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 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

Darkagl1 wrote:
This thread is silly. Here's something to consider. Rubrics get to shoot the inceptors first because inceptors can't deepstrike, because if we're going to be silly enough to do this single unit comparison half your single unit army must be placed on the board. Seriously though different units have different strengths just because two have an equal power level doesn't mean that they should have an equal chance of killing each other. That logic should be easy to set as terrible. Lascannon pres and autocannon pres have the same power level since they're the same tank but I'm pretty sure one is heavily favored in that fight.

You realize that Inceptors have a 10" move and will be able to maneuver so that they get first shot right? After 2 rounds of shooting the Rubrics have lost 2.5 wounds if the Inceptors charge they lose another .5 plus .7 for attacks puts them at 3.7 high enough to call it 4 leaving just the Aspiring Sorcerer which will do 1.4 wounds in combat finishing off 1 and putting 1 wound on another. Inceptors Fall Back and fire 12 rounds into the Sorc killing him.

Actually, with only 18" range vs 24", 10" movement might not be enough to do that. The Inceptor's threat range (move+shoot) with that is 28". If they're more than 28" away, they can't cover enough ground in one turn to shoot them before the end of that turn.

The TSons' threat range is... 29". 24" of weapon range plus 5" of movement. Because the TSons' threat range is larger, they have a window where they can get themselves into a position to get the first shot. Where as any move the Inceptors take that put them within striking range of the TSons will also put them in range for a counter-attack. If the Inceptors find themselves having to stop anywhere in between 29" and 18", an 11" window (note that's 1" further than their move), the TSons will get the first shot.

Text removed.

Reds8n

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:
You realize that Inceptors have a 10" move and will be able to maneuver so that they get first shot right? After 2 rounds of shooting the Rubrics *blah blah blah*

So, you're planning to leave your pricey Rubrics and Aspiring Sorcerer exposed to every army with greater mobility or an alpha strike option?

What outcome were you hoping for exactly? You want to be outplayed and outmanoeuvred by the SM player, but still win?

Why do you think Fast Attack exists?

Yoyoyo wrote:
So, you're planning to leave your pricey Rubrics and Aspiring Sorcerer exposed to every army with greater mobility or an alpha strike option?

What outcome were you hoping for exactly? You want to be outplayed and outmaneuvered by the SM player, but still win?

Why do you think Fast Attack exists?

Now were adding units?

How do you out maneuver a unit that isn't on the board? And can be placed anywhere on the board? You can't you will always get outmaneuvered.

What are Rubrics better at then Inceptors? That is my question to you, and against some thing that is fairly common. Not well if your getting shot at with Rend -4 S6 weapons that do multiple damage, unless there are GOBS of that.

 ross-128 wrote:

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

Darkagl1 wrote:
This thread is silly. Here's something to consider. Rubrics get to shoot the inceptors first because inceptors can't deepstrike, because if we're going to be silly enough to do this single unit comparison half your single unit army must be placed on the board. Seriously though different units have different strengths just because two have an equal power level doesn't mean that they should have an equal chance of killing each other. That logic should be easy to set as terrible. Lascannon pres and autocannon pres have the same power level since they're the same tank but I'm pretty sure one is heavily favored in that fight.

You realize that Inceptors have a 10" move and will be able to maneuver so that they get first shot right? After 2 rounds of shooting the Rubrics have lost 2.5 wounds if the Inceptors charge they lose another .5 plus .7 for attacks puts them at 3.7 high enough to call it 4 leaving just the Aspiring Sorcerer which will do 1.4 wounds in combat finishing off 1 and putting 1 wound on another. Inceptors Fall Back and fire 12 rounds into the Sorc killing him.

Actually, with only 18" range vs 24", 10" movement might not be enough to do that. The Inceptor's threat range (move+shoot) with that is 28". If they're more than 28" away, they can't cover enough ground in one turn to shoot them before the end of that turn.

The TSons' threat range is... 29". 24" of weapon range plus 5" of movement. Because the TSons' threat range is larger, they have a window where they can get themselves into a position to get the first shot. Where as any move the Inceptors take that put them within striking range of the TSons will also put them in range for a counter-attack. If the Inceptors find themselves having to stop anywhere in between 29" and 18", an 11" window (note that's 1" further than their move), the TSons will get the first shot.

