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 Arachnofiend wrote:
It's a legal list if you just make the onager detachment a spearhead so I'm just gonna assume it was a silly mistake.

I'd love to see him summarize what the army is supposed to do and how it works in play because I'm definitely not seeing it... Seems like it'd get wrecked hard by chaos daemons and tyranid lists.

I think Wulfey's pre-codex list was similar to this: Cawl with 6 Crawlers, Celestine, Sisters, and a ton of Conscripts. The idea, if I recall correctly, was to march up the board with everything and shoot the enemy off the table.

Suzuteo wrote:

 Arachnofiend wrote:
It's a legal list if you just make the onager detachment a spearhead so I'm just gonna assume it was a silly mistake.

I'd love to see him summarize what the army is supposed to do and how it works in play because I'm definitely not seeing it... Seems like it'd get wrecked hard by chaos daemons and tyranid lists.

I think Wulfey's pre-codex list was similar to this: Cawl with 6 Crawlers, Celestine, Sisters, and a ton of Conscripts. The idea, if I recall correctly, was to march up the board with everything and shoot the enemy off the table.

The pinnacle of strategy.I approve.

Infiltrators are actually very cheap for what they can do. Easy access to -3 AP in CC, CP options to increase chances to hit in close combat/shooting, decent shooting for a back-up Wrath of Mars, and 2 wounds, for when it matters. A five man squad for 110, or 220 for 10, is cheap enough to run as chaffe for Onagers. I prefer the taser-flechettes for Wrath of Mars efficiency myself, though.

Proving that match-ups count for so much in an event. Far more than just about anything else.

If admech gets first turn or doesn't get the long board edge short 12" deployment it can work. The problem is when you run up against a deepstrike list and only have 12" of board space to deploy and end up going second. Every daemons list is built around the 3d6 bloodletter charge and if you can't space that out with scouts or a deep deployment ... uh ... yeah it doens't matter what you picked from the admech codex.

 axisofentropy wrote:
Maxwell Hill won his first 3 LVO games making him the top AdMech player at the end of Day 1 with this army.

Huh, I was actually tempted to try something like this. What is his forgeworld trait? That would tell a lot about how he is playing it.

As for his antihorde, believe it or not those Infiltrators can be pretty nasty anti horde with flechette pistols (EDIT: Whoops he took stub carbines and power swords, I dont know what his game is there then.) They put out 5 shots apiece and can shred things like guardsmen from the look of it. In addition, vanguard have assault 3 lasguns with an 18" range, that deal 2 damage on 6's. They'd help contribute as well. You also need to remember each Neutron Onager is putting out 6 stubber shots. I mean it's nothing spectacular but he actually isn't that screwed for infantry, especially if he can stay back at range a bit. The dominuses all put out reroll 1 auras so he can spread them out and ensure most of his army is hitting well.

I really like the look of his army, those Neutron lasers hit like a train and every time I used them I didn't really have an issue with planes or hard to hit units if you had enough shots. With 6 I'd imagine his plan for dealing with hard to hit units is literally "I'm gonna shoot them more."

Well, gravity reasserted itself and Maxwell Hill lost his last two games against actual good armies:

Win vs. AdMech
Win vs. Death Guard
Win vs. Necrons
Win vs. Grey Knights
Loss vs. Blood Angels
Loss vs. Tyranids/Genestealers

The top 8 is a crapton of Eldar, some Blood Angels or Soup, and one Chaos Daemons. Lots of infantry, lots of flying, as expected. I think taking Icarus is clearly superior to Neutron in the current meta.

Suzuteo wrote:
Well, gravity reasserted itself and Maxwell Hill lost his last two games against actual good armies:

Win vs. AdMech
Win vs. Death Guard
Win vs. Necrons
Win vs. Grey Knights
Loss vs. Blood Angels
Loss vs. Tyranids/Genestealers

The top 8 is a crapton of Eldar, some Blood Angels or Soup, and one Chaos Daemons. Lots of infantry, lots of flying, as expected. I think taking Icarus is clearly superior to Neutron in the current meta.

Eldar? So Dark Reaper and Shining Spear spam?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Wulfey wrote:
If admech gets first turn or doesn't get the long board edge short 12" deployment it can work. The problem is when you run up against a deepstrike list and only have 12" of board space to deploy and end up going second. Every daemons list is built around the 3d6 bloodletter charge and if you can't space that out with scouts or a deep deployment ... uh ... yeah it doens't matter what you picked from the admech codex.

I can't plan for a single strategy from a single Codex at the detriment of every other army. We can put enough roadblocks out front to get us at least one or two good turns of shooting, which is all we need to stop big threats like that.

Yeah, eldar got 5 out of 8 top spots, the top 3 were identical eldar lists AND the 2nd place dude only copied the list 2 weeks prior and didn't even know his stratagems. Didn't stop him from getting 2nd place. Wow. Much balance

How long till the nerf bat swings in the direction of the pointy eared space elves I wonder...

