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drbored wrote:
@dracpanzer

40k doesn't really need any of its factions except Space Marines to turn a buck. The rest of the armies in 40k are there just to provide context for the Space Marines. They don't need Imperial Guard because there are Space Marines. They don't need Eldar or Tau or Orks or Necron because there are Space Marines. If anything, Horus Heresy proved that gamers are willing to play a game with nothing but Space Marines, setting aside every other faction in the game just to play with more Space Marines and more flavors of Space Marines (that many of those HH players are begging GW to get rules for 40k).

You are right, though, they can melt that pewter down and sell it off to anyone willing to buy it off of their hands, recouping much of any loss that they would have suffered from molding the models in the first place.

However, Sisters of Battle would bring a variety to the tabletop that we haven't seen. Factions like Dark Eldar, Genestealer Cult, Adeptus Mechanicus, and even Deathwatch have all brought something new to the table that we haven't seen before, and fans have been loving it. All of these 'small unpopular factions' are critical to building the lore and variety on the table.

So that we're not all just playing a bunch of different colored Space Marines.

Huh? What does that have to do with the rumors that SoB are getting the first Dex of 2018? Or even that GW has decided to make an effort to put more representations of women on the table top? Like most of the factions in 8ed a dex doesn't necessarily mean they are getting new models. If GW is looking to add a greater percentage of female models to their range SoB are literally the last place to do that. The actual Sisters list is, you know, full of female models. Ministorum lsts could have a few units get female options, but those units aren't SoB units anyways.

GW making the effort to produce more female models is more likely to result in female Tau, AdMech, AM, maybe even Orks than it is likely to give you plastic Sisters. Going off the word of GW store staff and the idea that Sisters would only be represented on the table top if they were plastic =/= plastic Sisters.

 dracpanzer wrote:

drbored wrote:
@dracpanzer

40k doesn't really need any of its factions except Space Marines to turn a buck. The rest of the armies in 40k are there just to provide context for the Space Marines. They don't need Imperial Guard because there are Space Marines. They don't need Eldar or Tau or Orks or Necron because there are Space Marines. If anything, Horus Heresy proved that gamers are willing to play a game with nothing but Space Marines, setting aside every other faction in the game just to play with more Space Marines and more flavors of Space Marines (that many of those HH players are begging GW to get rules for 40k).

You are right, though, they can melt that pewter down and sell it off to anyone willing to buy it off of their hands, recouping much of any loss that they would have suffered from molding the models in the first place.

However, Sisters of Battle would bring a variety to the tabletop that we haven't seen. Factions like Dark Eldar, Genestealer Cult, Adeptus Mechanicus, and even Deathwatch have all brought something new to the table that we haven't seen before, and fans have been loving it. All of these 'small unpopular factions' are critical to building the lore and variety on the table.

So that we're not all just playing a bunch of different colored Space Marines.

Huh? What does that have to do with the rumors that SoB are getting the first Dex of 2018? Or even that GW has decided to make an effort to put more representations of women on the table top? Like most of the factions in 8ed a dex doesn't necessarily mean they are getting new models. If GW is looking to add a greater percentage of female models to their range SoB are literally the last place to do that. The actual Sisters list is, you know, full of female models. Ministorum lsts could have a few units get female options, but those units aren't SoB units anyways.

GW making the effort to produce more female models is more likely to result in female Tau, AdMech, AM, maybe even Orks than it is likely to give you plastic Sisters. Going off the word of GW store staff and the idea that Sisters would only be represented on the table top if they were plastic =/= plastic Sisters.

That doesn't make any sense to me.
If GW really wanted to increase the amount of female representation in their game SoB would be the first place to start.
What would be better than having a whole faction that is 99% women?

At the moment it looks especially bad as SoB have been so ignored and marginalised for so long.
Its all too easy at the moment to say that GW don't give two gaks about more female models in their game.

If SoB had a new complete model range and a new book, GW could say 'look we have changed, we have gone full force behind female representation, we ARE listening to the players and this proves it!'

 dan2026 wrote:

That doesn't make any sense to me.
If GW really wanted to increase the amount of female representation in their game SoB would be the first place to start.
What would be better than having a whole faction that is 99% women?

At the moment it looks especially bad as SoB have been so ignored and marginalised for so long.
Its all too easy at the moment to say that GW don't give two gaks about more female models in their game.

If SoB had a new complete model range and a new book, GW could say 'look we have changed, we have gone full force behind female representation, we ARE listening to the players and this proves it!'

