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 em_en_oh_pee wrote:

Wulfey wrote:
I am more concerned with Catachan vehicles getting to rerolling their random shots. That is going to make Catachan forgeworld artillery batteries even more overpowered than they are. 80 points for a basilisk platform that does d6 shots str9, -2, d3 damage shots already gets to roll two dice and pick the highest for the d6. A future catachen one will get to reroll one of the two dice. That is 3 bites at the d6 apple.

We do anti-infantry well. Maybe we can add that sort of thing to our gunline and toss some cheap Catachans in front of our lines. Who knows. I likely won't branch out unless I do a custom Guard army akin to the ones they showed the other day. I did sell my Cadians a while ago, because I had no want to paint them, but some of those FW pieces are really rad and might get me interested.

Someone at my FLGS has like 6-9 Long Tom Toys from Ebay (they aren't even models and there is zero paint). He passes these things around to his friends to serve as proxies for the 6-9 forgeworld basilisks. It is complete cancer. They get put down out of LOS behind a piece of terrain and throw out the most point efficient str9 shooting in the game while at the same time being completely post-Hobby stand ins.

EDIT: I get why they use the toys. The forgeworld basilisk platforms aren't even made and the carriage batterys are like $100 for an 80 point model. But using toys as proxies and having absolutely insane rules always gets my goat.

Probably should not mention that I told my buddy to get a bag o zombies for his death guard

Wulfey wrote:

 em_en_oh_pee wrote:

Wulfey wrote:
I am more concerned with Catachan vehicles getting to rerolling their random shots. That is going to make Catachan forgeworld artillery batteries even more overpowered than they are. 80 points for a basilisk platform that does d6 shots str9, -2, d3 damage shots already gets to roll two dice and pick the highest for the d6. A future catachen one will get to reroll one of the two dice. That is 3 bites at the d6 apple.

We do anti-infantry well. Maybe we can add that sort of thing to our gunline and toss some cheap Catachans in front of our lines. Who knows. I likely won't branch out unless I do a custom Guard army akin to the ones they showed the other day. I did sell my Cadians a while ago, because I had no want to paint them, but some of those FW pieces are really rad and might get me interested.

Someone at my FLGS has like 6-9 Long Tom Toys from Ebay (they aren't even models and there is zero paint). He passes these things around to his friends to serve as proxies for the 6-9 forgeworld basilisks. It is complete cancer. They get put down out of LOS behind a piece of terrain and throw out the most point efficient str9 shooting in the game while at the same time being completely post-Hobby stand ins.

EDIT: I get why they use the toys. The forgeworld basilisk platforms aren't even made and the carriage batterys are like $100 for an 80 point model. But using toys as proxies and having absolutely insane rules always gets my goat.

The Imperial FW stuff never really bothered me all that much. The biggest offender (IMO) was Traitor Guard back in 7th ed. I don't know if they're still painful to fight in this edition.

I was checking out the front page for updated tactics. Are we sure Wrath of Mars lasts for whole phase? Its not 2x shots per profile, its the unit gets to shoot again, meaning they do their round of shooting, and then they do it again. The strat doesent really say just for that attack though but it doesent say they get that bonus til end of the phase?

str00dles1 wrote:
I was checking out the front page for updated tactics. Are we sure Wrath of Mars lasts for whole phase? Its not 2x shots per profile, its the unit gets to shoot again, meaning they do their round of shooting, and then they do it again. The strat doesent really say just for that attack though but it doesent say they get that bonus til end of the phase?

They fixed the wording on the Protector Protocols. It is now 2x shots.

EDIT (for citation):

pg82, AdMech Codex
"..you can double the number of shots it makes with each of its ranged weapons - i.e., the heavy phosphor blaster's Type becomes Heavy 6..."

 em_en_oh_pee wrote:

str00dles1 wrote:
I was checking out the front page for updated tactics. Are we sure Wrath of Mars lasts for whole phase? Its not 2x shots per profile, its the unit gets to shoot again, meaning they do their round of shooting, and then they do it again. The strat doesent really say just for that attack though but it doesent say they get that bonus til end of the phase?

They fixed the wording on the Protector Protocols. It is now 2x shots.

EDIT (for citation):

pg82, AdMech Codex
"..you can double the number of shots it makes with each of its ranged weapons - i.e., the heavy phosphor blaster's Type becomes Heavy 6..."

Missed that. Good catch! thanks!

Playing 1500 Pts vs Nids this week. This is what I plan on bringing. Any C&C?


