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What were you expecting, it ain't marines or Titans.
Same with all their 40k regular stuff.
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
tneva82 wrote: Well they have only started working book 9 and gave initial previews. Woudln't expect release date being announced any time soon. Probably next year earliest anyway
According to Anuj at the event, a lot of it is done, but it'll still be 6 months of playtesting and 6 months of printing and shipping.
There was even mention of the Lion currently being playtested!
Whatever date FW tells you, take the ‘over’. It’ll probably be 18+ months. Malevolence missed its date after two years of time, and didn’t even include Dark Mech like originally announced. They make some great stuff, but it’s a small team producing some very ambitious products, and their track record with deadlines is what it is.
tneva82 wrote: Well they have only started working book 9 and gave initial previews. Woudln't expect release date being announced any time soon. Probably next year earliest anyway
According to Anuj at the event, a lot of it is done, but it'll still be 6 months of playtesting and 6 months of printing and shipping.
There was even mention of the Lion currently being playtested!
Whatever date FW tells you, take the ‘over’. It’ll probably be 18+ months. Malevolence missed its date after two years of time, and didn’t even include Dark Mech like originally announced. They make some great stuff, but it’s a small team producing some very ambitious products, and their track record with deadlines is what it is.
Oh I know. But keep in mind that they have gotten more staff in, and feel far more back on track than previous years, as you can probably tell from the Weekender.
I'm not going to expect it on time anyway, because this is FW, but they seemed quite certain on the way forward and that what happened with Malevolence was a very unfortunate series of events for them. So it's nice to see a more positive attitude towards 30k again. New FAQ in a month or so with some major changes, possible return of some FW paints, etc.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2019/02/04 01:52:36
I had a great weekend at the event picking up an Ordinatus Aktaeus. Annoyingly the rules were meant to be given out at the event but due to a mix up they weren't. Spoke to the rules team and apparently it is a 40 capacity transport that can take up to castellax sized units, although each one counts as 8 models. You can use the drill with or without the Ordinatus chassis, without its basically a large drop pod that has an apocalyptic blast marker for its area effect followed up with 15 missile shots when it opens. With the chassis you can choose which turn it is launched, and the later you leave it the bigger the area of effect, up to 22" turn 7 while still working as a drop pod as well. Going to be a fun unit to play with, I'm going to need some more termites and the Ordinatus Sagittar to go with it and my existing Termites/Ulator.
My biggest takeaway from the event was from the first Q&A Forum with the HH rules team. The team is now three people and soley focused on producing one book a year. They will be only working on HH as well. Last year they tried to do Talons of the Emperor as a red book/40k codex but ran into so many approval processes with GW as GW made it clear it owns 8th edition. It seems to me that FW have given up on 40k... This was reenforced by Tony and others stating that there will now be tens of books more before they get to the SoT. Each will expand the legions out so sounds like they will be full of legion specific units, doesn't sound like a good idea to me as that must limit sales if only one legion can field something (see the new WS land speeder that I know a lot of people would buy if they could).
Much of what I saw for Talons such as the black and purple artwork for Custodies has ended up in Malevolence for the unified and fully updated custodies list.
Speaking of Malevolence the demon list on the surface looks really flexible and fun, being able to take models up to An’ggrath's size as a Primarch equivalent (they are around 600 points base). New line breaker demon will be coming to give demons some hard hitting offence. I really like that demons start of strong with +1S +1T on first couple of turns and slowly get weaker as the game progresses.
Looky Likey wrote: My biggest takeaway from the event was from the first Q&A Forum with the HH rules team. The team is now three people and soley focused on producing one book a year. They will be only working on HH as well. Last year they tried to do Talons of the Emperor as a red book/40k codex but ran into so many approval processes with GW as GW made it clear it owns 8th edition. It seems to me that FW have given up on 40k... This was reenforced by Tony and others stating that there will now be tens of books more before they get to the SoT. Each will expand the legions out so sounds like they will be full of legion specific units, doesn't sound like a good idea to me as that must limit sales if only one legion can field something (see the new WS land speeder that I know a lot of people would buy if they could).
Uuuh while book a year would be nice wouldn't this basically mean decades before they get to siege of terra? Tens of books, 1 per year...With BL getting to Siege of terra in few months seems like long wait.
Oh wow, I think they're putting a bit too much faith into the Horus Heresy as a whole carrying them for the coming years.
As awesome as the models are, there is fatigue and the trickle at which things are rolled out. They can never manage to hold attention for so long, especially not when the main event over at BL will be over in two or so years.
Plausibly explains why Forgeworld rules for 40k have been sporadic. If the main studio is keeping a tight grip on the rules, they're probably either ignoring FW altogether or doing a slow rollout overtime. Looks like the Imperial Armour Index books are pretty much it for the forseeable future.
