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2017/05/30 14:55:35
Subject: Re:Warhammer 40k 8th Edition Summary - 29 May 2017: Tons of faction/rules leaks! (all info in OP)
Spoletta wrote: "Why my dreadnaught requires only 4.155 lascannon hits to go down while a ghost ark requires 10,9?!?!?" Do you see? It's easy to make a counter argument.
Right tools for the right job, comparing the autocannon shots needed to kill it's perfect target (ghost ark) against the shots required to kill a non optimal target (dreadnaught) do not make for a fair comparison, the same i did with lascannons.
Technically, it's 6.17 to kill a Dread and 15.42 to kill a GA but yes, it's a valid point. My issue, though, is that it's a total characteristic change of the vehicle - it's gone from immune to low strength and very weak to high damage to the total reverse - it now hates small arms and loves being shot by high damage. It's a change for no reason other than to arbitrarily change the feeling of the vehicle. Plus, there's a lot more weapons that are S6-8 with damage of 3 or less than there are lascannon equivalents - the lascannons can shoot other units, but the Ghost Ark can't pop back to life if it gets shot to death.
...isn't that a strength? My heavy weapons are mostly useless so I need to point my anti-elite guns at your vehicles?
2017/05/30 14:55:46
Subject: Warhammer 40k 8th Edition Summary - 29 May 2017: Tons of faction/rules leaks! (all info in OP)
Shadow Walker wrote: From 4chan:
>drop pods deploy 9 away from enemy, troops must disembark 9 away from enemy
>can transport 10 infantry models, but they can't have the jump pack, terminator, centurion or primaris keyword
>scarab occult have 4++
>taurox and taurox prime m14" w10 r6 3+
>chimera m12" w10 r7 3+
>veterans have same stats as normal infantry except bs 3+; can have 3 special weapons, a heavy weapon a heavy flamer; 6ppm without equip
>valkyrie m20"(min)-45"(max); w14 s7 t7 3+
>can go in stationary flight mode and reduce its movement to up to 20", but loses the other rules of fliers (-1 to be hit, can only be charged by flying stuff)
>grav-chute deployment still in: if performed when moving more than 20" 1/6 models die
>hellstroke missiles: heavy1 s8 ap-2 d6 >ogryns w3 s5 t5; ws3+; +1 attack on charge; weapon is 12" ass3 s5 ap- d1
>vanquisher is heavy 1 72" s8 ap-3 d6, roll 2 dice for damage and discard the lower
>basilisk 240" heavyD6 s9 ap-3 d3, roll 2 dice for determining the number of shots and discard the lower; can shoot on units it can't see
>confirmed characters: yarrick, pask, creed, kell, harker, straken, nork
>mawloc can deploy up to 1" away from enemies but 6" away from other mawlocs
>enemies within 2" get damage according to a d6 >1: nothing; 2-3: 1 mortal; 4-5: d3 mortals; 6: 3 mortals
>can't charge in the same turn; can reenter reserves like before
Awesome news!
Can you ask for info on chapter tactics, Legion traits, tau septs and so on. Nothing has been leaked and I would think those would be important. It makes me ask if they are even in the indexes.
Done Some there suspect it will be in codexes not index books.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/05/30 14:57:38
2017/05/30 14:56:39
Subject: Warhammer 40k 8th Edition Summary - 29 May 2017: Tons of faction/rules leaks! (all info in OP)
DarknessEternal wrote: So every faction leaked so far has massive ways to ignore Morale.
Didn't the article say something about having to worry about Morale? "It will apply to almost every unit"
Well, we know that's a lie now. Wonder what else was a lie.
Morale is back to being exclusively for Eldar.
Every single army has to worry about morale... even Space marines now don't "auto save". You have to figure out if you want to use that as a valid strategy, aka, disrupt the morale protectors. Ya know, strategy!
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/05/30 14:57:13
"Fear is freedom! Subjugation is liberation! Contradiction is truth! These are the truths of this world! Surrender to these truths, you pigs in human clothing!" - Satsuki Kiryuin, Kill la Kill
2017/05/30 14:56:52
Subject: Warhammer 40k 8th Edition Summary - 29 May 2017: Tons of faction/rules leaks! (all info in OP)
Posting Imotek so EyjioMade can explain why he's terrible for not being able to arm-wrestle a Warlord titan in single combat
>imotek
>ws2+ w6 s5 t5 2+ 4++
>living metal (but regains d3 wounds)
>flayed units of the same dynasty within 12 reroll 1's
>at the start of the unit choose an infantry of the same dynasty and it gets +1 to advance, charge and hit rolls
>once per game choose an enemy unit within 48": on a 2+ it suffers a number of mortals wounds equal to the roll, each unit within 6 of it also get d3 mortal wounds on a 6
>228 pts
>staff 18" s6 ap-3 d2
>in melee it's S-user ap-3 d2
>the gauntlet is a flamerthrower with s4 and ap-
2017/05/30 14:57:29
Subject: Warhammer 40k 8th Edition Summary - 29 May 2017: Tons of faction/rules leaks! (all info in OP)
Likely a way to say they don,t normally get a save, but with cover modifers they can gain a save by it being improved to a 6+ or better.
