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Also new box art in the new colour scheme. They like to keep things consistent across a range. This probably means that all the Tau stuff will be roboxed eventually.

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
First, blast weapons can't hit flyers or FMCs/ FGMCs.

That double D shot should be swatting down a HVT like Fateweaver, Belakor, or a pimped-out Flyrant. With a 12" move you've actually got fairly decent range.

People still use FMC's.....? Lol thought 7th ed completely murdered them.

vitae_drinker wrote:
Depending on your local sales tax, true.

Thay are on ebay for $118, no tax, free postage. That is the way I'll go.

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
Reboxing with the new decals maybe?
Or just reboxing in general (or did Pathfinders already have the current 'grey style' box?)

Battleforce is going to be nixed, that's a guarantee at this juncture.

We'll see a new box in the $160-$230 range that gives you an army right out of the box, in the same vein as any other release we've had lately.

Pathfinders just would be a rebox to include the new decals, go to the "background" box and as someone else mentioned be repainted in the new color scheme for promo shots.

 krazynadechukr wrote:

vitae_drinker wrote:
Depending on your local sales tax, true.

Thay are on ebay for $118, no tax, free postage. That is the way I'll go.

Im tempted to do that too. but im usually skeptical of cheaper-than-retail price things that just released.

Theyre probably recasts. Which, personally, doesnt bug me since ive never had a problem with "new in box" ebays and i intend to kitbash this thing anyway lol.

....feth it i did it lol

 Mr Morden wrote:

Contrary to some posters you can compare this thing to being 2 carnifexes with FNP, and those are laughably easy to kill, the difference is you were nice enough to put them in 1 gigantic spot and spend more points to do so.

Doesn't that just sum up the problems with the game - what was once a big scary unit - a Carnfex now just arrow fodder.

Plus of course the Carnfex does not get the near immunity to posions and shed loads of other special rules the Tau Walker - Sorry its a GCreature get . Its likely better in Clsoe Combat given stomp :( Yeah that makes sense............

The other problem is that to many it seems about right for its points but because its not stupidly broken like the Wraith Kinght - its usless..............

The proper nid players are fairly quiet on this thing for some reason, as a person who has run nids for a decade there is a valid reason you don't run T6 w4 sv3+ models that walk. 'Cause they're dead before you know it.

Poison is a non issue as its really only dark smeldar that have it on mass, and frankly they have enough of it to drop the pooh-surge,

And wraithknights are terrible, any good player can drop one in a turn, they do great against people that don't know how to deal with them. They are so bad in competitive environments, the only time they do well is when you can spam them. Otherwise just take more hemlocks and jetbikes.

If you are building an army you have to be able to counter a few things in the current meta:
1) Invisibility, anything that stops this is gold
2) Cover, now that thunderdome is a thing
3) Imperial wraith knights
4) Jet bikes

Get those bases covered and you can wreck anything. Its why lictor shame and mawlocs do so well.

 Vineheart01 wrote:

 krazynadechukr wrote:

vitae_drinker wrote:
Depending on your local sales tax, true.

Thay are on ebay for $118, no tax, free postage. That is the way I'll go.

Im tempted to do that too. but im usually skeptical of cheaper-than-retail price things that just released.

Theyre probably recasts. Which, personally, doesnt bug me since ive never had a problem with "new in box" ebays and i intend to kitbash this thing anyway lol.

....feth it i did it lol

I really doubt that. (1-($118/$150))*100% = 21.3% discount. When 20% is fairly common from many legit online retailers I don't think that extra 1-2% should make you jump to thinking it's a recast.

Yeah. Now like $80? Yeah, recast.

I think saying one model or another is bad or good is a little premature due to having no information about unit synergies, army wide special rules, etc.

Yes, you can compare it to other models from other codexs of equal points and see how they compare to each other and you may find one lacking. But as to how it works in its own codex is still very much up in the air without knowing any other information. Heck, you cant even compare the Stormsurge to a Riptide at this point because we have no idea how or if the Riptide has gone through any changes.

 Co'tor Shas wrote:

First, blast weapons can't hit flyers or FMCs/ FGMCs. Even if they have skyfire they can't.

That is wrong. Just because ITC ruled it that way doesn't make it true.

BRB wrote:Hard to Hit
A Swooping Flying Monstrous Creature is a very difficult target for units without specialized weapons. Shots resolved at such a target can only be resolved as Snap Shots unless the model or weapon has the Skyfire special rule.

Note that this is different from the Flyers Hard to Hit rule:

BRB wrote:Hard to Hit
Zooming Flyers are incredibly difficult targets for troops without suitably calibrated weapons and scopes. Shots resolved at a Zooming Flyer can only be resolved as Snap Shots (unless the model or weapon has the Skyfire special rule). Template and Blast weapons, and any other attacks that don’t roll To Hit, cannot hit Zooming Flyers.

The difference is very clear. Flying vehicles cannot ever be hit by blast/template weapons, but FMC's can if the weapon in question has skyfire.

The difference is that the Nids can't hang back and fire at range. This suit can.

If I were a Nid player, I'd take this in a heartbeat for the awesome firepower and countercharge capability.

Did...did I seriously just read someone state the Wraithknight is a terrible unit? Someone has the most mind-numbingly warped view of game balance I've ever seen.

The Stormsurge is fine.

