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Dont rely on saves, rely on speed and combat end timing to stay alive.

Having expensive glass units isnt worth the loss unless you have allies.

Yeah, the army cant handle any kind of firepower which is why I think using the formation the Scalpel Squadron is going to help more than anything. You start on board , your guys are going to die.

You get the jump on them the 2nd turn, use the Mirage stuff to jink past any oncoming fire on the turn then Charge on turn 3.

Need someway to manipulate or ensure that you get the Reserve rolls though.

Being able to take a Fortification is tough though. If your allying with Eldar Autarch is the way to go. Plus he can tank the Skyweavers.

I mean have we found out if you can even take a Ally detachment with them with Eldar or Dark Eldar? How does that even work? Do Dark Eldar or Eldar just take the Special detachment?

You can ally an Eldar (or anyone else) CAD, Allied or specific Detachment to a Harlequin Masque detachment or any of their formations. The HM Detachment can be your primary and contain your Warlord, an Allied detachment cannot (but a CAD can, so if you want a Warlord Farseer, Archon ect then that's still doable)

 Paradigm wrote:
You can ally an Eldar (or anyone else) CAD, Allied or specific Detachment to a Harlequin Masque detachment or any of their formations. The HM Detachment can be your primary and contain your Warlord, an Allied detachment cannot (but a CAD can, so if you want a Warlord Farseer, Archon ect then that's still doable)

This. Most formats are moving to an 0-1 CAD/Ally/Formation/Detachment scheme, with no more than 2 sources. So Harlie would occupy either a formation/detachment (depending on what you take), and CWE/DE would be CAD/Ally. Can't think of a reason you wouldn't use a CAD in order to have greater flexibility, but I guess the option's there. Again, for a very modest cost in real world money (relative to GW pricing) and points, I can't think of a good reason to not at least run 2 farseers and some jetbikes. Could easily ebay your entire CAD for ~70 bucks (no farseer on jetbike model, so really just buy > = 8 CWE jetbikes) and you're set.

Wait so you cannot have a Harlequin ally because they have no HQ , but you could have a Primary Harlequin special detachment, and ally with Dark Eldar/ Eldar.

However, the best I've seen for getting a crap load of Harlequins is really just to use that one formation that has 3 spirit seers 3 DJ, Solitaire, 3 Harlequin troops, 2 Skyweavers, Voidweavers.

1 Formation and can be taken with the benefit of a CAD.

You could have a Harlie primary, and Allied or CAD Eldar/DE. You could alternatively have a Primary Eldar (either flavour) and a secondary (not Allied Detachment) Harlie Detachment/formation.

In 7th, the only thing that determines the Primary detachment is where the Warlord lives, and any Detachment can be taken in what used to be the 'allies' slot. For example, all of these are legal:

Space Marines CAD, Space Marines CAD
Space Marines CAD, Blood Angels CAD
Space Marines CAD, Blood Angels Baal Strike Force, IG Allied detachment
Space Marine CAD, Champions of Fenris SW, Adamantine Lance Knight formation, Inquisition Detachment, Harlequin Masque Detachment, Legion of the Damned Detachment.

In other words, any combination of Detachments and Formations is possible. The only real Restriction is that you Warlord cannot be in an Allied Detachment, but can be from any other/any other can be your Primary Detachment.

I think Harlequins are their own faction so that would mean that you could not take a Eldar "normal" detachment and a Harlequin special detachment. Your main Primary detachment determines what's type of CADS you can have.

So yeah if you take the Harlequin special cad, then you can only have ally Eldar and DArk Eldar Cads.

Hollismason wrote:
I think Harlequins are their own faction so that would mean that you could not take a Eldar "normal" detachment and a Harlequin special detachment. Your main Primary detachment determines what's type of CADS you can have.

So yeah if you take the Harlequin special cad, then you can only have ally Eldar and DArk Eldar Cads.

