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^ im not a chaos daemon player, the tetrad sparked me but now im not really interested after realizing that infernal tetrad, no matter how i wrap my head around it, it does not work. Now i just have to find a good way to play my csm...

 labmouse42 wrote:

 -v10mega wrote:
1. knights+ tetrad

I can tell you from this past weekend that this does not work in a tourney. You lack enough models to really do damage.

 jy2 wrote:
7. infernal tetrad+ screamer formation - 8.5. This is potentially a very good build if you can fit all of that in. 2K is doable but unfortunately, I don't think you can do it at 1850 (assuming the Burning Skyhost formation). This is my favorite of all the builds you have listed. Too bad it won't work at 1850.

You --could-- make it fit with a 1245 tetrad. That's what I ran over this weekend, and it was not the tetrad that was the weak point, it was the two knights I brought.
If you bring 27 screamers, a 45 point herald, and a 25 point disc, you have 1245 points left over for the tetrad. The burning host will run you 745.
Unlike the two knights, it gives you a lot more units to score with.

However, I cannot stress this enough. Running a warphost formation mitigates the warp storm table to an incredible degree. I lost one game because a 4 came up on the warp storm table, meaning that even through I was rerolling saves, going from a 3+ to a 4+ on the tzeentch prince killed him. In two games I rolled a 3, causing 2 wounds in one instance and killing another prince in another game. When you only have 6 models, losing a prince to bad luck can easily cost you the game.

The tetrad is a lot better at 2k and 2500 than 1850. There is a reason you don't see it winning at big events.

Hm sorry to hear that =(. Is it only the Units you need for scoring? What were the main problems you had? Which armies did you face?

What would you change for your next tourney?

And my last question is: Please can you write a battle report about your tourney?^^

tetrad suffer of same limits any other demonic flying circus suffer, too few pieces, i m using a 16WC list so i have two troops with obj secure and i can summon what i need (often screamers), burning skyhost cost too much for standard game, it did not fit at 1850pts, the best build i found for it is with murder horde+kairos, fast good melee power, some WC and decent endurance.

You're right, but there are one Flying Circus list that isn't that bad.

Nurgle Circus with 3 Princes, GUO, Fatey and 2x11 Horrors.

How does your list look like?

I am with you that skyhost is to expensive with tetrad for standard games, but how do you fit Kairos with Murderhost and Tetrad into 1850 Points?

I don't get it, it also is to expensive with kairos or the tetrad for a 1850 Point Game or is it for a 2000 point Game?

 Darksider wrote:
Hm sorry to hear that =(. Is it only the Units you need for scoring? What were the main problems you had? Which armies did you face?

What would you change for your next tourney?

And my last question is: Please can you write a battle report about your tourney?^^

Practice Game One : Tetrad vs Tetrad
In this practice game, my opponent brought the Cabal to my two knights. He was able to vastly out-psychic me during the game, but had no tools to take down the knights. Over the course of the game I was able to target the princes I needed and kill them with the knights.

Practice Game Two : White Scars Hunting Force
In the second practice game I went against a White Scars and Space Wolf death star and murdered it. This is where the tetrad really shines, as it's a great counter to a death star. Null zone and grav killed the Tzeentch prince on turn one, but the other 3 princes were able to wipe out the death star on the bottom of one.

Tourney Game One : Tau Riptide Wing
My opponent in this game had 7 riptides, one commander with maker lights and a lone suit. He was able to put out an incredible amount of firepower and completely wrecked the two knights. The tetrad assaulted him on turn 3 and by turn 4 he was tabled. Riptide squads fall to the tetrad, as they lose combat by 3-5 and just get swept off the board.

Tourney Game Two : Warp Spider Spam
My opponent this game had 41 warp spiders, a wraithknight, two D cannons and 3 squads of scat bikes. On turn one, I moved to the center of the table with the Tzeench prince and cast cursed earth on 3 dice. He had a perils with the power, failed his FNP, failed his LD and was removed from play. The rest of the game went downhill from there. His warp spiders could not hurt the princes, since the princes had such high inits. I was either wiping one warp spider squad per turn with each prince or bringing it down to 1-2 men left.
In this game, I also rolled a 3 on the warp storm table, and the Slaanesh prince did 3 wounds to himself.
He was able to slowly whittle the knights down, as well as the other princes. If I did not lose the Tzeentch prince on turn one, both my opponent and I expect I would have won this game. I had all the right powers/gifts to walk right over his army.