Deathguard Poxwalkers have the same value too
I guess I need to invest in some d7s then.
Seriously though, I like the change. Putting it in their statline like this negeates the need for rules specifically to cover units with no save in cover. It's solid game design and good streamlining.
Of course it reminds me of the first time I shot at an Avatar with a melta and was told I needed a 7 to wound it...but tat,s neither here nor there.
2017/05/30 14:58:25
Subject: Warhammer 40k 8th Edition Summary - 29 May 2017: Tons of faction/rules leaks! (all info in OP)
Source tells me GW is done with official leaks due to these massive leaks already out there. Reliable source says sentiment is "ahhh f@#$ it".......jk jk
2017/05/30 14:59:13
Subject: Warhammer 40k 8th Edition Summary - 29 May 2017: Tons of faction/rules leaks! (all info in OP)
casvalremdeikun wrote: From 4chan:
>ghost arc: w14 s6 t6 4+
>living metal, quantum shielding
>you can still make reanimation protocols for the embarked unit
>also at the end of the movement phase you can choose an unit within 3 for additional reanimation protocol rolls (doesn't stack with the resurrection globe)
>you can choose one unit to hold in reverses "on the tomb world"; it can come out within 3 of the monolith but more than 1 from the enemy at the start of the movement phase
>boyz cost the same with slugga, choppa and bomms; hit on 3+, shoot on 5+; if 20 or more gain an additional attack
>nobz 17ppm, 3 models minimum
>old one eye: 10w r7
>ws3+, gives +1 to hit on carnifices within 6
>his charge does d3 mortal wounds on a 4+ instead of 1
>each attack that hits generate another attack to resolve with the same weapon against the same target
>140pts
>kantor same characteristics of other chapter masters (w6 ws2+ s4 t4 4++)
>crimson fists within 6 get another attack and reroll to hit
>dorn's arrow: 24" ass4 s4 ap-1 d1
>sternguards same stats as marines but with ld8(-9 sergeant)
>specialist requiem: rapid fire1 s4 ap-2 d1
>up to 2 can have heavy flamers, heavy weapons, special weapons or combi-weapons
>everyone can have combi-weapons
>16ppm without weapons (which go from 11ppm to 15 ppm respectively for combiflamer and combiplasma)
>vanguards are almost the same but can get any weapon combination between melee and pistols
>yes twin pistols too
Arks are still transports? That's annoying.
I hated that necrons still used conventional transports, instead of teleport shenanigans. If you can manipulate time and space, why would you ride around on a vehicle that could be destroyed like a peasant?
Especially if said transport clearly has no space to carry models due to the wreckages, and lore wise is basically a corpse wagon.
Not one of the better designed vehicles, and necron vehicles aren't well designed to begin with. Except for the monolith. That one is special.
Lore wise warriors were the peasent classes, so it's appropiate. Plus the Ghost Ark carries spare parts for you so they don,t have to teleport all the way back to your main tomb for repairs.
2017/05/30 14:59:30
Subject: Warhammer 40k 8th Edition Summary - 29 May 2017: Tons of faction/rules leaks! (all info in OP)
DarknessEternal wrote: So every faction leaked so far has massive ways to ignore Morale.
Didn't the article say something about having to worry about Morale? "It will apply to almost every unit"
Well, we know that's a lie now. Wonder what else was a lie.
Morale is back to being exclusively for Eldar.
By and large, the ways to ignore Morale tests are tied to units specifically(Tau bonding knife ritual makes it so that any roll of a 6 means that the Morale test is auto-passed...which is kinda funky wording but whatever) or are in small auras.
2017/05/30 14:59:40
Subject: Re:Warhammer 40k 8th Edition Summary - 29 May 2017: Tons of faction/rules leaks! (all info in OP)
Daedalus81 wrote: ...isn't that a strength? My heavy weapons are mostly useless so I need to point my anti-elite guns at your vehicles?