Not sure where this comes from. You can take a CAD from any army as a Primary, secondary... ad infinatum Detachment regardless of whether or not your Primary is a CAD. So:

Harlequin Masque (Primary, Contains Warlord, has own benefits), Eldar CAD (normal benefits, restrictions, no Warlord), Dark Eldar Realspace Raiders (specific restrictions/benefits, no Warlord)

is a perfectly fine setup. A Combined Arms Detachment (CAD) is only one type of detachment, a Harlie Masque Detachment is not a CAD.

The only restriction is that you may not have an Allied (as in 1 HQ, 0-1 FA/HS/EL, 1-2 Troops) Detachent from the same Codex as your Primary Detachment (that contains your Warlord, this can be a CAD or specific Detachment).

Nevermind we wrote the same thing.

Yeah, I see what your saying.

Anyway this is the list I am considering its... different. Mainly I am making use of the fact that the Harlequins give a special rule to Dark Eldar that is really really useful. Hit and Run. Here we go!

Dark Eldar Real Space Raider Detachment

Lelith ( GREAT HARLEQUIN!!)

Elites
Incubi w/ Klaivex x3 , Venom
3 Grotesques w/ Raider w/ Aerosails


Troops
5 Kabalit Troops w/ Blaster , Raider w/ Dark Lance
5 Kabalite Troops w/ Blaster, Raider w/ Dark Lance

F. Attack
Raider w/ Dark Lance
Razorwing
Razorwing

Formation Cresendo
Solitaire
3 Death Jesters
3 Shadowseer
8 Harlequins (unsure of load out)
5 Harlequins , Star Weaver
5 Harlequins , Star Weaver
2 Skyweavers
2 Skyweavers
Voidweaver


Lelith makes a fantastic substitution for Great Harlequin and a great add because she get's Hit and Run , plus in a Harlequin unit she gains the run and charge.

Hollismason wrote:
Nevermind we wrote the same thing.

Yeah, I see what your saying.

Anyway this is the list I am considering its... different. Mainly I am making use of the fact that the Harlequins give a special rule to Dark Eldar that is really really useful. Hit and Run. Here we go!

Dark Eldar Real Space Raider Detachment

Lelith ( GREAT HARLEQUIN!!)

Elites
Incubi w/ Klaivex x3 , Venom
3 Grotesques w/ Raider w/ Aerosails


Troops
5 Kabalit Troops w/ Blaster , Raider w/ Dark Lance
5 Kabalite Troops w/ Blaster, Raider w/ Dark Lance

F. Attack
Raider w/ Dark Lance
Razorwing
Razorwing

Formation Cresendo
Solitaire
3 Death Jesters
3 Solitairs
8 Harlequins (unsure of load out)
5 Harlequins , Star Weaver
5 Harlequins , Star Weaver
2 Skyweavers
2 Skyweavers
Voidweaver


Lelith makes a fantastic substitution for Great Harlequin and a great add because she get's Hit and Run , plus in a Harlequin unit she gains the run and charge.

Couple of minor points: You said "3 Solitairs" [sic]. I assume you mean Shadowseers as per the detachment. Pretty sure that's what you meant, just wanted to make sure you weren't planning on taking 4 solitaires. As awesome as that'd be they're unique, so can never have more than 1

Second, not sure what the Incubi bring to the fight. Your Harlies are plenty of CC, especially w/Lelith. Same points gets you scourges, which would fill a pretty big AT gap you have. Same question about the grotesques, but being high T and FnP I can see wanting a durable scary unit to draw fire.

Thrid: not 100% on the formation rule conferring to Lelith. It applies to "units from this formation". Her being an IC, I think it works as IC's become part of the unit and the unit is from the formation. She's got fleet, so the only real question is of her not being "purchased" from the formation and the questionable conferal of the rule to her. Again, I think you're right there, but I'd make a YMTD thread just to be sure.

