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Vermis:
Kings of War may have a place for my High Elves, but no Skaven facsimile is there.

Mayhem sounds interesting but other then you I've heard nothing about it.

The others again, nothing looks like I'll find someone here stateside to game with those systems.

I believe there's a Skaven fan list (and the culture of KoW seems to suggest this sort of thing is much more widely accepted) and I've read somewhere recently that an official, or at least endorsed, list for each WHFB faction not already well represented has had its development accelerated in light of recent developments.

Skaven can be played very well using official rules as a Goblin Counts As army in KoW. Also since allies are a prevalent feature of the game (I've seen armies with units from multiple 'pure' armies) you can add stuff like Ogres as Rat Ogres; Chariots or Battlewagons from either Orcs or Ogres, too.

As to the OP's question, one of our FLGS has put WFB and LOTR/Hobbit all up for 50% off. I don't think it's due to the upcoming changes but rather that nobody buys the stuff and he wants the shelf space back. He has not reduced prices on 40k and may be expanding that to take over the opened space.

privateer4hire wrote:


As to the OP's question, one of our FLGS has put WFB and LOTR/Hobbit all up for 50% off. I don't think it's due to the upcoming changes but rather that nobody buys the stuff and he wants the shelf space back. He has not reduced prices on 40k and may be expanding that to take over the opened space.

Damn if only Arizona wasnt so far away...

KoW 2.0 will feature army lists for all WHFB armies, iirc.

 Sigvatr wrote:
KoW 2.0 will feature army lists for all WHFB armies, iirc.

That's great.

Too bad nobody I know plays KoW.

 KingmanHighborn wrote:
Vermis:
Kings of War may have a place for my High Elves, but no Skaven facsimile is there.

As mentioned, there's a ratmen list for KoW by... Ah, what was Matt Gilbert's role with Mantic, again? That's what got me buying WFB models again, although my focus has shifted a bit since.

Mayhem sounds interesting but other then you I've heard nothing about it.

Tell me about it. I'd'a thought folk already tired of WFB and switching to different rules for their expensive armies could spend a couple of dollars for a look-see. I could count the number of hooks I got on Dakka on the fingers of one hand, if my hand was involved in a firework accident. But you might get a few more references somewhere like the Lead Adventure Forum.

Some of the ranges might seem a bit short, and I'd bump the suggested 60mm square unit for 28mm up to 80mm (add another 20mm strip and you've got a KoW regiment!) but I like the command point system (after Warmaster and Hail Caesar I'm hooked on command and control in mass battle games), I think the polydice mechanic is innovative, and the unit creation rules deftly sidestep the army list issue.

I bang on about Legions of Battle too. A bit different but has it's own unit creation rules. I'd say it reads like a cross between Warhammer and Hail Caesar, with the intent to be compatible with the former's models and basing conventions, but skewing the gameplay a little towards the latter.

The others again, nothing looks like I'll find someone here stateside to game with those systems.

Pathfinder had to start somewhere too, among the disgruntled ex-players of the big, 'mainstream' game.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Sigvatr wrote:
KoW 2.0 will feature army lists for all WHFB armies, iirc.

That's great.

Too bad nobody I know plays KoW.

Like I said to Yodhrin, you can try to promote a game yourself or you can sit around feeling sorry for yourself. If you still can't get anyone to play KoW or one of the many other compatible battle games, that's too bad, but you won't know unless you cut the apron strings and make an effort.

 Silent Puffin? wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

So I'm not the only one who thinks Karl Franz is going walk out of the shower after having a weird dream.

Karl Franz is too tame. It will definitely be Sigmar.

Karl Franz became Sigmar to kill an orc once. That was weird, man.


As for me, I'm shelving all my Warhammer. I've been annoyed at the game since the ET stuff turned the entire game into an arms race, and I don't actually want to associate with the company that released all that stuff any more.

Depending on whether 9th will hook me back in depends on whether the edition is perfect or not. At this point, it's not looking likely

My lfgs just put all Fantasy stuff 30% and is not ordering anymore.

Basicly he has said since there is no way of knowing what's getting canned he is selling all of it to make sure he is not left with a load of dead stock.

Hopefully I can pick up an Empire battalion NIB for cheap soon

Considering what escalation and stronghold assault led 40k into, these end times books are just a teasing of what they want to do, mishmashed bs armies and complete disregard for integrity of the soul of the game.

