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Just got back from ITC tournament tonight...

Top table had barkstar vs. feth ton of renegade shooting (earth shaker, thudd guns, quad lasers, other gubbins+the Masque and nurglings.}

Renegade player shot all the shooty stuff... then, the Masque popped up and shook some T&A at the barkstar (D3" move/charge).

Barkstart conceded the game.

A 75pt model (masque) shut down the barkstar.

 whembly wrote:
Just got back from ITC tournament tonight...

Top table had barkstar vs. feth ton of renegade shooting (earth shaker, thudd guns, quad lasers, other gubbins+the Masque and nurglings.}

Renegade player shot all the shooty stuff... then, the Masque popped up and shook some T&A at the barkstar (D3" move/charge).

Barkstart conceded the game.

A 75pt model (masque) shut down the barkstar.

That's brilliant. Congrats to the player who thought that solution up.

 Insectum7 wrote:

 whembly wrote:
Just got back from ITC tournament tonight...

Top table had barkstar vs. feth ton of renegade shooting (earth shaker, thudd guns, quad lasers, other gubbins+the Masque and nurglings.}

Renegade player shot all the shooty stuff... then, the Masque popped up and shook some T&A at the barkstar (D3" move/charge).

Barkstart conceded the game.

A 75pt model (masque) shut down the barkstar.

That's brilliant. Congrats to the player who thought that solution up.

Which will no longer work if the opponent has a plane. They'd feel really silly telling it to stop moving turn 4 when everything is basically dead already.

 vercingatorix wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:

 whembly wrote:
Just got back from ITC tournament tonight...

Top table had barkstar vs. feth ton of renegade shooting (earth shaker, thudd guns, quad lasers, other gubbins+the Masque and nurglings.}

Renegade player shot all the shooty stuff... then, the Masque popped up and shook some T&A at the barkstar (D3" move/charge).

Barkstart conceded the game.

A 75pt model (masque) shut down the barkstar.

That's brilliant. Congrats to the player who thought that solution up.

Which will no longer work if the opponent has a plane. They'd feel really silly telling it to stop moving turn 4 when everything is basically dead already.

That list is more suited for ETC than ITC, a 3 formation barkstar is not as effective obviously. Also if the barkstar goes first and gets the buffs off, all those shootings will do very little.

Let say the masque pops up against the ETC barkstar, it has to be 12" away to use the Dance of Caging. You can pretty much say goodbye to it after one unsaved living lightning wound or Sammael's PC.

How did list fare at ETC then?

I'll use the England player as the example for the etc. His list was pretty much the same as the one in the first post, apart from his Libby conclave wasn't vanilla marine instead it was a dark angel conclave.

Game 1 vs 5 flyrants + 3 harpys, won 15-5

Game 2 vs 3 x 1 wyvern, stormsword, assassin bunker, the masque, 2 slaanesh heralds + seekers, won 20-0

Game 3 vs ethereal, stormsurge, riptide wing (3:1:1), drone formation 4x4 markers, culexus (note no bunker) won 17-3

Game 4 vs 45 warp spiders and a wraithknight, won 16-4

Game 5 vs 5 flyrants and 3 heldrakes won 18-2

Game 6 vs centstar won 18-2

So yeah in the hands of a good player that's what it's capable of. As you can see from the results from the games vs the nids that the rune priest formation is essential.

Minimanj wrote:
I'll use the England player as the example for the etc. His list was pretty much the same as the one in the first post, apart from his Libby conclave wasn't vanilla marine instead it was a dark angel conclave.

So yeah in the hands of a good player that's what it's capable of. As you can see from the results from the games vs the nids that the rune priest formation is essential.

This is an ETC list with the 4 det limit, vs the 3 det limit in ITC, so yeah.

Question, was this list something that was put forward as a TAC, or as a counter?

 vercingatorix wrote:


Which will no longer work if the opponent has a plane. They'd feel really silly telling it to stop moving turn 4 when everything is basically dead already.