Sisters are a faction in the game. You can purchase the models and they are supported with a reasonably competitive index list.

Giving more female models to an all female faction doesn't help possible female players associate with 40k more than SoB has already done that since '97. A faction of Penitent Battle Nuns doesn't appeal to every woman who sees them. GW is looking to get more females buying their product, they would get better results spreading those efforts around to all of the factions who are nearly 100% male or even adding viable female characters to those factions who have a larger percentage of female models like the Eldar do. My college age daughter has been around my Sisters models her entire life and they have never once drawn any interest from her like my howlng banshee or wych elves have done.

Sure GW hasn't done terribly well drawing in female gamers in the past. Hopefully their effort will lead to more female players. The effort and the need for it doesn't mean you will be 100% seeing plastic SoB when the dex drops. From looking at the rumors of late I look forward to SoB possibly getting a codex of one form or another (might be in an Imperial Agents form) sometime next year. Didn't we already know that though when GW said every faction is getting a dex? As far as the GW post about female models I can see them listening and putting forth effort to include females when I see the Escher gang included in the Necromunda starter box.

I'm not white knighting for GW, and I am not entirely happy with how an army I have played in every edition since they were released is being handled by GW. I just don't see the leap of logic being made by some in this thread from what we are hearing from the rumor mill.

Actually, having plastic Sisters would mean GW would actually finally start stocking Sisters in their brick and mortar stores again, and new players would think GW is introducing a brand new faction, because GW is a bunch of incompetent buffoons when it comes to marketing and there's a number of players who don't really go online much for their 40k hobby who honestly don't know Sisters even exist. In the past, I was actually accused of making gak up when I bought my pdf codex of sisters of battle with me along with my miniatures, they accused me of using third party models and making up an entire weird army list on my own. Lol.

 Melissia wrote:
Actually, having plastic Sisters would mean GW would actually finally start stocking Sisters in their brick and mortar stores again, and new players would think GW is introducing a brand new faction, because GW is a bunch of incompetent buffoons when it comes to marketing.

I like it, but it would be funnier if GW did a NEW release of the good old metal Sisters models in boxes that could sit heavily on store shelves.

Like I have said before, plastic Sisters models won't make a difference to me. I just don't see the current rumors adding up to their imminent arrival.

At the same time the way GW has handled Sisters in the past makes a possible army wide overhaul release problematic.

I would be quite happy with them moving Imagifers to HQ, allowing them wargear and different banner effects, then giving Veridyan her own rules again. My 12 stormbolter girls arrived yesterday from GW (woohoo I have 45 now) so I am good.

I just don't see how a moderately sized plastic release for SoB is any more of a risk for GW than say GS Cults or bringing back Blood Bowl or Necromunda or anything not as well known from the past like that.

But then I would of thought GW would have done new Sisters models years ago considering how much everyone shouts about wanting them.

But then I feel I don't have a good handle on the way GW operates anyway.
It makes sense to me. But maybe not to them. I dunno.

Well that alone is reason to believe that they might do a plastic release sometime even if we have no idea when that might be. Every so often they do release new plastic kits for an obscure army (and make no mistake, SoB is very obscure at the current moment for obvious reasons).

I don't see any reason they wouldn't ever do a release, given their past behavior. The only real question is when, and the only answer that any of us have is, "not right now".

I'm a bit hyped.

I went in to my local GW and talked to the guy. He's been in the business a long time and has always been very frank with me.

For context, this is a guy that said "Anyone that tells you that sisters sold well at any point is lying to you. If anything, the'll get a single test kit and that'll be it." He was pretty adamant about that.

Today, I got in and his tune had changed a little. He mentioned the Sisters of Silence, the leak-culling of the new CEO, and told me that if GW was going to do Sisters, they might try to do a box set that would help test the waters while curbing risk. We had a good long conversation, and he even mentioned an old hastings rumor that pointed to January 2018 being when Sisters might happen, and how hastings has been really solid, up until the leak lockdown.

I feel a bit more emboldened. Likely he was just trying to keep my spirits up, and I appreciate that a lot, since I bothered the crap out of him about it. XD

DrBored, remember, hope is the first step.

Rumors of a big updated Sisters of Battle release have been thrown around ever since I got into Warhammer 40,000. Almost every year, actually.

 TheCustomLime wrote:
Rumors of a big updated Sisters of Battle release have been thrown around ever since I got into Warhammer 40,000. Almost every year, actually.

 TheCustomLime wrote:
Rumors of a big updated Sisters of Battle release have been thrown around ever since I got into Warhammer 40,000. Almost every year, actually.

