NewHammer: The Dark Imperium and the End of the Blood Angels?

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**Luciferian**

So, no one has been talking about this yet, but today's Warhammer Community update is a fluffy one about the state of the Imperium:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/05/16/new-warhammer-40000-the-dark-imperium-may16gw-homepage-post-4/

Of course, they mention Row-bootay's Saviors of Mankind and how super awesome they are at saving mankind, but they also mention the part of the Imperium that has been isolated by the large warp rift going through the center of the galaxy. In particular, they single out the Blood Angels as being under threat of elimination:

Travel through the Cicatrix Maledictum is all but impossible, but sporadic contact has been made, through temporary warp-routes, to a few of the best-defended worlds on the other side – and things are not looking good.

On the far side of the galaxy-spanning warp storm, things have quite literally gone to hell.

There, the light of the Astronomicon is obscured behind a psychic maelstrom of nightmares and the entire region has been dubbed ‘Imperium Nihilus’, or the Dark Imperium.

Amongst the besieged Imperial worlds in this Dark Imperium are many Space Marine Chapter Planets, including Baal, home of the Blood Angels. Things were already looking pretty grim for the sons of Sanguinius, with a hive fleet closing in on them, and now it looks even bleaker. Cut off from the light of Terra, the Angels and their Successors stand unbowed against the might of Hive Fleet Leviathan, hoping they can withstand the storm.

Yipes, the Blood Angels sound like they are in trouble. This isn’t the first time they have triumphed against impossible odds though, can they make it out alive? We’ll have to see.

So, what's your take on this?

Is it empty melodrama?

Or, with the reveal of Primaris Marines, and the chance that OldMarines might eventually be replaced both in the fluff and on the tabletop, are the Blood Angels going to be the first victim of obsoletion?

**Vaktathi**

Almost certainly empty melodrama. The Blood Angels probably arent going anywhere.

**jade_angel**

They specifically said that BA would be getting NuMarines too.

They might be the first faction to go all-Primaris, but this is not the leadup to squatting.

**BlaxicanX**

BA will be fine. At worst we'll just get another warzone book where dozens of guard regiments get gak on and the BA are "nearly driven to extinction" but are otherwise fine.

**TheLumberJack**

I'm pretty sure the plan is to phase out the existing special chapters, and sorry martel but Blood Angels might be first. They are looking at streamlining the game, so cutting down armies makes sense. People have also been calling that all marines should be in one book for years. I think this is the start. They set it up perfectly fluff wise, as the angels are on the brink of annihilation (The wolves too). So it would be pretty easy to kill them off. Then with the creation of Primaris marines, they will have marines that don't have the flaws or traditions of their older counterparts, so slowly the older generation of marines like Death Company will die out. I think rules for the models will exist in the new edition, but never be updated and the models will never be updated. Then slowly they will stop producing them until they stop altogether. Then all new marines will be the Primaris marines and they will eventually be the only marine army

**Luciferian**

Vaktathi wrote:
Almost certainly empty melodrama. The Blood Angels probably arent going anywhere.

I think that's most likely true as well. But his is GW, so I wouldn't put it past them to start eliminating some of the non-Codex chapters if they truly want to consolidate the SM line and move everyone to Primaris marines. It's in the realm of possibility, anyway.

**Galas**

They can always call for the Necrons to help them against the Tyranids.

**SilverAlien**

Galas wrote:
They can always call for the Necrons to help them against the Tyranids.

Not sure if that's a joke, but I'm fully expecting at least a t'au and necron alliance to get put into the fluff, so this wouldn't shock me. I mean, Chaos is taking center stage as the main villain, and necrons aren't big fans themselves.

