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 oldzoggy wrote:
Meh everyone seems to be ok with it when it happens to happen to groceries, board games, furniture and other products we buy. I have even seen it happen to preconstructed magic decks and magic boosters.

Why should non essential limited edition GW stuff that sells out in minutes be an exception, when we accept it for food water and housing ? The store is not going to get a bad rep for this, op even bought the box.

But people aren't okay with it for all those things. They up a storm about it, buy less of it, and in general hate whoever is causing the problem. I don't think anyone that plays magic says "man, I'm really glad these go for triple what they're supposed to go for".

 kingbobbito wrote:

 oldzoggy wrote:
Meh everyone seems to be ok with it when it happens to happen to groceries, board games, furniture and other products we buy. I have even seen it happen to preconstructed magic decks and magic boosters.

Why should non essential limited edition GW stuff that sells out in minutes be an exception, when we accept it for food water and housing ? The store is not going to get a bad rep for this, op even bought the box.

But people aren't okay with it for all those things. They up a storm about it, buy less of it, and in general hate whoever is causing the problem. I don't think anyone that plays magic says "man, I'm really glad these go for triple what they're supposed to go for".

I...actually do say that (once verbatim), but that's because I apparently have some kind of cosmic good luck where the cards I bought for cheap ends up rising in price like there's no tomorrow. Like once I bought an Emrakul the Aeon's Torn for 5 bucks because the store owner said that the set just went out of rotation and no one in their sane mind would play it in Extended or Legacy due to it's insane cost.

Then Modern happened and the damn thing is now 50 bucks. It also doesn't help that on that same day I pulled a second Emrakul after I bought some packs as well (for 3 bucks each). Said Store Owner still remembers me (and not in a favourable way, although less now that I've spent a decent chunk of money there).

 kingbobbito wrote:
something that had a set price attached to it

Oddly, I don't see anyone complaining when stores offer to sell that same thing-with-a-set-price-attached at less than MSRP. It's almost like the issue here is customers who consider it a moral right to get cheap stuff, not respect for MSRP...

 kingbobbito wrote:

 AnomanderRake wrote:

 kingbobbito wrote:
...and no legitimate business would scalp stuff...

...Wha...?

This is a very simple set of equations. Supply of SWA is apparently limited. Demand is apparently high. Your LGS decided that people would probably still buy it if they charged an extra $30. You are now presented with the choice to buy it from them for an extra $30 or buy it from someone else at someone else's price.

Nowhere in there is "legitimate business" a relevant or useful concept. Your power to dictate prices to any supplier extends to whether you choose to buy the plastic toys, there's no intrinsic fairness that mandates them to sell plastic toys at list price here.

As much as people want to believe 40k is a collector's item, even you admit they are plastic toys. At Christmas time did you see toys are us selling anything at a markup because they were having trouble getting it in stock? They sell limited edition items as well, and you don't see them deciding that when stock is low they're going to bump up the prices.

Let me guess, you think it's fine when people take bottled water into areas where disasters have hit and sell it for triple what it's worth?

(EDIT: why can't I say r?)

actually Toys R' Us are notorious for marking up their prices, especially on things like LEGO and such, go ahead check their LEGO prices, then check those prices against the LEGO online store or such, you will see a considerable mark up on TRU prices.

Going to subject specific shops generally means paying higher prices.
I rarely shop for art supplies in the local art supply store, I get most of what I need from my local Newsagent at close to half the price, twice a year I grit my teeth and restock my watercolour paints. How that place is always crowded is anyone's guess, "struggling artists" who don't shop about would be mine.

 Dakka Wolf wrote:
Going to subject specific shops generally means paying higher prices.
I rarely shop for art supplies in the local art supply store, I get most of what I need from my local Newsagent at close to half the price, twice a year I grit my teeth and restock my watercolour paints. How that place is always crowded is anyone's guess, "struggling artists" who don't shop about would be mine.

I go to Michael's or Aaron Brothers armed with 50% off coupons for my art supply buying.

Asterios wrote:

 Dakka Wolf wrote:
Going to subject specific shops generally means paying higher prices.
I rarely shop for art supplies in the local art supply store, I get most of what I need from my local Newsagent at close to half the price, twice a year I grit my teeth and restock my watercolour paints. How that place is always crowded is anyone's guess, "struggling artists" who don't shop about would be mine.

I go to Michael's or Aaron Brothers armed with 50% off coupons for my art supply buying.

