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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/08 23:29:19
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Shas'o Commanding the Hunter Kadre
Olympia, WA
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D Weapons and instant Death Weapons weaken it. So there's that. Grotesques would be a decent answer.
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Hold out bait to entice the enemy. Feign disorder, and then crush him.
-Sun Tzu, the Art of War
http://www.40kunorthodoxy.blogspot.com
7th Ambassadorial Grand Tournament Registration: http://40kambassadors.com/register.php |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/08 23:32:40
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Dakka Veteran
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Jancoran wrote:D Weapons and instant Death Weapons weaken it. So there's that. Grotesques would be a decent answer.
Something everyone has, right?
Oh, and you can still make it on a 4+ with a Single 65 pts Crypter even in case of ID weapons, so not a good answer
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/08 23:41:27
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Warplord Titan Princeps of Tzeentch
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I must say, the new RP rules are more streamlined, but horrible design.
There is literally NO counter to that. at all. not a thing you could do. and it makes everything so much harder to kill.
The decurion just makes it worse, it makes the RP to be as if the entire codex has double the wounds, and pesudo eternal warrior.
and the capoptek formation piles on the final point of "what were they thinking" with giving units who were already absurdly tough for the cost (wraiths and spiders) acsess to the biggest shield USR in the game, for practically free.
Somewhere along the lines a huge ball was dropped, and nobody noticed.
(And for the dude that said tau and eldar were called underpowered at first-donno about eldar, but tau was precived as good from the first moment. the thing we complained about is the pisspoor internal balance and the fact some choices are clearly OP such as the riptide's IA or the broadside HYMP, while others were pointless, like rail broadsides, vespids and stealth suits)
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can neither confirm nor deny I lost track of what I've got right now. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 00:03:59
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Dakka Veteran
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They are incredibly durable, but where is their punch? Wraiths? Weight of Gauss fire? Destroyers? Maybe I'm missing something but their damage output doesn't seem to be massive.
Their Tesla got weaker, their main source of mobility (Scythes) got more expensive, A lot of cool units that you never saw can now be useful (Flayed Ones, those elite infantry guys etc.) which is cool. Wraiths did get pretty silly and they're really the only thing I worry about facing, as my army really doesn't have many answers to kill them.
I'm looking forward to playing against them and to see what sort of combinations will become popular. I'm really inspired to build my own Dark Mechanicum count-as-Necrons force too, but I'll have to see how much time and money I have available in the future.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/10/09 00:38:01
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Imperial Guard Landspeeder Pilot
On moon miranda.
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GrafWattenburg wrote:They are incredibly durable, but where is their punch? Wraiths? Weight of Gauss fire? Destroyers? Maybe I'm missing something but their damage output doesn't seem to be massive.
Their Tesla got weaker, their main source of mobility (Scythes) got more expensive, A lot of cool units that you never saw can now be useful (Flayed Ones, those elite infantry guys etc.) which is cool. Wraiths did get pretty silly and they're really the only thing I worry about facing, as my army really doesn't have many answers to kill them.
I'm looking forward to playing against them and to see what sort of combinations will become popular. I'm really inspired to build my own Dark Mechanicum count-as-Necrons force too, but I'll have to see how much time and money I have available in the future.
Their CC punch got massively increased, Gauss platforms in general are either cheaper, more resilient, or both, and Tesla remains just as effective aside from when Snapshooting, and their Tesla heavy units still aren't exactly outrageously expensive.
Between Wraiths, JSJ Destroyers, unbelievably resilient Immortals & Warriors, Flayed Ones putting out 5 "Shred" attacks each on a charge, Ghost Arks putting out double the number of shots at 12-24" they used to (up to 20 shots at two different targets at 24" now), Nightscythes still being amongst the cheapest and most effective flyers in the game, synergistic abilities like Stalkers, and of course Formations, they put still put out phenomenal damage.
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IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.
New Heavy Gear Log! Also...Grey Knights!
