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I´m really curious about the FAQ. Lets hope for the best and that it comes out soon!

As Admech have synergy with knights maybe letting us avoid restrictions could be a cool fluffy reward.

...probably not going to happen that way though

Suzuteo wrote:
GW is in a real pickle. There are multiple elements that need to be touched on, and it's hard to do it in an FAQ:
1) CP recyclers
2) Command benefits
3) Allies

Proposed changes that I've heard:
1) Fixed CP for all armies based on detachments
2) Fixed CP followed by per turn charging for all armies based on detachments (bright side: we can finally penalize first-mover by saying you don't charge CP on the first turn)
3) Flatter command benefits and lower requirements for all detachments
4) Only detachments that share a faction keyword with the Warlord have a CP pool
5) Each faction keyword has its own separate CP pool
6) Each detachment has its own separate CP pool

We benefit immensely from any change in this structure because we are still a very CP efficient army. Warlord has 6+/6+ and most of our stratagems cost 1 CP.

7) You can add changeing batallions to have one of each mandatory
8) Undoing rule of 3

and I would add give secutarii a forgeworld

Not sure if making Battalions harder to access is ideal. Having them yield less CP seems fairer to everyone.

They won't undo the rule of 3. It's been really good for the health of the metagame. Though I still think we should all be clamoring for them to allow for squadrons of 2x Dunecrawler, given the crabs were meant to attack in pairs.

Bring back the Suzuteo crab extravaganza!!

How many walkers was it you had crammed in with a load of dragoons for screen again?

I remember seeing that build and thinking: this.looks.glorious

Was that me? I used to run 4x Crawlers, but someone else here ran 6x Crawlers. Haha.

I think so, you had up to 5 at one point as I recall. 6 dunecrawlers though haha that’s nuts!

I'm unsure why people are expecting nerfs. AdMech are one of the worst armies in the game result wise. 0 20+people (that's RTTs even!) tournament wins in the entire summer.

Also, rule of 3 is the best thing that's ever happened in 8th ed lol

I want knights left alone as by the time I get mine painted and on the table I’m going to be quite sad if they are unplayable.

I’d love it if I could play Admech and Knights and that’s my plan so hopefully gw don’t shaft that in a big way

24 Fulgurites for my barrel of monkeys strategy. The scale is actually sort of funny. They are hunched over, but if they were standing up straight, they would almost be as tall as my truescale Space Marines. So these guys are like basketball players. Which is wholly justifiable, since GW insists that Fulgurites go onto 32mm bases.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 rvd1ofakind wrote:
I'm unsure why people are expecting nerfs. AdMech are one of the worst armies in the game result wise. 0 20+people (that's RTTs even!) tournament wins in the entire summer.

Also, rule of 3 is the best thing that's ever happened in 8th ed lol

Agreed and agreed. People are crying about the Drills being good; some exaggerate and say they are OP, but they fail to recognize that AdMech has always had very strong vehicles in general.

I wouldnt expect direct nerfs, but theres every chance they could be heavy handed when fixing some of the larger problems and adversely affect the mid to lower end of the meta sprectrum again.

I would hope their emphasis is on breaking up the hyper-efficient Guard lists at the top. And fixing the silly close combat rules for wobbly models.

Has anyone compared hoplites to fulgurites yet? Atm im looking at adding a couple of helverins, 10 hoplites or 10 fulgurites to my list. But points wise fulgurites are on the expensive side compared to hoplites and helverins will just be replacing any balistarii or dunecrawlers i have in low points lists.

Octovol wrote:
Has anyone compared hoplites to fulgurites yet? Atm im looking at adding a couple of helverins, 10 hoplites or 10 fulgurites to my list. But points wise fulgurites are on the expensive side compared to hoplites and helverins will just be replacing any balistarii or dunecrawlers i have in low points lists.

Hoplites can't generate mortal wounds (other than being hit and rolling 6s) so I haven't found them to be very good. The fulgurites also can go up to 3++ when they kill something and then still have the additional 5+ to ignore the wound.

Suzuteo wrote:

Agreed and agreed. People are crying about the Drills being good; some exaggerate and say they are OP, but they fail to recognize that AdMech has always had very strong vehicles in general.

I agree, the drills aren't even close to OP. I could see a minimal points hike, they are decently efficient. If they were WS 3+ they would be really solid. As they are right now, they are too swingy, just don't have the volume of dice to make them reliable.

If soup lists are penalized and the guard CP farm is nerfed, I think admech come up quite a bit.

However one of the things I'm realizing in 8th is all lists need a free safety of some sort. What I mean by this is a highly mobile model that can do serious damage in CC. Things like the smash captain, shield captain on dawneagle, yncarne, bike autarch, daemon prince, talos, etc. All of these units are resilient as well.

I think the biggest problem is we don't really have a unit that can do something similar. Is everyone overcoming this deficiency by using allies? Or has someone found a unit that fills this role?

Who is complaining the Drills are OP? If anything they could use a slight cut.

bogalubov wrote:

Octovol wrote:
Has anyone compared hoplites to fulgurites yet? Atm im looking at adding a couple of helverins, 10 hoplites or 10 fulgurites to my list. But points wise fulgurites are on the expensive side compared to hoplites and helverins will just be replacing any balistarii or dunecrawlers i have in low points lists.