Is that how they do it?
By that logic I'm paying a bit more than the people who usually shop at these places - you might be on to something with that.

 Dakka Wolf wrote:

Asterios wrote:

 Dakka Wolf wrote:
Going to subject specific shops generally means paying higher prices.
I rarely shop for art supplies in the local art supply store, I get most of what I need from my local Newsagent at close to half the price, twice a year I grit my teeth and restock my watercolour paints. How that place is always crowded is anyone's guess, "struggling artists" who don't shop about would be mine.

I go to Michael's or Aaron Brothers armed with 50% off coupons for my art supply buying.

Is that how they do it?
By that logic I'm paying a bit more than the people who usually shop at these places - you might be on to something with that.

yeah go to their web sites, they usually have up to 70% off sales or have coupons for anywhere from 40-60% off an item, its a sales gimmick charge a lot for an item and then offer coupons and it makes me people think they are getting a steal when in actuality the coupon price is decent, but not the steal people think it is.

Asterios wrote:

 Dakka Wolf wrote:

Asterios wrote:

 Dakka Wolf wrote:
Going to subject specific shops generally means paying higher prices.
I rarely shop for art supplies in the local art supply store, I get most of what I need from my local Newsagent at close to half the price, twice a year I grit my teeth and restock my watercolour paints. How that place is always crowded is anyone's guess, "struggling artists" who don't shop about would be mine.

I go to Michael's or Aaron Brothers armed with 50% off coupons for my art supply buying.

Is that how they do it?
By that logic I'm paying a bit more than the people who usually shop at these places - you might be on to something with that.

yeah go to their web sites, they usually have up to 70% off sales or have coupons for anywhere from 40-60% off an item, its a sales gimmick charge a lot for an item and then offer coupons and it makes me people think they are getting a steal when in actuality the coupon price is decent, but not the steal people think it is.

Thanks for the hot tip, neither of those companies exists nearby but I'll check for my local to see if they do it.

Dunno about across the pond there, but Michaels here and some art stores also offer an additional 10% off for students or teachers so long as you have a School ID you can provide them with. It's usable in combination with other discounts here. Ask about it, 10% doesn't sound like much but it can add up when you're buying stacks of special paper.

Stop shopping at Tims dude. You keep making threads about his store. Just stop going there

Hmm, my FLGS has 4 of the 5 copies it received still up for sale. It just wasn't a game system most of us cared about.

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
Dunno about across the pond there, but Michaels here and some art stores also offer an additional 10% off for students or teachers so long as you have a School ID you can provide them with. It's usable in combination with other discounts here. Ask about it, 10% doesn't sound like much but it can add up when you're buying stacks of special paper.

Website says they have the 10% student discount but nothing about 50% coupons. You're right though, never hurts to ask.

 kingbobbito wrote:

 AnomanderRake wrote:

 kingbobbito wrote:
...and no legitimate business would scalp stuff...

...Wha...?

This is a very simple set of equations. Supply of SWA is apparently limited. Demand is apparently high. Your LGS decided that people would probably still buy it if they charged an extra $30. You are now presented with the choice to buy it from them for an extra $30 or buy it from someone else at someone else's price.

Nowhere in there is "legitimate business" a relevant or useful concept. Your power to dictate prices to any supplier extends to whether you choose to buy the plastic toys, there's no intrinsic fairness that mandates them to sell plastic toys at list price here.

As much as people want to believe 40k is a collector's item, even you admit they are plastic toys. At Christmas time did you see toys are us selling anything at a markup because they were having trouble getting it in stock? They sell limited edition items as well, and you don't see them deciding that when stock is low they're going to bump up the prices.

Let me guess, you think it's fine when people take bottled water into areas where disasters have hit and sell it for triple what it's worth?

(EDIT: why can't I say r?)

You realize stores are free to set prices right? Why you think it only applies to lowering?

And what makes miniatures special where stores have to set prices to some value and no other where for example pc software you can see 2 edition older software on sale for over rpp of new version...

 Dakka Wolf wrote:

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
Dunno about across the pond there, but Michaels here and some art stores also offer an additional 10% off for students or teachers so long as you have a School ID you can provide them with. It's usable in combination with other discounts here. Ask about it, 10% doesn't sound like much but it can add up when you're buying stacks of special paper.

