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 gwarsh41 wrote:

 Excommunicatus wrote:
I would just make it so that CP can only be 'spent' by the Faction that generated them, so my Daemons wouldn't be able to use any of the 10CP my two R&H Battalions generate as an example.

People like me will still take R&H/AM Battalions because fluff über alles (with an umlaut, Not Online!!) but it utterly kills the soup problem in competitive play whereby a handful of Guardsmen make Custodes fight better, like they're trying to impress the Guard or something.

We are already there with Daemons FAQ forcing them to only use strats on their own faction. I could see this as a beta rule with the next chapter approved.

Actually there are deamon stratagems.that specifcally get used on ither units like the 2 for summoning deamons and the one to hurt enemies that perals of the warp


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Captyn_Bob wrote:

 ulfhednir86 wrote:
For an first turn alpha strike you need to move up then grav chut at risk but with orgyns at most you need to Roll is 4d6 and cp re roll a 1

Have people tried this out yet ? Always wanted a valkyrie...

Many times and its very good.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Not Online!!! wrote:

Yep. If they both go to 5ppm, I'm dragging back out my RnH army. Time to be relevant... if only our covenants were decent.

I got quite the mileage out of Khorne, s4 compensates quite well for ws 5+, not to mention that aswell as the one banner, ws is the other thing we can buff (Rogue Psyker covens can reliably cast Unnatural vigour) . Not to mention that disciples and especially marauders are good to great in melee too.

Other then khorne, tzeentch is the gunline option but noone is charging a r&h gunline anyways since, well mostly because you can fairly easily out shoot us.

Nurgle is to specific and Slaanesh might get charges off easier but in melee sucks soooooo. Yeah not really much in terms of usefull covenants.

Slannesh is good for gunline as well. You can use it to stay away from enemies or quickly take unoccupied objectives then. Gap it

Wave of bodies

This is just a speculation but theoretically you can field a ludicrous amont of body to submerge the opponent and control the board. I think that with an objective battle no one has sufficient firepower to dislodge you.
you can field two battalions and the final unit cont, in 2000 points it's:
4 renegade commanders.
8x 50 mutant rabble
1x 30 mutant rabble
6 x enforcers

There are 430 bodies (and 430 flshlights shots ), I don't think that someone can table you, except maybe for some ad hoc tau list.

I would like to try this experiment but my vraks heretics are 180 soldiers and 120 zombies, I need more miniatures!

 brugner8 wrote:
Wave of bodies

This is just a speculation but theoretically you can field a ludicrous amont of body to submerge the opponent and control the board. I think that with an objective battle no one has sufficient firepower to dislodge you.
you can field two battalions and the final unit cont, in 2000 points it's:
4 renegade commanders.
8x 50 mutant rabble
1x 30 mutant rabble
6 x enforcers

There are 430 bodies (and 430 flshlights shots ), I don't think that someone can table you, except maybe for some ad hoc tau list.

I would like to try this experiment but my vraks heretics are 180 soldiers and 120 zombies, I need more miniatures!

2 problems: A enforcers are 1 per slot and are therfore limited thanks to the rule of three to three, ergo you will not have enough of them. Same with the commanders, you would need a coven or a malefic for the last HQ slot. (Coven is better since unnatural vigour actually makes mutant good in melee)

Secondly, Since you will not have enough enforcers and mutants have no other morale boost possibility (lack of vox and Chaossigil) this means you will have an average of a 5,5 in ld. Now t3 and sv6+ is not durable and the morale problems you will get from that will disintegrate any mutant blob there is through normal lasgun fire.

Then there is the whole problem of us lacking some aura boni charachters, which are very much needed for such a wave tactic.(mainly Abbadon the (H)armless)
not to mention that the board becomes a serious issue for us in such a deployment and then there is the lack of anti knight meassures.

But yes, R&H mass assult get's more enticing, if cultists and guardsmen get nerfed, making us actually a niche. I also suspect that our cultists won't get nerfed, since we neither get good covens /traits and have random LD on them too, so potentially a mass cultists R&H list now works, heck even militia will benefit indirectly and with a vox they still are 15pts per 20 man blob cheaper then their IG counterpart.