Hoplites can't generate mortal wounds (other than being hit and rolling 6s) so I haven't found them to be very good. The fulgurites also can go up to 3++ when they kill something and then still have the additional 5+ to ignore the wound.

Yes but you’d expect that if you take even numbers of them. Points wise you get almost twice as many hoplites as fulgurites. Realistically you have a choice between 5 fulgurites (80pts) and 10 hoplites (90pts). Or 10 fulgurites (160pts) and 20 hoplites (180pts) Fulgurites are almost double the cost, but are they doubly killy and tanky?

One of the missions i’ll be up against shortly is a 25PL infantry only skirmish. These two seemed like likely candidates, but you get a whole lot more bodies in hoplites than fulgurites. They both have a 5++ to begin with, though hoplites are 4++ in combat, the fulgurite 5+++ might overcome its lack of bodies but i doubt it. Even once a fulgurite unit gets its 3++ hoplites are still 4++ in combat anyway, though fulgurites are also -1 to hit until theyre in charge range which is a big bonus if you’re considering their survivability in the open.

Hoplites also get to overwatch and are better at wounding than fulgurites. I feel like theres more depth to this comparison than one does more MW than the other.

@Octovol
I would like to point out the annoying fact that Fulgurites are on 32mm bases, which makes a huge difference in CC. Hoplites are on 25mm bases, so they aren't great for counts-as models.

@Slayer-Fan123, linds14sr20det
People on Reddit were whining about it because the Drill+Fulgurite combo actually does really well against Knights. I think Drills are fine exactly where they are in terms of points.

@linds14sr20det
I use Smash Captain and Mephiston. Dragoons are the closest thing in AdMech to what you say, but they are really big and don't fly.

I don't go to Reddit overall, but it doesn't shock me someone is whining their poor Knights can be killed.

Hey guys, just a quick question for anyone who can help (which means anyone who owns both admech and space marines haha).

Looking to do a converted unit using (hopefully) infiltrators/ruststalkers. But I’m not sure if the infiltrator model size is quite right, as I don’t yet own any and while they look pretty spindly they are on 40mm bases.

Could someone take a photo for me, of an infiltrator/ruststalker in between a standard 32mm base space marine and a 40mm base terminator?

Also would be curious how the rusty would look on a 32mm base, I think they would look ok but their stance is very wide and seems to fill the 40mm.

Thanks to anyone who can help me out

Octovol wrote:

bogalubov wrote:

Octovol wrote:
Has anyone compared hoplites to fulgurites yet? Atm im looking at adding a couple of helverins, 10 hoplites or 10 fulgurites to my list. But points wise fulgurites are on the expensive side compared to hoplites and helverins will just be replacing any balistarii or dunecrawlers i have in low points lists.

Hoplites can't generate mortal wounds (other than being hit and rolling 6s) so I haven't found them to be very good. The fulgurites also can go up to 3++ when they kill something and then still have the additional 5+ to ignore the wound.

Yes but you’d expect that if you take even numbers of them. Points wise you get almost twice as many hoplites as fulgurites. Realistically you have a choice between 5 fulgurites (80pts) and 10 hoplites (90pts). Or 10 fulgurites (160pts) and 20 hoplites (180pts) Fulgurites are almost double the cost, but are they doubly killy and tanky?

One of the missions i’ll be up against shortly is a 25PL infantry only skirmish. These two seemed like likely candidates, but you get a whole lot more bodies in hoplites than fulgurites. They both have a 5++ to begin with, though hoplites are 4++ in combat, the fulgurite 5+++ might overcome its lack of bodies but i doubt it. Even once a fulgurite unit gets its 3++ hoplites are still 4++ in combat anyway, though fulgurites are also -1 to hit until theyre in charge range which is a big bonus if you’re considering their survivability in the open.

Hoplites also get to overwatch and are better at wounding than fulgurites. I feel like theres more depth to this comparison than one does more MW than the other.

Hoplite no forgeworld no stygies strategem so either footslogging in which cae that 4+ mortal W thing doesnt work or drill tax.

As to tanky well.a hoplite take sv 50% melee or 50-33% in shooting

Fullgrite save 55% if not killed a unit and 77% if it has

U02dah4 wrote:

Octovol wrote:

bogalubov wrote:

Octovol wrote:
Has anyone compared hoplites to fulgurites yet? Atm im looking at adding a couple of helverins, 10 hoplites or 10 fulgurites to my list. But points wise fulgurites are on the expensive side compared to hoplites and helverins will just be replacing any balistarii or dunecrawlers i have in low points lists.

Hoplites can't generate mortal wounds (other than being hit and rolling 6s) so I haven't found them to be very good. The fulgurites also can go up to 3++ when they kill something and then still have the additional 5+ to ignore the wound.

Yes but you’d expect that if you take even numbers of them. Points wise you get almost twice as many hoplites as fulgurites. Realistically you have a choice between 5 fulgurites (80pts) and 10 hoplites (90pts). Or 10 fulgurites (160pts) and 20 hoplites (180pts) Fulgurites are almost double the cost, but are they doubly killy and tanky?