Hmm math seems to check out.

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:
What are Rubrics better at then Inceptors?

Filling your mandatory troops slot, meching up in a Rhino, leveraging mission special rules, bashing multiwound targets with force weapons, denying offensive psychic powers, taking Invul saves, etc.

Alpha strike isn't new either. The goal is minimize vulnerability, then crush the relatively expensive alpha striker. Of course you'll fail hard if you leave a pseudo-elite like Rubrics badly exposed, That's just bad play in any edition.

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:
Yeah no it doesn't, LOS is a thing, think then speak.

Maybe hide your Rubrics from LOS too, then?

Or don't, because you're 10 pages deep into whining and seem to enjoy looking stupid in front of a diverse international audience.

Your call!

Yoyoyo wrote:
Filling your mandatory troops slot

with a massively expensive that isn't good at anything?

Yoyoyo wrote:
meching up in a Rhino

Yeah 200 points per unit awesome.

Yoyoyo wrote:
leveraging mission special rules

Because the slow unit will be able to do that better????

Yoyoyo wrote:
bashing multiwound targets with force weapons

.66 wounds per turn. a 2 wound unit would take 3 turns to kill. Super effective.

Yoyoyo wrote:
denying offensive psychic powers

Point taken

Yoyoyo wrote:
taking Invul saves

So against -3 rend weapons. Which im sure will be all over the battle field.

Yoyoyo wrote:
Alpha strike isn't new either. The goal is minimize vulnerability, then crush the relatively expensive alpha striker. Of course you'll fail hard if you leave a pseudo-elite like Rubrics badly exposed, That's just bad play in any edition.

How are you going to minimize vulerability if your using Rubrics as Troops? They are going to be the most prevalent unit on the board for your army, there the ones that are supposed to mitigate the risk.

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

Darkagl1 wrote:

 ross-128 wrote:

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

Darkagl1 wrote:
This thread is silly. Here's something to consider. Rubrics get to shoot the inceptors first because inceptors can't deepstrike, because if we're going to be silly enough to do this single unit comparison half your single unit army must be placed on the board. Seriously though different units have different strengths just because two have an equal power level doesn't mean that they should have an equal chance of killing each other. That logic should be easy to set as terrible. Lascannon pres and autocannon pres have the same power level since they're the same tank but I'm pretty sure one is heavily favored in that fight.

You realize that Inceptors have a 10" move and will be able to maneuver so that they get first shot right? After 2 rounds of shooting the Rubrics have lost 2.5 wounds if the Inceptors charge they lose another .5 plus .7 for attacks puts them at 3.7 high enough to call it 4 leaving just the Aspiring Sorcerer which will do 1.4 wounds in combat finishing off 1 and putting 1 wound on another. Inceptors Fall Back and fire 12 rounds into the Sorc killing him.

Actually, with only 18" range vs 24", 10" movement might not be enough to do that. The Inceptor's threat range (move+shoot) with that is 28". If they're more than 28" away, they can't cover enough ground in one turn to shoot them before the end of that turn.

The TSons' threat range is... 29". 24" of weapon range plus 5" of movement. Because the TSons' threat range is larger, they have a window where they can get themselves into a position to get the first shot. Where as any move the Inceptors take that put them within striking range of the TSons will also put them in range for a counter-attack. If the Inceptors find themselves having to stop anywhere in between 29" and 18", an 11" window (note that's 1" further than their move), the TSons will get the first shot.

Hmm math seems to check out.

Yeah no it doesn't, LOS is a thing, think then speak.

So the extra threat range doesn't matter because reasons gotcha.

Darkagl1 wrote:

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

Yeah no it doesn't, LOS is a thing, think then speak.

So the extra threat range doesn't matter because reasons gotcha.

Yes because LOS isn't a thing that anyone has ever used to prevent being shot at while moving forward.

Do me favor Type blood angles battle report into you tube and spend 9 hours watching the results and count the number of times the BA player uses terrain to prevent their unit from being shot at. I'm sure it will be in the hundreds. Your right though I'M being unreasonable.

It would matter if they had the same or near the same MS and both had FLY

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:
How are you going to minimize vulerability if your using Rubrics as Troops?

Wow what a good question.

I suggest you set them up with no protection and dismounted in the open, where deep strikers can easily shoot them at maximum range to full effect.

