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I've been playing since 3rd ed. Back then, Terminators came on 25mm bases, and were considerably smaller than the current models. When GW updated Terminators to be bigger, on 40mm bases, I was all "Feth that, I'm playing with the Terminators I have on the bases they came with!"

Eventually, I wound up with some Terminators from Assault on Black Reach, which are of the new scale. I decided to assemble and paint them, because I was a better painter then than when I did my original Terminators. Once I had a couple squads' worth, I decided to rebase some of my older Terminators (the THSS ones in particular). What I found was, on the new bases, the older Termies blended right in with the newer, bigger ones, and you really had to look at them hard to notice the size discrepancy.

I suspect we'll find mixing old Marines with NuMarines will be similar. Rebase the older Marines on 32mm bases, and I suspect we'll be able to mix them pretty freely with NuMarines without anyone particularly noticing the size differences. I've been rebasing them anyway, because I've found old Marines look more imposing on the bigger bases. My double-demi Lion's Blade is now entirely on 32mm bases. When the NuMarines come, they'll fit right in.

There is nothing wrong with the models themselves or GW updating the range. In fact, I'm happy we're finally getting truescale models and even the profile looks good to me.
It's the fluff that is bothering me.

Was there this much fuss when 25mm baby terminators got upsized?

Those didn't come with a lore change attached that made them super terminators.

 Roknar wrote:
Those didn't come with a lore change attached that made them super terminators.

The non-vocal majority largely doesn't give a single flying grot for the lore.
The people here on Dakka are the ONLY people I've seen that care enough about the lore to give it more than a cursory glance and a "k, whatever."

I'm with them, and we like the little short stories or whatever, but we're not even nearly invested enough to care that these marines are better marines and why that is a travesty.

22 people so far going to "boycott". Wish we could have a "where are they now" thread in a years time

 Purifier wrote:
The non-vocal majority largely doesn't give a single flying grot for the lore.
The people here on Dakka are the ONLY people I've seen that care enough about the lore to give it more than a cursory glance and a "k, whatever."

I'm with them, and we like the little short stories or whatever, but we're not even nearly invested enough to care that these marines are better marines and why that is a travesty.

I don't see a problem with people not being interested in the lore, although I always have the burning curiosity of why they aren't playing a better TT game system than 40k if the models and lore don't interest them very much.

Nu Marines will be my squads Sgts. now.

 Purifier wrote:

 Roknar wrote:
Those didn't come with a lore change attached that made them super terminators.

The non-vocal majority largely doesn't give a single flying grot for the lore.
The people here on Dakka are the ONLY people I've seen that care enough about the lore to give it more than a cursory glance and a "k, whatever."

I'm with them, and we like the little short stories or whatever, but we're not even nearly invested enough to care that these marines are better marines and why that is a travesty.

Yea but those that care have a more or less legitimate reason to be crying murder as opposed to being a model update. If they had just updated the models like they have done many times there wouldn't be so much noise.
People still would have complained but it would have received less attention.
I for one like the models for the most part. Don't like the kneepads and the bolt rifles but they still are a plus on the whole.
The profile is fine too for the time being. We don't know anything about numarine army composition yet.
But that lore man.....ugh.

 General Annoyance wrote:

 Purifier wrote:
The non-vocal majority largely doesn't give a single flying grot for the lore.
The people here on Dakka are the ONLY people I've seen that care enough about the lore to give it more than a cursory glance and a "k, whatever."

I'm with them, and we like the little short stories or whatever, but we're not even nearly invested enough to care that these marines are better marines and why that is a travesty.

I don't see a problem with people not being interested in the lore, although I always have the burning curiosity of why they aren't playing a better TT game system than 40k if the models and lore don't interest them very much.

Who said the models don't? Everyone I talk to are very interested in the models, care a great deal about the rules and have a passing curiosity for the lore at best.

 Purifier wrote:


The non-vocal majority largely doesn't give a single flying grot for the lore.

I beg to differ.

 Purifier wrote:
Who said the models don't? Everyone I talk to are very interested in the models, care a great deal about the rules and have a passing curiosity for the lore at best.

That's a strange combination of sentiment; if people are very interested in the models, then wouldn't they want to know a little more about them to add to their appeal?

And as for the rules, are they aware of other gaming systems out there that might offer a much more rounded experience?

The only thing that worries me about primaris marines is I play grey Knights. And I hope either they make some kind of kit that makes the nu marines into grey knight or come out with a whole new grey Knights line.

