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The situation has not improved in regards to communication, they still have to be chased for information and still ignore emails.

Ugh, I want to back this but, this is my first kickstarter. I had just put in a 40$ pledge in and then dropped it to a dollar after using the search bar on Dakka.

I will keep my pledge till it is apparent that people are getting there stuff.

This is a shame as I want the Claymore tank and some Marines for my Inquistorial Retinue. (Counts as Sternguard.) Is it even worth the risk guys? To be honest, since this is my first leap into KS are there any tips you guys can provide? Only if you got the time, I don't want to be a forum nuisance haha.

Oh and I am unsure if this is relevant. I went to check the retail to see if their (not) Marines were for sale and the website is down.

I am getting some mixed signals as a customer on this for sure considering the history, and the fact that normally it seems like Alpharius and Haight are spot on with kickstarter/studio/fishy companies.

 Stormwall wrote:
Ugh, I want to back this but, this is my first kickstarter. I had just put in a 40$ pledge in and then dropped it to a dollar after using the search bar on Dakka.

I will keep my pledge till it is apparent that people are getting there stuff.

This is a shame as I want the Claymore tank and some Marines for my Inquistorial Retinue. (Counts as Sternguard.) Is it even worth the risk guys? To be honest, since this is my first leap into KS are there any tips you guys can provide? Only if you got the time, I don't want to be a forum nuisance haha.

Oh and I am unsure if this is relevant. I went to check the retail to see if their (not) Marines were for sale and the website is down.

I am getting some mixed signals as a customer on this for sure considering the history, and the fact that normally it seems like Alpharius and Haight are spot on with kickstarter/studio/fishy companies.

I'd say no, there's enough not-marine options out there for you to start an army tomorrow using Mantic or Dreamforge or whatever. Why tie up your money and take the stress of models you MIGHT get in a year or two.

To be honest Kid, I liked the generic-ness. I mean it would 40$. But, that's 40$ I don't have right now to fling at a wall.

If anyone knows marines that look almost Starcrafty, I guess PM me.

I dunno.. they've been communicating daily on the actual project itself. I'm providing input and actual designs on the VTOL and they've been extremely responsive. I think they're likely just a really small operation and trying to juggle everything they've got going on. From what I've seen, they are getting hammered with messages.

*Snip*

Edit#2: Lot of salt in the comments on the KS emerging over the most recent update. My signifigant other thought it was sketchy too so I decided to say feth it and I just ordered all the bits I've been wanting from Zinge. Plus I trust Kid a lot based on his judgement calls on Dakka. I can always buy these retail a year or two from now, right?

Thanks all for the support, sorry I wasted your time but you all probably just saved me from getting burned. I decided to invest in a years worth of DCM and some tank bits.

 MLaw wrote:
I dunno.. they've been communicating daily on the actual project itself. I'm providing input and actual designs on the VTOL and they've been extremely responsive. I think they're likely just a really small operation and trying to juggle everything they've got going on. From what I've seen, they are getting hammered with messages.

Communication being present WHILE fundraising or shortly after isn't a good measure of what is to come in my experience both in the KS that I pledged for as well as following another dozen or more here. It's when the delays and problems roll in that the communication record is key. Obviously, if the company can't be bothered to communicate well while funding then they certainly won't improve after refunds aren't an option either. If you want to see how this company might react to adversity, I believe there is a personal account on one of the earlier pages.

My stuff did show up. Granted I haven't opened to double check it's the right stuff.

I think the problem is everyone whined and complained when they didn't have it.. then when they got it nobody noticed.

Titan-Forge has been on BoW to talk about it and again to show off actual castings of some of this stuff.

I complained because they had $100 of my money and weren't responding to emails or requests for what I ordered. I then took what was retail available on their website instead of what I originally wanted just to make sure ingot something for my money. And it was a project I was hot on 3-6 months ago. So now they wait till I come back around.

Eh, to be honest it seems like they do deliver it is just awful how they approach it. I'm going to wait for retail or sculpt up some (not destiny,) figures.