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

Darkagl1 wrote:

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

Yeah no it doesn't, LOS is a thing, think then speak.

So the extra threat range doesn't matter because reasons gotcha.

Yes because LOS isn't a thing that anyone has ever used to prevent being shot at while moving forward.

Do me favor Type blood angles battle report into you tube and spend 9 hours watching the results and count the number of times the BA player uses terrain to prevent their unit from being shot at. I'm sure it will be in the hundreds. Your right though I'M being unreasonable.

It would matter if they had the same or near the same MS and both had FLY

I think the point he's trying to make is that apparently outside conditions don't matter unless it's convenient for you.

It definitely seems to me that you need to spend some time playing Imperial Guard so you can learn to rely less on raw stats and single models. Maybe by the end of it you might even learn to play.

Poor OP.

Where is the "beating a dead horse" emoticon?

 ross-128 wrote:

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

Darkagl1 wrote:

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

Yeah no it doesn't, LOS is a thing, think then speak.

So the extra threat range doesn't matter because reasons gotcha.

Yes because LOS isn't a thing that anyone has ever used to prevent being shot at while moving forward.

Do me favor Type blood angles battle report into you tube and spend 9 hours watching the results and count the number of times the BA player uses terrain to prevent their unit from being shot at. I'm sure it will be in the hundreds. Your right though I'M being unreasonable.

It would matter if they had the same or near the same MS and both had FLY

I think the point he's trying to make is that apparently outside conditions don't matter unless it's convenient for you.

It definitely seems to me that you need to spend some time playing Imperial Guard so you can learn to rely less on raw stats and single models. Maybe by the end of it you might even learn to play.

No I'm trying to keep it simple, they are the ones that try to say things like no LOS allowed no cover allowed, Inceptors cant DS, and have to mindlessly jump forward without ever taking advantage of anything because the controlling player is incompetent. If anything THEY are the ones trying to manipulate things in thier favor. They keep saying i am comparing the two units in a vacuum when they keep trying to compare them in a vacuum.

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

Darkagl1 wrote:

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

Yeah no it doesn't, LOS is a thing, think then speak.

So the extra threat range doesn't matter because reasons gotcha.

Yes because LOS isn't a thing that anyone has ever used to prevent being shot at while moving forward.

Do me favor Type blood angles battle report into you tube and spend 9 hours watching the results and count the number of times the BA player uses terrain to prevent their unit from being shot at. I'm sure it will be in the hundreds. Your right though I'M being unreasonable.

It would matter if they had the same or near the same MS and both had FLY

Oh I see you seem to be laboring under a misapprehension that only the inceptors can use terrain.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 ross-128 wrote:

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

Darkagl1 wrote:

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

Yeah no it doesn't, LOS is a thing, think then speak.

So the extra threat range doesn't matter because reasons gotcha.

Yes because LOS isn't a thing that anyone has ever used to prevent being shot at while moving forward.

Do me favor Type blood angles battle report into you tube and spend 9 hours watching the results and count the number of times the BA player uses terrain to prevent their unit from being shot at. I'm sure it will be in the hundreds. Your right though I'M being unreasonable.

It would matter if they had the same or near the same MS and both had FLY

I think the point he's trying to make is that apparently outside conditions don't matter unless it's convenient for you.

It definitely seems to me that you need to spend some time playing Imperial Guard so you can learn to rely less on raw stats and single models. Maybe by the end of it you might even learn to play.

Yep sure seems that way doesn't it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

 ross-128 wrote:

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

Darkagl1 wrote:

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

Yeah no it doesn't, LOS is a thing, think then speak.

So the extra threat range doesn't matter because reasons gotcha.

Yes because LOS isn't a thing that anyone has ever used to prevent being shot at while moving forward.

Do me favor Type blood angles battle report into you tube and spend 9 hours watching the results and count the number of times the BA player uses terrain to prevent their unit from being shot at. I'm sure it will be in the hundreds. Your right though I'M being unreasonable.

It would matter if they had the same or near the same MS and both had FLY

I think the point he's trying to make is that apparently outside conditions don't matter unless it's convenient for you.

It definitely seems to me that you need to spend some time playing Imperial Guard so you can learn to rely less on raw stats and single models. Maybe by the end of it you might even learn to play.