The Forgeworld fires release. Is that confirmed by an official source as March release. Or is it just heavily rumoured?

I am purchasing some more Admech stuff and don’t know if I should hang fire and save money for other cool toys.

This is proving an expensive hobby lol

Scouts don't just save admech from daemons, they save you from Obliterators, Scions, Tau, Nurglings, and even less deepstrike plays like Lias Issodon. I played a 60 guard body list and the super wide screen didn't give me any distance on the 12" deployment setup. I am pretty sure but will have some test games to confirm that 30 guard bodies and 15 scout marines will be a much better screen. The scout marines provide distance, the guard provide raw padding.

EDIT: the whole reason eldar are overpowered is that the designer's note from chapter approved that prevents DRUKARI and HARLEQUIN strategems from being applied to YNNARRI happened to not be in codex eldar since it came out before chapter approved. That will be fixed in a few weeks, but it applied at LVO which meant that all other lists were junk compared to codex ELDAR strategems applying to index YNNARRI. I bailed on my LVO ticket once I saw that that garbage was going to be legal. Why bother?

Wulfey wrote:
Scouts don't just save admech from daemons, they save you from Obliterators, Scions, Tau, Nurglings, and even less deepstrike plays like Lias Issodon. I played a 60 guard body list and the super wide screen didn't give me any distance on the 12" deployment setup. I am pretty sure but will have some test games to confirm that 30 guard bodies and 15 scout marines will be a much better screen. The scout marines provide distance, the guard provide raw padding.

Raven Guard Scouts, I am guessing?

 em_en_oh_pee wrote:

Wulfey wrote:
Scouts don't just save admech from daemons, they save you from Obliterators, Scions, Tau, Nurglings, and even less deepstrike plays like Lias Issodon. I played a 60 guard body list and the super wide screen didn't give me any distance on the 12" deployment setup. I am pretty sure but will have some test games to confirm that 30 guard bodies and 15 scout marines will be a much better screen. The scout marines provide distance, the guard provide raw padding.

Raven Guard Scouts, I am guessing?

No chapter tactics because I am too dependent on celestine and hate the space marine HQs. Space marine HQs are stinkers. The good ones are 130 points and they don't carry their weight. It would be nice if something made my scouts live longer or fight better, but that isn't their role. Is there a good, cheap space marine HQ?

Wulfey wrote:

 em_en_oh_pee wrote:

Wulfey wrote:
Scouts don't just save admech from daemons, they save you from Obliterators, Scions, Tau, Nurglings, and even less deepstrike plays like Lias Issodon. I played a 60 guard body list and the super wide screen didn't give me any distance on the 12" deployment setup. I am pretty sure but will have some test games to confirm that 30 guard bodies and 15 scout marines will be a much better screen. The scout marines provide distance, the guard provide raw padding.

Raven Guard Scouts, I am guessing?

No chapter tactics because I am too dependent on celestine and hate the space marine HQs. Space marine HQs are stinkers. The good ones are 130 points and they don't carry their weight. It would be nice if something made my scouts live longer or fight better, but that isn't their role. Is there a good, cheap space marine HQ?

Not likely. Basic Lieutenant is like 63pt. I don't have CA in front of me, but maybe a Libby? I think those went down in price?

What about taking a tanky HQ in place of Celestine? A biker Captain maybe like the old Smash.... you know, from 7th.

Wulfey wrote:
Scouts don't just save admech from daemons, they save you from Obliterators, Scions, Tau, Nurglings, and even less deepstrike plays like Lias Issodon. I played a 60 guard body list and the super wide screen didn't give me any distance on the 12" deployment setup. I am pretty sure but will have some test games to confirm that 30 guard bodies and 15 scout marines will be a much better screen. The scout marines provide distance, the guard provide raw padding.

EDIT: the whole reason eldar are overpowered is that the designer's note from chapter approved that prevents DRUKARI and HARLEQUIN strategems from being applied to YNNARRI happened to not be in codex eldar since it came out before chapter approved. That will be fixed in a few weeks, but it applied at LVO which meant that all other lists were junk compared to codex ELDAR strategems applying to index YNNARRI. I bailed on my LVO ticket once I saw that that garbage was going to be legal. Why bother?

Ah. Did not realise that was what those guys were using. Cheers for the clarification.That sucks you missed the LVO though. Hope you didnt have to much booked in the way of hotels etc.

 Silentz wrote:
Quick update for the thread... there was a major tournament in the UK this weekend called Caledonian Uprising. 96 players, 2 days. Full list pack is here should you want to read the pure cheddar: https://www.dropbox.com/s/p3dlxq0a45bbk18/Uprising18lists.pdf?dl=0

Anyway, 8th position was a well known UK player who wins a lot of tournaments, running a list which looks identical to many posted up here. I was surprised to see
a) this very competitive player take the "uncompetitive" admech, and
b) a list which looks like the kind of thing I could field!