It's not really a strength or a weakness. The anti-elite guns which would normally fire at 2+ saves will target Necron vehicles instead. Does that help overly? Well, not really, there's very few 2+ saves in a Necron list and the normal troops are all T4 with 4+ or 3+s - better to kill with mass fire than anti-elite guns anyway.
2017/05/30 15:00:31
Subject: Warhammer 40k 8th Edition Summary - 29 May 2017: Tons of faction/rules leaks! (all info in OP)
Twoshoes23 wrote: Source tells me GW is done with official leaks due to these massive leaks already out there. Reliable source says sentiment is "ahhh f@#$ it".......jk jk
That'd be silly, because we're pretty much a minority. Though I suppose facebook posts do increase the spread.
2017/05/30 15:01:34
Subject: Warhammer 40k 8th Edition Summary - 29 May 2017: Tons of faction/rules leaks! (all info in OP)
Shadow Walker wrote: From 4chan:
>drop pods deploy 9 away from enemy, troops must disembark 9 away from enemy
>can transport 10 infantry models, but they can't have the jump pack, terminator, centurion or primaris keyword
>scarab occult have 4++
>taurox and taurox prime m14" w10 r6 3+
>chimera m12" w10 r7 3+
>veterans have same stats as normal infantry except bs 3+; can have 3 special weapons, a heavy weapon a heavy flamer; 6ppm without equip
>valkyrie m20"(min)-45"(max); w14 s7 t7 3+
>can go in stationary flight mode and reduce its movement to up to 20", but loses the other rules of fliers (-1 to be hit, can only be charged by flying stuff)
>grav-chute deployment still in: if performed when moving more than 20" 1/6 models die
>hellstroke missiles: heavy1 s8 ap-2 d6 >ogryns w3 s5 t5; ws3+; +1 attack on charge; weapon is 12" ass3 s5 ap- d1
>vanquisher is heavy 1 72" s8 ap-3 d6, roll 2 dice for damage and discard the lower
>basilisk 240" heavyD6 s9 ap-3 d3, roll 2 dice for determining the number of shots and discard the lower; can shoot on units it can't see
>confirmed characters: yarrick, pask, creed, kell, harker, straken, nork
>mawloc can deploy up to 1" away from enemies but 6" away from other mawlocs
>enemies within 2" get damage according to a d6 >1: nothing; 2-3: 1 mortal; 4-5: d3 mortals; 6: 3 mortals
>can't charge in the same turn; can reenter reserves like before
You know everyone wants to know what the worlds largest nuke does!!!!
Show us the deathstrike!!!
It's a vehicle wihose sole purpose is a single shot expensive delayed fire nuke!!!! This better be one of the most powerful weapons in game like 2d6 hits d3 mortal wounds and str10 ap-4
Also poor kell not only did he take a bullet in the head for creed that guy still makes him continu fighting.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/05/30 15:09:44
2017/05/30 15:01:54
Subject: Re:Warhammer 40k 8th Edition Summary - 29 May 2017: Tons of faction/rules leaks! (all info in OP)
Daedalus81 wrote: ...isn't that a strength? My heavy weapons are mostly useless so I need to point my anti-elite guns at your vehicles?
It's not really a strength or a weakness. The anti-elite guns which would normally fire at 2+ saves will target Necron vehicles instead. Does that help overly? Well, not really, there's very few 2+ saves in a Necron list and the normal troops are all T4 with 4+ or 3+s - better to kill with mass fire than anti-elite guns anyway.
Look at it from another point of view. The enemy heavy weapons don't have good targets, and those things tend to cost a lot.
2017/05/30 15:03:18
Subject: Warhammer 40k 8th Edition Summary - 29 May 2017: Tons of faction/rules leaks! (all info in OP)
Twoshoes23 wrote: Source tells me GW is done with official leaks due to these massive leaks already out there. Reliable source says sentiment is "ahhh f@#$ it".......jk jk
That'd be silly, because we're pretty much a minority. Though I suppose facebook posts do increase the spread.
don't be silly gw aleady knew once store copies hit the stores Saturday everyone was going to read them.
2017/05/30 15:03:39
Subject: Warhammer 40k 8th Edition Summary - 29 May 2017: Tons of faction/rules leaks! (all info in OP)
zerosignal wrote: Storm Bolters are four shots at half-range now... so a Rhino with two is putting out a fair old hail of anti-infantry fire.
that's true, and it looks like you can take two of them. so 8 shots at close range isn't bad. still, with the changes to heavy weapons i was planning to use them out of rhinos
2017/05/30 15:04:00
Subject: Warhammer 40k 8th Edition Summary - 29 May 2017: Tons of faction/rules leaks! (all info in OP)
Shadow Walker wrote: From 4chan:
>drop pods deploy 9 away from enemy, troops must disembark 9 away from enemy
>can transport 10 infantry models, but they can't have the jump pack, terminator, centurion or primaris keyword
Well, feth.