Fourth: I don't have my codex (though I don't begrudge the dock workers getting their piece of the pie), but is pressing crescendo (run -> charge rule) specific to the formations, or is it also on the Masque detachment? I'm assuming it's on the formations, because otherwise the "re-roll 1's on invuln" isn't really enough to justify the bloat in that formation.

Yes it's a mistype.

It's on the formation and Lelith is part of a unit from that formation, so the ability will confer to her because they don't stop being units of that formation when joined by a Character. Maybe that's YMDC question to be left out. This question though has come up with other units from formations being joined by special characters and in fact it's always yep, it works that way.

The Incubi are there because of the Death Jesters, I needed a Small squad to put them with that would benefit from a brutal assault and a 3 man incubi squad is pretty nice. 3+ ,5+ FNP and a massive number of AP2 attacks is pretty sweet. Something the army does in fact lack or I can stick the Death jesters with the Kabalite Warriors and run Lelith w/ a Shadowseer and Incubi together in one hard hitting squad.

Grotesques are there because them getting Hit and Run is amazing. Plus they are a great tarpit plus eventually they get fearless and they need a LD10.

The point was to give Hit and Run to units that don't usually get it (Grotesques / Incubi) , and add some stuff to the Harlequins that they don't get (high toughness, stock AP2 weaponry, Fliers)

I don't think it's hard hitting enough though plus I have to actually sit down and do the points but that's basically the idea I'm going for.

My corsairs have plenty to drop a hive tyrant, and the blob certainly wouldn't be running towards it on open ground. They totally ignore difficult terrain, if I think big and shoooty is gonna be a problem, go for cover. I should be safe an average of 14" away, then my night wing interceptors/ phoenix bomber can drop their air support in one volley.
But you are correct, flying monstrous creature spam will be a real problem for pure harlequins.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Hollismason wrote:
Yes it's a mistype.

It's on the formation and Lelith is part of a unit from that formation, so the ability will confer to her because they don't stop being units of that formation when joined by a Character. Maybe that's YMDC question to be left out. This question though has come up with other units from formations being joined by special characters and in fact it's always yep, it works that way.

The Incubi are there because of the Death Jesters, I needed a Small squad to put them with that would benefit from a brutal assault and a 3 man incubi squad is pretty nice. 3+ ,5+ FNP and a massive number of AP2 attacks is pretty sweet. Something the army does in fact lack or I can stick the Death jesters with the Kabalite Warriors and run Lelith w/ a Solitair and Incubi together in one hard hitting squad.

Grotesques are there because them getting Hit and Run is amazing. Plus they are a great tarpit plus eventually they get fearless and they need a LD10.

The point was to give Hit and Run to units that don't usually get it (Grotesques / Incubi) , and add some stuff to the Harlequins that they don't get (high toughness, stock AP2 weaponry, Fliers)

I don't think it's hard hitting enough though plus I have to actually sit down and do the points but that's basically the idea I'm going for.

Nothing can join a solitaire.

Yeah I can't get the shadowseer / solitair thing out of my head I don't know why.

Are there any ideas of using Harlies as smaller allies for Eldar?

I'm not sure how I would use “Way of Heroes” efficiently. All seem more or less usefull but at the same time also fragile.
"Company of Actors” made me sad when I realised that the minimum size of the unit is 7, and therefore they cannot fit in their DT.
I'm also not 100% sold on all the weaver formations. “Faolchu’s Blade”/"Cegorach’s Jest”

Hollismason wrote:Yes it's a mistype.

It's on the formation and Lelith is part of a unit from that formation, so the ability will confer to her because they don't stop being units of that formation when joined by a Character. Maybe that's YMDC question to be left out. This question though has come up with other units from formations being joined by special characters and in fact it's always yep, it works that way.

The Incubi are there because of the Death Jesters, I needed a Small squad to put them with that would benefit from a brutal assault and a 3 man incubi squad is pretty nice. 3+ ,5+ FNP and a massive number of AP2 attacks is pretty sweet. Something the army does in fact lack or I can stick the Death jesters with the Kabalite Warriors and run Lelith w/ a Shadowseer and Incubi together in one hard hitting squad.