Not Online!!! wrote:

 brugner8 wrote:
Wave of bodies

This is just a speculation but theoretically you can field a ludicrous amont of body to submerge the opponent and control the board. I think that with an objective battle no one has sufficient firepower to dislodge you.
you can field two battalions and the final unit cont, in 2000 points it's:
4 renegade commanders.
8x 50 mutant rabble
1x 30 mutant rabble
6 x enforcers

There are 430 bodies (and 430 flshlights shots ), I don't think that someone can table you, except maybe for some ad hoc tau list.

I would like to try this experiment but my vraks heretics are 180 soldiers and 120 zombies, I need more miniatures!

2 problems: A enforcers are 1 per slot and are therfore limited thanks to the rule of three to three, ergo you will not have enough of them. Same with the commanders, you would need a coven or a malefic for the last HQ slot. (Coven is better since unnatural vigour actually makes mutant good in melee)

Secondly, Since you will not have enough enforcers and mutants have no other morale boost possibility (lack of vox and Chaossigil) this means you will have an average of a 5,5 in ld. Now t3 and sv6+ is not durable and the morale problems you will get from that will disintegrate any mutant blob there is through normal lasgun fire.

Then there is the whole problem of us lacking some aura boni charachters, which are very much needed for such a wave tactic.(mainly Abbadon the (H)armless)
not to mention that the board becomes a serious issue for us in such a deployment and then there is the lack of anti knight meassures.

But yes, R&H mass assult get's more enticing, if cultists and guardsmen get nerfed, making us actually a niche. I also suspect that our cultists won't get nerfed, since we neither get good covens /traits and have random LD on them too, so potentially a mass cultists R&H list now works, heck even militia will benefit indirectly and with a vox they still are 15pts per 20 man blob cheaper then their IG counterpart.

I know, it was just an abstract.

To be more realistic you can field a cheap brigade ( 3x commander, x4 50 mutant rubble, x3 mitilia squad, x3 enforcer x3 spawns, x 3 mortar squads ) for 1130 points, witch I dopn't think it's worth their 12 CP..
I think that the battalion it's more viable , with 740 points ( 2x commander, 3x50 mutant rabble, 3x enforcer) which it will be more useful than the minimum battalion of Iron Warriors, to make the cultist immune to morale (1xlord 1x exalted champ 3x 40 cultist ) which will be raised to 5 points per cultist, so 744 points and the the compulsory warlord trait,
The Abbadon one cost 840 with the new cost.

I know, it was just an abstract.

To be more realistic you can field a cheap brigade ( 3x commander, x4 50 mutant rubble, x3 mitilia squad, x3 enforcer x3 spawns, x 3 mortar squads ) for 1130 points, witch I dopn't think it's worth their 12 CP..
I think that the battalion it's more viable , with 740 points ( 2x commander, 3x50 mutant rabble, 3x enforcer) which it will be more useful than the minimum battalion of Iron Warriors, to make the cultist immune to morale (1xlord 1x exalted champ 3x 40 cultist ) which will be raised to 5 points per cultist, so 744 points and the the compulsory warlord trait,
The Abbadon one cost 840 with the new cost.

Actually you can get a better Brigade imo if you go with

3 commanders (75pts)

Elites
3 Command squads (4 disciples each) with commandvox (3 x34 = 102) (maybee add in some mortars or AT hwt's

Troops:
6 x 20 militia with vox (6 x 85 =510 pts) (mortars or stubbers if pts free)

Assult:
3 x 1 Chaos spawn (33 x 3 = 99)

Heavy support

3 x 6 mortar teams (48 x 3 = 144 )

Total:
930 Pts.

Considering you get 120 militia members with an average LD of 9 aswell as 12 disciples which also can work as AT aswell as 18 mortars it get's you a solid body.
Even if you just allow for just 1000 pts, you can easily fit in more Heavy weapons as you see fit, making the list actually fairly enticing to run. for the 70 pts you can equip all your militia squads with 2 mortars, and have left 10 pts still which you can further invest. Technically you could also equip everything on this list with heavy stubbers, which ofcourse saves points, for heavier equipment.

As for your suggested battalion, honestly split away the enforcers in a seperate detachment since you run huge mutant blobs, i suggest you either get a coven for unnatural vigour or a command squad with a flag in order to boost their melee capability.

Well seems like sentinels, spawn, chimeras and other goodies are going to get cheaper.

In case of the chimera base 10 pts and 5 on the multilaser

Question now, isch the basic chimera at 78pts worth it?