Spartan117xyz wrote:
The only thing that worries me about primaris marines is I play grey Knights. And I hope either they make some kind of kit that makes the nu marines into grey knight or come out with a whole new grey Knights line.

Don't stress, they will be handing out NuMarines like Oprah Winfrey,
"YOU GET PRIMARIS MARINES, YOU GET PRIMARIS MARINES, YOU ALL GET PRIMARIS MARINES"

 General Annoyance wrote:

That's a strange combination of sentiment;

No, it really isn't. You're assuming that everyone has your interest in something.

 General Annoyance wrote:
if people are very interested in the models, then wouldn't they want to know a little more about them to add to their appeal?

I love the Tesla, and I have a soft spot for the MINI Cooper. I have no interest in learning their history. They're shiny toys. Have you never liked something solely for the aesthetic?

 General Annoyance wrote:


And as for the rules, are they aware of other gaming systems out there that might offer a much more rounded experience?

Yes, but none that are played widely enough to reliably get games, and when you're slushing hundreds if not thousands of dollars into something, you'd like to be able to use it, no?

 Rippy wrote:
Don't stress, they will be handing out NuMarines like Oprah Winfrey,
"YOU GET PRIMARIS MARINES, YOU GET PRIMARIS MARINES, YOU ALL GET PRIMARIS MARINES"

That wouldn't make for everything that goes into a Grey Knight though; they have to be accomplished Psykers too...

RULE #1 - BE POLITE.

RULE #2 - STAY ON TOPIC.

RULE #3 - NO SPAM.

 JohnU wrote:
Was there this much fuss when 25mm baby terminators got upsized?

There was indeed. Some people were angry because GW initially said that all models needed to be on the new base size. Then GW back-tracked and said you could use the original size which then led to all sorts of arguments about whether using one size or the other was gaming for an advantage.

Fortunately my LGS is a lot more relaxed about such things which means my 2nd ed metal termies are still rocking the battlefields of the 41st millenium.

I think you should buy them, paint them up, then make a youtube video why you hate them.

The new models look a bit gangly to me, a bit like Peter Crouch! But maybe I am just used to the current shape and I certainly wouldn't advocate a boycott.

I am really happy that they have a story justification for the scale change.
Even if, as the story of the Indomitus Crusade progresses, normal space marines are eventually sidelined, I can still play with them in a 'pre-gathering storm' 40K setting without feeling like I am playing with the 'wrong' models.

Justified or not, had they re-conned marines to have always been like Primaris Marines then I would have felt that all my old marines had been invalidated as they would have felt more like a 'counts as' force rather a true representation of the Space Marines.

 Purifier wrote:
No, it really isn't. You're assuming that everyone has your interest in something.

I'm really not. As I said:

 General Annoyance wrote:
I don't see a problem with people not being interested in the lore, although I always have the burning curiosity of why they aren't playing a better TT game system than 40k if the models and lore don't interest them very much.

I love the Tesla, and I have a soft spot for the MINI Cooper. I have no interest in learning their history. They're shiny toys. Have you never liked something solely for the aesthetic?

I have - most art is a good example for me. Most of the time though I like to delve deeper into something. Perhaps this is just me being a very curious individual, but equally I would have thought that most people would at least be a bit inquisitive and care about the background behind something that they collect, paint, play with, and possibly cherish in a nice display cabinet.

Yes, but none that are played widely enough to reliably get games, and when you're slushing hundreds if not thousands of dollars into something, you'd like to be able to use it, no?

Perhaps it is different where you are, but where I am, 40k has got an inkling of presence next to Dropzone, Flames, Team Yankee, Infinity, Saga, Malifaux and Warmachine.

Nope!

I don't think I'll be mixing them into my existing Dark Angels directly - but I may start up a new Chapter fresh once I'm caught up on the rest of my painting.

 Kroem wrote:
The new models look a bit gangly to me, a bit like Peter Crouch! But maybe I am just used to the current shape and I certainly wouldn't advocate a boycott.

I am really happy that they have a story justification for the scale change.
Even if, as the story of the Indomitus Crusade progresses, normal space marines are eventually sidelined, I can still play with them in a 'pre-gathering storm' 40K setting without feeling like I am playing with the 'wrong' models.

Justified or not, had they re-conned marines to have always been like Primaris Marines then I would have felt that all my old marines had been invalidated as they would have felt more like a 'counts as' force rather a true representation of the Space Marines.