Grotesques are there because them getting Hit and Run is amazing. Plus they are a great tarpit plus eventually they get fearless and they need a LD10.

The point was to give Hit and Run to units that don't usually get it (Grotesques / Incubi) , and add some stuff to the Harlequins that they don't get (high toughness, stock AP2 weaponry, Fliers)

I don't think it's hard hitting enough though plus I have to actually sit down and do the points but that's basically the idea I'm going for.

If you're happy w/ Incubi then I guess it's alright. A HtH unit w/out grenades is DOA to me though (See: Skyweavers). Counting on the DJ to force people out of cover is a pretty big gamble, but I suppose it could work. However, my main remark was more a question of do you really need more CC units from DE? Harlies do CC fairly well as is, what the DE offer that is lacking is AT and AA. Completely agree on taking a couple Razorwings, they're amazing. And a Grotesque bomb is a good pressure unit to distract from the more fragile harlies. Just don't see Incubi adding anywhere near as much as a squad or two of Scourges w/ Haywire blasters would, especially given my rant below on how bad the AT options in the harlie codex are.

macexor wrote:Are there any ideas of using Harlies as smaller allies for Eldar?

I'm not sure how I would use “Way of Heroes” efficiently. All seem more or less usefull but at the same time also fragile.
"Company of Actors” made me sad when I realised that the minimum size of the unit is 7, and therefore they cannot fit in their DT.
I'm also not 100% sold on all the weaver formations. “Faolchu’s Blade”/"Cegorach’s Jest”

Definitely planning on doing CWE main w/ Harlie friends. ATM my initial plan is to run an old unit from a list I don't run anymore: 20 man Guardian blob (2 BLs) backed up by "Company of Actors". Crusader + Fleet + Battle focus puts a giant fearless (thanks Shard), Obsec. blob in the center of the board on turn 1. Harlies are there to bail them out of CC/deterrent and are pretty well untargetable due to the blob screening them out, having veil and providing a cover save to be augmented by either Shroud or dance of shadows. Rest of the list is pretty standard CWE fair, but the blob + Harlies provide a huge problem in terms of objective coverage for your opponent.

Looks something like
Farseer- Shard, Jetbike
Farseer- Spirt stone Anath, Jetbike

DA- WS (SL, holofields)
DA- WS (SL, holofields)
Guardian blob- 2 BL platforms WS (SL, holofields)

Warp Spiders

WK

Company of Actors- SS- Mask of secrets, DJ-Laughing God's Eye, ~10 Harlies w/Kisses

That CWE list (outside the guardians) is the base of what I use now, and it's a pretty good/cookie cutter template. The guardian blob is a unit I used to run with Vect (............) and had some success with. The Company of Actors costs ~ same as Vect did after factoring in warriors/venoms. It's definitely not a GT winner, but the guts are solid and it can get work done. More importantly, it's something I can throw together with just one unit of Harlies while I try and figure out how to break the codex.

Far as I can tell, Way of Heroes is a way to get a Solitaire cheap. A solo DJ is underwhelming. A solo Shadowseer might be able to shoot mind bullets at someone, but other than that is pretty meh not being able to cast veil on a nasty unit. Stealth + Shroud and Infiltrate on the Solitaire is pretty gravy, just not sure it's worth the 120-145 point tax to get it.

Faolchu's Blade............no. Maybe I'm missing the boat, but I don't see anything in either the Skyweaver or Voidweaver that makes me want to take either. As I've said before, re-rolling Jink sounds really good, till you realize that the weapons you want on these guys are blast template weapons that can't be fired while jinking. So, great, they won't die. But they're also not putting out any dmg past the one turn they blow mirage launchers. The Voidweaver can be fired focus, but a single shot weapons aren't great to begin with (high every sniper unit in the game), snap shotting makes them pretty close to pointless. W/out volume of fire weapons, Jink wrecks your dmg output. Alt you can use the Voidweaver as a Shuriken Cannon boat....which costs more than a Vyper. And we all know how often Vyper's see a table. Unless you're chasing a full squadron of Voidweavers around with a Farseer guiding them (and even then), I'm not sure how this formation does anything besides force your opponent to shoot AI weapons to force a jink so they can ignore them the rest of the game.