Howdy all,
I'm looking at adding some chaos (nurgle) marine allies to my (nurgle) renegades army (so I can have some units that aren't a pack of sniveling diseased cowards).
I'm torn between just ordinary chaos marines, but nurgle themed (I first dreamt this army up in 7th, and honestly haven't had the experience to say that I know anything substantial about the new Death Guard stuff) or gunning it and diving into the new Death Guard lineup.

My renegades list (as yet to see action ) is roughly as follows, though I'm feeling pretty flexible
Basilisk with Heavy Flamer
Rogue Psyker Coven
3x Mortars
2x Autocannons
Heavy stubber (probably gonna affix this to an infantry squad)
about 35 infantry (still weighing up what to run these boyos as)
a champion type dude with a plasma pistol and chainsword. (could easy do a command squad)

Thanks for your help!
For a bit of background with the nurgle marines, I've bought the vanilla chaos marine box and the new death guard troops. I've got some terminators and warp talons too - I'm a little put off the newer death guard models, so other than my plague marine kit, everything is from the regular range.
I was thinking of trying to just use them as a platform to spam plasma/melta, and have a bit of a hammer to the anvil of renegade infantry masses. I'm not super fussed about being megadeathstarwaac, but if anyone knows of any tasty little killy units to keep my games interesting, I'd be all ears!
Thanks very much guys!

https://imgur.com/a/l5CZZbL

So for all that did not see the new CA pts.
Cultists went up, some nice stuff went down. (gl for 3 pts, heavy stubber for 2!!!, Chimeras are now way cheaper, sentinels with ml cost 35/40 a piece now, hydras went down,plasma went down, Leman russ variants went down, heck demolishers and exterminator autocannons are now 20/17ppm so actually they are now an alternative to the basic leman russ!!)

@posermcbogus

First off: welcome back

Secondly: Do you want a structureized army or more along the line of a, well trenchline with enforcer backup?

Ogryn Berserker Darts would be something that you should consider (Valkirye with berserkers and champ inside)

Good old militia now is the possible cheapest option and got some nice dakka options, especially since Heavy stubbers now only cost 2 pts. Add in voxes and Chaos sigils if you field 20 man militia mobs, and cover them with some command squads with command voxes and you get a fairly durable mainline.

Ofcourse there is the 50 man + 1 enforcer combo, probably our toughest mainline unit. Does however not get much for special and heavy weaponry.

3x mortars are pitifull, if you want a proper anvil to castle you need enough fire support, so stock up on em. (the more the merier)

Consider offensive units, or sacrifice units, basically not every militia squad needs more pts invested then a vox and just thrown at the enemy in order to stop an advance.

A hammer based upon CSM is fairly usefull, not to mention that they do things good which R&H struggle, hint durability can also be increased by giving them the AL trait, Zombie marines / marine ghosts that are harder to hit, why not. (bonus pts for plague marines with -1 to hit)

The coven would be able to support a 50 man blob for melee with unnatural vigour, side note it is the best psy denial unit in the game, except it's pricetag.

I'd reccomend you fill 2 battalions, as cheap as possible with your R&H and than add in your CSM hammer and fill the rest up to your liking.

-------------------
Oh and i nearly forgot: A new old follower of the Lost and the damned is always welcome.

Edit: Side note, cultists are now 5ppm even for us, and we got the shiete ones compared to CSM cultists, so maybee refrain from using them......

Not Online!!! wrote:
Do you want a structureized army or more along the line of a, well trenchline with enforcer backup?

TRENCHLINE!TRENCHLINE!TRENCHLINE!TRENCHLINE!

Not Online!!! wrote:
Ogryn Berserker Darts would be something that you should consider (Valkirye with berserkers and champ inside)

Might consider this in the future, plaguing up the fantasy ogres is something I might try to do in the future. What are people's thoughts on deep-striking in a bunch of termies to do a similar (albeit more expensive) job? Was thinking of giving them combi-plasma just to have a versatile little assassination unit.
For loadouts on the raptors, what is the common go-to? I feel like the answer is plasma, because it's 8th ed. and the answer is always plasma.