His skill level will have made a big difference, I am sure.

Anyway here's the list.

Mars Batallion
Cawl
Techpriest Enginseer (warlord) with Chorister Technis

3 x 5 skitarii rangers, no upgrades

4 x Dakka Kastelans
1 xNeuron laser Onager Dunecrawler

Stygies VIII Outrider
Techpriest Enginseer

4 x Sydonian Dragoons with taser lance and phosphor serpenta and BSDT
1 x Sydonian Dragoon with taser lance and BSDT
1 x Sydonian Dragoon with taser lance and BSDT

Super Heavy Aux
Knight Crusader - Thermal Cannon, Gatling Cannon, Stormspear missiles

The next best AdMech came 80th

Hey guys,

This was my list! Thanks for the shout out Silentz. It did really well, I wanted to try out a few things in a competitive setting, namely:
Was four robots enough?
Could a single IK do work?
Were the dragoons worth it?

I played deathguard horde, mortarion and friends, blood angels, Eldar reaper spam and IG over the weekend. I would probably drop the 4/1/1 walkers down to a big unit of six in an auxiliary, if I were to play it again, to better maximise their hitting power.

Lots of good tools in the codex though, guys! Really enjoyed my first shot at pure admech

Nightrunner wrote:

Hey guys,

This was my list! Thanks for the shout out Silentz. It did really well, I wanted to try out a few things in a competitive setting, namely:
Was four robots enough?
Could a single IK do work?
Were the dragoons worth it?

I played deathguard horde, mortarion and friends, blood angels, Eldar reaper spam and IG over the weekend. I would probably drop the 4/1/1 walkers down to a big unit of six in an auxiliary, if I were to play it again, to better maximise their hitting power.

Lots of good tools in the codex though, guys! Really enjoyed my first shot at pure admech

Cool!

I think most people here run 5 Kastelans in their competitive games. They are really strong against a large variety of targets and thus form the core of most armies. 4 is considered the minimum though.

If you drop two Dragoons, something you could do is make the Mars detachment a Spearhead and the Stygies VIII detachment the Battalion; add a Crawler. I would also lose the Serpentas. They don't do enough to justify their cost. I mean, they aren't even pistols...

Wulfey wrote:

No chapter tactics because I am too dependent on celestine and hate the space marine HQs. Space marine HQs are stinkers. The good ones are 130 points and they don't carry their weight. It would be nice if something made my scouts live longer or fight better, but that isn't their role. Is there a good, cheap space marine HQ?

No. SMs are like Tau. Their HQs are expected to actually do some fighting and not just stand in as a tax or aura caddy.

I only lost the price of the champions ticket .. like $80. But a flight to vegas and the 4 days of hotels and food was like $1000 when a priced it. I figured i wanted more models more than I wanted that trip. I just moved up to the bay area for a new job and have been going to game kastle tournaments i can drive to instead of spending that much money on tourneys that need hotels.

Wulfey wrote:
I only lost the price of the champions ticket .. like $80. But a flight to vegas and the 4 days of hotels and food was like $1000 when a priced it. I figured i wanted more models more than I wanted that trip. I just moved up to the bay area for a new job and have been going to game kastle tournaments i can drive to instead of spending that much money on tourneys that need hotels.

The logic is sound. Ouch that’s a lot for a quick trip.. defo the right call

Wulfey wrote:
I only lost the price of the champions ticket .. like $80. But a flight to vegas and the 4 days of hotels and food was like $1000 when a priced it. I figured i wanted more models more than I wanted that trip. I just moved up to the bay area for a new job and have been going to game kastle tournaments i can drive to instead of spending that much money on tourneys that need hotels.

I think you're in the same area as me now; I live in the South Bay. But I haven't been able to play in awhile because my job requires me to stay late on the day that my group's tabletop night falls. Not to mention, my progress in building/painting is abysmal (which to be fair, is fine because I find building/painting to be therapeutic). On top of this, my most-local game store is closing. (Is anyone else seeing how many comic stores have been closing recently?)

Anyhow, which Game Kastle, and what days do they meet on?

Wulfey wrote:
I only lost the price of the champions ticket .. like $80. But a flight to vegas and the 4 days of hotels and food was like $1000 when a priced it. I figured i wanted more models more than I wanted that trip. I just moved up to the bay area for a new job and have been going to game kastle tournaments i can drive to instead of spending that much money on tourneys that need hotels.

Bay area fething hurts doesn't it? I came back myself recently to be back with family and I still have a hard time affording stuff!