Tourney Game Three : Eldar Gunline
This army consisted of scat bikes, a warp hunter, two hornets and a few warp spiders. My opponent got very lucky with his D shots, and his rolling in general. I got rather unlucky with gifts and powers, getting little or no durability enhancements. He went first and it was not night fighting. He killed two princes and one knight on turn one. On the top of turn 2, he killed the other 2 princes and the last knight. Getting tabled on the top of two was not a good way to end the day.

Tourney Game Four : Gladius
In this game, I played a gladius style list with dark angels. He kept feeding my army squads of tanks and troops. By the end of the game, he ran out of squads to feed me, and I was able to get the objectives. In this game the nurgle prince died with a 3 rolled on the warp storm table. Both knights died to melta shots and melta bombs.
In this game my warlord trait was harnessing on a 3+ so I was able to cast summon and incursion a number of times on 4 dice each. This helped me to hold objectives that were otherwise lost to me.

Tourney Game Five: Renegades
In this game my opponent had 7 wyverns in a VSG, one bloodthirster, a squad of zombies, 10 TL lascannons, some screamers with a herald in them, and a squad of horrors. He assaulted and wrecked one knight with his bloodthirster, and then I showed him how good the balesword was against D-thirsters. He sacrificed his horrors to create another D-Thirster, which my nurgle prince had to stop before it killed other princes. To kill it, I had to go through terrain, which means we both swung at I1, and both the second thirster and the nurgle prince died.
That sacrifice was the key difference in the game. If I had one more prince to hit his lines, I would have been able to wipe his army, but instead there was just not quite enough to do the job. By turn five, he killed everything but the Tzeentch prince.

MVP
The nurgle prince, hands down was the MVP for all the games. The balesword and shrouded are complete money. When it came to killing Riptides, Librarians, D-Thirsters, and Wraithknights, the nurgle prince was my go-to guy.

Knights
The knights were extremely lackluster. In 6 out of 7 games, my opponents had exactly the right tools to take them down. Doing 6 HP to AV 12 is not that hard. While a D sword sounds good, 4 attacks is just lackluster when your hitting on 4s. The stomps are nice, but not guaranteed. WKs are so much better for the same cost as these assault knights.
Because the knights died so easily, it ment that every game was an uphill battle. If I had something like a burning skyhost instead, I could have applied pressure and had a lot more units to score with.

Warp Storm Table
The table really worked against me this tourney -- and is a big problem for daemon players without proper mitigation. In three games the warp storm table screwed me by either hurting or killing a prince, or lowering my save seriously weakening my army. An incursion would have helped to mitigate that issue greatly. My normal ITC list has fatey as well, so the warp storm table is the thing I look forward to each turn.

if models is your problem i have 3 lists, if you want to see them and you can give your synopsis on it.

 labmouse42 wrote:

 Darksider wrote:
Hm sorry to hear that =(. Is it only the Units you need for scoring? What were the main problems you had? Which armies did you face?

What would you change for your next tourney?

And my last question is: Please can you write a battle report about your tourney?^^

Practice Game One : Tetrad vs Tetrad
In this practice game, my opponent brought the Cabal to my two knights. He was able to vastly out-psychic me during the game, but had no tools to take down the knights. Over the course of the game I was able to target the princes I needed and kill them with the knights.

Practice Game Two : White Scars Hunting Force
In the second practice game I went against a White Scars and Space Wolf death star and murdered it. This is where the tetrad really shines, as it's a great counter to a death star. Null zone and grav killed the Tzeentch prince on turn one, but the other 3 princes were able to wipe out the death star on the bottom of one.

Tourney Game One : Tau Riptide Wing
My opponent in this game had 7 riptides, one commander with maker lights and a lone suit. He was able to put out an incredible amount of firepower and completely wrecked the two knights. The tetrad assaulted him on turn 3 and by turn 4 he was tabled. Riptide squads fall to the tetrad, as they lose combat by 3-5 and just get swept off the board.