Not Online!!! wrote:
Good old militia now is the possible cheapest option and got some nice dakka options, especially since Heavy stubbers now only cost 2 pts. Add in voxes and Chaos sigils if you field 20 man militia mobs, and cover them with some command squads with command voxes and you get a fairly durable mainline.
Ofcourse there is the 50 man + 1 enforcer combo, probably our toughest mainline unit. Does however not get much for special and heavy weaponry.

Sounds like militia it is! I might experiment with the 50 man blob at some point, though I sure don't have the minis for it right now.

Not Online!!! wrote:
3x mortars are pitifull, if you want a proper anvil to castle you need enough fire support, so stock up on em. (the more the merier)

Duly noted, sir!

Not Online!!! wrote:
Consider offensive units, or sacrifice units, basically not every militia squad needs more pts invested then a vox and just thrown at the enemy in order to stop an advance.

Other than ogryns, what do ya have in mind? my militia/blob have a mix of autoguns/ autopistols + brutal assault weapons, could the latter work at least as a sacrifice unit? I was mostly planning on running them all as autoguns, and passing the mix off as just disorganization and lack of uniformity amongst their fetid ranks.
Cheers for the help!

Other than ogryns, what do ya have in mind? my militia/blob have a mix of autoguns/ autopistols + brutal assault weapons, could the latter work at least as a sacrifice unit? I was mostly planning on running them all as autoguns, and passing the mix off as just disorganization and lack of uniformity amongst their fetid ranks.
Cheers for the help!

Generally i would not mix the squads in their main weapon department, however Ulfhendir has had some decent sucess with throwing melee milita at the enemy in order to stop their advance and get some breathing room for your mainline.

Actually i am fairly certain that you can just take a 50 man blob with a enforcer to get the same result but on a broader part of the frontline, so maybee make that. Granted it is a 230ppm tarpit but atleast it is an annoying as all hell tarpit. (especially when you get the t4 result)

You can also consider summoning Daemons, They are decently cheap and our HQ don't need to move, so why not?

Marauders also can make a fairly annoying offensive unit, considering they nearly always need to be wiped since "in it for the money" makes them really tough, especially in melee against non specialized units.

(hint disorganization can also be achieved by combining autoguns aswell as lasguns in a squad)

So what are the best Imperial Guard units for us that went down in points?

Also sounds like, the main buff we got directly was Disciples costing 6 instead of 7?

And are grenade launchers now like 3 points or something?

Grenade Launchers went down to 3, Flamers went down to 6. The base cost of a Chimera dropped 20pts and the Hydra dropped a little. Sentinels dropped 10pts.

Heavy Stubbers went down to 2pts, which is pretty huge.

 Excommunicatus wrote:
Grenade Launchers went down to 3, Flamers went down to 6. The base cost of a Chimera dropped 20pts and the Hydra dropped a little. Sentinels dropped 10pts.

Heavy Stubbers went down to 2pts, which is pretty huge.

hmmmmMMMMMMM

So, I'm thinking:

6 Renegade Heavy Weapons Teams, 6 Heavy Stubbers - 30p
6 Renegade Heavy Weapons Teams, 6 Heavy Stubbers - 30p
6 Renegade Heavy Weapons Teams, 6 Heavy Stubbers - 30p

Is gonna be pretty much an auto-include for me now. Just gotta model it all.

 ph34r wrote:

 Excommunicatus wrote:
Grenade Launchers went down to 3, Flamers went down to 6. The base cost of a Chimera dropped 20pts and the Hydra dropped a little. Sentinels dropped 10pts.

Heavy Stubbers went down to 2pts, which is pretty huge.

hmmmmMMMMMMM

So, I'm thinking:

6 Renegade Heavy Weapons Teams, 6 Heavy Stubbers - 30p
6 Renegade Heavy Weapons Teams, 6 Heavy Stubbers - 30p
6 Renegade Heavy Weapons Teams, 6 Heavy Stubbers - 30p

Is gonna be pretty much an auto-include for me now. Just gotta model it all.

Valkyires also dropped, on the rocket pods and on their price Tag.