Do note that the Stormsurge is a GMC. Poison only hurts it on a 6+. Any army that relies on poison is gonna struggle against this thing. Is it as durable as it could be? No, it's actually really fragile. But then again that's always been Tau's problem. We have good saves, but our toughness is really low, so we always have to make a ton of saves and anything that makes it through those saves is gonna wreck us.

 Co'tor Shas wrote:

First, blast weapons can't hit flyers or FMCs/ FGMCs. Even if they have skyfire they can't. Besides, the D is at 10", not a real game-changer, except against something like an assaulting knight (and if the knight survives, the suit is beyond dead because of the knights CC abilities and weapons).

Well, in fact you can lob blasts or templates on FMCs, if you have Skyfire. Only Flyers are immune to those.
And GCs can't overwatch, so it's even worse for the SS

8 Wounds makes it more durable than people realize. It's harder to kill VS Grav and D than most other GMCs.

 Vector Strike wrote:

 Co'tor Shas wrote:

First, blast weapons can't hit flyers or FMCs/ FGMCs. Even if they have skyfire they can't. Besides, the D is at 10", not a real game-changer, except against something like an assaulting knight (and if the knight survives, the suit is beyond dead because of the knights CC abilities and weapons).

Well, in fact you can lob blasts or templates on FMCs, if you have Skyfire. Only Flyers are immune to those.
And GCs can't overwatch, so it's even worse for the SS

Wait, really? That's sort of dumb... We just play them the same in my group. I guess we're all just oblivious idiots.

It had always bothered me that big was always given bonus and no negative stats. Ok so poison wounds on a 6 only. We get that. But GMC's should be easier to hit then. They are freaking huge. +1 to hit rolls??
But then GW goes around in cycles of one type of unit being the best. As someone pointed out Carnifexes used to be scary, Terminators used to be deadly. Many iconic units left for dust in the arms race.
I live these big centre peice kits but smaller scale units need to matter.

So a Baleflamer Heldrake can choose to shoot at a FMC, therefore gains skyfire for the phase, and can now target an FMC? I never saw this at a gaming table, we always thought it is not allowed. Are you sure that is correct?

By the rules, yep. It's in the BRB.

Found it thanks

Where do I go to vent about a model that is clearly a vehicle being treated as a GMC? Why haven't dreadnaughts been made into monstrous creatures? The picture on the GW main-page show this is clearly an open-topped vehicle...

Not here, I think there is a thread in GD.

There are rumors that the ghostkeel will have some sort of enemy weapon disruption mechanic and that it will have a cockpit in the torso as well, pilot included. I wonder if that's true lol, can't wait for official photos.

Cheers
Kahnawake

Yeah I estimate it has between 3-4 weapons.

The fusion collider with its blast template, either two fusion blasters or a single twin linked fusion blaster, and the shield thing looks like a a fusion blaster.

This would match up with the rumored rules quite well. I'm hoping for the 4 weapons myself. That makes it an extremely competitive weapons platform. With 3 weapons it's good but not that good. If it has two like some people think? Lol. Never hitting that table over cheap fusion suits.

 Gamgee wrote:
Yeah I estimate it has between 3-4 weapons.

The fusion collider with its blast template, either two fusion blasters or a single twin linked fusion blaster, and the shield thing looks like a a fusion blaster.

This would match up with the rumored rules quite well. I'm hoping for the 4 weapons myself. That makes it an extremely competitive weapons platform. With 3 weapons it's good but not that good. If it has two like some people think? Lol. Never hitting that table over cheap fusion suits.

It will only have two weapons (arm weapon and twin-linked shoulder weapon), I'm pretty darn sure about this. If the new rumors are anything to go by then it has some sort of Neural System Jammer in its other hand. And yes, it will have limited uses (being comparable to fusion Stealth suits rather than Sunforge+1 Crisis suits), exactly like the Stormsurge.

You can see the fusion blaster barrel on that arm with the antennae. It looks like that device is a shell around the weapon system in that arm. It couldn't be anything else it's the perfect fit and shape of the fusion guns on its shoulders. Look closely. Or it could be something new, but it is a gun.

 Gamgee wrote:
You can see the fusion blaster barrel on that arm with the antennae. It looks like that device is a shell around the weapon system in that arm. It couldn't be anything else it's the perfect fit and shape of the fusion guns on its shoulders. Look closely.

Nah, the arm thingie has only one "barrel" and lacks the cooling slits as well as those flask-things.

Your right I took a super close look. So it's a gun of some kind? I swear if this is GW's idea of what an ECM device is I'm going to rage.

ECM in real life is not a gun. It's electronics.

Maybe they mean a CIWS style gun that shoots down incoming projectiles? Either way I senses some GW stupidity on that model incoming.

If it only has 2 guns I'm never putting it on the table. Not worth its cost increase at that point. Two guns. Weak ones at that for its role. *sigh*

I got a feeling your right now. This Tau update might continue sucking. Still I hope its some sort of gun. We need some anti-tank weapons other than fusion suits. Or make HH's viable or HRR. Something. Right now we don't need any of this since we got other suits that do it better as a tank hunter.

Hmmm 130 points for two fusion shots. Or 52 for two on a crisis. Hmmm..... HHHMmmmmmmmm.... I wonder what I'm going to pick. The only thing worth it on the 95 with only two guns is its... anti infantry guns. Oh boy yay. More anti-infantry.

It can only shoot two guns anyway can't it?