Tourney Game Two : Warp Spider Spam
My opponent this game had 41 warp spiders, a wraithknight, two D cannons and 3 squads of scat bikes. On turn one, I moved to the center of the table with the Tzeench prince and cast cursed earth on 3 dice. He had a perils with the power, failed his FNP, failed his LD and was removed from play. The rest of the game went downhill from there. His warp spiders could not hurt the princes, since the princes had such high inits. I was either wiping one warp spider squad per turn with each prince or bringing it down to 1-2 men left.
In this game, I also rolled a 3 on the warp storm table, and the Slaanesh prince did 3 wounds to himself.
He was able to slowly whittle the knights down, as well as the other princes. If I did not lose the Tzeentch prince on turn one, both my opponent and I expect I would have won this game. I had all the right powers/gifts to walk right over his army.

Tourney Game Three : Eldar Gunline
This army consisted of scat bikes, a warp hunter, two hornets and a few warp spiders. My opponent got very lucky with his D shots, and his rolling in general. I got rather unlucky with gifts and powers, getting little or no durability enhancements. He went first and it was not night fighting. He killed two princes and one knight on turn one. On the top of turn 2, he killed the other 2 princes and the last knight. Getting tabled on the top of two was not a good way to end the day.

Tourney Game Four : Gladius
In this game, I played a gladius style list with dark angels. He kept feeding my army squads of tanks and troops. By the end of the game, he ran out of squads to feed me, and I was able to get the objectives. In this game the nurgle prince died with a 3 rolled on the warp storm table. Both knights died to melta shots and melta bombs.
In this game my warlord trait was harnessing on a 3+ so I was able to cast summon and incursion a number of times on 4 dice each. This helped me to hold objectives that were otherwise lost to me.

Tourney Game Five: Renegades
In this game my opponent had 7 wyverns in a VSG, one bloodthirster, a squad of zombies, 10 TL lascannons, some screamers with a herald in them, and a squad of horrors. He assaulted and wrecked one knight with his bloodthirster, and then I showed him how good the balesword was against D-thirsters. He sacrificed his horrors to create another D-Thirster, which my nurgle prince had to stop before it killed other princes. To kill it, I had to go through terrain, which means we both swung at I1, and both the second thirster and the nurgle prince died.
That sacrifice was the key difference in the game. If I had one more prince to hit his lines, I would have been able to wipe his army, but instead there was just not quite enough to do the job. By turn five, he killed everything but the Tzeentch prince.

MVP
The nurgle prince, hands down was the MVP for all the games. The balesword and shrouded are complete money. When it came to killing Riptides, Librarians, D-Thirsters, and Wraithknights, the nurgle prince was my go-to guy.

Knights
The knights were extremely lackluster. In 6 out of 7 games, my opponents had exactly the right tools to take them down. Doing 6 HP to AV 12 is not that hard. While a D sword sounds good, 4 attacks is just lackluster when your hitting on 4s. The stomps are nice, but not guaranteed. WKs are so much better for the same cost as these assault knights.
Because the knights died so easily, it ment that every game was an uphill battle. If I had something like a burning skyhost instead, I could have applied pressure and had a lot more units to score with.

Warp Storm Table
The table really worked against me this tourney -- and is a big problem for daemon players without proper mitigation. In three games the warp storm table screwed me by either hurting or killing a prince, or lowering my save seriously weakening my army. An incursion would have helped to mitigate that issue greatly. My normal ITC list has fatey as well, so the warp storm table is the thing I look forward to each turn.

Against that elder that tabled you, since you didn't roll the desired gifts you should of just reserved most of your army if your opponent has first turn. Deploy only the Nurgle prince and hide him inside a ruin out of LOS.

 Darksider wrote:
You're right, but there are one Flying Circus list that isn't that bad.

Nurgle Circus with 3 Princes, GUO, Fatey and 2x11 Horrors.

How does your list look like?

I am with you that skyhost is to expensive with tetrad for standard games, but how do you fit Kairos with Murderhost and Tetrad into 1850 Points?

I don't get it, it also is to expensive with kairos or the tetrad for a 1850 Point Game or is it for a 2000 point Game?

my list play
D thirster with 1 greater rew 1 exalted
Kairos
3x11 horrors
DP tz, wings armor 2 greater 1 lesser 3°lev impossible robe

Be'lakor
10 cultisti
helldrake with baleflamer
i didn't say i play kairos+murderhost with tetrad, i meant play burning skyhost with murderhorde+kairos....

 SonsofVulkan wrote:

 labmouse42 wrote:

 Darksider wrote:
Hm sorry to hear that =(. Is it only the Units you need for scoring? What were the main problems you had? Which armies did you face?

What would you change for your next tourney?