As far as skyweavers go......so much wasted potential. Why can't GW just type "grenades" in the equipment column? Anywho, w/out them being a reasonable CC threat their only niche is haywire blaster. See above about why blast templates on a platform that relies on Jink for it's durability is a bad idea. If they had a Heavy 2 option to fire the blaster, these guys would be amazing. That or grenades. Or if the glaive was an even swap for the bolas. Or if their armor was 3+, not the ubiquitously ignored 4+. Or. Or. Or. Or. Or.

Cegorach's Jest: Again, no. It's exactly the same as Faolchu's Blade, except now you trade one unit of skyweavers for a troupe. That gets you a Starweaver, which is OK, but now you've also lost your Jink bonus and your troupe doesn't get access to a shadowseer/DJ. So while your Dmg potential goes up (Harlies don't care about jink) you sacrifice a huge amount of durability for that pretty small/situational/vulnerable offense. It really is Faolchu's Blade minus the re-roll, and Faolchu's Blade isn't even worth taking then....

Yeah I can see the points on the Incubi but I wanna test it out first, before saying no. I know that the Grotesques are going to be good, Shadowseer gives them Fearless w/ the Mask , and a -2 LD check for Fear. Plus, no one can bog down the unit because of hit and run.

Can't say for sure the Incubi won't work till they hit a table.

But that Grot bomb could be real nasty. 3-4 Grots on a raider, Lelith/Tooled up archon/succubus (armor of misery + phantasom launcher?) +1-3 shadowseers w/mask could really synergize well with the rest of the Harliequins. It's a target that has to be dealt with.T5 FnP fearless grots will absorb a lot of firepower, letting the Harlies do their thing in peace. Either deal with all the small squads of nasties, or focus on the big wrecking ball of nasty. Forcing that target priority is gonna make some people sweat. With armor of Misery it's a -4LD, and your shadowseer has access to 2 LD based psychic attacks, one of which keeps going till they roll higher than you on a LD test.... You could DS down and get Slay the Warlord and there's nothing your opponent could do but cry.

As far as skyweavers go......so much wasted potential. Why can't GW just type "grenades" in the equipment column? Anywho, w/out them being a reasonable CC threat their only niche is haywire blaster. See above about why blast templates on a platform that relies on Jink for it's durability is a bad idea. If they had a Heavy 2 option to fire the blaster, these guys would be amazing. That or grenades. Or if the glaive was an even swap for the bolas. Or if their armor was 3+, not the ubiquitously ignored 4+. Or. Or. Or. Or. Or.

If one member has plasma grenades, does the whole unit benefit?
Autarch on jetbike?

 Dash2021 wrote:
Can't say for sure the Incubi won't work till they hit a table.

But that Grot bomb could be real nasty. 3-4 Grots on a raider, Lelith/Tooled up archon/succubus (armor of misery + phantasom launcher?) +1-3 shadowseers w/mask could really synergize well with the rest of the Harliequins. It's a target that has to be dealt with.T5 FnP fearless grots will absorb a lot of firepower, letting the Harlies do their thing in peace. Either deal with all the small squads of nasties, or focus on the big wrecking ball of nasty. Forcing that target priority is gonna make some people sweat. With armor of Misery it's a -4LD, and your shadowseer has access to 2 LD based psychic attacks, one of which keeps going till they roll higher than you on a LD test.... You could DS down and get Slay the Warlord and there's nothing your opponent could do but cry.

Yeah the Armour of Misery , Mask of Secrets combo is almost instant death for any Character if you get it off . I think statistically it's like ridiculous chance of them succeeding, w/ LD 10 , they'd need to roll a 6, at the same time you rolled a 1 or 2.