Huh?

 Insectum7 wrote:

 vercingatorix wrote:


Which will no longer work if the opponent has a plane. They'd feel really silly telling it to stop moving turn 4 when everything is basically dead already.

Huh?

Assuming the renegade player doesn't have points for a flyer after a full renegade artillery company and a daemon detachment. This would mean the death star player could force the masque to either deploy on the board and get shot or come in from reserves on a 6(I think its a 6). So, itt is likely that the death star would just run over the artillery company then split apart so when the masque deep strikes in turn 4 (automatically) then she's fairly useless.

 vercingatorix wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:

 vercingatorix wrote:


Which will no longer work if the opponent has a plane. They'd feel really silly telling it to stop moving turn 4 when everything is basically dead already.

Huh?

Assuming the renegade player doesn't have points for a flyer after a full renegade artillery company and a daemon detachment. This would mean the death star player could force the masque to either deploy on the board and get shot or come in from reserves on a 6(I think its a 6). So, itt is likely that the death star would just run over the artillery company then split apart so when the masque deep strikes in turn 4 (automatically) then she's fairly useless.

The masque was on the board on turn one, in his deployment zone behind a LOS blocking terrain. She was never a target.

Renegade player simply shot at every non-barkstar unit dead in turn 1.

The barkstar player (who really didn't have any shooting, or had none) had to move up the board in order to engage in CC... at that point, the masque simple moved into 12" range, and said "no, you now only move/run d3".

Which again wouldn't work on the ETC list as it has much more psychic shooting and will blow that masque away in one turn. And also renegades wouldn't work in ETC/NOVA format once the deathstar go invis, the earthshakers becomes useless.

Yeah I am really surprised that the Masque was able to do anything. 1 Living Lightening and She's dead. Reducing their move/run would only work for 1 turn since she'd have to be close enough to them that the Barkstar could just charge her and consolidate after. So they still get closer.

If you try to Deep Strike her, the Barkstar will have already moved for at least 1 turn, possibly 2 so they are where they need to be already. So she must make them dance turn 1

The only way for her to have worked is if the Barkstar play had absolutely no idea what she could do and thus ignored her for the turn. If he had known what she could do, she would have died turn 1.

 Galef wrote:
Yeah I am really surprised that the Masque was able to do anything. 1 Living Lightening and She's dead. Reducing their move/run would only work for 1 turn since she'd have to be close enough to them that the Barkstar could just charge her and consolidate after. So they still get closer.

If you try to Deep Strike her, the Barkstar will have already moved for at least 1 turn, possibly 2 so they are where they need to be already. So she must make them dance turn 1

The only way for her to have worked is if the Barkstar play had absolutely no idea what she could do and thus ignored her for the turn. If he had known what she could do, she would have died turn 1.

You have to remember that she's slaneesh. So she can come out from behind a wall, then run 4-9 inches away, probably behind said wall. So she's never going to get charged by the unit. I don't know what ETC says but nova specifies that her power doesn't work on turbo-boosting.

 vercingatorix wrote:

 Galef wrote:
Yeah I am really surprised that the Masque was able to do anything. 1 Living Lightening and She's dead. Reducing their move/run would only work for 1 turn since she'd have to be close enough to them that the Barkstar could just charge her and consolidate after. So they still get closer.

If you try to Deep Strike her, the Barkstar will have already moved for at least 1 turn, possibly 2 so they are where they need to be already. So she must make them dance turn 1

The only way for her to have worked is if the Barkstar play had absolutely no idea what she could do and thus ignored her for the turn. If he had known what she could do, she would have died turn 1.

You have to remember that she's slaneesh. So she can come out from behind a wall, then run 4-9 inches away, probably behind said wall. So she's never going to get charged by the unit. I don't know what ETC says but nova specifies that her power doesn't work on turbo-boosting.