Website says they have the 10% student discount but nothing about 50% coupons. You're right though, never hurts to ask.

todays crop of coupons on Michael's:

http://www.michaels.com/on/demandware.store/Sites-MichaelsUS-Site/default/Coupons-ViewCoupons?storeid=8840&address=628%20W%20Hammer%20Ln%2c%20Stockton%2c%20CA%2095210&hours=9%3a00am%20-%209%3a00pm&hoursun=10%3a00am%20-%207%3a00pm&postalcode=&city=&state=&tel=%28209%29%20473-1701

 kingbobbito wrote:

 AnomanderRake wrote:

 kingbobbito wrote:
...and no legitimate business would scalp stuff...

...Wha...?

This is a very simple set of equations. Supply of SWA is apparently limited. Demand is apparently high. Your LGS decided that people would probably still buy it if they charged an extra $30. You are now presented with the choice to buy it from them for an extra $30 or buy it from someone else at someone else's price.

Nowhere in there is "legitimate business" a relevant or useful concept. Your power to dictate prices to any supplier extends to whether you choose to buy the plastic toys, there's no intrinsic fairness that mandates them to sell plastic toys at list price here.

As much as people want to believe 40k is a collector's item, even you admit they are plastic toys. At Christmas time did you see toys are us selling anything at a markup because they were having trouble getting it in stock? They sell limited edition items as well, and you don't see them deciding that when stock is low they're going to bump up the prices.

Let me guess, you think it's fine when people take bottled water into areas where disasters have hit and sell it for triple what it's worth?

(EDIT: why can't I say r?)

Umm, having worked for Toys R Us for several years, I can very firmly tell you that they do just that. Mark up the prices on highly desired, low availability products. Those TNMT sewer lairs that came out a few years ago? Prices magically went from $80 to $100 around Christmas time. I wonder why that is.

To those saying it's the model that other stores employ - yea, ok, that's true.

But games like this need a community. There's no community when you go into Toys R Us to buy some nonsense Ninja Turtle stuff.

A hobby shop isn't just a place to buy stuff. Without a thriving community, there is no hobby shop, and without a hobby shop, there is no gaming.

Gamers, and hobby shop proprietors, need to understand that it's a symbiotic relationship. Neither one does well without the other. Gouging prices is what gave hobby shops such a bad name in the first place, and ultimately why they vanished pretty quick once people realized you could buy on the internet and save a lot of money.

Is the store owner perfectly within his rights to charge whatever he pleases? Yes.

But the phrase, penny rich, dollar poor, comes to mind. He might make an extra $100 total on his last few copies of Shadow War Armageddon. But in the long run, that kind of stuff leaves a foul taste in people's mouths, and will push people away from the store. While I might not be describing how you personally will react, many people will, and hopefully we can all understand that there are quite a few people out there who think differently than we do.

I've dropped probably $1000 this year so far on GW products. If a store gouged me, they'd lose my business. Would you trade my purchases for $30 extra dollars for SWA?

If you view it that way, it all depends on the local clientele and the loss vs gain ratio.

If the store owner feels that gouging for this particular set will earn him enough revenue in the long run (i.e: your old veteran gamers barely buy anything and the majority of his profits are from people who come in once or twice and never comes back) then you can bet your shorts he's gonna gouge the hell out of his products. This is a problem with stores next to colleges (like mine), where they're pretty much guaranteed to get a new crop of customers every year and it's also very hard to develop a local playerbase (due to people leaving every year).

Also trying to shame these kind of stores don't consistently work. The shop below me once creeped out a crop of foreign exchange students so bad that I had to physically step in to get the shop owner to back off (I was part of the student's escorts) when he wouldn't leave them alone and kept trying to talk them into buying some rather creepy stuff (like naked anime figurines or gag adult toys). And yes, he fully knew they didn't speak a lick of english and at one point tried to get me to "help" him by translating. Story made the rounds around the college.

3 years later his store is still open under him, business no worse for wear.

 kingbobbito wrote:
...Let me guess, you think it's fine when people take bottled water into areas where disasters have hit and sell it for triple what it's worth?...

Just out of curiosity, did you read my post?

Are you trying to suggest that a game store inconveniencing you by forcing you to go to a different store to get a luxury item at list price is in any way comparable to people trying to profit off a disaster by gouging folks for basic necessities?

 AnomanderRake wrote:

 kingbobbito wrote:
...Let me guess, you think it's fine when people take bottled water into areas where disasters have hit and sell it for triple what it's worth?...

Just out of curiosity, did you read my post?

