, unless your opponent rolls 6's for deny the witch like the fateweaver himself) then even if the weirdboy dies from an unlucky perils, you still get more points of models on the table than you lost.

This might be harder for a CSM as they cost more (you'd need a level 3, so thats 120pts without any other gear or options), almost the price of two wierdboyz.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
 wuestenfux wrote:

A Weirdboy will on average die at turn two after summoning a second unit of Horrors.
Rolling six dice for each summoning will on average suffice.


I'd say an average of gaining two 90 pt units, and losing one 70 pt unit, with a net loss of 1 warp charge (assuming you still had enough boyz in range alive) isn't a bad swap. Besides, on turn two you could cast with the horrors instead, so there would be little chance of a failure perils. Depends on situation of course, like where all the units are at that point, and where you'd want something summoned.

With 3 weirdboyz, having 12 warp charges first turn is average i believe. And so you could have two pink horror squads down. Then next turn, maybe a mastery level 2 herald of tzeentch. Though the orky thing to do might be to risk it all and explode yourself into a giant monstrous killing machine.

Whatever you do, because the weirdboy is so cheap you should at least get your points cost out of it. But theres a chance of getting a lot more than 70pts out of it.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/01/01 22:04:18


 
   
 
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