ETC ruled it for all movement. D3" for move/run/turbo/charge/hit and run etc..

harkequin wrote:

 vercingatorix wrote:

 Galef wrote:
Yeah I am really surprised that the Masque was able to do anything. 1 Living Lightening and She's dead. Reducing their move/run would only work for 1 turn since she'd have to be close enough to them that the Barkstar could just charge her and consolidate after. So they still get closer.

If you try to Deep Strike her, the Barkstar will have already moved for at least 1 turn, possibly 2 so they are where they need to be already. So she must make them dance turn 1

The only way for her to have worked is if the Barkstar play had absolutely no idea what she could do and thus ignored her for the turn. If he had known what she could do, she would have died turn 1.

You have to remember that she's slaneesh. So she can come out from behind a wall, then run 4-9 inches away, probably behind said wall. So she's never going to get charged by the unit. I don't know what ETC says but nova specifies that her power doesn't work on turbo-boosting.

ETC ruled it for all movement. D3" for move/run/turbo/charge/hit and run etc..

Which makes sense. What happens in the unit? Everyone is in a zombie daze including the guy on the motorcycle and he just snaps out of it for a minutes and drives off like a maniac?

Assuming the dogs are T4, would multiple S9 torrent flamers/ barrage large blasts do anything to that star in an ITC setting? So for the most part ignoring invisibility and any FNP shenanigans they get,...

...admittedly it doesn't get past Forewarning + Veil of Time + Sanctuary (I know that's from three separate tables and sanctuary is really needed , but with that may psykers there's a good chance he'll get it if he goes for it)

 Torus wrote:
Assuming the dogs are T4, would multiple S9 torrent flamers/ barrage large blasts do anything to that star in an ITC setting? So for the most part ignoring invisibility and any FNP shenanigans they get,...

...admittedly it doesn't get past Forewarning + Veil of Time + Sanctuary (I know that's from three separate tables and sanctuary is really needed , but with that may psykers there's a good chance he'll get it if he goes for it)

Why would you need Forewarning when Azreal gives them all a 4++ already? Rolling veil plus Sanctuary really isn't that difficult. Actually trying to hurt the star once it's powered up is pretty futile and very few armies can actually do enough damage T1 even if they go first. I said it a couple pages back, but as someone that's used a Barkstar at big events the only things that would seriously worry me are:
- Culexus + iKnights/Eldar/Tau
- The Masque + lots of LoS blocking terrain
- Absurd Barrage spam that might snipe the Libs with good powers or Azzy (like renegades with 10 wyverns and 12 thudd guns, or eldar with 3+ warp hunters, a couple thunderfires won't bother me at all)

 vercingatorix wrote:

 Galef wrote:
Yeah I am really surprised that the Masque was able to do anything. 1 Living Lightening and She's dead. Reducing their move/run would only work for 1 turn since she'd have to be close enough to them that the Barkstar could just charge her and consolidate after. So they still get closer.

If you try to Deep Strike her, the Barkstar will have already moved for at least 1 turn, possibly 2 so they are where they need to be already. So she must make them dance turn 1

The only way for her to have worked is if the Barkstar play had absolutely no idea what she could do and thus ignored her for the turn. If he had known what she could do, she would have died turn 1.

You have to remember that she's slaneesh. So she can come out from behind a wall, then run 4-9 inches away, probably behind said wall. So she's never going to get charged by the unit. I don't know what ETC says but nova specifies that her power doesn't work on turbo-boosting.

I believe that's exactly what happened... masque pointed her fingers, then ran behind some LOS blocking terrain.

 whembly wrote:
I believe that's exactly what happened... masque pointed her fingers, then ran behind some LOS blocking terrain.

Yeah against Masque you gotta get a little creative. Once I hit veil I go for Phaseform, coupled with Sammys plasma cannon (or Azzys combo-plas, or just bolters) it usually does the trick unless she's grimmed.

I played against the masque this past week at nova and another useful trick is bringing down flyers. It's a great anti-fateweaver model.