And I keep coming back, with faith that someday they'll have a new plastic line that will empty my wallets. I will always have hope for a Sisters of Battle release, no matter how political, no matter how their design changes, no matter what their rules are, because I love the faction, the lore, and the characters.

Someday my faith shall be rewarded.

Don't worry, I'm sure it will happen some day. It's just never right around the corner until we actually see pictures.

Until I see a picture of a plastic Sister of Battle I will flat out refuse to believe any rumor. Even if it's grainy af and looks like a conversion.

 TheCustomLime wrote:
Until I see a picture of a plastic Sister of Battle I will flat out refuse to believe any rumor. Even if it's grainy af and looks like a conversion.

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Gathering-Storm-Triumvirate-of-the-Imperium

I think people keep forgetting that this is a plastic Sisters of Battle model.

We really are just waiting for the rest of the line. That's all.

drbored wrote:

 TheCustomLime wrote:
Until I see a picture of a plastic Sister of Battle I will flat out refuse to believe any rumor. Even if it's grainy af and looks like a conversion.

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Gathering-Storm-Triumvirate-of-the-Imperium

I think people keep forgetting that this is a plastic Sisters of Battle model.

We really are just waiting for the rest of the line. That's all.

Celestine is an Imperial Soup model. :p

 Arachnofiend wrote:

drbored wrote:

 TheCustomLime wrote:
Until I see a picture of a plastic Sister of Battle I will flat out refuse to believe any rumor. Even if it's grainy af and looks like a conversion.

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Gathering-Storm-Triumvirate-of-the-Imperium

I think people keep forgetting that this is a plastic Sisters of Battle model.

We really are just waiting for the rest of the line. That's all.

Celestine is an Imperial Soup model. :p

"Imperial Soup" means nothing. That's not a GW term, it's not a business strategy, it's not a release strategy. It's a meme that the 40k community invented to describe a certain kind of list that players are salty about.

Celestine and her Geminae are in plastic. Veridyan is in resin and did better than expected (so good, the model went from limited release to staying in production).

The one mistake GW made is in lumping Celestine with two other models not related to Sisters of Battle. If Celestine was on her own, people would have bought her for her rules, for her style, for the challenge of painting/building/converting, etc. GW would have gotten a better idea of how popular the range /could/ be.

We are just waiting for the rest of the army to find a spot in GW's release schedule.

drbored wrote:
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Gathering-Storm-Triumvirate-of-the-Imperium

I think people keep forgetting that this is a plastic Sisters of Battle model.

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Sisters-of-Battle-Immolator-2016

This is a way older plastic Sister of Battle model. Sitting in a tank. From 2003. So what? I'm pretty sure TheCustomLine has seen this model already, and then waited the 13 years between this plastic sister of battle model release and the next plastic sister of battle model release and therefore (rightfully) doesn't believe that plastic Saint Celestine release implies any other plastic sisters of battle are going to be released any time soon. What he meant was that he will refuse to believe any rumor unless there is a picture of the models rumored to be released. Which is very sensible.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

drbored wrote:
We are just waiting for the rest of the army to find a spot in GW's release schedule.

Watch as that spot is taken by the Magnificum Primaris Marines which are like the marines but bigger and better. Or by the twelve different Chaos Marine codex that GW seem dedicated to make to match the twelve different loyalist marines codex. Or by the Kroot mercenaries, which would definitely be better than moar marines. Or by the squats. Or by literally anything that GW can think of. I mean, Sisters of Silence got a spot before us. There really is no way GW will find a spot for Sisters at this rate.

Actually, "Imperial Soup" does have meaning in this context. Because when they released that new Celestine model, they did so in a way that, at the time, literally removed Celestine from the Sisters of Battle codex, and instead gave her to all Imperial factions.

Exalted.

 Melissia wrote:
Actually, "Imperial Soup" does have meaning in this context. Because when they released that new Celestine model, they did so in a way that, at the time, literally removed Celestine from the Sisters of Battle codex, and instead gave her to all Imperial factions.

That doesn't make any sense. Celestine is still part of the Sisters of Battle, but like many characters, she has the 'Imperium' keyword. It's like saying they took Marneus Calgar away from Ultramarine and gave them to everyone because he, too, has the Imperium keyword.

Yes, Imperium has a lot of allies. Yes, you can do a lot of shenanigans. No, Celestine having the Imperium keyword does not take her away from the Sisters of Battle Codex or prove that they are not going to update the line.

