Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 Dr_Keenbean wrote:

I sincerely hope they continue to post free PDFs of example Kill Teams on the store (or in White Dwarf) so people can try things out without committing to an expensive codex. That was an excellent move.

The free PDFs are only for the Kill Team collections, right? These are all the rules you need to play these pre-made teams? Are all the keywords on the PDFs, like "Special Rule: 'Ere We Go", included in the mini rulebook, or are they codex rules? And I'm assuming that these PDFs don't contain enough information to customize your own units, just play the one specific team?

The difficulty of getting rules is the main thing that has kept me away from 40k. If they learn anything from Age of Sigmar for the next edition of 40k, free rules should be number one.

Some are codex rules, others are universal special rules found in the core rulebook.

 Sqorgar wrote:
I realize that the starter box comes with rules for the space marines and fire warriors, but if I wanted to get one of the other kill team groups on the GW site (like the Wraithguard or Tyranid Warriors), I would need to buy a codex for each faction, right? 40k doesn't have free unit rules. I'm assuming that the mini rulebook included with the game doesn't have unit stats in it for all the possible kill teams. And there's no AoS-like app where I can buy unit stats separately from the codices (that I'm aware of). So, realistically, to play Kill Team with a bunch of different factional teams would require a few hundred dollars in codices, right?

It just seems to me like Kill Team is less a stepping on point for new players and more like alternate scenario rules for people who already have 40k experience, armies, and books. I'm just wondering how viable it would be if I played Kill Team (and only Kill Team) as a player with no 40k experience, armies, or books.

You are correct in that the additional rules for other models, not included in Kill Team, are only available, from GW, via their respective codexes.

 Sqorgar wrote:

 Dr_Keenbean wrote:

I sincerely hope they continue to post free PDFs of example Kill Teams on the store (or in White Dwarf) so people can try things out without committing to an expensive codex. That was an excellent move.

The free PDFs are only for the Kill Team collections, right? These are all the rules you need to play these pre-made teams? Are all the keywords on the PDFs, like "Special Rule: 'Ere We Go", included in the mini rulebook, or are they codex rules? And I'm assuming that these PDFs don't contain enough information to customize your own units, just play the one specific team?

The difficulty of getting rules is the main thing that has kept me away from 40k. If they learn anything from Age of Sigmar for the next edition of 40k, free rules should be number one.

Sadly, I don't think the PDFs are enough. For instance, the Harlequin one doesn't list the profiles of their special weapons, the effect of their special wargear, or the psychic disciplines the shadowseer has access to. And I'm fairly confident that they're not included in the KT rulebook.
So, while they are nice examples, they don't allow use to play these teams without the corresponding codices, most of the time

The Kill Team boxed set only contains the relevant unit rules for the models included, alongside an A5 rulebook and a Kill Team rulebook.

Am I incorrect, but didn't AOS only gave free rules for the WF models they made obsolete, and that you need to buy the rules for the new releases ?

I believe when you go to the games workshop store site, with each AoS item there is an option bottom right to download their scroll.

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Sylvaneth-Treelord-Ancient#

You can find unit rules in the little tabs to the bottom right as "RULES"

https://www.games-workshop.com/resources/PDF/AoS_Warscrolls/aos-warscroll-treelordancient-en.pdf


Back onto the topic, do you believe they've balanced out the factions this time around? Or is it going to be a bit of a hodgepodge when it comes to the armywide rules.

 MrDwhitey wrote:
I believe when you go to the games workshop store site, with each AoS item there is an option bottom right to download their scroll.

Spoiler:

I was unaware. Thank you for clarifying that.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
Back onto the topic, do you believe they've balanced out the factions this time around? Or is it going to be a bit of a hodgepodge when it comes to the armywide rules.

As I understand it, changes to army wide rules are the only changes made. All the other unit rules are the same as in the codices.

The army building restrictions, as well as splitting units into single model units will change the balance between codices.
For instance, Tau's markerlight are basically useless now (since only one model can benefit from a markerlight, instead of a whole bunch of models in the same unit). And they lost access to the best units in the codex, as well as formations. On the other side, they have easy access to mass flamers (crisis suits w/ two flamers are 32pts, for a T4 W2 3+ jetpack model), which can be deadly on a terrain dense map.

Each faction will have to use very different army lists than what they use now, and I have no clue what the resulting power scale will look like. However, many things are clearly out (deathstars in general), and things like hight rate of fire weapons, which are really good in standard 40K, will be much less versatile (still good against vehicles, but very bad against infantry).

fresus wrote:

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
Back onto the topic, do you believe they've balanced out the factions this time around? Or is it going to be a bit of a hodgepodge when it comes to the armywide rules.

As I understand it, changes to army wide rules are the only changes made. All the other unit rules are the same as in the codices.

The army building restrictions, as well as splitting units into single model units will change the balance between codices.
For instance, Tau's markerlight are basically useless now (since only one model can benefit from a markerlight, instead of a whole bunch of models in the same unit). And they lost access to the best units in the codex, as well as formations. On the other side, they have easy access to mass flamers (crisis suits w/ two flamers are 32pts, for a T4 W2 3+ jetpack model), which can be deadly on a terrain dense map.