++ Battalion Detachment +3CP (Imperium - Adeptus Mechanicus) [30 PL, 511pts] ++

+ Uncategorised +

Forge World: Stygies VIII

+ HQ +

Tech-Priest Enginseer [3 PL, 52pts]: Autocaduceus of Arkhan Land, Omnissian Axe, Servo-arm

Tech-Priest Enginseer [3 PL, 52pts]: Omnissian Axe, Servo-arm

+ Troops +

Skitarii Rangers [4 PL, 45pts]: 4x Skitarii Ranger
. Ranger Alpha: Galvanic rifle

Skitarii Rangers [4 PL, 45pts]: 4x Skitarii Ranger
. Ranger Alpha: Galvanic rifle

Skitarii Rangers [4 PL, 45pts]: 4x Skitarii Ranger
. Ranger Alpha: Galvanic rifle

+ Fast Attack +

Sydonian Dragoons [12 PL, 272pts]
. Sydonian Dragoon: Taser lance
. Sydonian Dragoon: Taser lance
. Sydonian Dragoon: Taser lance
. Sydonian Dragoon: Taser lance

++ Spearhead Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Adeptus Mechanicus) [49 PL, 976pts] ++

+ Uncategorised +

Forge World: Mars

+ HQ +

Belisarius Cawl [13 PL, 250pts]
. Warlord: Static Psalm-Code

+ Heavy Support +

Kastelan Robots [24 PL, 440pts]
. Kastelan Robot: Heavy Phosphor blaster
. . Heavy phosphor blasters: 2x Heavy Phosphor blaster
. Kastelan Robot: Heavy Phosphor blaster
. . Heavy phosphor blasters: 2x Heavy Phosphor blaster
. Kastelan Robot: Heavy Phosphor blaster
. . Heavy phosphor blasters: 2x Heavy Phosphor blaster
. Kastelan Robot: Heavy Phosphor blaster
. . Heavy phosphor blasters: 2x Heavy Phosphor blaster

Onager Dunecrawler [6 PL, 143pts]: Smoke Launchers
. Neutron laser & cognis heavy Stubber: Cognis heavy stubber, Neutron Laser

Onager Dunecrawler [6 PL, 143pts]: Smoke Launchers
. Neutron laser & cognis heavy Stubber: Cognis heavy stubber, Neutron Laser

++ Total: [79 PL, 1487pts] ++

A Neutron Onager with two heavy stubbers is 145, not 143.

Rangers are 8, not 9.

Hmm. Seems BattleScribe is lying to me. I'll have to look into the codex tonight and fix my list up. Thank you for the heads up!

So I added the second stubbers to the onagers, and the freed up points let me give omnispex to my rangers. There's probably a better use for 21 points, but I don't know what it is. Sitting at 1497/1500

gendoikari87 wrote:
tau in cc? Lol just go 5 dakkastelens and a fistelen. I mean yes castle but because of the melta not tau cc. Unless what's his face is on the table. Even without agrapinaa a modest 4 dakkastelens nearly kills 3 suits in overwatch so unless they're throwing a six man strong unit at you they won't survive to tie anyone down

You still seem to underestimate the importance of denying an enemy the best usage of their units.

Kastelans have a crushing weakness in that once you root them, they cannot move. Any decent Tau player knows how to exploit it. Move Commanders in, shoot whatever guns they have, and charge the Kastelans. Sure, there's overwatch, but doing 6 wounds to a T5 3+ on a natural 6 roll is tough. Anyhow, they will eventually get into CC. Once this happens, you're screwed. You cannot shoot with your Kastelans. You cannot fall back with your Kastelans. You cannot shoot the Commander tying your Kastelan up in CC. The next turn, they fall back and shoot. Another Commander charges your Kastelans.

I actually don't see more than a few Fusion Blasters on the table in a Tau matchup, and those guns are going to be going after your Icarus Crawlers, which burst Battlesuits like pinatas. Most Battlesuits are packing Burst Cannons because of the prevalence of horde armies.

I got robots numbers 5 and 6 in the mail today. I bought them in bits from ebay. Came out to $35 shipped for both (torsos, legs, arms, guns). I omitted the rear reactor and gun bits since I can recycle my knight's stubbers and other pieces to convert those.

Working on a 75 PL list for an impromptu game tomorrow, I have the option of 4 Robots, 2 Dragoons, and 2 Dunecrawlers, or 2 Robots, 4 Dragoons, and 3 Dunecrawlers. Playing vs Tau. What do you guys think?

More Robots = More Victories

And yeah that is my serious suggestion go with the 4 robo option.

Would a Spearhead detachment of an Enginseer and multiple units of Servitors (1 HB per unit) be a viable artillery screen?

I ran four melee robots today. And on turn two I was able to get them into the charge. They were on Ageis as I was being pelted by Lazcannons and 1ks. All four got into melee, and I gak you not, everyone one of them missed. Twice. They killed about 4 1ks before being blown off.