I get it.. I do.. I'm still waiting for Burn-In, Ranger Project, Mercs, and GG Boards.. and I agree.. it's definitely better to be safe with your money. I like the look but if people want other hard sci-fi, it's easy to find.

So, for those that backed their previous projects, were you allowed to add stuff when the project manager went up? Curious as I'm not sure on everything I'd want right now and would like to know if I could spend more later when it goes up and we need to pay shipping.

I mean, I hear what you're saying about them holding your money for so long, but I kinda really want their Lord of Ignorance and by the time it'll be on their website my wife will be in law school and I won't have spending money, so the whole spending money now and eventually getting it someday down the line even if way after their stated date is still appealing to me...

I am still tempted to pledge here. I think they will fulfill this campaign fine - they are learning as they go a bit. And I received my items easily from the last campaign, along with Orlando etc, and Hulk finally has his. The company has flaws, but their product is absolutely top notch. So just go in with your eyes open that you might have to be a squeaky wheel... But I'm a huge fan of their heavily armored marines, it's just that I already have counts as models for this purpose!

Edit: One of the things this company excels at is making casts which match the render exactly. Look at this:




I'm still likely to wait till retail, but their prices are definitely higher then, too.

Yeah, that model's part of the reason I wanna know if they allow you to add afterwards...

Very nice sculpts all round, but the poses are the most lame daemons I think I've ever seen!!?

 Platuan4th wrote:
So, for those that backed their previous projects, were you allowed to add stuff when the project manager went up? Curious as I'm not sure on everything I'd want right now and would like to know if I could spend more later when it goes up and we need to pay shipping.

I mean, I hear what you're saying about them holding your money for so long, but I kinda really want their Lord of Ignorance and by the time it'll be on their website my wife will be in law school and I won't have spending money, so the whole spending money now and eventually getting it someday down the line even if way after their stated date is still appealing to me...

I'm pretty sure I added a bit of cash in the PM but it was on top of a decent sized pledge anyway rather than just a basic $1

If you want to back I think it's a reasonable chance to take, Titan Forge are not just scammers as the majority of stuff is delivered (and what arrives is very nice)

but they do seem to get distracted (or run out of money?) so I'd be sure to make decisions & fill in the PM quickly when it arrives so you're at the front of the fulfilment queue (rather than waiting to see finished casts etc), and don't pledge money you can't afford to loose if things do go wrong (again normal KS advise, but it really is important here)

 Grimstonefire wrote:
Very nice sculpts all round, but the poses are the most lame daemons I think I've ever seen!!?

There's a chance those are also multi-part (the Terrans are and they haven't exactly done a great job making that known).

$20 shipping to the US, on top of the delays and minimal discount really limits my excitment level.

I do like the Greater Daemons, the Tzeentch stuff, the Bloodcrushers, and the direction the Slaanesh stuff is going.

The marines are also aces, but I'd rather wait and see if I'll still want/need the stuff by the time it actually ships.

Yeah, outside of the pre-packed bundles the discount is pretty horrible. Add the long wait time, probably communication issues, and double the cost of shipping vs. their sites shipping and it all kinda pushes you away.

For people who haven't been following closely.
This is the $25,000 Stretch. It's still a WiP.

The pod needs to be refined. Other than that it will work in many game settings

I checked out the pics on beast of war and I have some reservations about those being actual casts, they could be really well done 3d renders with textured materials. The lighting is multi source and seems to be computer generated and the lack of background and perfectly crisp edging with the black background indicates they either have somebody that's godly with photoshop doing their editing or it's a 3d render designed to look like an actual cast. The light sources on the bases also seem to be different from the models indicating the image may be composited on Photoshop. I see a lot of this style stuff being generated at my 3d school and it fools a lot of people into thinking it's a physical object when it's a render.

Before I'd consider putting any money into this I'd like to see some pictures of casts or prints alongside a real object or background.

 inqscott wrote:
The pod needs to be refined. Other than that it will work in many game settings

That part hasn't been touched yet past them doing the initial blocking in of the shape.