No I'm trying to keep it simple, they are the ones that try to say things like no LOS allowed no cover allowed, Inceptors cant DS, and have to mindlessly jump forward without ever taking advantage of anything because the controlling player is a slow. If anything THEY are the ones trying to manipulate. They keep saying i am comparing the two units in a vacuum when they keep trying to compare them in a vacuum.

Ok let's try to keep this simple. Purely taking two units and comparing them on the basis of power level (or points for that matter) and having them fight it out is a pointless exercise. It's even more pointless when you're trying to compare them in a vacuum (which you're trying to do) and you cheat the game rules (allowing deepstrike in 1v1 when in order to deepstrike you must have half your units on board rounded up). When that was pointed out to you, which means rubrics shoot first because of larger range you responded with no, because inceptors have greater movement. When it was pointed out that rubrics still have larger threat range, you responded with no because LOS. When it was pointed out that both sides can use LOS, you responded with some other special qualification. You're the one who is trying to insist on some sort of silly comparison in the first place, and every time anyone points out how silly it is or how you math bad you respond with more special conditions to attempt to justify what is a pointless comparison to make in the first place. At this point the only conclusion I can draw is you have some sort of victim complex associated with playing chaos and a world in which rubrics aren't completely outclassed by inceptors is somehow scary to you.

Alrighty so this is how many wounds it takes to kill a thousand sons marine versus a primaris marine

Damage one weapon
no rend - 6 wounds to 6 wounds
Rend 1 - 3 wounds to 4 wounds
Rend 2 - 2 wounds to 3 wounds
Rend 3 - 2 wounds to 2.4 wounds
Rend 4+ - 2 wounds to 2 wounds
Damage one weapon is same at no rend, and better for primaris until -4 when it evens out to the same again.

Multi damage weapon
No rend - 3 wounds to 4.5 wounds for d3, 3.51 for d6
Rend 1 - 2 wounds to 3 wounds for d3 2.34, for d6
Rend 2 - 2 wounds to 2.25 wounds for 1.755, for d6
Rend 3 - 2 wounds to 1.8 wounds for 1.404, for d6
Rend 4+ - 2 wounds to 1.5 wounds for d3, 1.17 for d6
So against multi wound No rend to rend -2 Primaris are more survivable. For rend -3 and above d3 primaris are less survivable that thousand sons. For d6 wounds primaris are worse off at rend -2

So we can clearly see when thousand sons are more durable than primaris

Now for comparing the likelihood of wounding a T4 to T5 here is how likely a single hit from a weapon is likely to wound.
Str 3 - .33 to .33
Str 4 - .5 wounds to 1/3
Str 5 - .66 wounds to .5
Str 6 - .66 wounds to .66
Str 7 - .66 to .66
Str 8 - .83 to .66
Str 9 - .83 to .66
Str 10 - .83 to .83

Now lets look at comparing a hit from a Str 5 weapon to a Str 4 against thousand sons and inceptors

Toughness 3 - .66 to .66
Toughness 4 - .5 to .66
Toughness 5 - .33 to .5
Toughness 6 - .33 to .33
Toughness 7 - .33 to .33
Toughness 8 - .16 to .33
Toughness 9 - .16 to .33
Toughness 10 - .16 to .16

Taking this with the above we can multiply out how a combination of weapon stats would work to kill something.

A single heavy bolter hit .4256 wounds and .25 wounds
A single Inferno boltgun hit will do .5 wounds, and .11 wounds

So in this situation we are comparing basically two unit types where it is super heavily weighted for the inceptors but terrible for the thousand sons.

No wonder they seem poorly balanced against each other.

Backing up a bit, is the complaint about tacts really that they don,t specialize enough to be super awesome at anything? The most generalist of all generalist troop choices.

Are people forgetting what tacts are actually supposed to be? They do a little of everything at a reasonaly competent level and that's it. They'll never wow you, but the can always have the ability to contribute something pretty much no matter the situation.

And with Power being the way it is as long as they can still combat squad you basically get two units for the cost of one full sized one rather than paying more for two seperate units.

But, you know, complete trash.