I haven't seen any stores marking down fantasy stuff but I keep an eye on ebay and thing aren't really moving unless they are dirt cheap. The usual rarities sell but for the most part it is very stagnant.

Yeah I'm not seeing anything coming down to affordability, but then again I'm only looking for Phoenix Guard right now.

And only have about 15 bucks and stuff in my dakka swap to trade for them.

Still I have seen a lot of fantasy sitting as well, so it's not coming down in price but it's not selling either for the most part.

 KingmanHighborn wrote:
Yeah I'm not seeing anything coming down to affordability, but then again I'm only looking for Phoenix Guard right now.

And only have about 15 bucks and stuff in my dakka swap to trade for them.

Still I have seen a lot of fantasy sitting as well, so it's not coming down in price but it's not selling either for the most part.

Happens every edition change. At this point the panic sellers have already sold. That ship has sailed. Now the wait & see group is well, waitng
Nobodys really buying but nobody is looking to sell either, expect to see more buying and selling when new edition drops.

 Shas'O Dorian wrote:

 KingmanHighborn wrote:
Yeah I'm not seeing anything coming down to affordability, but then again I'm only looking for Phoenix Guard right now.

And only have about 15 bucks and stuff in my dakka swap to trade for them.

Still I have seen a lot of fantasy sitting as well, so it's not coming down in price but it's not selling either for the most part.

Happens every edition change. At this point the panic sellers have already sold. That ship has sailed. Now the wait & see group is well, waitng
Nobodys really buying but nobody is looking to sell either, expect to see more buying and selling when new edition drops.

It's a bit disingenuous to say it " happens every edition change", when the game is being changed in a huge way, the background is dead and the rumours point at a different type of game altogether. Not exactly 6th edition to 7th edition change, is it?

 Ravenous D wrote:
Considering what escalation and stronghold assault led 40k into, these end times books are just a teasing of what they want to do, mishmashed bs armies and complete disregard for integrity of the soul of the game.

Please dont, I cannot bare to see another instawinbutton super smurf mary sue army coming into existence to spoil another of GW's games

 Shas'O Dorian wrote:

 KingmanHighborn wrote:
Yeah I'm not seeing anything coming down to affordability, but then again I'm only looking for Phoenix Guard right now.

And only have about 15 bucks and stuff in my dakka swap to trade for them.

Still I have seen a lot of fantasy sitting as well, so it's not coming down in price but it's not selling either for the most part.

Happens every edition change. At this point the panic sellers have already sold. That ship has sailed. Now the wait & see group is well, waitng
Nobodys really buying but nobody is looking to sell either, expect to see more buying and selling when new edition drops.

This is a little more than an edition change. The trend I see has been going on for 8-12 months. Hard to get collectable stuff sells, but the mundane sits and sits unless the seller really brings down the price. Some of it is that sellers think they deserve retail $ for their used stuff and some just appears to be genuine disinterest.

No, it honestly does happen every edition change. I remember the sky was falling when step up attacks and random charge ranges were announced. When a 12 dice magic phase would ruin everyone but dwarfs. When those new test or die spells would make X unplayable or how steadfast would turn the game into belt sander vs belt sander.

There are wild and crazy rumours every time and the cycle continues. This is just like storm of chaos except for the "ending" which they already wrote themselves an out for in book III.

It may be a bigger change than before but you missed my point, which is panic sellers have sold and many players will hold off buying until we see new rules before we commit to buying or selling hundreds if not thousands of dollars. This is why the market is stagnant.

 Shas'O Dorian wrote:
No, it honestly does happen every edition change. I remember the sky was falling when step up attacks and random charge ranges were announced. When a 12 dice magic phase would ruin everyone but dwarfs.

There are wild and crazy rumours every time and the cycle continues. This is just like storm of chaos except for the "ending" which they already wrote themselves an out for in book III.

It may be a bigger change than before but you missed my point, which is panic sellers have sold and many players will hold off buying until we see new rules before we commit to buying or selling hundreds if not thousands of dollars. This is why the market is stagnant.

Considering that 8th edition killed Fantasy, it appears that the sky really did fall with step up attacks and random charges.

Mr. S Baldrick wrote:Some of it is that sellers think they deserve retail $ for their used stuff

One gamer's 'pre-loved jewel-like items of wonder' is another gamer's 'old tat'.