The correct pronunciation is Imperial Guard and Stormtroopers, "Astra Militarum" and "Tempestus Scions" are something you'll find at Hogwarts. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 00:39:24
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Devestating Grey Knight Dreadknight
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GrafWattenburg wrote:They are incredibly durable, but where is their punch? Wraiths? Weight of Gauss fire? Destroyers? Maybe I'm missing something but their damage output doesn't seem to be massive. Their Tesla got weaker, their main source of mobility (Scythes) got more expensive, A lot of cool units that you never saw can now be useful (Flayed Ones, those elite infantry guys etc.) which is cool. Wraiths did get pretty silly and they're really the only thing I worry about facing, as my army really doesn't have many answers to kill them. I'm looking forward to playing against them and to see what sort of combinations will become popular. I'm really inspired to build my own Dark Mechanicum count-as-Necrons force too, but I'll have to see how much time and money I have available in the future. Weight of fire has always been their thing, its just now Gauss is the autotake instead of tesla because the snapshot shenanigans got corrected. Hurting everything and anything on 6s is awesome; it means they can almost always do something which is great for the player because it doesn't make it feel like you have dead-weight in your army. I expect to see foot-slogging massed warriors at my FLGS soon, it will be a fun fight but I do expect to lose in the end.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/09 00:39:49
SHUPPET wrote:
wtf is this buddhist monk ascendant martial dice arts crap lol
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 00:52:11
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Shas'o Commanding the Hunter Kadre
Olympia, WA
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KurtAngle2 wrote: Jancoran wrote:D Weapons and instant Death Weapons weaken it. So there's that. Grotesques would be a decent answer.
Something everyone has, right?
Oh, and you can still make it on a 4+ with a Single 65 pts Crypter even in case of ID weapons, so not a good answer
So snipe the dude. Got snipers? if you think that every necron army will be built invincibly, i have some excellent ocean front property I can sell you in South Dakota and the weather is STUNNING this time of year.
Let's not overblow this. Lets think through it. So the dude has a Cryptek eh? How do you remove it?
So the guy has a Resurrection orb eh? How can we remove it...
So the Necron dude has Wraiths eh? how do you mire it?
I think asking those questions is probably worthwhile eh? Maybe moreso than spewing what the necrons CAAAAAN do, how about we talk about what we should do in response?
One response is Grotesques and Dark Eldar players will have them. Unless they don't want them. But that's a choice, isn't it?
So there's these really annoying characters eh? How about 120 Precision hots from the IG blob? or perhaps the precision shots from Tau Stealthsuits and/or Crisis teams with Burst Cannons? 24 STR 5 precision shots per unit might give you some help and its dirt cheap to give them precision shot. Costs IG nothing. Land one of those lascannons on him and let him make his save. Maybe he makes it. Maybe he gives the wound away. Who knows but its one MORE way to think about it.
Im just kinda tired of the doom and gloom. I play a ton of armies and I could get all upset about it or I can figure it out.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/09 07:42:51
Hold out bait to entice the enemy. Feign disorder, and then crush him.
-Sun Tzu, the Art of War
http://www.40kunorthodoxy.blogspot.com
7th Ambassadorial Grand Tournament Registration: http://40kambassadors.com/register.php |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 01:00:21
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Loyal Necron Lychguard
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GrafWattenburg wrote:They are incredibly durable, but where is their punch? Wraiths? Weight of Gauss fire? Destroyers? Maybe I'm missing something but their damage output doesn't seem to be massive.
Their Tesla got weaker, their main source of mobility (Scythes) got more expensive, A lot of cool units that you never saw can now be useful (Flayed Ones, those elite infantry guys etc.) which is cool. Wraiths did get pretty silly and they're really the only thing I worry about facing, as my army really doesn't have many answers to kill them.
I'm looking forward to playing against them and to see what sort of combinations will become popular. I'm really inspired to build my own Dark Mechanicum count-as-Necrons force too, but I'll have to see how much time and money I have available in the future.
I mean, weight of fire sure, but most of our units are viable now, and a lot of them have synergy. We have plenty of punch now, just as much as we did, and it takes you even longer to kill us, so we're shooting at you longer.
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40k:
8th Edtion: 9405 pts - Varantekh Dynasty |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 01:06:35
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Imperial Guard Landspeeder Pilot
On moon miranda.
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Jancoran wrote:KurtAngle2 wrote: Jancoran wrote:D Weapons and instant Death Weapons weaken it. So there's that. Grotesques would be a decent answer.
Something everyone has, right?
Oh, and you can still make it on a 4+ with a Single 65 pts Crypter even in case of ID weapons, so not a good answer
So snipe the dude. Got snipers? if you think that every necron army will be built invincibly, i have some excellent oceanfront property I can sell you South Dakota and the weathr is STUNNING tis time of year.
This is a kind of absurd response. "sniping" anything is exceedingly luck based and usually dependent on typically notably sub-optimal units, Wyverns and Thunderfire cannons being the primary exceptions through the abuse of Barrage wound-allocation. And that's not even taking "Look out sir!" into account.