Back to the main topic, the problem with this entire topic is that it's basically approaching the entire system wrong:

1. Power is basically the cost of a unit plus half of it's biggest upgrades divided by 20. It has nothing to do with how strong or weak the unit is, just the cost. Said cost also assumes you,re buying upgrades that you may not run and may not even contribute to the combat strength of the unit (banners for example).
2. Two units of identical costs in points where never expected to be exactly the same in durability, ranged damage, resilience, speed or melee. It's apples to oranges inside of the same codex and a complete apples to pine trees comparison between different armies. You only get close when you take two units from the same book who share similiar jobs and compare them (HB Devs vs Inceptors would be an example) and weigh pros and cons appropiately for what you want them to do.
3. The topic fails to address new information as it comes out properly (Death to the False Emperor generating extra attacks when you roll a 6 to hit for example), nor does it properly admit that it's comparing unlike items based solely on how much they cost in a less than perfect match play setup. You know, the game mode that's supposed to be actually balanced?

That said, for a more accurate comparison 5 Rubrics cost 6 power, which is 120 points, or 24 ppm when armed with Inferno Bolters (which are rolled into their power, much like how Inceptors have their weapons rolled into their Power).

An Inceptor costs 39 ppm and another 14ppm for both of their guns for a total of 43ppm.

So one Inceptor is nearly twice the cost of a single Rubric.

Maybe that's the balance feels so off....

At this point just play a better army then.

Just had a thought...Tacticals could be 13ppm without any wargear. Cheaper base, but cost some points to equip (with free options, like how Primaris have free bolt pistols).

ERJAK wrote:
At this point just play a better army then.

Why play a better army? How do we know Rubrics are over priced? How do we know Inceptors are underpriced?

On one hand to claim that since all the information isn't available, little can be discerned from what is known just simply is not true. Much can be gleaned from the released information on a straight up comparison of inceptors and rubric marines. On the other hand, it is also very true that not all the information is known, so without context it is premature to base any final analysis on what has been leaked so far. Luckily all should be revealed in the very near future.

What is more telling perhaps is IF there is a large discrepancy in the relative strength of certain units, how quickly or well will the new GW address that imbalance? Everyone is allowed to make their share of mistakes, and ol' GW made plenty. The problem in the past was that they neither rarely cared nor bothered with a suitable solution. How will they address the unavoidable issues that do arise?

In the meantime, I'd say give them the benefit of the doubt. If they screw up, THEN bust out the pitchforks and torches!

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

ERJAK wrote:
At this point just play a better army then.

Why play a better army? How do we know Rubrics are over priced? How do we know Inceptors are underpriced?

Well we know Inceptors in points work out to around near double that of a basic Rubric. Assuming that means the additional 40 points in the initial 160 points a Rubric Squad should cost at base (8*20) is likely split between the cost of the Sorceror and half the cost of all the upgrades the unit can potentially take, even if the unit isn't using them or can't take them (the gun upgrade for example).

Basically to do a proper comparison on how these two units could Celebrity Death Match it up we'd need to work out an equivlant amount of points for both units from match play list rather than comparing a unit that's paying for upgrades it can't even use and a unit with no upgrades.

The issue isn't so much that Inceptors will beat Rubrics in a shoot out. In fact, assuming Rubrics start in rapid fire range, they win. (With few survivors, but hey.)

The issue is Inceptors are VASTLY superior at taking out pretty much anything else. MEQs, TEQs, GEQs, Dreadnoughts, Russes...

I need to correct a math error from earlier: Inceotors are 54 points with guns. That means they are more than double the cost of a Rubric with an Inferno Bolter.

Big difference looking at it like points where we get 6 Rubrics vs 3 Inceptors versus power were we,re looking at 6 Rubrics+Sorc+1/2 cost full wargear loadout
Vs 3 Inceptors.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
I mean when your one dude cost as much as two of my dudes, it,s a bit more reasonable for them to be basically twice as good.

 amanita wrote:
On one hand to claim that since all the information isn't available, little can be discerned from what is known just simply is not true. Much can be gleaned from the released information on a straight up comparison of inceptors and rubric marines. On the other hand, it is also very true that not all the information is known, so without context it is premature to base any final analysis on what has been leaked so far. Luckily all should be revealed in the very near future.

What is more telling perhaps is IF there is a large discrepancy in the relative strength of certain units, how quickly or well will the new GW address that imbalance? Everyone is allowed to make their share of mistakes, and ol' GW made plenty. The problem in the past was that they neither rarely cared nor bothered with a suitable solution. How will they address the unavoidable issues that do arise?