I dunno I'm sure someone can do the math, this was the Grot Bomb I was thinking of


Archon w/ Webway Portal, Agonizer, Shadowfield, Armour of Misery (
Shadowseer Level 2 w/ Mask w/ Phantamancy
Shadowseer w/ Telepathy (-4 Psychic Shriek isn't to bad)
3 Grotesques

Expensive but worth it because Death Jesters can shoot at the squads with in 12 " of this and they'll have a -6 to their LD rolls or Fail, then you have the power Terror from Telepathy for a -5 , it just get's kind of ridiculous having a -4 Modifier.

What do you guys think about taking some Harlequins as allies for Tau? how would you kit them out

Lurker wrote:

As far as skyweavers go......so much wasted potential. Why can't GW just type "grenades" in the equipment column? Anywho, w/out them being a reasonable CC threat their only niche is haywire blaster. See above about why blast templates on a platform that relies on Jink for it's durability is a bad idea. If they had a Heavy 2 option to fire the blaster, these guys would be amazing. That or grenades. Or if the glaive was an even swap for the bolas. Or if their armor was 3+, not the ubiquitously ignored 4+. Or. Or. Or. Or. Or.

If one member has plasma grenades, does the whole unit benefit?
Autarch on jetbike?

Unfortunately no, grenades are work on whom they're equipped.

Hollismason wrote:

 Dash2021 wrote:
Can't say for sure the Incubi won't work till they hit a table.

But that Grot bomb could be real nasty. 3-4 Grots on a raider, Lelith/Tooled up archon/succubus (armor of misery + phantasom launcher?) +1-3 shadowseers w/mask could really synergize well with the rest of the Harliequins. It's a target that has to be dealt with.T5 FnP fearless grots will absorb a lot of firepower, letting the Harlies do their thing in peace. Either deal with all the small squads of nasties, or focus on the big wrecking ball of nasty. Forcing that target priority is gonna make some people sweat. With armor of Misery it's a -4LD, and your shadowseer has access to 2 LD based psychic attacks, one of which keeps going till they roll higher than you on a LD test.... You could DS down and get Slay the Warlord and there's nothing your opponent could do but cry.

Yeah the Armour of Misery , Mask of Secrets combo is almost instant death for any Character if you get it off . I think statistically it's like ridiculous chance of them succeeding, w/ LD 10 , they'd need to roll a 6, at the same time you rolled a 1 or 2.

I dunno I'm sure someone can do the math, this was the Grot Bomb I was thinking of


Archon w/ Webway Portal, Agonizer, Shadowfield, Armour of Misery (
Shadowseer Level 2 w/ Mask w/ Phantamancy
Shadowseer w/ Telepathy (-4 Psychic Shriek isn't to bad)
3 Grotesques

Expensive but worth it because Death Jesters can shoot at the squads with in 12 " of this and they'll have a -6 to their LD rolls or Fail, then you have the power Terror from Telepathy for a -5 , it just get's kind of ridiculous having a -4 Modifier.

For Mirror to fail in that scenario it's 1/18 chance. That loadout was similar to what I was thinking, minus the DJ. Not sold on him just yet, seems pretty situational/gimmicky. Whereas another shadowseer gets more chances at powers you want + more WC's. I always err on the side of more psychers.

 Dash2021 wrote:

Lurker wrote:

As far as skyweavers go......so much wasted potential. Why can't GW just type "grenades" in the equipment column? Anywho, w/out them being a reasonable CC threat their only niche is haywire blaster. See above about why blast templates on a platform that relies on Jink for it's durability is a bad idea. If they had a Heavy 2 option to fire the blaster, these guys would be amazing. That or grenades. Or if the glaive was an even swap for the bolas. Or if their armor was 3+, not the ubiquitously ignored 4+. Or. Or. Or. Or. Or.