They didn't need new marines or to retcon anything. The models and profile are now what they always should have been from the start. Even the bolt rifle profile makes more sense than the current boltgun.

Why should I boycott them?

They look like a modern day reinterpretation of the iconic Space Marine, which look pretty darn dated when you look at some of the other models GW has been putting out lately (like Sisters of Silence or Custodes). Even compared to other companies that produce a similar power armored human, the GW Space Marine looks pretty bleh.

If I only have to paint 20 Nu-Marines, if they are just as capable and cost just as many points as 40 Space Marines, and if 5 Nu-Marines cost the same as 10 model Tactical Squad, then it's a no brainer for me. I'm going to buy 20 Nu-Marines instead of 40 Space Marines. Less cost, less painting, better looking models.

It's a new edition. Codexes go out, models are left behind, fluff gets retconned, and new fluff, new models, and new codexes come into play. Get over it, or go find something else to take up your time with.

 Tamwulf wrote:

It's a new edition. Codexes go out, models are left behind, fluff gets retconned, and new fluff, new models, and new codexes come into play. Get over it, or go find something else to take up your time with.

I certainly will. Don't like the rules, don't like the lore, don't care about the models.

 General Annoyance wrote:

 Purifier wrote:
No, it really isn't. You're assuming that everyone has your interest in something.

I'm really not. As I said:

 General Annoyance wrote:
I don't see a problem with people not being interested in the lore, although I always have the burning curiosity of why they aren't playing a better TT game system than 40k if the models and lore don't interest them very much.

I love the Tesla, and I have a soft spot for the MINI Cooper. I have no interest in learning their history. They're shiny toys. Have you never liked something solely for the aesthetic?

I have - most art is a good example for me. Most of the time though I like to delve deeper into something. Perhaps this is just me being a very curious individual, but equally I would have thought that most people would at least be a bit inquisitive and care about the background behind something that they collect, paint, play with, and possibly cherish in a nice display cabinet.

Yes, but none that are played widely enough to reliably get games, and when you're slushing hundreds if not thousands of dollars into something, you'd like to be able to use it, no?

Perhaps it is different where you are, but where I am, 40k has got an inkling of presence next to Dropzone, Flames, Team Yankee, Infinity, Saga, Malifaux and Warmachine.

You really are, when you add the caveat that they can't love the model without loving the lore.

The 40k lore if you get past the superficial layer (which is really cool) of a grim dark universe in constant war, is and always has been utter gak. The models however have always been amazing compared to the competition, and only in the last 5 years or so have other companies really caught up and competed on a level ground.

I'm interested in "what place does my army have in the hierarchy?" But no more specific than that. I bought the Skitarius book because I had no books at one time, and I couldn't finish it.

Most players of 40k have never read a black library book. So yeah, it's no problem to love one part without the other.

 Roknar wrote:


They didn't need new marines or to retcon anything. The models and profile are now what they always should have been from the start. Even the bolt rifle profile makes more sense than the current boltgun.

I think that really depends on what you're reading. For me, Marines should be on par with Aspect Warriors, which is more or less currently where they stand. And Marines bully guardsmen around quite well.

But I like my grimdark heroes to be "barely enough, if even that".

I voted no even though I'm fairly sure that Primaris Marines are a way to replace the old lines and rules of marines by using a carrot instead of a stick. That being said, we all know they were going to update the line at some point, and the new models are quite worthy of being the next generation of SM line.

They didn't need new marines or to retcon anything. The models and profile are now what they always should have been from the start. Even the bolt rifle profile makes more sense than the current boltgun.

Yea they absolute could have pulled the 'What you on about mate? they always looked like this.' trick but I'm just saying I'm glad they didn't so that my current marine models still feel worthwhile characters, especially in 40 'historical battle' type settings.

I'm excited to see what they do with Primaris Marines in the story going forward. I was sceptical about Stormcast Eternals until I read their backround in WD a couple of months back and so I'm sure we will all grow to like these new characters as well.

 Traditio wrote:

I've played games where the size of my model bases were brought into question. Because, apparently, 25 mm. vs. 32 mm. is a big deal.

Here's what you do; look them straight in the eye and say "Like I give a damn what your opinion is." The basing argument is only a 'big deal' for people looking for an excuse for why they lose games (as in: "I lost the game because that guy had marines on 25mm bases and it's not faaaaaaaaair!").