Are you trying to suggest that a game store inconveniencing you by forcing you to go to a different store to get a luxury item at list price is in any way comparable to people trying to profit off a disaster by gouging folks for basic necessities?

This is wargaming - yes, people do attach this level of importance to it.

As far as higher pricing in shops? That's life. Prices vary in different places and it's up to the shop. They don't owe you and your have free choice to shop where you think the best deal is.

There's a massive difference between scalping a "luxury" consumer item and someone profiteering/scalping materials required for life/safety during a state of emergency. Just a tad...bit...different.

I haven't been to my FLGS since before SWA came out. They'll probably still have some (they still have Imperial Space Marines in stock) but as always (thanks Switzerland) it'll be marked up. I'm lucky that both the Euro and the pound are down, though. Swiss franc is still going strong.

Can't speak for SWA but have a horror story with a former FLGS.
Went to a nearby shop back in the day, things changed when they started upcharging for a lot of stuff. MTG packs started going $1 above everywhere else, 40k kits were 15% more expensive than GW shops, everything just went up in price one day.

My group stopped going. Decided to see them after a 6 year hiatus. Prices went up, the building is borderline condemned, and when I inquired about some older D20 books, they said they wouldn't go below MSRP. I didn't come back. This was in 2013.

A week ago I was calling around looking for packs for the new Final Fantasy Card Game. They still had a phone number and all other options were looking bleak so i tried. These guys wanted $10 a pack for something that sells for $3.99 MSRP.
I don't know how they stay afloat.

 Peregrine wrote:

 kingbobbito wrote:
Let me guess, you think it's fine when people take bottled water into areas where disasters have hit and sell it for triple what it's worth?

Do you honestly see no difference between spiking prices on an essential item that people will literally die without, and increasing prices a bit on a luxury item to reflect its actual market price?

I'm curious of this ever got answered, and if OP has tried to drink his SWA box set yet.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

mokoshkana wrote:
Stop shopping at Tims dude. You keep making threads about his store. Just stop going there

Ah, this thread makes more sense now.

I think you're an idiot to buy it and then complain about the price gouging that you were aware of prior to buying it.

OP, FLGS set the price to what they think will sell and not scare their customers away to buy somewhere else.
That is pretty much how the market works.
It sucks, I feel your pain but this is normal.
I thank my lucky stars that my local FLGS seems to sell under the GW listed prices so your post at least helps me not take it for granted.

"Scalping" really does not apply here, I do have a FLGS that buys from the larger cheaper FLGS on occasion which would be more like scalping.
Heck, those same guys have Imperial Knights selling for $190 while the "larger cheaper" FLGS sells for $130.
Mind, the smaller store hosts gaming so I feel buying the occasional "marked up" item keeps them in business and pays for the gaming space which would be very bad if they closed.

I find it humorous that people complain about GW pricing, but when hobby shops charge well above that pricing, people jump to defend the LGS.

This is a silly complaint. Do you complain when a store has a clearance bin, marking things down that they cannot sell? That is just the opposite of this. In one case the store has demand for a particular product that exceeds their supply, in the other they have supply that exceeds their demand. If you don't like the increased price don't buy it and if no one buys it the store will eventually mark them down because demand for the product will dry up.

I get the whole supply and demand thing but I do agree that it's shady for a retailer to mark up the MSRP of a product because they think they can get away with it. Like the OP said, you don't see Best Buy or Gamestop marking up consoles - they made an agreement with the distributor and bought them with the expectation that they were going to be sold at a certain price. Price gouging after something starts selling well is a bad move.

BUT, OP did support this practice by buying it in the end. Hopefully people like this find that few people are willing to do the same and learn the hard way that blatantly fleecing your customers doesn't pay in the long run.

I'm not saying it is a good move, though the MSRP itself says suggested, so I don't think it is shady to sell something above (or below) that price. As for best buy etc, larger stores have less to gain on a percentage basis (and more to lose from bad PR) by marking things up. Though if it were a more accepted practice, it would be far less common to have situations where stores were sold out of stock for months because supply cannot keep up with demand. In the console market what happens is instead individuals buy the consoles and then re-sell them at a mark-up on sites like Amazon or Ebay.

Take the Nintendo Switch, MSRP at $299, I cannot find it for sale online for less than $350

Or the Nintendo Classic MSRP of $60 cannot find it for less than $200.

This would be far less common if stores raised the price initially to a point where it would not be profitable for individuals to buy extras and resell. Then as stock caught up with demand prices would fall.