In the meantime, I'd say give them the benefit of the doubt. If they screw up, THEN bust out the pitchforks and torches!

Could not agree more I just want this information ahead of time so when we can do a proper comparasion it will happen quickly. But you have to admit there is a striking gap between these units that needs to be filled and give that the lack of information is slight at this point its not looking like the gap will be closed in any noticible way.

 ClockworkZion wrote:
I mean when your one dude cost as much as two of my dudes, it,s a bit more reasonable for them to be basically twice as good.

Except that ONE SQUAD of Inceptors is twice as good as ONE SQUAD of Rubrics. Not model per model.

 Thousand-Son-Sorcerer wrote:

 amanita wrote:
On one hand to claim that since all the information isn't available, little can be discerned from what is known just simply is not true. Much can be gleaned from the released information on a straight up comparison of inceptors and rubric marines. On the other hand, it is also very true that not all the information is known, so without context it is premature to base any final analysis on what has been leaked so far. Luckily all should be revealed in the very near future.

What is more telling perhaps is IF there is a large discrepancy in the relative strength of certain units, how quickly or well will the new GW address that imbalance? Everyone is allowed to make their share of mistakes, and ol' GW made plenty. The problem in the past was that they neither rarely cared nor bothered with a suitable solution. How will they address the unavoidable issues that do arise?

In the meantime, I'd say give them the benefit of the doubt. If they screw up, THEN bust out the pitchforks and torches!

Could not agree more I just want this information ahead of time so when we can do a proper comparasion it will happen quickly. But you have to admit there is a striking gap between these units that needs to be filled and give that the lack of information is slight at this point its not looking like the gap will be closed in any noticible way.

The gap exists because units pay more upfront for potential upgrades and less for additinonal kodels. When comparing a MSU squad that has upgrades with a unit that can't take options there will be a disparity.

If you want to compare use points, or wait for Inceptors to get a real release and their datasheet to chane to reflect new options.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 JNAProductions wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:
I mean when your one dude cost as much as two of my dudes, it,s a bit more reasonable for them to be basically twice as good.

Except that ONE SQUAD of Inceptors is twice as good as ONE SQUAD of Rubrics. Not model per model.

Go back and read the offical response from GW on how power is calculated and then look at the options available to each unit. Consider also that the Rubrics have to pay easilly 20 points extra for a having a psyker as well.

Power is NOT a means to measure combat potential, it's a rough ranking of COST based on the unit plus half the total points of all the upgrades it COULD take. Rubrics have more options, thus pay more base than Inceptors.

Using power to compare a unit that is paying more for options it can't use at base size (Soulreaper Cannon), and aren't getting benifts from (banner) and it basically throws any sort of equality of the two units out the window.

Tell me, what exactly do you THINK the banner will do? Because it'd have to outright double the power of Rubrics to make them on par.

And if that's really how power level works... It's crap. Plain and simple.

 ClockworkZion wrote:
I need to correct a math error from earlier: Inceotors are 54 points with guns. That means they are more than double the cost of a Rubric with an Inferno Bolter.

Big difference looking at it like points where we get 6 Rubrics vs 3 Inceptors versus power were we,re looking at 6 Rubrics+Sorc+1/2 cost full wargear loadout
Vs 3 Inceptors.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
I mean when your one dude cost as much as two of my dudes, it,s a bit more reasonable for them to be basically twice as good.

Yeah thats fine now find the upgrade that puts the Rubrics even close to on par with Inceptors. Rhinos cant be included since they arent an upgrade. Your options are flamers, icon, and DttFE. Flamers are NOT good in any way. Right now flamers cost 4 ppm which is 8 to 10 points DttFE is going to be marginial as far as i can tell which means the icon is going cost 30 points at a least and double thier ranged capabilities and slightly increase thier durability.

 JNAProductions wrote:
Tell me, what exactly do you THINK the banner will do? Because it'd have to outright double the power of Rubrics to make them on par.

And if that's really how power level works... It's crap. Plain and simple.

I don,t know and that wasn't the point. The point was that the 8 power assumes you have it and makes you pay for it. Just like it makes you pay for the Soulreaper you can't use at start.

There are costs bundled into that power that make the scales unbalanced in terms of options. A unit with no options is going to have a lower power because it has not additional costs to factor in.