Not feasible short of a Vindicare Assassin.
Either that or trying to kill him through a challenge in combat, but he can probably decline without much hazard or have something with a Warscythe step up.
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IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.
New Heavy Gear Log! Also...Grey Knights!
The correct pronunciation is Imperial Guard and Stormtroopers, "Astra Militarum" and "Tempestus Scions" are something you'll find at Hogwarts. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 01:06:42
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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On the plus side, close combat is back.
Yay?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 01:08:41
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Loyal Necron Lychguard
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40k:
8th Edtion: 9405 pts - Varantekh Dynasty |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 01:38:17
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Gargantuan Gargant
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The answer to 4+RP is volume of fire, plain and simple.
Does MSU suck at that ? Yes.
Does GW want you to buy and field more models ? Yes.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 01:56:54
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Fixture of Dakka
Chicago, Illinois
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People bitch about wraiths, but seriously people are going to lose their gak over Flayed Ones, once everyone get's on board with the 2 DLord Deepstriking Flayed ones with Wraiths lists.
Hell yes, CC oriented Necrons!
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If I lose it is because I had bad luck, if you win it is because you cheated. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 03:26:33
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Annoyed Blood Angel Devastator
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adamsouza wrote:The answer to 4+ RP is volume of fire, plain and simple.
Does MSU suck at that ? Yes.
Does GW want you to buy and field more models ? Yes.
Insane volumes of fire for a 4++ re-rolling ones or possible total re-rolls and multi wound wound models getting the save on each wound.
Please stop kidding yourself, the other 7th books would struggle hard to put out the kind of firepower needed to drowned it in fire And let me be clear the other 7th books ARE the standard, not tau, not eldar, not any pre 7th book. Why? Because its a 7th book and the 7th books were written to be somewhat balanced against each other.
The hope shouldve been that GW had finally seen the light and that would continue not that they would pull a classic GW and go overboard with no real answer as to why.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 03:29:48
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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BlackArmour wrote: adamsouza wrote:The answer to 4+ RP is volume of fire, plain and simple.
Does MSU suck at that ? Yes.
Does GW want you to buy and field more models ? Yes.
Insane volumes of fire for a 4++ re-rolling ones or possible total re-rolls and multi wound wound models getting the save on each wound.
Please stop kidding yourself, the other 7th books would struggle hard to put out the kind of firepower needed to drowned it in fire And let me be clear the other 7th books ARE the standard, not tau, not eldar, not any pre 7th book. Why? Because its a 7th book and the 7th books were written to be somewhat balanced against each other.
The hope shouldve been that GW had finally seen the light and that would continue not that they would pull a classic GW and go overboard with no real answer as to why.
Wait, how are they getting re-rolling ones??
Please tell me that's a formation, and I didn't skip over some wargear...
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 03:34:33
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Gargantuan Gargant
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BlackArmour wrote: adamsouza wrote:The answer to 4+ RP is volume of fire, plain and simple.
Does MSU suck at that ? Yes.
Does GW want you to buy and field more models ? Yes.
Insane volumes of fire for a 4++ re-rolling ones or possible total re-rolls and multi wound wound models getting the save on each wound.
Please stop kidding yourself, the other 7th books would struggle hard to put out the kind of firepower needed to drowned it in fire .
I've math hammered it all out in the other tactics thread. 4+ with 4+ RP is better than a 3+ save and worse than a 2+ save (kinda like any MEQ with FNP).
All those foot sloggin Astra Militarum lists are looking pretty good right now.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 03:50:48
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Imperial Guard Landspeeder Pilot
On moon miranda.
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adamsouza wrote:
All those foot sloggin Astra Militarum lists are looking pretty good right now.
O_o how so?
If we're referring to massed lasgun fire, a full 300pt blob (before any upgrades or character inclusions) of 50 dudes with FRFSRF (not including cost of officer unit or chance of failing Ld test) getting off 150 shots at 12" or less is killing a grand total of six 13pt Necron Warriors with 4+ RP.
For a 13pt model, that's a pretty insane amount of resiliency.
One will also notice Imperial Guard aren't exactly matching top-notch against anything else right now either.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/09 03:51:26
IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.
New Heavy Gear Log! Also...Grey Knights!
The correct pronunciation is Imperial Guard and Stormtroopers, "Astra Militarum" and "Tempestus Scions" are something you'll find at Hogwarts. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 03:51:39
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Annoyed Blood Angel Devastator
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adamsouza wrote: BlackArmour wrote: adamsouza wrote:The answer to 4+ RP is volume of fire, plain and simple.