And my last question is: Please can you write a battle report about your tourney?^^

Practice Game One : Tetrad vs Tetrad
In this practice game, my opponent brought the Cabal to my two knights. He was able to vastly out-psychic me during the game, but had no tools to take down the knights. Over the course of the game I was able to target the princes I needed and kill them with the knights.

Practice Game Two : White Scars Hunting Force
In the second practice game I went against a White Scars and Space Wolf death star and murdered it. This is where the tetrad really shines, as it's a great counter to a death star. Null zone and grav killed the Tzeentch prince on turn one, but the other 3 princes were able to wipe out the death star on the bottom of one.

Tourney Game One : Tau Riptide Wing
My opponent in this game had 7 riptides, one commander with maker lights and a lone suit. He was able to put out an incredible amount of firepower and completely wrecked the two knights. The tetrad assaulted him on turn 3 and by turn 4 he was tabled. Riptide squads fall to the tetrad, as they lose combat by 3-5 and just get swept off the board.

Tourney Game Two : Warp Spider Spam
My opponent this game had 41 warp spiders, a wraithknight, two D cannons and 3 squads of scat bikes. On turn one, I moved to the center of the table with the Tzeench prince and cast cursed earth on 3 dice. He had a perils with the power, failed his FNP, failed his LD and was removed from play. The rest of the game went downhill from there. His warp spiders could not hurt the princes, since the princes had such high inits. I was either wiping one warp spider squad per turn with each prince or bringing it down to 1-2 men left.
In this game, I also rolled a 3 on the warp storm table, and the Slaanesh prince did 3 wounds to himself.
He was able to slowly whittle the knights down, as well as the other princes. If I did not lose the Tzeentch prince on turn one, both my opponent and I expect I would have won this game. I had all the right powers/gifts to walk right over his army.

Tourney Game Three : Eldar Gunline
This army consisted of scat bikes, a warp hunter, two hornets and a few warp spiders. My opponent got very lucky with his D shots, and his rolling in general. I got rather unlucky with gifts and powers, getting little or no durability enhancements. He went first and it was not night fighting. He killed two princes and one knight on turn one. On the top of turn 2, he killed the other 2 princes and the last knight. Getting tabled on the top of two was not a good way to end the day.

Tourney Game Four : Gladius
In this game, I played a gladius style list with dark angels. He kept feeding my army squads of tanks and troops. By the end of the game, he ran out of squads to feed me, and I was able to get the objectives. In this game the nurgle prince died with a 3 rolled on the warp storm table. Both knights died to melta shots and melta bombs.
In this game my warlord trait was harnessing on a 3+ so I was able to cast summon and incursion a number of times on 4 dice each. This helped me to hold objectives that were otherwise lost to me.

Tourney Game Five: Renegades
In this game my opponent had 7 wyverns in a VSG, one bloodthirster, a squad of zombies, 10 TL lascannons, some screamers with a herald in them, and a squad of horrors. He assaulted and wrecked one knight with his bloodthirster, and then I showed him how good the balesword was against D-thirsters. He sacrificed his horrors to create another D-Thirster, which my nurgle prince had to stop before it killed other princes. To kill it, I had to go through terrain, which means we both swung at I1, and both the second thirster and the nurgle prince died.
That sacrifice was the key difference in the game. If I had one more prince to hit his lines, I would have been able to wipe his army, but instead there was just not quite enough to do the job. By turn five, he killed everything but the Tzeentch prince.

MVP
The nurgle prince, hands down was the MVP for all the games. The balesword and shrouded are complete money. When it came to killing Riptides, Librarians, D-Thirsters, and Wraithknights, the nurgle prince was my go-to guy.

Knights
The knights were extremely lackluster. In 6 out of 7 games, my opponents had exactly the right tools to take them down. Doing 6 HP to AV 12 is not that hard. While a D sword sounds good, 4 attacks is just lackluster when your hitting on 4s. The stomps are nice, but not guaranteed. WKs are so much better for the same cost as these assault knights.
Because the knights died so easily, it ment that every game was an uphill battle. If I had something like a burning skyhost instead, I could have applied pressure and had a lot more units to score with.

Warp Storm Table
The table really worked against me this tourney -- and is a big problem for daemon players without proper mitigation. In three games the warp storm table screwed me by either hurting or killing a prince, or lowering my save seriously weakening my army. An incursion would have helped to mitigate that issue greatly. My normal ITC list has fatey as well, so the warp storm table is the thing I look forward to each turn.