Why do the dice gods hate me?

 Tsol wrote:
I ran four melee robots today. And on turn two I was able to get them into the charge. They were on Ageis as I was being pelted by Lazcannons and 1ks. All four got into melee, and I gak you not, everyone one of them missed. Twice. They killed about 4 1ks before being blown off.

Why do the dice gods hate me?

did you administer the proper unguents and recite the canticle of rolling?

 Tsol wrote:
I ran four melee robots today. And on turn two I was able to get them into the charge. They were on Ageis as I was being pelted by Lazcannons and 1ks. All four got into melee, and I gak you not, everyone one of them missed. Twice. They killed about 4 1ks before being blown off.

Why do the dice gods hate me?

My biggest beef with fistelans is the lack of invulnerable save in CC. I'd otherwise consider giving them a go. The threat they posess is significant, both psychological and otherwise. I mean points wise they're not efficient at all, both fulgurites and infiltrators would probably be better melee options and certainly dragoons. But people are scared of robots, they're not worried about the others; Not as much anyway. I mean they SHOULD be worried about fulgurites if they have any sense but i think Fistelans are a decent distracifex if ineficient. 3 dragoons may do the job though they're big enough.

Octovol wrote:

 Tsol wrote:
I ran four melee robots today. And on turn two I was able to get them into the charge. They were on Ageis as I was being pelted by Lazcannons and 1ks. All four got into melee, and I gak you not, everyone one of them missed. Twice. They killed about 4 1ks before being blown off.

Why do the dice gods hate me?

My biggest beef with fistelans is the lack of invulnerable save in CC. I'd otherwise consider giving them a go. The threat they posess is significant, both psychological and otherwise. I mean points wise they're not efficient at all, both fulgurites and infiltrators would probably be better melee options and certainly dragoons. But people are scared of robots, they're not worried about the others; Not as much anyway. I mean they SHOULD be worried about fulgurites if they have any sense but i think Fistelans are a decent distracifex if ineficient. 3 dragoons may do the job though they're big enough.

most power weapons are -3 giving you effectively a terminator invuln save under most situations if you stay in aegis... not the best option though. *shrug*

 Rolsheen wrote:
Would a Spearhead detachment of an Enginseer and multiple units of Servitors (1 HB per unit) be a viable artillery screen?

No. The only reason you would take Servitors are as Elite filler for a Brigade or Vanguard detachment. They are overcosted for what they do.

Which is a shame, since they would have been okay if you could take 4 Heavy Bolters (48 points for 12 S5 AP-1 D1 shots). It's also just too bad that Agripinaa didn't get the FNP or some dogma that would synergize with the stratagem or Servitors and Kataphrons in general.

It's funny to me that the servo arm costs more than a heavy bolter.

Anyways, I'd like to report I've had a fair bit of luck using my Stygies brigade. I've noticed you aren't paying that much more for a brigade over two battalions as well, given it's either an additional tech priest or 3 elite slots. That's 100 points more tax, but a unit of servitors does more than your third enginseer would do its kinda a wash. Assuming you aren't running a mars battalion separately.

I'm going to again recommend dominus+plasma destroyers+their stratagem as an alternative way of buffing kastalens compared to Cawl. It's solid for anyone who doesn't want to use mars. You don't get the mars stratagem is the downside, so probably not as good for competitive, but your robots are noticeably more resistant to damage.

I think what I like about going all Stygies is I finally feel like I can play a game that doesn't devolve into who can alpha strike the hardest/first. It's far more fun for me than previously. It's not tournament level I'm sure, but it's excellent for my local group.

SilverAlien wrote:
It's funny to me that the servo arm costs more than a heavy bolter.

Anyways, I'd like to report I've had a fair bit of luck using my Stygies brigade. I've noticed you aren't paying that much more for a brigade over two battalions as well, given it's either an additional tech priest or 3 elite slots. That's 100 points more tax, but a unit of servitors does more than your third enginseer would do its kinda a wash. Assuming you aren't running a mars battalion separately.

I'm going to again recommend dominus+plasma destroyers+their stratagem as an alternative way of buffing kastalens compared to Cawl. It's solid for anyone who doesn't want to use mars. You don't get the mars stratagem is the downside, so probably not as good for competitive, but your robots are noticeably more resistant to damage.

I think what I like about going all Stygies is I finally feel like I can play a game that doesn't devolve into who can alpha strike the hardest/first. It's far more fun for me than previously. It's not tournament level I'm sure, but it's excellent for my local group.