If one member has plasma grenades, does the whole unit benefit?
Autarch on jetbike?

Unfortunately no, grenades are work on whom they're equipped.

Hollismason wrote:

 Dash2021 wrote:
Can't say for sure the Incubi won't work till they hit a table.

But that Grot bomb could be real nasty. 3-4 Grots on a raider, Lelith/Tooled up archon/succubus (armor of misery + phantasom launcher?) +1-3 shadowseers w/mask could really synergize well with the rest of the Harliequins. It's a target that has to be dealt with.T5 FnP fearless grots will absorb a lot of firepower, letting the Harlies do their thing in peace. Either deal with all the small squads of nasties, or focus on the big wrecking ball of nasty. Forcing that target priority is gonna make some people sweat. With armor of Misery it's a -4LD, and your shadowseer has access to 2 LD based psychic attacks, one of which keeps going till they roll higher than you on a LD test.... You could DS down and get Slay the Warlord and there's nothing your opponent could do but cry.

Yeah the Armour of Misery , Mask of Secrets combo is almost instant death for any Character if you get it off . I think statistically it's like ridiculous chance of them succeeding, w/ LD 10 , they'd need to roll a 6, at the same time you rolled a 1 or 2.

I dunno I'm sure someone can do the math, this was the Grot Bomb I was thinking of


Archon w/ Webway Portal, Agonizer, Shadowfield, Armour of Misery (
Shadowseer Level 2 w/ Mask w/ Phantamancy
Shadowseer w/ Telepathy (-4 Psychic Shriek isn't to bad)
3 Grotesques

Expensive but worth it because Death Jesters can shoot at the squads with in 12 " of this and they'll have a -6 to their LD rolls or Fail, then you have the power Terror from Telepathy for a -5 , it just get's kind of ridiculous having a -4 Modifier.

For Mirror to fail in that scenario it's 1/18 chance. That loadout was similar to what I was thinking, minus the DJ. Not sold on him just yet, seems pretty situational/gimmicky. Whereas another shadowseer gets more chances at powers you want + more WC's. I always err on the side of more psychers.

Harlequins also make Wyches viable as well Shadowseers giving them the 2D6 x 2 or you can't shoot makes people thing about it when their running across the field and then 2nd turn you've got them in combat most likely. I mean they have no armour but their cheap as hell.

You wanna maximize the chances of a Deathjester shot working so a Jinking Raider w/ Dark Lance is pretty dang good. Have them hang out with some Trueborn w/ H. Weapons for more damage .

All in all I think the Harlequins work and gel better with the Dark ELdar than they do with the normal Eldar codex.

Stircrazy wrote:
What do you guys think about taking some Harlequins as allies for Tau? how would you kit them out

Go with Company of Actors. Only thing Harliquins are bringing to the table for Tau is a credible CC threat, and any other method of taking Harlies is going to tie up a bunch of points in crap you have no use for (skyweavers/voidweavers). Being Tau, nothing should reach your lines that a single full strength troupe can't easily take care of.

12 man strong troupe, all kisses (maybe sword on TM), DJ with Eye of laughing god (if you want, totally unnecessary), Shadow Seer (ML2) with Mask (too cheap to not take and get fearless). That'll run you ~ 420 or so. Could easily take squad size down, just illustrating your max points investment going this route. Any other method of allying in requires you buying a Voidweaver which is ~18 melta bombs worth of extremely sub-standard (by tau reckoning) AT, and either skyweavers (see above post/rant) or lots more Harlies + DT's. More Harlies isn't necessarily bad, but they're not really adding much to your army. You just want one nice CC deterrent to prevent your entire army getting wiped out by that SM scout squad that managed to get into CC.

Hollismason wrote: All in all I think the Harlequins work and gel better with the Dark ELdar than they do with the normal Eldar codex.

Exactly the conclusion I've come to. Scourges and Razorwings fill every Harlie weakness, and the rest of the codex is cheap enough to make up for the Harlies expense. CWE really only offers more psychic shenanigans, which while powerful, isn't nearly as balanced.