Against that elder that tabled you, since you didn't roll the desired gifts you should of just reserved most of your army if your opponent has first turn. Deploy only the Nurgle prince and hide him inside a ruin out of LOS.

your interesting battle report shows clearly why will be hard see a tetrad going well in major tourney, just a bad roll on warp storm and you f......ed, or just lucky opponent with D weapons, is just too dangerous play nothing against warp storm bad rolls....i know it myself

@labmouse42

Thanks for you report man^^.


@v10mega

Please show your lists, i am really curious^^


@blackmage

Haha you got me XD.

Btw nice list, but why the exalted on the D-Thirster?

I also think that a bad warpstorm really f***s up the Tetrad, but maybe we should try to fit it into an complete Daemonic Incursion, instead of playing only the Tetrad Formation?

 SonsofVulkan wrote:
Against that elder that tabled you, since you didn't roll the desired gifts you should of just reserved most of your army if your opponent has first turn. Deploy only the Nurgle prince and hide him inside a ruin out of LOS.

And get tabled piecemeal?
The result would have been the same. That just illustrated why the tetrad + knights is not a good list for tourneys.
By all means, feel free to prove me wrong. NOVA is coming up around the corner. I would love to see the tetrad list place in the top 10.

 Darksider wrote:
I also think that a bad warpstorm really f***s up the Tetrad, but maybe we should try to fit it into an complete Daemonic Incursion, instead of playing only the Tetrad Formation?

At 1850 your really limited here. You can bring a tallyband of mostly nurglings, but then your tetrad does not have great support. Nurglings also just are a bit lackluster in a meta where every second army you play with be either Tau or Eldar. Even with a 2+ save, scat bikes just double out nurglings. With perfect timing, the nurglings just evaporate.

At 2k, you can squeeze in a warpflame host, and now your cooking! The warpflame host can offer a lot of psychic support for the tetrad, giving more chances for cursed earth, etc. It also can act as a summoning base to create more units, or a firepower base to throw out lots of shots. The +2 STR on all the Tzeentch powers is actually pretty beefy. (Assuming you have the loci of conjuring).


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 blackmage wrote:
your interesting battle report shows clearly why will be hard see a tetrad going well in major tourney, just a bad roll on warp storm and you f......ed, or just lucky opponent with D weapons, is just too dangerous play nothing against warp storm bad rolls....i know it myself

Yep. For a 3 round tourney, a Tetrad list can win. It's quite possible to not have that 'bad game' over the course of 3 rounds. If you are playing 5 or 6 rounds, the chances of getting knocked out of the running drops dramatically.
For casual games, it does not matter. You can have a bad game 1/4 of the time. Winning in 3/4 of your games might seem like the list is kicking ass -- which it can, especially against the right matchup.

 Darksider wrote:
@labmouse42

Thanks for you report man^^.


@v10mega

Please show your lists, i am really curious^^


@blackmage

Haha you got me XD.

Btw nice list, but why the exalted on the D-Thirster?

I also think that a bad warpstorm really f***s up the Tetrad, but maybe we should try to fit it into an complete Daemonic Incursion, instead of playing only the Tetrad Formation?

i have exalted on D thirster cause TZ Dp already have the robe and you cant have two artifacts ( i use exalted for grimorie) on same model.If i will take out robe, i def put the exalted on Dp

What does your general experience from play say about Warp-forged Armour on the Slaanesh and Nurgle prince?

Is it a must? Somewhat useful? Better to spend the points elsewhere?


I am asking from a meta with plenty of Marines, Tau and Eldar, if that helps answering it.

 labmouse42 wrote:

 SonsofVulkan wrote:
Against that elder that tabled you, since you didn't roll the desired gifts you should of just reserved most of your army if your opponent has first turn. Deploy only the Nurgle prince and hide him inside a ruin out of LOS.

And get tabled piecemeal?
The result would have been the same. That just illustrated why the tetrad + knights is not a good list for tourneys.
By all means, feel free to prove me wrong. NOVA is coming up around the corner. I would love to see the tetrad list place in the top 10.

 Darksider wrote:
I also think that a bad warpstorm really f***s up the Tetrad, but maybe we should try to fit it into an complete Daemonic Incursion, instead of playing only the Tetrad Formation?

