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While I am primarily an Eldar player, if there was an MEQ army that I would play it would be Chaos. Unfortunately, I don't play Chaos for two reasons:

1. I am already sworn to building a Dark Eldar army.

2. CSM currently sucks bricks.

Not helping CSM is the fact that some of their models kits are either ancient, finecast, ugly as feth, or a combination of the three. Therefore, I have decided to compile a list of kits that GW should redo for the next Chaos Space Marine release:

HQ:
-Plastic Abbadon, make him look intimidating instead of a goober.
-Generic Characters in plastic: Chaos Lord (non-termie), Sorceror (same), Warpsmith, Dark Apostle
-Upgrade kit for Traitor Legions compatible with generic characters.

Elites:
-Mutilator plastic kit (combo with Obliterator) that doesn't look like a glorified dog turd.
-Plastic Plague Marines
-Plastic Khorne Berzerkers
-Separate plastic kit for Noise Marines
-Separate plastic kit for Rubric Marines

Troops:
-Updated Chaos Space Marine squad with all weapon options included and character upgrades.
-Big box of cultists (20 is a good number) with weapon options. Can be snap-together for all I care.

Fast Attack:
-Plastic Chaos Spawn, allows for more diversity in body/mutation types

Heavy Support:
-Plastic Obliterators (combo with Mutilators)
-Plastic Havocs, more weapon options included.

Is there anything I missed or a plastic kit that strikes people as particularly ugly?

So, short answer, every infantry unit that isn't Raptors.

Not to discount the rest of your post, but Chaos Spawn are already in plastic with loads of options.

http://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Chaos-Spawn;jsessionid=F3C9D54DAF659B10BE88A87B71D3BC8C?_requestid=631468

Release a chosen kit, since they are currently not available. Only this time let us actually choose what weapons to put on them.

Lords on mounts would be nice. Maybe a nice kit would encourage more people to actually field them.

Otherwise, what GreyHamster said.
In an ideal world we'd also get more visual options for our tanks, like chaos treads and daemon possession parts.

Chaos Lord is fine, I don't see why he'd need an update. Also makes a pretty good kitbash for Abaddon.

Well, if we're being honest and serious, then every single kit bar;
- Termie Lord
- Raptors/Warptalons

Needs a serious overhaul... Currently the only kit we have that even provides at least 1 of every unit option is the Raptor kit. Everything else is missing at least half the possible upgrade options.

And to really make you cry, consider the fact that those Loyalist dogs have now received TWO freaking plastic Devastator kits, while we're still languishing with the hiedious and absolutely unplayable Finecrap Havoc kit!

Well after they made chosen and kranon or whatever his name is, I think the termie lord and hq section in general could use a face lift.

Pythius Primus wrote:Not to discount the rest of your post, but Chaos Spawn are already in plastic with loads of options.

http://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Chaos-Spawn;jsessionid=F3C9D54DAF659B10BE88A87B71D3BC8C?_requestid=631468

My apologies. I was looking at the 40k Spawn instead of the Fantasy Spawn.

Roknar wrote:Release a chosen kit, since they are currently not available. Only this time let us actually choose what weapons to put on them.

Lords on mounts would be nice. Maybe a nice kit would encourage more people to actually field them.

Otherwise, what GreyHamster said.
In an ideal world we'd also get more visual options for our tanks, like chaos treads and daemon possession parts.

I personally think a redo of the Dark Vengeance Chosen as a separate kit would be awesome if they had enough options to go with it. I'm not totally sold on a mount kit for CSM; Daemons already have enough possibilities for conversions in that area.

A vehicle upgrade kit like the Loyalists have would be great if it had enough icons, spiky bits, and weapon options.

I think most of the vehicle kits for Chaos are fine, except for the Defiler. Trash that thing and let CSM take Soul Grinders.

So yeah, basically every non-vehicle kit bar a few needs a redesign and plastic version. Good to know that there's at least some consensus around this issue.

I posted my thoughts here in my blog earlier, but I think we'd only get a new multi part Obliterator/Mutilator kit, new Havocs, Legion/Warband upgrade kits, and plastic Plague Marines are also likely. I'd also assume they'd release a new HQ of some sort, and probably replacing the Finecast HQs.

I noticed Alpha Legion shoulder pads were sold out in the UK webstore, so I ordered some to my cousins in the US to ship to me, so I'm wondering if those moulds are done.

Imho most important would be the former metal-plastic dual-kits, so TS, Noisemarines and Havocs. I still have some of those metal TS torsos *shudder* Even if it's finecast now it's still horrible and gw is replacing finecast anyway.

Zerkers deserve a new box too as they are from 2nd edition, but there is so much good fantasy stuff out there for khorne so that converting is a piece of cake.