**Martel732**

TheLumberJack wrote:
I'm pretty sure the plan is to phase out the existing special chapters, and sorry martel but Blood Angels might be first. They are looking at streamlining the game, so cutting down armies makes sense. People have also been calling that all marines should be in one book for years. I think this is the start. They set it up perfectly fluff wise, as the angels are on the brink of annihilation (The wolves too). So it would be pretty easy to kill them off. Then with the creation of Primaris marines, they will have marines that don't have the flaws or traditions of their older counterparts, so slowly the older generation of marines like Death Company will die out. I think rules for the models will exist in the new edition, but never be updated and the models will never be updated. Then slowly they will stop producing them until they stop altogether. Then all new marines will be the Primaris marines and they will eventually be the only marine army

I can play other games.

**YeOldSaltPotato**

Vaktathi wrote:
Almost certainly empty melodrama. The Blood Angels probably arent going anywhere.

But with them teetering on the edge you've got a great entrance for their primarch to show back up and save the day. Give you guilli on one side and sang on the other trying to hold together a fractured galaxy. Seems like a promising story to me, unless Someone else is being primed to show up and try to deal with the dark side of the galaxy.

**Kap'n Krump**

SilverAlien wrote:
Galas wrote:
They can always call for the Necrons to help them against the Tyranids.

Not sure if that's a joke, but I'm fully expecting at least a t'au and necron alliance to get put into the fluff, so this wouldn't shock me. I mean, Chaos is taking center stage as the main villain, and necrons aren't big fans themselves.

It's kind of a joke. In the 5th ed BA codex, there was a canon story of blood angels and necrons teaming up to fight tyranids, and leaving each other in peace afterwards. That unlikely alliance has been made fun of quite a bit over the years, especially as it was written by matt ward. Just google blood angel necron brofist.

**Luciferian**

SilverAlien wrote:

Not sure if that's a joke, but I'm fully expecting at least a t'au and necron alliance to get put into the fluff, so this wouldn't shock me. I mean, Chaos is taking center stage as the main villain, and necrons aren't big fans themselves.

I do believe it was a Wardian reference (and thus a joke), but what if you're saying is correct? Wouldn't that be a simple way for them to bring every faction into an AoS style Grand Alliance and basically make the new factions merely the Imperium, Chaos, Order Xenos and Destruction Xenos?

**dosiere**

I imagine it's just setting them up for sanguinius to come back, or reincarnated or whatever. Besides, it's time to start killing off all the old space marine chapters anyway. There are better ones now, or so I've heard. No use wasting all the resources on the old ones.

**Grimgold**

Did anyone else notice the part where they said that the ad mech has been cooking the nu marines since shortly after the heresy? Think of all of the terrible stuff the IoM has been dealing with, and the ad mech has just been sitting on several legions worth of nu-marines:

"Quick unleash the Primaris marines, the orks are seiging Terra"
"Nope, can't release them until Guilliman says so"
"Dude he is dead, he has been dead for like 2,000 years"
"Look Bob I don't make the rules"

**Luciferian**

dosiere wrote:
I imagine it's just setting them up for sanguinius to come back, or reincarnated or whatever. Besides, it's time to start killing off all the old space marine chapters anyway. There are better ones now, or so I've heard. No use wasting all the resources on the old ones.

That's a pretty good possibility as well. Laying the groundwork for more Primarchs to come back. Although, as a DA player, I would be kind of disappointed if the Lion isn't next in line seeing that he's actually alive and Sanguinius is dead.

**Sentinel1**

I don't think the Blood Angels would be completely wiped out even if Baal was destroyed. They would still remain in the fluff even if characters and support was dropped. Whether this is a rationalisation by GW to phase out the old with streamlined new or just the build up for a campaign book I don't know.

It would be interesting if GW followed a two empires rule of two imperium's fighting under different circumstances for the same goals. If its anything like what happened to the Roman Empire when it became the Western Empire and Eastern Empire, one will prospers and the other will utterly fall...

Also I wonder how GW will treat these new super marines with balancing a rolling story. Will the other races sit by or will they have a go at upping the stakes? Will we see super corrupted chaos marines, some middle tier super tau battle suits, Necron new but totally not anything like the discontinued Pariahs etc?