Does MSU suck at that ? Yes.
Does GW want you to buy and field more models ? Yes.
Insane volumes of fire for a 4++ re-rolling ones or possible total re-rolls and multi wound wound models getting the save on each wound.
Please stop kidding yourself, the other 7th books would struggle hard to put out the kind of firepower needed to drowned it in fire .
I've math hammered it all out in the other tactics thread. 4+ with 4+ RP is better than a 3+ save and worse than a 2+ save (kinda like any MEQ with FNP).
All those foot sloggin Astra Militarum lists are looking pretty good right now.
Leaving out that fact your math hammer appears to fail to account for re-rolling 1s or total re-rolls or anything with better than a 4+ save (immortals, wraiths etc)
Thats 1 codex, that btw most necron players will likely have a CC that cn deep strike and pop an invisibilty like power and then proceed to destroy any gun lines. So no.... They dont look good. Automatically Appended Next Post: Akiasura wrote: BlackArmour wrote: adamsouza wrote:The answer to 4+ RP is volume of fire, plain and simple.
Does MSU suck at that ? Yes.
Does GW want you to buy and field more models ? Yes.
Insane volumes of fire for a 4++ re-rolling ones or possible total re-rolls and multi wound wound models getting the save on each wound.
Please stop kidding yourself, the other 7th books would struggle hard to put out the kind of firepower needed to drowned it in fire And let me be clear the other 7th books ARE the standard, not tau, not eldar, not any pre 7th book. Why? Because its a 7th book and the 7th books were written to be somewhat balanced against each other.
The hope shouldve been that GW had finally seen the light and that would continue not that they would pull a classic GW and go overboard with no real answer as to why.
Wait, how are they getting re-rolling ones??
Please tell me that's a formation, and I didn't skip over some wargear...
..... Sadly another formation, shield of baal.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/09 03:53:30
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 04:23:04
Subject: Re:Power Level of the Necron Codex
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!!Goffik Rocker!!
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Newcrons are not overly killy but are very durable. It's like playing against an army of smashfethers. You know you'll never kill them without S: D.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/09 04:23:50
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 05:27:33
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Trigger-Happy Baal Predator Pilot
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And also the reclamation legion of the decurion detachment.
EDIT: SP
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/09 05:27:47
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 05:38:32
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Loyal Necron Lychguard
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Mulletdude wrote:
And also the reclamation legion of the decurion detachment.
EDIT: SP
Beat me to it. lol
Yeah, the standard formation of their personal "force org" equivalent gives a 12" bubble of rerolling ones from your warlord. Automatically Appended Next Post: Also, a random fact I happened upon a little while ago, Spyders and their spawning ability, can now be used locked or unlocked in combat, and at any time during the movement phase. Also, if they roll a 1 and take an unsaved wound, you're allowed a RP roll if you have it from the formation. =P
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/09 05:40:32
40k:
8th Edtion: 9405 pts - Varantekh Dynasty |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 07:41:45
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Shas'o Commanding the Hunter Kadre
Olympia, WA
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Vaktathi wrote: Jancoran wrote:KurtAngle2 wrote: Jancoran wrote:D Weapons and instant Death Weapons weaken it. So there's that. Grotesques would be a decent answer.
Something everyone has, right?
Oh, and you can still make it on a 4+ with a Single 65 pts Crypter even in case of ID weapons, so not a good answer
So snipe the dude. Got snipers? if you think that every necron army will be built invincibly, i have some excellent oceanfront property I can sell you South Dakota and the weathr is STUNNING tis time of year.
This is a kind of absurd response. "sniping" anything is exceedingly luck based and usually dependent on typically notably sub-optimal units, Wyverns and Thunderfire cannons being the primary exceptions through the abuse of Barrage wound-allocation. And that's not even taking "Look out sir!" into account.
Not feasible short of a Vindicare Assassin.
Either that or trying to kill him through a challenge in combat, but he can probably decline without much hazard or have something with a Warscythe step up.
Well here's your alternative: Swoon or change what you're doing I guess. A Vindicare works. Get one.
I've named no less than three different forces that can employ means to get at characters that are problematic and you've named a dataslate anyone can use. ANYONE. I can name more. Even if you CANT snipe them, you may kill them anyways.
Don't lose hope so early in the game. I doubt ANYONE has enough games in againt them to have claimed to have adjusted to it. So I'll wait until people have played more before going all crazy about it.