Hollismason wrote: You wanna maximize the chances of a Deathjester shot working so a Jinking Raider w/ Dark Lance is pretty dang good. Have them hang out with some Trueborn w/ H. Weapons for more damage

Trueborn w/Shredders and Splinter Cannons in a raider w/splinter racks and nightshields + a DJ or 2 could really do some work.

Yeah I don't think people have yet figured out how powerful the Death Jester ability is especially with a assault army. It's basically Ye Old Lash of Submission rules almost.

Getting a unit to fall back towards you then assaulting them is insane, especially with the fact that you can run them in the direction you want, that's pretty powerful.

There's all sorts of Shenanigans, but the biggest one I see is declaring a multi assault against units that are falling back with the -4 LD Squad. I have to chekc but I'm pretty sure if you come in contact with a board edge while fleeing even if it's not your own your removed, but I think that's not how it works.

Set all the units falling back towards you once they have range , run to reposition better, then declare a charge against the units.

Regroup or die.

Yup, go off any table edge and you're out of the game.

It has good potential, especially against backfield gunline armies like Guard and Tau.

Imagine having a few of them popping shots off at a guard blob. First one eats the Sergeant as the commisar decapitates him, second or third sets them running straight off the table!

I was just looking at the Death Jester's ability, to force moral tests after causing unsaved wounds, and it got me thinking. So when do you make the call on what direction they fall back? the reason why I ask is if it is after the total is rolled it could be possible to force the unit to be unable to use up the full amount of the fall back distance (by directing them in to another unit terrain or the like) so that they would be destroyed by the "Trapped!" portion of the fall back rules. so not only can you run a unit off the table or into charge range but potentially just destroy them outright.

Hollismason wrote:Yeah I don't think people have yet figured out how powerful the Death Jester ability is especially with a assault army. It's basically Ye Old Lash of Submission rules almost.

Getting a unit to fall back towards you then assaulting them is insane, especially with the fact that you can run them in the direction you want, that's pretty powerful.

There's all sorts of Shenanigans, but the biggest one I see is declaring a multi assault against units that are falling back with the -4 LD Squad. I have to chekc but I'm pretty sure if you come in contact with a board edge while fleeing even if it's not your own your removed, but I think that's not how it works.

Set all the units falling back towards you once they have range , run to reposition better, then declare a charge against the units.

Regroup or die.

It's not the ability I question, it's reliably getting to use it. Shuriken cannons are ok, but not great. When it goes off it'll be nice, but you got to get that unsaved wound first. I already run a psycher heavy army, so relying more heavily on shadowseers is a comfortable decision for me. Maybe I'll warm to DJ's though.

Arthurmw43 wrote:I was just looking at the Death Jester's ability, to force moral tests after causing unsaved wounds, and it got me thinking. So when do you make the call on what direction they fall back? the reason why I ask is if it is after the total is rolled it could be possible to force the unit to be unable to use up the full amount of the fall back distance (by directing them in to another unit terrain or the like) so that they would be destroyed by the "Trapped!" portion of the fall back rules. so not only can you run a unit off the table or into charge range but potentially just destroy them outright.

From what I understand, the fallback happens as normal, with the only difference being that you pick the direction instead of it being your opponents board edge by default. So it could be entirely possible to wipe a squad that way.

So that im clear, with the jester, I shoot and hurt one, then it fails a check, it runs in a direction of my choosing.

I would then, choose to go off the board with them (unlikely but instant removal) or make them come closer to me so I can charge them better (which makes them pass an Ld or die?)

Correct me if im wrong.

So it seems like it can work if you build a force around them, but its situational in every respect.

That's the gist of it, bear in mind the Morale test is at -2Ld (or more, if you have a Shadowseer with the Relic Mask nearby).

Ok he doesn't seem like a bad deal then... Who knows what he might do. Even if once every few games he causes a unit to die its probably just worth having.