This the elimination volley strategm? I'd consider that if i were taking destroyers anyway, but destroyers are just as expensive as 3 balistarii with twin auto cannons. And i know it doesn't help the robots but the protector doctrine for skitarii units both allows them to advance and fire on a 3+ at no penalty and hit through cover and hard to hit at 2+ for 1cp instead of the 2cp for other strats. If I had a squad of 6 balistarii that efficiency only increases. I'm just not sure on the durability and fire power the kataphron tax brings with it, just to make robots 3+ to hit. I guess kataphrons lined up in front of robots are probably big enough to provide them with cover, that seems like a good idea.

I know robots are good, but i feel better spreading my fire power over my force. especially with the options the ironstrider platform gives. I'm also on board with not pandering to the alpha strike. We have ways of mitigating that now with stygies and lucius. Hide all your crawlers behind terrain because they can still move out and fire without penalty and infiltrate/deep strike your robots or balistarii to save them from the alpha. Hell for 1cp you can still hide (hide...yeah right lol) your balistarii from the alpha, move them and fire at 2+. It makes me uncomfortable relying on a big clump of robots and onagers all bumming cawl/tpd for re-rolls. Just reminds me of death stars all over again and having everything just sat at the back firing game after game gets pretty tiresome for me.

Fml they brought back send in the next wave

 Rolsheen wrote:
Would a Spearhead detachment of an Enginseer and multiple units of Servitors (1 HB per unit) be a viable artillery screen?

Any number of units of Servitors are not a viable anything, unfortunately. Servitors suck.

 ph34r wrote:

 Rolsheen wrote:
Would a Spearhead detachment of an Enginseer and multiple units of Servitors (1 HB per unit) be a viable artillery screen?

Any number of units of Servitors are not a viable anything, unfortunately. Servitors suck.

which is a shame because they can be made good. Increase max unit size remove the two mandatory servo arms

Conscripts were not nerfed for admech purposes. They now only run in units of 20-30 and require a 4+ to receive orders. That means they are still an A+ screen. Big question now is whether scions get the nerf bat.

6 robots + screen + deepstrike for days fellas

Wulfey wrote:
Conscripts were not nerfed for admech purposes. They now only run in units of 20-30 and require a 4+ to receive orders. That means they are still an A+ screen. Big question now is whether scions get the nerf bat.

6 robots + screen + deepstrike for days fellas

yup. And the strategem is beyond op if it works like it used to


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Idk maybe it being 2cp will balance it

gendoikari87 wrote:

Wulfey wrote:
Conscripts were not nerfed for admech purposes. They now only run in units of 20-30 and require a 4+ to receive orders. That means they are still an A+ screen. Big question now is whether scions get the nerf bat.

6 robots + screen + deepstrike for days fellas

yup. And the strategem is beyond op if it works like it used to


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Idk maybe it being 2cp will balance it

Horde armies are the number 2 reason why 6 cawl/mars robots is now standard. Magnus being number 1. If I run up against an infantry spamming guard player ... that sounds like fun. Going to be a lot of dice. What worries me are those damned forge world artillery platforms and the manticore with those beast mode missiles.

Wulfey wrote:
Conscripts were not nerfed for admech purposes. They now only run in units of 20-30 and require a 4+ to receive orders. That means they are still an A+ screen. Big question now is whether scions get the nerf bat.

6 robots + screen + deepstrike for days fellas

I am legitimately curious if they got other nerfs to make them so much less obviously good.

I am guessing Scions get a point hike for sure.

Wulfey wrote:
Conscripts were not nerfed for admech purposes. They now only run in units of 20-30 and require a 4+ to receive orders. That means they are still an A+ screen. Big question now is whether scions get the nerf bat.

6 robots + screen + deepstrike for days fellas

As a screen they're mildly less effective, but not getting orders so easily was definitely the biggest issue with getting close with Vanguard for me

 em_en_oh_pee wrote:

Wulfey wrote:
Conscripts were not nerfed for admech purposes. They now only run in units of 20-30 and require a 4+ to receive orders. That means they are still an A+ screen. Big question now is whether scions get the nerf bat.

6 robots + screen + deepstrike for days fellas

I am legitimately curious if they got other nerfs to make them so much less obviously good.

I am guessing Scions get a point hike for sure.

Yeah, it is kind of killing me. I have two options as I see it. The STYGIES one certainly is fluffier, but the damage output just sucks. I think it is comparably durable due to superior armor and -1 to hit. But infiltrating at the cost of CP seems like junk compared to the plasmacide squads. If they nerf scions ... my boys are suddenly going to turn into elysians that run the Resin rules.

STYGIES battalion
25 vanguard at -1 to hit + 2 purely tax enginseers
2 dragoons with superior -1 to hit instead of mars double canticles

AM/SCIONS battalion with current rules
26 plasma shots that deepstrike (if in rapid fire)
40 conscripts with commisar morale resistance