Certain leman russ variants also got cheaper through their gun

... damn that's a lot of heavy stubbers... would be a challenge to make them all lol

Captyn_Bob wrote:
... damn that's a lot of heavy stubbers... would be a challenge to make them all lol

Those are rookie numbers:

This is the true 500 pts stubber list:

Battalion:
2x commander 50 pts

3x6 Hwt with stubbers 90 pts

4x 10 militia with heavy stubber 168

3x 5 command disciples with heavy stubber 96 pts

3x 5 disciples with heavy stubber 96pts

Total 500 pts 5 cp
28 heavy stubbers

That's only 500 points??? Damn that's the real stuff right there.

 brugner8 wrote:
Wave of bodies

This is just a speculation but theoretically you can field a ludicrous amont of body to submerge the opponent and control the board. I think that with an objective battle no one has sufficient firepower to dislodge you.
you can field two battalions and the final unit cont, in 2000 points it's:
4 renegade commanders.
8x 50 mutant rabble
1x 30 mutant rabble
6 x enforcers

There are 430 bodies (and 430 flshlights shots ), I don't think that someone can table you, except maybe for some ad hoc tau list.

I would like to try this experiment but my vraks heretics are 180 soldiers and 120 zombies, I need more miniatures!

I have got 360 model ork list nearly tabled by dark eldars in 5 turns. Also on more practical issue despite fairly light terrain I pretty much crammed my DZ so would have needed to ditch movement trays to cram more models which would make moving models paaaaaaain.

 ph34r wrote:
That's only 500 points??? Damn that's the real stuff right there.

you called , i delivered.
had some minor faults in the list and fixed it.

Immo, it seems as if we are now the best army for a ww1 style gunline. I would imagine that running a covenant of tzeentch in there would make this a nice all comers list.

40 militia bodies, for soaking bullets.

18 HWT's with stubbers are basically another 36 dudes.

30 Disciples spread on msu, (6 stubbers that hit 2/3rds of the time)

two commanders.

that is in essence 108 modells, on 500 pts, with a lot of dakka.
Heck the 22 militia lmg's guarantee 22 hits per shooting phase, that is a surprising amount of dakka. not to mention that they also can fire their lasguns/autoguns/ 19th century musket, whenever they are in range.
All vehicles that are t7 you wound on 5's so stubbing down a thing or two is actually possible. If they charge you, you get a free shooting phase before that in addition.



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tneva82 wrote:

 brugner8 wrote:
Wave of bodies

This is just a speculation but theoretically you can field a ludicrous amont of body to submerge the opponent and control the board. I think that with an objective battle no one has sufficient firepower to dislodge you.
you can field two battalions and the final unit cont, in 2000 points it's:
4 renegade commanders.
8x 50 mutant rabble
1x 30 mutant rabble
6 x enforcers

There are 430 bodies (and 430 flshlights shots ), I don't think that someone can table you, except maybe for some ad hoc tau list.

I would like to try this experiment but my vraks heretics are 180 soldiers and 120 zombies, I need more miniatures!

I have got 360 model ork list nearly tabled by dark eldars in 5 turns.

wellp.
but this is (the) R&H ............. thread.

jokes aside, DE are highly questionable in their anti-horde capacity anyways.

My list plans for eighteen HWTs, currently with Mortars. That's 18D6 S4 shots for 144pts, which on average is 63 shots and 21 hits (and potentially as low as 18/6 or a high as 108/36). Eighteen HWTs with HS put out 54 S4 shots, averaging eighteen hits and cost 90pts.

So the expected offensive output per cost is pretty comparable. HS are cheaper; but won't hit as much. Of course this is somewhat of a false comparison 'cause for those 54pts you could take a ten-strong Militia Squad with a Heavy Bolter and a Flamer, or some other thing to improve your dakka/strategic situation more than three extra hits with a Mortar will.

I'm going to stick with Mortars on my HWTs and slap Heavy Stubbers on all my tanks, 'cause none of them move and they all have BS4+.

 Excommunicatus wrote:
My list plans for eighteen HWTs, currently with Mortars. That's 18D6 S4 shots for 144pts, which on average is 63 shots and 21 hits (and potentially as low as 18/6 or a high as 108/36). Eighteen HWTs with HS put out 54 S4 shots, averaging eighteen hits and cost 90pts.

So the expected offensive output per cost is pretty comparable. HS are cheaper; but won't hit as much. Of course this is somewhat of a false comparison 'cause for those 54pts you could take a ten-strong Militia Squad with a Heavy Bolter and a Flamer, or some other thing to improve your dakka/strategic situation more than three extra hits with a Mortar will.

I'm going to stick with Mortars on my HWTs and slap Heavy Stubbers on all my tanks, 'cause none of them move and they all have BS4+.