PhantomViper wrote:
Considering that 8th edition killed Fantasy, it appears that the sky really did fall with step up attacks and random charges.

Took the words right out of my mouth.

 Shas'O Dorian wrote:

 KingmanHighborn wrote:
Yeah I'm not seeing anything coming down to affordability, but then again I'm only looking for Phoenix Guard right now.

And only have about 15 bucks and stuff in my dakka swap to trade for them.

Still I have seen a lot of fantasy sitting as well, so it's not coming down in price but it's not selling either for the most part.

Happens every edition change. At this point the panic sellers have already sold. That ship has sailed. Now the wait & see group is well, waitng
Nobodys really buying but nobody is looking to sell either, expect to see more buying and selling when new edition drops.

I wouldn't say its panic sellers, we all know that GW balances things buy utterly screwing over most of the stuff that was good. I cycle out my armies to stay ahead of that curve, the only time I gave them a chance I had $450 worth of paper weights. Really you have two options, 1) cycle your armies every year or two or 2) make 2 or 3 massive armies with all the options and hope they don't all get nerfed.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 master of ordinance wrote:

 Ravenous D wrote:
Considering what escalation and stronghold assault led 40k into, these end times books are just a teasing of what they want to do, mishmashed bs armies and complete disregard for integrity of the soul of the game.

Please dont, I cannot bare to see another instawinbutton super smurf mary sue army coming into existence to spoil another of GW's games

Well considering the unbound rumours and chaos currently able to have skaven and undead, it looks like GW is turning warhammer into heroscape.

Considering Fantasy is the only GW product that actually sells at my local store, I don't think it's going on clearance any time soon.

I hope they just say "psyke it was all a dream from a drunk living in the streets of middenheim"

Play on 8th play on

I think that 8th ed had some good ideas, like the step up attacks and the removal of the charger goes first rule (I have many memories of Brettonian lance formations raping my Skaven spear blocks) but at the same time the magic phase was blown so far out of proportion that it became a joke.

9th ed looks set to kill fantasy.

 Vermis wrote:

Emphasis mine. Yup. If you have the attitude that people will buy your stuff regardless of quality (because they do), why would you work towards a tight, balanced, ultimate version, when you can just shake the snowglobe every four years or so and get people to buy the same thing again?

GW's problem now is that's blown up in their faces: among other factors like skyrocketing prices, more and more people are waking up to the pointless rules churn, especially the terrible disregard for balance that affected 7th ed, and the randomfest and 'buy more hordes and big monsters' spendfest that affected 8th ed. Apparently they realise one of the latter points with the rumoured downsizing of 9th, but otherwise they still seem to be going with their old standby of just chucking out whatever's not doing so well (+ customers) rather than wonder why it's not doing so well.

To be honest, with that track record, part of me is surprised there's a 9th ed at all.

Kingman: take your pick.

You...don't actually play this game, do you?


Seriously though, am I the only one who gets the feeling that 90% of the people whining on here are 40K players who haven't actually touched their WHFB minis since 6th or 7th?

You've got me there, PRND. But I'll let you into a wee secret: that edition you like? That eighth edition? There's a whole lot of other people who stopped playing it, and stopped buying stuff for it, for largely the same reasons. I don't have to play the game right this instant to read about the worsening financial reports, the gamers staying away in droves, and aaaall their complaints that let me know that 8th ed is still clunky, rubbish, buy-to-win, business-as-usual Warhammer. That's why it's dying. That's why GW threw up their arms in clueless exasperation and blew up the planet. That's why they're shaking that ol' rules snowglobe harder than usual. Or did you honestly think that GW were taking 30+ years to conscientiously and very gradually toil their way towards a completely balanced, elegant, and affordable wargame?

You can blame me for it if you like. Wouldn't be the first time. But that doesn't make GW more benevolent, or make 8th ed more popular or longer-lived. It drove players off and now it's gone too.

All I ever wanted was Warhammer Armies: Cathay...

was that too much to ask?

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:


All I ever wanted was Warhammer Armies: Cathay...

was that too much to ask?

Amen.

Now we will never see it.

If they are shelving fantasy why do you guys think they just made new models for it... They aren't that stupid. I may take this time of panic to build up a skaven force!

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:


All I ever wanted was Warhammer Armies: Cathay...

was that too much to ask?

Yes, it was. As we know GW would screw it up with some sort of offensively racist stereotyping, I'm glad that Cathay and Ind won't happen.