At 1850 your really limited here. You can bring a tallyband of mostly nurglings, but then your tetrad does not have great support. Nurglings also just are a bit lackluster in a meta where every second army you play with be either Tau or Eldar. Even with a 2+ save, scat bikes just double out nurglings. With perfect timing, the nurglings just evaporate.

At 2k, you can squeeze in a warpflame host, and now your cooking! The warpflame host can offer a lot of psychic support for the tetrad, giving more chances for cursed earth, etc. It also can act as a summoning base to create more units, or a firepower base to throw out lots of shots. The +2 STR on all the Tzeentch powers is actually pretty beefy. (Assuming you have the loci of conjuring).


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 blackmage wrote:
your interesting battle report shows clearly why will be hard see a tetrad going well in major tourney, just a bad roll on warp storm and you f......ed, or just lucky opponent with D weapons, is just too dangerous play nothing against warp storm bad rolls....i know it myself

Yep. For a 3 round tourney, a Tetrad list can win. It's quite possible to not have that 'bad game' over the course of 3 rounds. If you are playing 5 or 6 rounds, the chances of getting knocked out of the running drops dramatically.
For casual games, it does not matter. You can have a bad game 1/4 of the time. Winning in 3/4 of your games might seem like the list is kicking ass -- which it can, especially against the right matchup.

The guy that won a major GT with daemons last year had just as low model counts compared to the Tetra, basically 2 CADs, I think Fatey, D-thirster, Tz DP, heldrake, and some horrors. But most Importantly he brought a bastion with comms relay. The biggest problem with any low model count armies is getting alpha striked into oblivion. Tetra can do well at a major GT, they just need the right supporting assets.

And I think the Tz and Nurgle DPs can start on the board and survive most alpha strikes. Also ITC GTs tend to be very terrain heavy.

Spiky Norman wrote:
What does your general experience from play say about Warp-forged Armour on the Slaanesh and Nurgle prince?
Is it a must? Somewhat useful? Better to spend the points elsewhere?
I am asking from a meta with plenty of Marines, Tau and Eldar, if that helps answering it.

I've been leaving it off the Slaanesh and Nurgle princes and I've not missed it.
The marines will shoot at your tzeentch or khorne prince anyway, so it's not like your 'denying the 3+ save' target.

late to the party on this one, but oh god why would you ever be so evil as to bring a tetrad and a destroyer cult? That is just evil!

@labmouse42
My main army has been slowly shifting from daemons to renegades. Those TW lascannon artillery are one of the bread and butter units of our army. for 80pt you get 3 of them. I just completed my 3rd unit. Do they down knights as fast in play as they do in theory? Also, by the sound of that list, I think I have chatted with your opponent in one of the R&H groups I am in. 7 wyverns.. damn, people give me the stink eye for owning 2 of them! Though I do have 8 earthshaker/meduesa artillery.

I can't bring myself to buy a VSG, I feel like that will be the final nail in my R&H going full cheese mode.

 Drasius wrote:

 jy2 wrote:
The problem here is that defensive buffs are more important than offensive ones.

This is actually a point in favour of Corruption, since it means you can still have a good weapon without needing to sacrifice one of your 2 greater rewards and therefore, survivability.

I still think 2 greaters and using one for the balesword is better, but corruption does have its place, even if it it extremely niche.

I'd rather use my points elsewhere. To me, Corruption is like the sprinkles on top of my strawberry Sunday. It makes it look pretty but is totally unnecessary. The Sunday still tastes just as good without.

 labmouse42 wrote:

 jy2 wrote:
7. infernal tetrad+ screamer formation - 8.5. This is potentially a very good build if you can fit all of that in. 2K is doable but unfortunately, I don't think you can do it at 1850 (assuming the Burning Skyhost formation). This is my favorite of all the builds you have listed. Too bad it won't work at 1850.

You --could-- make it fit with a 1245 tetrad. That's what I ran over this weekend, and it was not the tetrad that was the weak point, it was the two knights I brought.
If you bring 27 screamers, a 45 point herald, and a 25 point disc, you have 1245 points left over for the tetrad. The burning host will run you 745.
Unlike the two knights, it gives you a lot more units to score with.

However, I cannot stress this enough. Running a warphost formation mitigates the warp storm table to an incredible degree. I lost one game because a 4 came up on the warp storm table, meaning that even through I was rerolling saves, going from a 3+ to a 4+ on the tzeentch prince killed him. In two games I rolled a 3, causing 2 wounds in one instance and killing another prince in another game. When you only have 6 models, losing a prince to bad luck can easily cost you the game.