One of the missions i’ll be up against shortly is a 25PL infantry only skirmish. These two seemed like likely candidates, but you get a whole lot more bodies in hoplites than fulgurites. They both have a 5++ to begin with, though hoplites are 4++ in combat, the fulgurite 5+++ might overcome its lack of bodies but i doubt it. Even once a fulgurite unit gets its 3++ hoplites are still 4++ in combat anyway, though fulgurites are also -1 to hit until theyre in charge range which is a big bonus if you’re considering their survivability in the open.

Hoplites also get to overwatch and are better at wounding than fulgurites. I feel like theres more depth to this comparison than one does more MW than the other.

Hoplite no forgeworld no stygies strategem so either footslogging in which cae that 4+ mortal W thing doesnt work or drill tax.

As to tanky well.a hoplite take sv 50% melee or 50-33% in shooting

Fullgrite save 55% if not killed a unit and 77% if it has

This was the bit I was missing in my deliberation, thank you. Although I do see hoplites more as a cheap infantry melee unit thats kinda meant to foot slog, having one without the other, is going to draw attention to them. Priests it is for now!

Until I can afford several units of hoplites and/or drills not being able to infiltrate or deep strike them means the comparison over their effectiveness is irrelevant if they cant actually get to a target.

incidentally I briefly mathhammered the comparison. Against T5 and T6 Hoplites win out easily. Against anything else, even vehicles, fulgurites win out on the comparison. Even with more than half as many attacks.

Niiru wrote:
Hey guys, just a quick question for anyone who can help (which means anyone who owns both admech and space marines haha).

Looking to do a converted unit using (hopefully) infiltrators/ruststalkers. But I’m not sure if the infiltrator model size is quite right, as I don’t yet own any and while they look pretty spindly they are on 40mm bases.

Could someone take a photo for me, of an infiltrator/ruststalker in between a standard 32mm base space marine and a 40mm base terminator?

Also would be curious how the rusty would look on a 32mm base, I think they would look ok but their stance is very wide and seems to fill the 40mm.

Thanks to anyone who can help me out

their wide stance fills the 40mm base. They're about the same height as the old space marines, so shorter than the new primaris marines.

I have 30 hoplites in my paint queue right now. I like them but The issue they have is a lack of stygies it is rediculous they the dont have a forgeworld.

 axisofentropy wrote:

Niiru wrote:
Hey guys, just a quick question for anyone who can help (which means anyone who owns both admech and space marines haha).

Looking to do a converted unit using (hopefully) infiltrators/ruststalkers. But I’m not sure if the infiltrator model size is quite right, as I don’t yet own any and while they look pretty spindly they are on 40mm bases.

Could someone take a photo for me, of an infiltrator/ruststalker in between a standard 32mm base space marine and a 40mm base terminator?

Also would be curious how the rusty would look on a 32mm base, I think they would look ok but their stance is very wide and seems to fill the 40mm.

Thanks to anyone who can help me out

their wide stance fills the 40mm base. They're about the same height as the old space marines, so shorter than the new primaris marines.

Those old space marines were originally on 25mm bases weren't they? Those ruststalkers much have a really gaping stance lol. Wonder if they can be easily re-posed into a more sensible 32mm base kind of size...

No, keep them on 40mm. Tournament organizers don't like models on bases different from what came in the box, especially for newer models.

Doubly true for models that fight. It matters a lot less for shooting models.

Octovol wrote:
Has anyone compared hoplites to fulgurites yet? Atm im looking at adding a couple of helverins, 10 hoplites or 10 fulgurites to my list. But points wise fulgurites are on the expensive side compared to hoplites and helverins will just be replacing any balistarii or dunecrawlers i have in low points lists.

Hoplites are hilarious against armies like Khorne that get 4 attacks per model. When you charge a Berserker with 10 guys and he laughs at you...and then he lands 40 attacks...and takes 10 mortal wounds...lol! In that regard, they are excellent against Strength 3 or 4 units that just spit attacks at you in close combat. Anything that isn't completely dedicated as a close combat unit is going to have trouble against 4+ saves in melee, and most things will be hurt by your Strength 6 attack backs. Just don't run 20 of the guys unless you plan on dropping them in with a Drill, or put them on the frontline against a melee heavy army. They WILL get shot off the board, just like the rest of our Toughness 3 bodies.

Hoplites tend not to get charged. Their save is better in melee and reflects mortal wounds, and their overwatch isn’t terrible. Much easier to shoot them with any standard anti-infantry or anti-horde guns since they only have toughness 3 and a 5+ invuln.

In fact, so far I’ve never managed to get them into melee - they and the drill get blown apart unless they make their 9” charge. Not gone first yet so Stygies wouldn’t have helped.

I like them but they might be best used as pricey but resilient bubblewrap around your big guns when faced with melee hordes. Subterranean Assault has yet to open up much except distracting enemy fire for me.

I only use them and peltasts in large 3000+ point games to do what their fluff says, they guard my knight titans.