- Only time will tell -

**YeOldSaltPotato**

Grimgold wrote:
Did anyone else notice the part where they said that the ad mech has been cooking the nu marines since shortly after the heresy? Think of all of the terrible stuff the IoM has been dealing with, and the ad mech has just been sitting on several legions worth of nu-marines:

"Quick unleash the Primaris marines, the orks are seiging Terra"
"Nope, can't release them until Guilliman says so"
"Dude he is dead, he has been dead for like 2,000 years"
"Look Bob I don't make the rules"

I figured it was the other way around myself, the project sat in development hell of Cawl's personal projects till Guilliman kicked him in the ass and said he needed marines now and that this would involve a veritable torrent of new space marines to explain GW's typical release schedule.

**Roknar**

YeOldSaltPotato wrote:
Vaktathi wrote:
Almost certainly empty melodrama. The Blood Angels probably arent going anywhere.

But with them teetering on the edge you've got a great entrance for their primarch to show back up and save the day. Give you guilli on one side and sang on the other trying to hold together a fractured galaxy. Seems like a promising story to me, unless Someone else is being primed to show up and try to deal with the dark side of the galaxy.

God please no. That sounds so perfectly GW it's making me scared. Though I suppose this would be the perfect time for the sanguinor or whatever it's called to appear.
Just as long as it doesn't turn out to be sanguinius himself.

**YeOldSaltPotato**

Roknar wrote:
God please no. That sounds so perfectly GW it's making me scared. Though I suppose this would be the perfect time for the sanguinor or whatever it's called to appear.
Just as long as it doesn't turn out to be sanguinius himself.

Yeah, him being very much dead does put a damper on things, but who knows maybe they'll find a way to do something more interesting than literally the first thing that popped into my head.

**BrianDavion**

Grimgold wrote:
Did anyone else notice the part where they said that the ad mech has been cooking the nu marines since shortly after the heresy? Think of all of the terrible stuff the IoM has been dealing with, and the ad mech has just been sitting on several legions worth of nu-marines:

"Quick unleash the Primaris marines, the orks are seiging Terra"
"Nope, can't release them until Guilliman says so"
"Dude he is dead, he has been dead for like 2,000 years"
"Look Bob I don't make the rules"

I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks that this basicly shows how messed up the IoM was. where you had quite possiably the salvation of the galaxy on hand, but the only one whom could authorize it... was only alive on a technicality (bonus points if indeed they coul;dn't deploy them BECAUSE Gulliman was TECHNICLY alive)

**gummyofallbears**

Martel732 wrote:
TheLumberJack wrote:
I'm pretty sure the plan is to phase out the existing special chapters, and sorry martel but Blood Angels might be first. They are looking at streamlining the game, so cutting down armies makes sense. People have also been calling that all marines should be in one book for years. I think this is the start. They set it up perfectly fluff wise, as the angels are on the brink of annihilation (The wolves too). So it would be pretty easy to kill them off. Then with the creation of Primaris marines, they will have marines that don't have the flaws or traditions of their older counterparts, so slowly the older generation of marines like Death Company will die out. I think rules for the models will exist in the new edition, but never be updated and the models will never be updated. Then slowly they will stop producing them until they stop altogether. Then all new marines will be the Primaris marines and they will eventually be the only marine army

I can play other games.

Have ya tried sigmar? The elves and lizards there are a lot less annoying

**SilverAlien**

Luciferian wrote:
SilverAlien wrote:

Not sure if that's a joke, but I'm fully expecting at least a t'au and necron alliance to get put into the fluff, so this wouldn't shock me. I mean, Chaos is taking center stage as the main villain, and necrons aren't big fans themselves.

I do believe it was a Wardian reference (and thus a joke), but what if you're saying is correct? Wouldn't that be a simple way for them to bring every faction into an AoS style Grand Alliance and basically make the new factions merely the Imperium, Chaos, Order Xenos and Destruction Xenos?

People keep suggesting this, but I just don't see how tyranids could work with it. Then again neither did ally rules yet that still happened.

So unless orks and tyranids somehow become friends, I just don't see it. Also, I'm reasonably certain eldar would be their own thing, considering fluff's current movement.