BrookM wrote: Oh wow, I think they're putting a bit too much faith into the Horus Heresy as a whole carrying them for the coming years.
As awesome as the models are, there is fatigue and the trickle at which things are rolled out. They can never manage to hold attention for so long, especially not when the main event over at BL will be over in two or so years.
I dunno. I've never been that big into the Black Library Horus Heresy books. I've read a few of them and have found the quality sporadic. But, I love what Forgeworld have done with it and as long as they keep doing what they're doing, I'll be happy. Not forgetting specialist games as well.
For me personally the series has already peaked with the amazing White Scars arc as done by Chris Wraight. My only hope is that Chris has also been involved with the background sections of the White Scars in the HH book.
blood reaper wrote: God I hate the scenic bases Forge World produces for its characters so much. Let me tell you how much I've come to hate them. If the word 'hate' was to be engraved on each anoangstrom of every one of those scenic bases it would not equal one one-billionth of the hate I feel for those things.
They all look horrendously ugly (which is in part due to the tremendously mediocre painting ability of Forge Worlds new painter), but they're all clearly just stuck on to add to the cost of the model. The only good ones are those which comes with Horus or Angron.
I'm 99% sure that when they get to it, there will be a scenic duel base for Horus and the Emperor to recreate the classic showdown on the bridge of the Vengeful Spirit, probably with a dead Sanguinus added.
When it comes to scenic bases, at least FW has recognized they aren't loved and has made them optional for the most part.
I just wish they'd channel this effort into doing more terrain.
They're not really optional by any means. You have to buy the base with the Primarch, you can't chose not buy, say Horus, without the giant chunk of resin.
At least the character models themselves look neat. Sanguinus is however suffering form a horrendously skewed line of action.
the sanguinius model is actually really good when you see the whole thing. and the scenic base is amazing. its a bit of a scam that they make you buy it separately. i had the disposable income to buy the whole thing but it did sting buying it,
queen_annes_revenge wrote: the sanguinius model is actually really good when you see the whole thing. and the scenic base is amazing. its a bit of a scam that they make you buy it separately. i had the disposable income to buy the whole thing but it did sting buying it,
Huh so only having option to buy the full kit with base at the higher price is better in your opinion?
Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Put scenic base and people complain FW inflating price with price. Provide cheaper way without and people complain about having to buy base separately? Heh.
What is the price of Sanguinius combined with the scenic base?
Also, is Sanguinius removable from his scenic base? I noticed that in the scenic base his left hand is exchanged for one holding the daemon by its horn, so at the very least that would have to be magnetized. Is the base still slot-in like the other HH character dioramas?
queen_annes_revenge wrote: the sanguinius model is actually really good when you see the whole thing. and the scenic base is amazing. its a bit of a scam that they make you buy it separately. i had the disposable income to buy the whole thing but it did sting buying it,
Huh so only having option to buy the full kit with base at the higher price is better in your opinion?
Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Put scenic base and people complain FW inflating price with price. Provide cheaper way without and people complain about having to buy base separately? Heh.
my thoughts is that the £80 should've covered the scenic base aswell, as the older primarch models did. you can then always choose not to use the larger part of the scenic base. paying 45 quid for a base did make me die a little inside. FW prices are astronomical, and it bugs me that they seem to keep increasing with every new primarch. but I do like the products.
Redemption wrote: What is the price of Sanguinius combined with the scenic base?
Also, is Sanguinius removable from his scenic base? I noticed that in the scenic base his left hand is exchanged for one holding the daemon by its horn, so at the very least that would have to be magnetized. Is the base still slot-in like the other HH character dioramas?
125 GBP. I paid it because he was the only model I'm allowing myself to buy this year. the diorama base comes with a left hand built onto the horn of the demon hes killing, with a tube shaped insert to allow it to fit into the left arm of the sangy model, which you'd need to assemble without the left hand that comes with that kit. you could magnetize but I reckon the little insert combined with the base positioning would hold it together. I'll be building the whole thing together so it doesnt really matter to me.
queen_annes_revenge wrote: the sanguinius model is actually really good when you see the whole thing. and the scenic base is amazing. its a bit of a scam that they make you buy it separately. i had the disposable income to buy the whole thing but it did sting buying it,
Huh so only having option to buy the full kit with base at the higher price is better in your opinion?
Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Put scenic base and people complain FW inflating price with price. Provide cheaper way without and people complain about having to buy base separately? Heh.
my thoughts is that the £80 should've covered the scenic base aswell, as the older primarch models did. you can then always choose not to use the larger part of the scenic base. paying 45 quid for a base did make me die a little inside. FW prices are astronomical, and it bugs me that they seem to keep increasing with every new primarch. but I do like the products.