They really not gonna let the primaris to use normal marine transports, forcing everyone who wants to field primaris to buy completely new motor pool... I'm not pleased about this...
xttz wrote: Posting Imotek so EyjioMade can explain why he's terrible for not being able to arm-wrestle a Warlord titan in single combat
>imotek
>ws2+ w6 s5 t5 2+ 4++
>living metal (but regains d3 wounds)
>flayed units of the same dynasty within 12 reroll 1's
>at the start of the unit choose an infantry of the same dynasty and it gets +1 to advance, charge and hit rolls
>once per game choose an enemy unit within 48": on a 2+ it suffers a number of mortals wounds equal to the roll, each unit within 6 of it also get d3 mortal wounds on a 6
>228 pts
>staff 18" s6 ap-3 d2
>in melee it's S-user ap-3 d2
>the gauntlet is a flamerthrower with s4 and ap-
Hilarious.
Actually, he looks pretty good compared to many of the characters we've seen. Bit squishy unless wrapped in a blob, but wants to be in a blob anyway to hand out buffs. Seems quite reasonable. The lightning thing doing mortal wounds seems pretty powerful too, potential to wipe an MSU marine unit, though it's a shame it's once per game when psykers get something similar every turn. All in all, looks quite good and I'll probably try him. For reference, I've thought quite a lot of the necron infantry has seemed good - it's the vehicles and Destroyers which are looking mediocre.
2017/05/30 15:04:12
Subject: Warhammer 40k 8th Edition Summary - 29 May 2017: Tons of faction/rules leaks! (all info in OP)
benlac wrote: it seems like plasma guns are going to be decent all around weapons in this ed
If you can overcharge safely by getting rerolls or a bonus to your shooting, yes. Otherwise... not really. A squad of five hellblasters in rapid fire range will only shave off 3 wounds from a rhino without overcharging, even with over charge only 6-7. Previously 5 plasma guns could rather consistently kill a normal rhino in rapid fire range. Plasma also isn't quite as good against terminators, thanks to them being multi wound models and gets hot being fat more deadly (the strength bonus during overcharge means they are more effective then though).
It can, with overcharge, be a more realistic threat to heavy vehicles, but again only with overcharge.
In short, the standard shot is good at killing MEQ or weaker. For everything else, overcharge or find a better target.
2017/05/30 15:04:39
Subject: Warhammer 40k 8th Edition Summary - 29 May 2017: Tons of faction/rules leaks! (all info in OP)
Shadow Walker wrote: From 4chan:
>drop pods deploy 9 away from enemy, troops must disembark 9 away from enemy
>can transport 10 infantry models, but they can't have the jump pack, terminator, centurion or primaris keyword
>scarab occult have 4++
>taurox and taurox prime m14" w10 r6 3+
>chimera m12" w10 r7 3+
>veterans have same stats as normal infantry except bs 3+; can have 3 special weapons, a heavy weapon a heavy flamer; 6ppm without equip
>valkyrie m20"(min)-45"(max); w14 s7 t7 3+
>can go in stationary flight mode and reduce its movement to up to 20", but loses the other rules of fliers (-1 to be hit, can only be charged by flying stuff)
>grav-chute deployment still in: if performed when moving more than 20" 1/6 models die
>hellstroke missiles: heavy1 s8 ap-2 d6 >ogryns w3 s5 t5; ws3+; +1 attack on charge; weapon is 12" ass3 s5 ap- d1
>vanquisher is heavy 1 72" s8 ap-3 d6, roll 2 dice for damage and discard the lower
>basilisk 240" heavyD6 s9 ap-3 d3, roll 2 dice for determining the number of shots and discard the lower; can shoot on units it can't see
>confirmed characters: yarrick, pask, creed, kell, harker, straken, nork
>mawloc can deploy up to 1" away from enemies but 6" away from other mawlocs
>enemies within 2" get damage according to a d6 >1: nothing; 2-3: 1 mortal; 4-5: d3 mortals; 6: 3 mortals
>can't charge in the same turn; can reenter reserves like before
Awesome news!
Can you ask for info on chapter tactics, Legion traits, tau septs and so on. Nothing has been leaked and I would think those would be important. It makes me ask if they are even in the indexes.