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Hold out bait to entice the enemy. Feign disorder, and then crush him.
-Sun Tzu, the Art of War
http://www.40kunorthodoxy.blogspot.com
7th Ambassadorial Grand Tournament Registration: http://40kambassadors.com/register.php |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 08:37:07
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Imperial Guard Landspeeder Pilot
On moon miranda.
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Jancoran wrote:
Well here's your alternative: Swoon or change what you're doing I guess. A Vindicare works. Get one.
That's a 150pt model to deal with a 65pt character who's going to take an average of 3-4 turns to get the job done. Additionally, it has no fluff place being in many armies (which is important to some people, this game wouldn't exist without it). If that's the solution to the problem, then there's a game design issue on two separate levels.
I've named no less than three different forces that can employ means to get at characters that are problematic and you've named a dataslate anyone can use. ANYONE. I can name more. Even if you CANT snipe them, you may kill them anyways.
Yes, there have been some things put forward. Most of which aren't really as effective as they'd seem to otherwise be.
IG blob? Well, for something like you're talking about (not sure how to get 120 shots without using FRFSRF instead) we're talking about a 300pt blob minimum before characters or upgrade weapons, Lets assume 120 shots though anyway even though I think that's not possible.
We get 20 that get Precision Shots and can be allocated to the Cryptek. He can still Look Out Sir these, so 3.33 stick, 1.11 wound, 0.55 fail the armor save, and 0.277 shots make it through RP. So, about the time you made it through 20 Warriors through raw volume of firepower with Lasguns, you'd stick enough Precision Shots on to kill their Cryptek.
Don't lose hope so early in the game. I doubt ANYONE has enough games in againt them to have claimed to have adjusted to it. So I'll wait until people have played more before going all crazy about it.
I'm pointing out that the solutions being offered either aren't as effective as they may immediately seem, or have other caveats that are barriers to use.
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IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.
New Heavy Gear Log! Also...Grey Knights!
The correct pronunciation is Imperial Guard and Stormtroopers, "Astra Militarum" and "Tempestus Scions" are something you'll find at Hogwarts. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 13:29:25
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Been Around the Block
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They are good! My mono fluffy 2k Khorne list got humiliated by 20 flayed ones, 5 tomb blades and a barge lord. The rest of his army played little part in the game. Those with low attack heavy hitters are crippled by that 4+ RP rerole 1’s, because it’s a cheap save that can’t be bypassed.
You can build an army to get a +4 RP with a rerole even if you’re getting ID’ed. so a five man squad of warriors can survive against a bloodthirster.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 15:36:43
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Twisting Tzeentch Horror
Canada
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Can confirm, Warirors are very difficult to kill.
Even with small arms fire (say my 20 cultists with auto guns and 2x stubbers) they are as tough to kill or more difficult than a squad of terminators.
At roughly 1/3 the cost.
With a real weapon they are on equal footing (5+ save)(or 6 if warriors are unbuffed)
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3000 Points Tzeentch |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 18:36:44
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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Konrax wrote:Can confirm, Warirors are very difficult to kill.
Even with small arms fire (say my 20 cultists with auto guns and 2x stubbers) they are as tough to kill or more difficult than a squad of terminators.
At roughly 1/3 the cost.
With a real weapon they are on equal footing (5+ save)(or 6 if warriors are unbuffed)
To be fair, Terminators aren't exactly tough in the first place...
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CaptainStabby wrote:If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.
jy2 wrote:BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.
vipoid wrote:Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?
MarsNZ wrote:ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 19:14:28
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Shas'o Commanding the Hunter Kadre
Olympia, WA
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Vaktathi wrote: Jancoran wrote:
Well here's your alternative: Swoon or change what you're doing I guess. A Vindicare works. Get one.
That's a 150pt model to deal with a 65pt character who's going to take an average of 3-4 turns to get the job done. Additionally, it has no fluff place being in many armies (which is important to some people, this game wouldn't exist without it). If that's the solution to the problem, then there's a game design issue on two separate levels.
I've named no less than three different forces that can employ means to get at characters that are problematic and you've named a dataslate anyone can use. ANYONE. I can name more. Even if you CANT snipe them, you may kill them anyways.
Yes, there have been some things put forward. Most of which aren't really as effective as they'd seem to otherwise be.
IG blob? Well, for something like you're talking about (not sure how to get 120 shots without using FRFSRF instead) we're talking about a 300pt blob minimum before characters or upgrade weapons, Lets assume 120 shots though anyway even though I think that's not possible.