Suzuteo wrote:

Wulfey wrote:
I only lost the price of the champions ticket .. like $80. But a flight to vegas and the 4 days of hotels and food was like $1000 when a priced it. I figured i wanted more models more than I wanted that trip. I just moved up to the bay area for a new job and have been going to game kastle tournaments i can drive to instead of spending that much money on tourneys that need hotels.

I think you're in the same area as me now; I live in the South Bay. But I haven't been able to play in awhile because my job requires me to stay late on the day that my group's tabletop night falls. Not to mention, my progress in building/painting is abysmal (which to be fair, is fine because I find building/painting to be therapeutic). On top of this, my most-local game store is closing. (Is anyone else seeing how many comic stores have been closing recently?)

Anyhow, which Game Kastle, and what days do they meet on?

The Fremont California Game Kastle is doing a 1 day ITC 3 game RTT this saturday Feb 3. But the app is down right now. I have been going to the mountainview one. It was a serious tourney last time, I played Geoff

Wulfey wrote:

Suzuteo wrote:

Wulfey wrote:
I only lost the price of the champions ticket .. like $80. But a flight to vegas and the 4 days of hotels and food was like $1000 when a priced it. I figured i wanted more models more than I wanted that trip. I just moved up to the bay area for a new job and have been going to game kastle tournaments i can drive to instead of spending that much money on tourneys that need hotels.

I think you're in the same area as me now; I live in the South Bay. But I haven't been able to play in awhile because my job requires me to stay late on the day that my group's tabletop night falls. Not to mention, my progress in building/painting is abysmal (which to be fair, is fine because I find building/painting to be therapeutic). On top of this, my most-local game store is closing. (Is anyone else seeing how many comic stores have been closing recently?)

Anyhow, which Game Kastle, and what days do they meet on?

The Fremont California Game Kastle is doing a 1 day ITC 3 game RTT this saturday Feb 3. But the app is down right now. I have been going to the mountainview one. It was a serious tourney last time, I played Geoff

I actually live near that one!

Too bad I don't live near people anymore that'll let me borrow models :(

Wulfey wrote:
Is there a good, cheap space marine HQ?

Blood Angel Captain with those relic wings. ofc that requires your warlord to be a Blood Angel but he's really really good and not too expensive. He appears in several top LVO lists.

 axisofentropy wrote:

Wulfey wrote:
Is there a good, cheap space marine HQ?

Blood Angel Captain with those relic wings. ofc that requires your warlord to be a Blood Angel but he's really really good and not too expensive. He appears in several top LVO lists.

I am intrigued. I could see blood angels scouts being good and some blood angels HQs being worth losing celestine over. Time to check the PDFs.

If you go with him, you're going to want to bring Sanguinary Guard, Death Company, or something along those lines (both?). Might end up quite a costly point sink.

Personally, I think the strategy is at odds with how the rest of our army works. It's basically charging with 1500 points worth of jetpack infantry. Either they get us within two turns or die trying.

Which makes every game feel like this, down to the singing:

So I could get behind Mephiston. If he gets all 3 buff powers off then he swings like a primarch and can moves like celestine. But that is 3 powers on a 7-6-6. I get how blood angels climbed the ladders at LVO because the strategems they have really do turn CP into pure damage. All kinds of double swing strategems.

Against Blood Angels, what would be the plan? Is it just like against Tau? Castle along a table edge or a large geographical feature, putting as much distance between you and them as possible, leaving no room for a unit to stand? (Six Dragoons and Cawl turned sideways is actually a surprisingly good wall.)

Suzuteo wrote:
Against Blood Angels, what would be the plan? Is it just like against Tau? Castle along a table edge or a large geographical feature, putting as much distance between you and them as possible, leaving no room for a unit to stand? (Six Dragoons and Cawl turned sideways is actually a surprisingly good wall.)

Pick up models during their turn. Hope they are all in range of your unengaged phosphorbots. remember to put all your characters on the enemy facing sides of your phosphorbbots so you can heroically intervene before pile ins and hard block units from moving using base to base

 axisofentropy wrote:

Wulfey wrote:
Is there a good, cheap space marine HQ?

Blood Angel Captain with those relic wings. ofc that requires your warlord to be a Blood Angel but he's really really good and not too expensive. He appears in several top LVO lists.

oh there's a way to get him the relic wings without a blood Angel Warlord: a 100% blood Angel detachment allows their strategems including the extra relic strategem.

 axisofentropy wrote:

 axisofentropy wrote:

Wulfey wrote:
Is there a good, cheap space marine HQ?

Blood Angel Captain with those relic wings. ofc that requires your warlord to be a Blood Angel but he's really really good and not too expensive. He appears in several top LVO lists.

oh there's a way to get him the relic wings without a blood Angel Warlord: a 100% blood Angel detachment allows their strategems including the extra relic strategem.

I still cannot believe that that was RAI.