Is not only that her has the Imperium keyword (In 7th there was no keywords), but the fact that she, like Guilliman, has buffs that affect all Imperial units, not only SoB.

Marneus Calgar is a Ultramarine character, but for example Guilliman is in fact a "imperial soup" character. Personally I don't find a problem with that, it allows to reflect in the tabletop the cohesive style of fighting of the imperium.
But Melissia is right, it was obvious why they did it with Celestine in 7th. If she had only SoB rules, the potential of customers would be very small. With buffs for Imperial units, she was basically a usable character to something like 85% of the playerbase.

drbored wrote:

 Melissia wrote:
Actually, "Imperial Soup" does have meaning in this context. Because when they released that new Celestine model, they did so in a way that, at the time, literally removed Celestine from the Sisters of Battle codex, and instead gave her to all Imperial factions.

That doesn't make any sense.

You didn't pay attention to what I actually typed.

In all codices since 3rd edition, Sisters had Celestine. Then, in the last Sisters codex-- Imperial Agents of 7th edition-- Celestine was removed.

Later on, the "Triumvirate of the Imperium" came out with Celestine. When she came out, she was not a part of the Sisters codex any more, and the Sisters no longer had any named characters.

This "Triumvirate" was literally the start of the "Imperial Soup" that we saw in full form in 8th edition.

Yes, she was added back to Sisters in the Index. But the history still remains.

 Melissia wrote:

drbored wrote:

 Melissia wrote:
Actually, "Imperial Soup" does have meaning in this context. Because when they released that new Celestine model, they did so in a way that, at the time, literally removed Celestine from the Sisters of Battle codex, and instead gave her to all Imperial factions.

That doesn't make any sense.

You didn't pay attention to what I actually typed.

In all codices since 3rd edition, Sisters had Celestine. Then, in the last Sisters codex-- Imperial Agents of 7th edition-- Celestine was removed.

Later on, the "Triumvirate of the Imperium" came out with Celestine. When she came out, she was not a part of the Sisters codex any more, and the Sisters no longer had any named characters.

This "Triumvirate" was literally the start of the "Imperial Soup" that we saw in full form in 8th edition.

Yes, she was added back to Sisters in the Index. But the history still remains.

That history has a lot less meaning now that she's back in. We're moving forward, she's in the Codex, she's a plastic Sister of Battle, and we're waiting for the rest of the plastic army to come in. Where is the break in logic?

The break in the logic is that 'imperial soup' doesn't exist because it's not an official gw term, marketing or release strategy. Just because it was coined by apparently salty players, doesn't mean it's not valid or relevant to the game.

Edit: my bad, you said had imperial soup had no meaning. Which is different, although not very.

 Torga_DW wrote:
The break in the logic is that 'imperial soup' doesn't exist because it's not an official gw term, marketing or release strategy. Just because it was coined by apparently salty players, doesn't mean it's not valid or relevant to the game.

Edit: my bad, you said had imperial soup had no meaning. Which is different, although not very.

"Imperial Soup" has no meaning to GW. Imperial Soup =/= no plastic sisters. This is what I'm trying to say.

We have plastic Celestine and her Geminae. We are just waiting for the rest of the plastic sisters to release.

There are rumors and tidbits that are pointing to January 2018 or around that timeframe. Here's hoping.

Yep.

Bobby G has rules that buff non-ultramarine imperials. So i'd say imperial soup does have meaning for gw, even if they don't publically talk about it or call it that internally. Even if celestine is sitting back in the sisters list, she's still an iconic souper character available to all imperial chefs.

But yeah, imperial soup != no plastic sisters. I agree here.

drbored wrote:
Where is the break in logic?

Where you keep thinking that a codex release rumor for sisters in jan of 18 implies that they are getting plastics because GW wants more female representation in the future.

 dracpanzer wrote:

drbored wrote:
Where is the break in logic?

Where you keep thinking that a codex release rumor for sisters in jan of 18 implies that they are getting plastics because GW wants more female representation in the future.

That's a possibility. I think that there is going to be SoB plastics around Jan 2018 REGARDLESS of whether GW thinks that it's good for female representation. I think they're going to release them because they've been done for a while and they've finally found a slot to put them in.

Sorry to rain on your parade, but I wouldn't hold my breath until I saw something a little more substantial than hearsay from low-level GW employees who have no real connection to Nottingham. Is it likely that GW will release plastic Sisters some day? I'd say so. Is there any reason to believe that it will be in January 2018? Without any credible evidence, I'd say no.