If we go with what we most likely get I would say we get proper Havocs with 1-2 of each and a new corrupted heavy option in the line of what we get on the daemon engines and a mono-pose, hmm let me guess..., sorcerer in power armor replacing all other existing sculpts.
A Thousand Sons box could go with the Tzeentch codex. Imho they would not even have to do the LoC in plastic. He's still the best of the existing Greater Daemons.

The entire line and entire concept of the army needs a redo.

For the last 7 years GW has been working hard to strip them of a history and backstory down to a relatively generic "evil" faction, cutting away the Legions and their background and pushing more generic, all encompassing "renegades" instead. The faction as a whole feels "mushy", without any clear concept of what it wants to be other than "evil marines".

The faction needs almost its entire line of kits to be re-looked at on some level, and the faction really needs to be refocused to be *something*.

Please for the love of god, NONE.

I don't want to pay €100 for 10 thousand sons.

DaPino wrote:
Please for the love of god, NONE.

I don't want to pay €100 for 10 thousand sons.

Let's be honest, a plastic release for 1kSons may be one of the few times where the unit price actually goes down. Marines with no options, and a single character model, maybe with some extra bits of bling. That won't cost any more than a tactical squad, there literally aren't enough options in the unit to make any more sprues. In any case, 1kSons are horrible, and need a plastic facelift.

In general, though, every (Non-Dark Vengeance) kit that isn't the Terminator Lord or the Raptors/Warptalons box needs a rehaul. Chaos Space Marines have the worst miniature line in 40k, with the possible exception of Sisters of Battle. Let's take a look at the (possible) troops:
Standard CSM: A really bad kit, that's about 12-13 years old.
Cultists: Dark Vengeance or nothing. A multipart kit would be nice, but unlikely.
Berzerkers: Although the kit isn't great, FW make an awesome conversion kit, and there are some great stand-ins in the news AoS box. Least in need of an update.
Plague Marines: Finecast models, although there is another cool FW kit. Does need an update, though.
Noise Marines: Finecast/plastic combo? Yeah... upgrade, please.
Thousand Sons: As above, but this is a really horrible kit to assemble, and is the most in need of an update.

Normal csm. Boring design, bad quality (the legs, argh!) and stupid poses clearly betray the kit's age.

My wishlist would be:
Defilers
Full plastic Noise Marines
Havocs
Obliterators
Vanilla CSM

More skulls on spikes coming out of skulls on spikes?

Or you know.. evil looking stuff that isn't skulls on spikey bits. Make Asmodai work for it at least.

Breton wrote:
More skulls on spikes coming out of skulls on spikes?

Or you know.. evil looking stuff that isn't skulls on spikey bits. Make Asmodai work for it at least.

You seem to be new to this whole "Chaos" business. If it doesn't involve skulls, spikes, or icons it isn't truly devoted to Chaos.

I agree with the hybrid metal/plastic kits being the biggest priority.

I think Obliterator/mutilators would be next; I wouldn't be surprised if they end up larger then the current models.

I just don't see Berzerkers getting redone anytime soon... But I wish they would.

I would like to like to see the aesthetic of the Dark Vengence chosen and the Raptors carried through the whole range to varying degrees, to update the look to being more than spikes and skulls.

I realize it's not even close to a priority... I think GW should recut the Land Raider and Rhinos to incorporate a chaos specific aesthetic and move away from just having is glue generic meaningless spike and skull bits on our tanks. Do any other non-Imperial factions rely on an Imperial kit for their vehicle?

The Deamon Prince. I think its stupid as F*%@ that the DP models chaos has to use are the exact same model as the fantasy version just on a different shaped base.

Give us some hulking behemoth in power armour and a wide array of weapons both melee and ranged.

 jackflashultra wrote:
The Deamon Prince. I think its stupid as F*%@ that the DP models chaos has to use are the exact same model as the fantasy version just on a different shaped base.

Give us some hulking behemoth in power armour and a wide array of weapons both melee and ranged.

Like the Finecast Daemon Princes, one of which has a gun in it's arm? Or the fact that the model contains parts for Fantasy or 40k, like those power armoured pauldrons?

Eh I'm finding the power armoured version of the plastic prince to still look pretty pathetic. The finecast one get looks much more imposing, except for the hunchback pose.

I'm looking at starting a 2nd ed Chaos Space Marine army (Word Bearers probably) after a very long absence and is it just me or as I hold the colour sections of Codex Chaos (2nd ed circa '96) and I swear the models have got worse!

I've been happily impressed with the other ranges, not so much their new silly (3 units out of one model) kits, but for example what in the name of all that is holy is a Forgefiend and am I the only one who thinks my 5 year old could chew a lump of plastercene into a better model?

Not only have the prices TRIPLED in 15 years (despite the move to almost all plastic WTF???) but the models have gotten WORSE!!!

Looks like I'll be spending quite some time Ebay fishing me some DECENT terminators (i.e the old metal ones) and a Chaos Dreadhought that doesn't looks like a Dreadnought that's forgot to put on his trousers that morning....