Done Some there suspect it will be in codexes not index books.
Plz link thread please. I can't find it on tg. Thanks
2017/05/30 15:11:32
Subject: Warhammer 40k 8th Edition Summary - 29 May 2017: Tons of faction/rules leaks! (all info in OP)
benlac wrote: it seems like plasma guns are going to be decent all around weapons in this ed
If you can overcharge safely by getting rerolls or a bonus to your shooting, yes. Otherwise... not really. A squad of five hellblasters in rapid fire range will only shave off 3 wounds from a rhino without overcharging, even with over charge only 6-7. Previously 5 plasma guns could rather consistently kill a normal rhino in rapid fire range. Plasma also isn't quite as good against terminators, thanks to them being multi wound models and gets hot being fat more deadly (the strength bonus during overcharge means they are more effective then though).
It can, with overcharge, be a more realistic threat to heavy vehicles, but again only with overcharge.
In short, the standard shot is good at killing MEQ or weaker. For everything else, overcharge or find a better target.
Does a bonus to shooting help - "it just says on a roll of a 1" bad things happen. re-roll will sort this but a bonus would not?
I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
Shadow Walker wrote: From 4chan:
>drop pods deploy 9 away from enemy, troops must disembark 9 away from enemy
>can transport 10 infantry models, but they can't have the jump pack, terminator, centurion or primaris keyword
>scarab occult have 4++
>taurox and taurox prime m14" w10 r6 3+
>chimera m12" w10 r7 3+
>veterans have same stats as normal infantry except bs 3+; can have 3 special weapons, a heavy weapon a heavy flamer; 6ppm without equip
>valkyrie m20"(min)-45"(max); w14 s7 t7 3+
>can go in stationary flight mode and reduce its movement to up to 20", but loses the other rules of fliers (-1 to be hit, can only be charged by flying stuff)
>grav-chute deployment still in: if performed when moving more than 20" 1/6 models die
>hellstroke missiles: heavy1 s8 ap-2 d6 >ogryns w3 s5 t5; ws3+; +1 attack on charge; weapon is 12" ass3 s5 ap- d1
>vanquisher is heavy 1 72" s8 ap-3 d6, roll 2 dice for damage and discard the lower
>basilisk 240" heavyD6 s9 ap-3 d3, roll 2 dice for determining the number of shots and discard the lower; can shoot on units it can't see
>confirmed characters: yarrick, pask, creed, kell, harker, straken, nork
>mawloc can deploy up to 1" away from enemies but 6" away from other mawlocs
>enemies within 2" get damage according to a d6 >1: nothing; 2-3: 1 mortal; 4-5: d3 mortals; 6: 3 mortals
>can't charge in the same turn; can reenter reserves like before
Awesome news!
Can you ask for info on chapter tactics, Legion traits, tau septs and so on. Nothing has been leaked and I would think those would be important. It makes me ask if they are even in the indexes.
Done Some there suspect it will be in codexes not index books.
Plz link thread please. I can't find it on tg. Thanks
Humm, so a lascannon twin plasma razorback is 110 points. Not bad! or twin lascannon for 115. Man, that is a tough call haha. I like how it feels like all options have some merit compared to what they did before. I also like how a lot of FW variants can be built straight from the book(like the twin-multimelta) without having to reference a separate book.
I am guessing we are missing the sheet that says what category each weapon falls under. I dont see a special weapons list and related items so we will have to see.
Holy crap, thunder hammers actually have a solid use now, fixed 3 damage! Hope it is more limited in who can take it compared to a power fist otherwise you would never take a power fist since they are the same points on non-characters. However it is nice to see a huge price drop in lightning claws. 13 for a pair compared to 30 before.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/05/30 15:18:06
People who stopped buying GW but wont stop bitching about it are the vegans of warhammer
DarknessEternal wrote: So every faction leaked so far has massive ways to ignore Morale.
Didn't the article say something about having to worry about Morale? "It will apply to almost every unit"
Well, we know that's a lie now. Wonder what else was a lie.
Morale is back to being exclusively for Eldar.
Easy there, you're confusing things a bit. "Ignoring morale" would mean never needing to test or always automatically assin all tests. Now how many units actually can do that? Not many.
Orks for example have high morale as long as they have lots of friends, but can be devestated late game when their numbers are thinned. Nids can break just by losing synapse (as they should). Marines get a reroll that can potentially make things worse for them.
Now I have seen some "autopass on a roll of X" but a 1 in 6 chance of negating morale is a bonus, not something to rely on in your list.
Some there suspect it will be in codexes not index books.