@Paulson
http://www.beastsofwar.com/titan-forge/exclusive-checking-xterra-daemon-kingdoms-sculpts/

I can't really tell if those are supposed to be the casts.. and the BoW article is kinda vague on it.. but the texture around the rim of the bases makes me think it might be resin.. I dunno.
But in Update 17 Robek says it's the cast.. Also I have a picture of a first cast of Lord of Fury. There are more to come. Check BoW facebook profile and page as they will show more tommorow.

People who have gotten their previous stuff have sounded off here in the forum.. actually someone said something in this thread.. about their castings matching their 3d very closely... so I would not be too surprised if that was legit.

I'm erring towards caution on these as I've seen way too many ks using photos of renders to imply they are actual models. Being vague about the image or not being forthcoming (defiance games anyone?) they could be casts but the way they are presented has me about 80% that they are renders. If they are casts it shouldn't be to hard to come up with a picture of them on a desk or a work mat etc.

There seems to be a lot a vagueness in their posts, maybe it's the polish/English barrier but could be vague on purpose, combined with their past ks experience it doesn't leave me with a lot of trust.

I highly suspect they are renders especially when I compare it against the lighting and shading levels of the renders they have already posted. Based on what I see and do on a daily basis at Gnomon it's a very simple matter to add a material to the 3d that emulates resin and the roughness on the bases is a super easy add in zbrush. The lighting angles on the base vs the model are at different angles which indicates the image has been at least altered in Photoshop with two separate images. It's also odd that the body is so clean and perfect while the base has imperfections. The lighting is very close to their previous model but the lower angled "monster lighting" was turned off, but the rest is nearly identical to the point it looks like its a render of the same 3d model that's been rotated about 15 degrees and the light rigging was left the same. That's why I'm not convinced it's legit, if it is an actual print it's easy to prove with a different pic.

The 3d prints the "alleged" castings were made from.



This is likely just an elaborate rendering too.. I imagine they used the "Tabletop Gaming" Shader for this one..




Automatically Appended Next Post:
Paulson, I wasn't trying to sound like I was taking a shot at you.. and I agree on caution, but everyone is crying wolf a lot on Kickstarters.. maybe that's for the better.. but I can't help but feel like Defiance and the like have soured the whole thing.

People here have already stated that they got their stuff.. and that they like it, just not how the whole thing went down.
Hey, I even understand that the previous shakiness would drive people off.. I have a handful of companies I will not go near now. At the moment these guys have actually delivered, appear to be moving forward, and are offering stuff I want. For now they get the benefit of the doubt from me.

looking on their web site, the bases look kind of rough:



take from that what you will. i believe in the power of photoshop.

This is the image from BOW that was being presented as a "cast" side by side with the original render. After compring the two in an overlay in PS I'm 100% certain that the second image is just a render as even the camera POV and horizon is *exactly* the same but the model has been rotated slightly. It is really really tough to take a physical photo that will match the angle of the render this closely and not show a different angle of distortion (which changes the models proportions)








Now the image below I can tell is a physical print, not an issue. But the photo above being presented as a cast was what was raising my concern. I have no issue with the prints looking good or being reflective of the 3d model, but the image with the red background vs the image with the black are two renders, not a render and a cast as it's being promoted.

(You'll not that the print picture vs the render picture the camera POV & horizon are at different angles)

I personally think that those are legit castings that have been cleaned up for presentation. To what degree have they been cleaned up? I dunno.. but those bases.. how are those representative of what their new product will be? Those were castings of physical scupting.. this new line of products are castings of 3d printed goods.
That picture does highlight that TF does black backdrop cutouts on their physical products.. I just don't understand why people are so quick to villainize these guys. Sedition Wars was crucified over this kind of stuff.. arguably to a point where it destroyed McVey's reputation. In contrast, Mantic shovels out second rate crap to us and we give them a pass and ask for more.. I am just trying to understand the mentality people have here..


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Paulson... look again.. there's a mold line on the axe head on the cast you are struggling to believe.
EDIT: As a matter of fact.. the axe heads are at completely different angles.

Yeah, it's a cast imo - I have plenty of their stuff and the casts match the renders almost exactly.