The tetrad is a lot better at 2k and 2500 than 1850. There is a reason you don't see it winning at big events.

Any Daemon army without a way to mitigate the Warpstorm is not a top-tier Daemon army. Yes, it can still excel at times. However, over a period of 5-7 games (as in a GT), the Warp Storm is bound to screw you over and then you're out of the running to win the event.

To be a top Daemon army, you need either the Incursion or Fatey. The best ones will actually run both.

I dont have the list right now, but going from memory:

1. fleshed out tetrad+ necrosis the undying+ 5x15 zombies and 1x10 zombies (spread out the zombies into one big line and push while grabbing objs.)

2. decent tet+ skyhost (i can still make this work)

3. decent tet+ calvacade for super fast and rending

decent tet= decently fleshed out

and a side note: any1 think that the d axe and the rampage item from the rewards is a good idea? i think i like it more than the armour of scorn

 gwarsh41 wrote:
late to the party on this one, but oh god why would you ever be so evil as to bring a tetrad and a destroyer cult? That is just evil!

@labmouse42
My main army has been slowly shifting from daemons to renegades. Those TW lascannon artillery are one of the bread and butter units of our army. for 80pt you get 3 of them. I just completed my 3rd unit. Do they down knights as fast in play as they do in theory? Also, by the sound of that list, I think I have chatted with your opponent in one of the R&H groups I am in. 7 wyverns.. damn, people give me the stink eye for owning 2 of them! Though I do have 8 earthshaker/meduesa artillery.

I can't bring myself to buy a VSG, I feel like that will be the final nail in my R&H going full cheese mode.

Don't worry. Soon enough the VSG will be going the way of the Dodo. You won't see them around for very much longer.

What I see a lot of artillery-heavy Renegade players bring, though, is the Skyshield.

honestly the best way i think this could work is by putting the tetrad in the tallband or the flayer troupe in the demonic incursion, it gives some kind of warpstorm control and a poor man's obsec

 -v10mega wrote:
I dont have the list right now, but going from memory:

1. fleshed out tetrad+ necrosis the undying+ 5x15 zombies and 1x10 zombies (spread out the zombies into one big line and push while grabbing objs.)

2. decent tet+ skyhost (i can still make this work)

3. decent tet+ calvacade for super fast and rending

decent tet= decently fleshed out

and a side note: any1 think that the d axe and the rampage item from the rewards is a good idea? i think i like it more than the armour of scorn

Can you run a zombie army without Typhus? Zombies are not great for objective-hunting because they are just too slow.

And what points do you play at? Some of these lists won't work in many US tournaments, which are usually at 1850 or less.

You only take the Blade of Blood if you get another junk Greater Reward (like Armourbane/Fleshbane or 3+ for your D-Thirster). With your D-Thirster, defensive > offensive powers (as you're already toting a D-weapon). Your goal should be to make him more durable, not to make him more killy.

Can you run a zombie army without Typhus? Zombies are not great for objective-hunting because they are just too slow.

And what points do you play at? Some of these lists won't work in many US tournaments, which are usually at 1850 or less.

You only take the Blade of Blood if you get another junk Greater Reward (like Armourbane/Fleshbane or 3+ for your D-Thirster). With your D-Thirster, defensive > offensive powers (as you're already toting a D-weapon). Your goal should be to make him more durable, not to make him more killy.

i play 1850 and looking towards finishing my exams that are this week and start going competitve. you can run zombies if you take necrosius which is a nurgle sorcerer that is half the points of typhus.

once i go on break from studying and start watching signals ill post my three lists.

 gwarsh41 wrote:
Do they down knights as fast in play as they do in theory? Also, by the sound of that list, I think I have chatted with your opponent in one of the R&H groups I am in. 7 wyverns.. damn, people give me the stink eye for owning 2 of them! Though I do have 8 earthshaker/meduesa artillery.

I can't bring myself to buy a VSG, I feel like that will be the final nail in my R&H going full cheese mode.

Yes they did.

With the FAQ changes to the VSG coming up, there is less of a need to take it IMHO.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 -v10mega wrote:
any1 think that the d axe and the rampage item from the rewards is a good idea? i think i like it more than the armour of scorn

In most cases the Axe of Khorne will do the same job as the Daxe will.