Each faction will have to use very different army lists than what they use now, and I have no clue what the resulting power scale will look like. However, many things are clearly out (deathstars in general), and things like hight rate of fire weapons, which are really good in standard 40K, will be much less versatile (still good against vehicles, but very bad against infantry).

What he is trying to say, is that 40K is saved! Amen!


Just kidding. For all the points mentioned above and more, I am excited for this release.

Am tempted to pick this one up although don't need another game just yet. Have always liked the look of the muted colours of raptor marines and the idea of using camo of sorts.

Could really go to town on making them look beaten up as if they are being hunted or are a small strike team stranded on a hostile planet trying to cause chaos on the enemy. Hell might even load up a vehicle with stowage just for the cool factor.

So I have a sneaking suspicion that I wouldn't be the only one fielding Deathwatch this time around, and that simply won't satisfy my need to be a special snowflake.

I've decided it's an ample opportunity to unpack my Sisters of Battle.

And at least one conversion.

At first I was thinking of kitbashing a penitent engine (even drew up a couple of sketches) and fielding it with some seraphim, but the more I thought about it the more I wanted to put together something with a healthier number of models and less knee-jerk.

With that in mind, I bought a vindicator and started work converting it to a rhino.

It's interesting (maybe surprising) that in the Kill Team rules, Orks lose Mob Rule, but Tyranids don't lose Instinctive Behavior. I know that Zoanthropes/Warriors are important parts of KT, but to me, that seems pretty restrictive. Maybe GW will do something like HoR and double synapse range?

If it's not mentioned on that page, then no.

I think for Nids players will either go with stealers or all synapse creatures. Tyranid Warriors are a fair bit scarier in Kill Team than standard 40k.

Ben2 wrote:
I think for Nids players will either go with stealers or all synapse creatures. Tyranid Warriors are a fair bit scarier in Kill Team than standard 40k.

I kind of love hearing statements like that. Hearing about people fielding Penitent Engines, and Tyranid Warriors makes me think Kill Team will be a fun game to add into our various group's rotations of games. :-)

In Kill Team, a Tactical Marine with a Rending Heavy Bolter or an Ignores Cover plasma gun is a God among minis!

Clearly you need the magic anniversary marine with his excessive special rules x5 for kill team supremacy

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
Clearly you need the magic anniversary marine with his excessive special rules x5 for kill team supremacy

I have one, but I wouldn't bring it to Kill Team. I'd only use that in regular 40k games.

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:

Ben2 wrote:
I think for Nids players will either go with stealers or all synapse creatures. Tyranid Warriors are a fair bit scarier in Kill Team than standard 40k.

I kind of love hearing statements like that. Hearing about people fielding Penitent Engines, and Tyranid Warriors makes me think Kill Team will be a fun game to add into our various group's rotations of games. :-)

I think it won't take long before people come up with very broken lists (which could be even worse than in normal 40K, since there might be way fewer counters due to the restrictions on what you can field).
I do have high hopes for KT, but I think the amount of fun will be, just like in regular 40K, directly related to the people you play with, and how your definition of fun matches theirs.

People who bring the cheesiest lists to 40K will do the same thing in KT (it will be a very different list, but a very OP list nonetheless). And the ones who already bring fluffy lists to 40K will do the same in KT (and maybe have a name for each of their character).

They didn't change much of the core rules, or any of the codex entries. Optimized lists from strong codices will still walk over fluffy lists from weak codices.
I do hope it will bring a fun new way to play with people I can already play with, but I have little hope of KT being a good platform to reconcile powergamers and beer and pretzel guys.

It really depends on the player groups with regards to broken lists. Some groups will always have witches in there who want to put out the most broken gak possible and ruin the game for others.

I think the cheesiest lists will be Space Marine scouts with the Imperial Fists Chapter Tactics, Eldar Jetbikes, and Tau suits with dual flamers.

I'm going with a Carcharadon Tactical Squad.

Certain vehicles can also be bordering on the side of cheese, like the Chimera and Devilfish, whom are both quite tough, not to mention quite the powerhouses in terms of fire power and / or durability.

Perhaps even more so seeing as vehicles can apparently get USR's again.

 BrookM wrote:
Certain vehicles can also be bordering on the side of cheese, like the Chimera and Devilfish, whom are both quite tough, not to mention quite the powerhouses in terms of fire power and / or durability.

Perhaps even more so seeing as vehicles can apparently get USR's again.

Shrouded Chimera?

Sure, why not? Throw on camo netting while you're at it, then hope you're the attacker for the "Infiltrate the Camp" mission for maximum effect.

Can you DS in Kill Team? Tempestus Scions would be pretty powerful if that's the case.

Nope. And unless the rules have changed infiltrating / outflanking is also minimized.

Requizen wrote:
Can you DS in Kill Team? Tempestus Scions would be pretty powerful if that's the case.

No, you have to deploy normally. It even says that units that can only DS are allow to deploy normally.

Requizen wrote:
Can you DS in Kill Team? Tempestus Scions would be pretty powerful if that's the case.

You can't put anything in reserves except for 1 mission that allows/forces you to, and a Leader Trait (kind of like a warlord trait) that lets you outflank with a d3 units.

Again, this is from 6th edition rules. Not sure what the new rules will allow.