We get 20 that get Precision Shots and can be allocated to the Cryptek. He can still Look Out Sir these, so 3.33 stick, 1.11 wound, 0.55 fail the armor save, and 0.277 shots make it through RP. So, about the time you made it through 20 Warriors through raw volume of firepower with Lasguns, you'd stick enough Precision Shots on to kill their Cryptek.
Don't lose hope so early in the game. I doubt ANYONE has enough games in againt them to have claimed to have adjusted to it. So I'll wait until people have played more before going all crazy about it.
I'm pointing out that the solutions being offered either aren't as effective as they may immediately seem, or have other caveats that are barriers to use.
120 shots in rtwo rounds si entirely possible. You're closing your mind off ot the possibilities. You keep saying "yeah but" instead of "Yeah, correct". Why?
I guess its just a difference in how we think.
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Hold out bait to entice the enemy. Feign disorder, and then crush him.
-Sun Tzu, the Art of War
http://www.40kunorthodoxy.blogspot.com
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 19:39:02
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Warplord Titan Princeps of Tzeentch
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120 shots in two rounds is TECHINCALLY possible, but not PRACTICALLY possible.
To shoot this much you'll need 30 guys in RF range, and the wraiths to somehow fail to charge at them. given how absurdly faster wraiths are, even a single turn of RF is doubtful.
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can neither confirm nor deny I lost track of what I've got right now. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 20:38:01
Subject: Re:Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Battlewagon Driver with Charged Engine
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It's a good Codex and the only slightly overpowered unit I see are the Wraiths. I disagree about the new Codex being more powerful than the old one, by a far margin. On a general level units got buffs across the board, but they nerfed the overpowered builds ( albeit allowing a new one, but I'm fairly certain Wraith spam will start to get countered quite quickly as the meta develops. )
I just played against the new Necrons in a tournament but it doesn't really tell anyone anything as he wasn't playing a cheesy list even by a long shot.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/09 20:44:25
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/09 20:57:08
Subject: Power Level of the Necron Codex
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Imperial Guard Landspeeder Pilot
On moon miranda.
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Jancoran wrote: Vaktathi wrote: Jancoran wrote:
Well here's your alternative: Swoon or change what you're doing I guess. A Vindicare works. Get one.
That's a 150pt model to deal with a 65pt character who's going to take an average of 3-4 turns to get the job done. Additionally, it has no fluff place being in many armies (which is important to some people, this game wouldn't exist without it). If that's the solution to the problem, then there's a game design issue on two separate levels.
I've named no less than three different forces that can employ means to get at characters that are problematic and you've named a dataslate anyone can use. ANYONE. I can name more. Even if you CANT snipe them, you may kill them anyways.
Yes, there have been some things put forward. Most of which aren't really as effective as they'd seem to otherwise be.
IG blob? Well, for something like you're talking about (not sure how to get 120 shots without using FRFSRF instead) we're talking about a 300pt blob minimum before characters or upgrade weapons, Lets assume 120 shots though anyway even though I think that's not possible.
We get 20 that get Precision Shots and can be allocated to the Cryptek. He can still Look Out Sir these, so 3.33 stick, 1.11 wound, 0.55 fail the armor save, and 0.277 shots make it through RP. So, about the time you made it through 20 Warriors through raw volume of firepower with Lasguns, you'd stick enough Precision Shots on to kill their Cryptek.
Don't lose hope so early in the game. I doubt ANYONE has enough games in againt them to have claimed to have adjusted to it. So I'll wait until people have played more before going all crazy about it.
I'm pointing out that the solutions being offered either aren't as effective as they may immediately seem, or have other caveats that are barriers to use.
120 shots in rtwo rounds si entirely possible. You're closing your mind off ot the possibilities. You keep saying "yeah but" instead of "Yeah, correct". Why?
I guess its just a difference in how we think.
If we're going with two rounds, sure, but again, as shown, it's not an effective method of doing what you described, given the weak S, the ability to Look Out Sir the Precision Shots, and the 4+ sv on top of 4+ RP. So yeah, in that sense you can do it, but again "yeah but", it's not an effective method at all of picking out the character. Again, primarily due to the ability to "look out sir" the wounds, you'll kill the rest of the unit through brute force by the time enough wounds stick on the character to matter, making the tactic rather pointless.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/09 20:57:54
IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.
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The correct pronunciation is Imperial Guard and Stormtroopers, "Astra Militarum" and "Tempestus Scions" are something you'll find at Hogwarts. |
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