On 6's with the Axe of Khorne you are ID'ing on 6s instead of D'ing on 6s. Lets compare the three cases.
* If you are hitting a target without EW and is not a GC, then one wound will kill the model outright. The Daxe will only be doing D3 wounds unless another 6 is rolled.
* If you are hitting a target that is a GC, then the ID weapon will be doing d3 wounds, just like the Daxe, unless another 6 is rolled.
* If you are hitting a target with EW, then the Daxe is better.

In most cases, the Axe of Khorne will do the job as well as the Daxe (since you have a 1/36 chance of getting 2 sixes in a row). In some cases the Axe of Khorne will do better, like against a BT.

The best thing about the Axe of Khorne is that it's 10 points, and you still can bring 2 greaters AND the armor of scorn. It's a win-win.
I usually wind up getting the Axe and Blade on the Khorne prince, since 25% of the time will I get two defensive rewards. This means in assault he has 5 base + 1 extra specialist weapon + d3 rampage attacks + 1 charging = 8-10 attacks on the charge. He completely wrecks units he runs into.

@labmouse: Great report. I agree with most of your conclusions. Tetrad needs more support than two knights can provide. One rules question though: Why did you roll LD on the Tzeentch Prince after a perils? By my reading, the Impossible Robes test only applies after failing a save and not after wounds that never allowed the save to occur.

I don't know how much this affects infernal tetrad but I've been running a LoC as my warlord with impossible robes and absolutely loving it. I did pretty well at this last tournament with it but I was lucky. I got the +1 invul warlord trait in 4/5 games. He's in a CAD so I have re-roll and I re-roll everything that's not a 3, its just sooo much better than any other trait.

I played against the tetrad a couple and what I saw was that it is really really scared of anything that can take away its invul. I had a unit of blood letters kill two princes that had their invul turned to a 6+ with grimoire.

I play with belakor and I just find that even with shrouding he just gets picked off by anything with a decent amount of attacks. I have a feeling thats the case with daemon princes as well.

It seems like you need more threats to assault someone turn 2. I think an invisible d -thirster would fit in nicely with that honestly. Either that or the burning skyhost like was mentioned earlier.

It really seems to struggle against other daemons, tau, and grav + hunters eye, and shooty eldar.

That's a whole lot of popular builds to struggle against. :(

PanzerLeader wrote:
@labmouse: Great report. I agree with most of your conclusions. Tetrad needs more support than two knights can provide. One rules question though: Why did you roll LD on the Tzeentch Prince after a perils? By my reading, the Impossible Robes test only applies after failing a save and not after wounds that never allowed the save to occur.

Agreed. He shouldn't have had to take a LD after a failed Perils.

 jy2 wrote:

PanzerLeader wrote:
@labmouse: Great report. I agree with most of your conclusions. Tetrad needs more support than two knights can provide. One rules question though: Why did you roll LD on the Tzeentch Prince after a perils? By my reading, the Impossible Robes test only applies after failing a save and not after wounds that never allowed the save to occur.

Agreed. He shouldn't have had to take a LD after a failed Perils.

I don't think so, it specifies "suffers an unsaved wound" I think the perils would qualify.

if i want play a flying circus anyway i will go for "traditional" list, as i posted above, i really dont like to go at tourney and be screwed by warp storm, had too much bad experiences with it in past, the only tetrad i played was the version with tz+N heralds and horror+plaguebearers as CAD, more WC. some ground support with obj sec troops.
one of best demon list i tried was murder horde+burning skyhost and kairos, it perform so good against three of mayor threats Gladius,eldar scatter bike and Tau, too fast too much targets and some summoning power if needed.

 vercingatorix wrote:

 jy2 wrote:

PanzerLeader wrote:
@labmouse: Great report. I agree with most of your conclusions. Tetrad needs more support than two knights can provide. One rules question though: Why did you roll LD on the Tzeentch Prince after a perils? By my reading, the Impossible Robes test only applies after failing a save and not after wounds that never allowed the save to occur.

Agreed. He shouldn't have had to take a LD after a failed Perils.

I don't think so, it specifies "suffers an unsaved wound" I think the perils would qualify.

Unsaved meaning that you failed a save (or was denied a save due to the weapon's AP). With Perils, you don't even get a save.

It guess it could be a grey area depending on how one interprets it.

Here they come







ok so i think my points are off cause according to some people this does not work, after all i did do this on battle scribe so i might be wrong, but i think the zombies/cavalcade is the better choice, but i like the skyhost