 -Shrike- wrote:

 jackflashultra wrote:
The Deamon Prince. I think its stupid as F*%@ that the DP models chaos has to use are the exact same model as the fantasy version just on a different shaped base.

Give us some hulking behemoth in power armour and a wide array of weapons both melee and ranged.

Like the Finecast Daemon Princes, one of which has a gun in it's arm? Or the fact that the model contains parts for Fantasy or 40k, like those power armoured pauldrons?

Say what?.... wait lol you almost had me tell you said shitcast.. I mean finecast


Automatically Appended Next Post:

flyingthruwater wrote:
I've been happily impressed with the other ranges, not so much their new silly (3 units out of one model) kits, but for example what in the name of all that is holy is a Forgefiend and am I the only one who thinks my 5 year old could chew a lump of plastercene into a better model???

This, lmao

Obliterators, terminators, Berzerkers, possessed.
Plastic dreadclaw.

What needs to be redone the most is the basic troop kit. While not as horribly old as the Obliterators, their mold design itself is old and the models look fairly terrible unless Raptor bits are tossed in.

 Wyzilla wrote:
What needs to be redone the most is the basic troop kit. While not as horribly old as the Obliterators, their mold design itself is old and the models look fairly terrible unless Raptor bits are tossed in.

I agree, and I would be willing to bet money that CSM will get a new basic kit upon release of the new codex; it would fit the larger pattern for GW. Even if nothing else is updated, the cult troops can be converted from the basic kit.

I'd love to see Terminators and Chaos Marines in the same aesthetics as the Dark Vengeance dudes. Plastic Cult troops would be a given, but at least Forgeworld has some conversion kits for them. I'd also want to see upgrade sprues like the Space Marine ones for each legion. Considering those are sold out everywhere, I'd imagine they're good moneymakers for GW.

 TheNewBlood wrote:

 Wyzilla wrote:
What needs to be redone the most is the basic troop kit. While not as horribly old as the Obliterators, their mold design itself is old and the models look fairly terrible unless Raptor bits are tossed in.

I agree, and I would be willing to bet money that CSM will get a new basic kit upon release of the new codex; it would fit the larger pattern for GW. Even if nothing else is updated, the cult troops can be converted from the basic kit.

I honestly feel that the only way we get a new basic CSM kit is if GW finally gives us a brand new special weapon option, similar to how Loyalist scum got Grav guns introduced with their 6th ed codex.
Of all the armies available off store shelves, we have the longest list of needs in terms of the sate of our models...

Plastic Kits that need Recutting/Updating due to missing options;
- Chaos Space Marines: missing options for all heavy weapons bar the Heavy Bolter, Power maul, Power axe, all Combi-weapon varients.

- Chaos Terminators: missions parts for Combi-plasma, Lightning claws, Power sword. Only contains 1x Combi-Flamer, 1x Combi-Melta, 3x Combi-bolters, 2x Power fist, 1x Chainfist, 2x Power axe, 1x Power maul...
This is easily our most dysfunctional mess of a kit - it's impossible to actually build a decent unit of anything out of this box!!

- Khorne Berserkers: can only army half the unit with Chainaxes! But you get 4x Plasma pistols because... "Reasons."

Finecrap Kits that need Replacing to Plastic;
- Havocs: the current kit is BS as you get just 1 of each heavy weapon, meaning you'd need 4 fething kits just to get say 4x Autocannon for a squad! Plus there's no Champion options, (ie: combi-weapon), and no Special weapons to speak of.

- Noise Marines
- Plaguemarines
- Thousand Sons
- Oblits
- Mutilators

Kits that are Outright Missing;
- Chosen
- Cultists



And that's not even taking into account that we could really do with updated to both the Rhino & Land Raider kits to give us some new options - especially the woeful Land Raider!

What we really, desperately need is a minimum 4 week release... Replace the old & tired basic CSM kit, and give us a proper Termie kit in place of the useless garbage that currently exists.
Then give us an actual Havoc kit, (for feth's sake, Loyalists have now had TWO! ing plastic kits!), and a Chosen boxset.
Our last release can then be given over to an Oblit/Mutilator combo kit, and a clamshell character.

Of course, what I expect to happen, is that we get 1 updated kit, (my money is on Oblits/Mutilators), a couple of fugly & overpriced clamshells we don't need, and no Havocs or updated Marines/Termies.

When it comes to Chaos GW certainly kicks the can down the road. GWs had the opportunity to address many of the units piece meal but has allowed the back log to mount to the point where they really need to address a lot at the same time.

Andredre wrote:

Plastic dreadclaw.

No.
Not just no, hell no.

Chaos players for years have been asking for things to further differentiate them from their Loyalist counterparts, and you seemingly just want to copy/paste what you think is the reason why Loyalist books are so successful?
There are so many unique or interesting routes that could be used for Chaos to have a more reliable Deep Strike ability. Warpgates, for example, as a unique fortification for CSM.