This works aswell but why take a flamer when you can take two nade launchers?

Actually another thought occured to me, for 75pts you get a Chimera with a ML, Hb, and a Heavy Stubber.
For 525 pts (7 chimeras) you could fully mechanize the list above, now add the remaining pts in AT of your choice and that would actually be possibly a good base army.

Not Online!!! wrote:
wellp.
but this is (the) R&H ............. thread.

jokes aside, DE are highly questionable in their anti-horde capacity anyways.

Yes but are the R&H troops much more resilient than the orks? The DE averaged tad over 60 models per turn. After having super ice cold dices in 1st turn(12 dark lances failed to take down 4 KMK's, only managing to take down 2, and all the rest took down like 8 boyz...). Doesn't feel that bad.

Not Online!!! wrote:

 Excommunicatus wrote:
My list plans for eighteen HWTs, currently with Mortars. That's 18D6 S4 shots for 144pts, which on average is 63 shots and 21 hits (and potentially as low as 18/6 or a high as 108/36). Eighteen HWTs with HS put out 54 S4 shots, averaging eighteen hits and cost 90pts.

So the expected offensive output per cost is pretty comparable. HS are cheaper; but won't hit as much. Of course this is somewhat of a false comparison 'cause for those 54pts you could take a ten-strong Militia Squad with a Heavy Bolter and a Flamer, or some other thing to improve your dakka/strategic situation more than three extra hits with a Mortar will.

I'm going to stick with Mortars on my HWTs and slap Heavy Stubbers on all my tanks, 'cause none of them move and they all have BS4+.

This works aswell but why take a flamer when you can take two nade launchers?

Yeah, that's a good point. My dudes have Flamers 'cause their original job was to absorb charges.

tneva82 wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:
wellp.
but this is (the) R&H ............. thread.

jokes aside, DE are highly questionable in their anti-horde capacity anyways.

Yes but are the R&H troops much more resilient than the orks? The DE averaged tad over 60 models per turn. After having super ice cold dices in 1st turn(12 dark lances failed to take down 4 KMK's, only managing to take down 2, and all the rest took down like 8 boyz...). Doesn't feel that bad.

The first part was a meme, along the lines off: "THIS IS SPARTA" (get it? Because it is hard to play R&H)

R&H are not more resilient, probably, they are guardsment with sv6+ on average, sooooooo. the only saving grace is compared to orkz that we get 1 and 3/4 militia/ mutant dude per Ork boy.

Morale is a non issue if you follow these golden rules MSU or if not Enforcer behind blob squad. (except 20 man militia blob, they require vox lines for propaganda to hold the line)



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Excommunicatus wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:

 Excommunicatus wrote:
My list plans for eighteen HWTs, currently with Mortars. That's 18D6 S4 shots for 144pts, which on average is 63 shots and 21 hits (and potentially as low as 18/6 or a high as 108/36). Eighteen HWTs with HS put out 54 S4 shots, averaging eighteen hits and cost 90pts.

So the expected offensive output per cost is pretty comparable. HS are cheaper; but won't hit as much. Of course this is somewhat of a false comparison 'cause for those 54pts you could take a ten-strong Militia Squad with a Heavy Bolter and a Flamer, or some other thing to improve your dakka/strategic situation more than three extra hits with a Mortar will.

I'm going to stick with Mortars on my HWTs and slap Heavy Stubbers on all my tanks, 'cause none of them move and they all have BS4+.

This works aswell but why take a flamer when you can take two nade launchers?

Yeah, that's a good point. My dudes have Flamers 'cause their original job was to absorb charges.

(shhh, 20 man blobs with 4 flamers and a vox now actually might be a decent offensive unit)

Has anything changed for flamers, other than I guess they went down from 9(?) to 6(?) points?

Nope.

A 3rd in pricecut is good enough to consider them for a objective grabber squad that will advance forward.

greetings heretics.

i got good news and bad news

 ulfhednir86 wrote:
greetings heretics.

i got good news and bad news

Good news! Vets are down, not as down as guard vets though ???

Bad news... Milita are still at 4 and Cultists are up to 5, our troop choices are worse now! Yay!

Well, our troops are only worse if you used cultists :')

And actually, 10 cultists with stubber before was 45. Now it is 52, only 7 points more rather than a full 10.