That's basically the issue, the game has three grand alliances (eldar, imperial, chaos), a few races that can be justified as at least kinda working together (necrons, tau, and sorta orks, at least freebooters). And then tyranids.

**Popsghostly**

YeOldSaltPotato wrote:
Vaktathi wrote:
Almost certainly empty melodrama. The Blood Angels probably arent going anywhere.

But with them teetering on the edge you've got a great entrance for their primarch to show back up and save the day. Give you guilli on one side and sang on the other trying to hold together a fractured galaxy. Seems like a promising story to me, unless Someone else is being primed to show up and try to deal with the dark side of the galaxy.

Yeah this is leading up to Sanguinus coming back and maybe the Blood Angels will become something like the Vampire Angels or something like that and have the Vampire Transport armed with the Vampire Cannon and the special squads called the Vampire Warrior Killers with their Vampire Shields and Vampire Destroyer Fists.

**Galas**

Kap'n Krump wrote:
SilverAlien wrote:
Galas wrote:
They can always call for the Necrons to help them against the Tyranids.

Not sure if that's a joke, but I'm fully expecting at least a t'au and necron alliance to get put into the fluff, so this wouldn't shock me. I mean, Chaos is taking center stage as the main villain, and necrons aren't big fans themselves.

It's kind of a joke. In the 5th ed BA codex, there was a canon story of blood angels and necrons teaming up to fight tyranids, and leaving each other in peace afterwards. That unlikely alliance has been made fun of quite a bit over the years, especially as it was written by matt ward. Just google blood angel necron brofist.

Luciferian wrote:
SilverAlien wrote:

Not sure if that's a joke, but I'm fully expecting at least a t'au and necron alliance to get put into the fluff, so this wouldn't shock me. I mean, Chaos is taking center stage as the main villain, and necrons aren't big fans themselves.

I do believe it was a Wardian reference (and thus a joke), but what if you're saying is correct? Wouldn't that be a simple way for them to bring every faction into an AoS style Grand Alliance and basically make the new factions merely the Imperium, Chaos, Order Xenos and Destruction Xenos?

They have already confirmed that Chaos and Imperium books are gonna be like the Grand Alliances of AoS, but the Xenos book is gonna be more granular for fluff reasons, so to me at least they appear to have done that right.

**Lance845**

It's funny. Sounds like Shield of Baal is being rewritten the same way the 13th black crusade keeps getting rewritten. So maybe the necrons won't be friends this time. May be the adeptus soriatus won't play a part. Maybe Baal itself will be lost like Cadia and the BA will have to become a moving chapter.

**Strg Alt**

The Blood Angels SM chapter is one of 40K´s cornerstones. Get rid of them and you irrevocably trash the setting. This sentiment can also be applied to the Dark Angels, Space Wolves and Ultramarines. Though any other SM chapter is fair game for a good ol´ squatting.

**mrhappyface**

Luciferian wrote:
are the Blood Angels going to be the first victim of obsoletion?

Only in my dreams...

**jeff white**

The blood drinking thing will probably disappear if the actual angels do not.

**Rysgame**

Considering that BA are a MAJOR lore faction, I assume they have near Ultramarine level plot armor.

**Galas**

Strg Alt wrote:
The Blood Angels SM chapter is one of 40K´s cornerstones. Get rid of them and you irrevocably trash the setting. This sentiment can also be applied to the Dark Angels, Space Wolves and Ultramarines. Though any other SM chapter is fair game for a good ol´ squatting.

To me the popularity of Space Marines Chapters goes something like this:

1-Ultramarines
2-Space Wolves/Dark Angels/Blood Angels
3-Black Templars
4-Imperial Fist
5-White Scars/Crimson Fist
6-Salamanders/Ravenguard
7-Iron Hands.

To me is funny that the most popular Second Fond chapters are both Imperial Fist sucessors, and at least, to me, the Black Templars are actually more popular both in models, fluff, etc... than the Imperial Fist (Afterall, they received a proper codex, but Imperial Fist don't

)