Sanquinus seems to be also wee bit bigger than say my Horus and his scenic base also seems bigger than Horus had. Ergo if it was combined package price would be even higher than just Sanquinus.
yeah, granted, the newer Primarch models are even larger. they seemed to start creeping up with Perturabo. Russ and Alpharius are markedly bigger than Angron and Curze for example, and Magnus is an absolute monster. the newer models also have more detailing. but Still, bumping the price by £20 for a slight size increase and a little extra detail?
the scenic base of sangy is about the same size as horus' ruined marble eagle. there is more detail in the demon though, and painting that base will be a task in and of itself really. i can see sangy taking at least double the amount of time I've spent on angron and morty (3-4 weeks each)
yeah their idea of inflation is way off. its getting to the point where my red line will be reached. theres only so much I'm willing to shell out for an (albeit beautiful) piece of sculpted resin.
Looky Likey wrote: My biggest takeaway from the event was from the first Q&A Forum with the HH rules team. The team is now three people and soley focused on producing one book a year. They will be only working on HH as well. Last year they tried to do Talons of the Emperor as a red book/40k codex but ran into so many approval processes with GW as GW made it clear it owns 8th edition. It seems to me that FW have given up on 40k... This was reenforced by Tony and others stating that there will now be tens of books more before they get to the SoT. Each will expand the legions out so sounds like they will be full of legion specific units, doesn't sound like a good idea to me as that must limit sales if only one legion can field something (see the new WS land speeder that I know a lot of people would buy if they could).
Uuuh while book a year would be nice wouldn't this basically mean decades before they get to siege of terra? Tens of books, 1 per year...With BL getting to Siege of terra in few months seems like long wait.
IIRC, their stated plan before AB's passing was for up to 25 books. So maybe not much change there. I don't think it's sustainable, of course. They've always been a passionate team whose reach perpetually seems to exceed its grasp.
Regarding FW possibly being 'done' with 40K, that was what I was alluding to after the recent custodes beta rules release. My Spidey-Sense was tingling that it might be a rules dump and dusting of hands in place of a Talons book release. Maybe it still has life though...we'll see.
queen_annes_revenge wrote: they mentioned a unit thats coming that could represent sanguinary guard, but nothing solid.
From what I have read, they stated that if you want to use the Sanguinary Guard models, then you should use the Command Squad rules.
BrookM wrote: Oh wow, I think they're putting a bit too much faith into the Horus Heresy as a whole carrying them for the coming years.
As awesome as the models are, there is fatigue and the trickle at which things are rolled out. They can never manage to hold attention for so long, especially not when the main event over at BL will be over in two or so years.
This is probably the silliest opinion of I have seen all day. The release schedules for BL and 30k have little to do with one another. Which is how it should be. A series of novels should have a strict end point. A game should be more open ended. Plus there is a ton of stuff that 30k hasn't even gotten a chance to deal with yet. So I am perfectly content for the 30k team to go at their own pace and not worry about BL wrapping the series HH series up (and, even then, the BL teams has left the door open to telling more stories in the HH era, so realistically the door is not really closed, just the main story). .
queen_annes_revenge wrote: they mentioned a unit thats coming that could represent sanguinary guard, but nothing solid.
From what I have read, they stated that if you want to use the Sanguinary Guard models, then you should use the Command Squad rules.
BrookM wrote: Oh wow, I think they're putting a bit too much faith into the Horus Heresy as a whole carrying them for the coming years.
As awesome as the models are, there is fatigue and the trickle at which things are rolled out. They can never manage to hold attention for so long, especially not when the main event over at BL will be over in two or so years.
This is probably the silliest opinion of I have seen all day. The release schedules for BL and 30k have little to do with one another. Which is how it should be. A series of novels should have a strict end point. A game should be more open ended. Plus there is a ton of stuff that 30k hasn't even gotten a chance to deal with yet. So I am perfectly content for the 30k team to go at their own pace and not worry about BL wrapping the series HH series up (and, even then, the BL teams has left the door open to telling more stories in the HH era, so realistically the door is not really closed, just the main story). .
All true, but personally I'd prefer FW took the same approach - get the "main plot" laid out in broad strokes, including the finale, then go back and fill in the best of the rest. The idea we might not even start to get the FW books to fight the Solar War/Siege for another five or ten years is actually a bit depressing, especially since my favourite faction(Iron Hands) was basically written out of the series fairly early on(the subsequent Shattered Legions stuff is less IH content and more the BL team berating IH fans for liking them), and my second favourite faction(loyalist Mechanicum) will likely only get their next big feature when FW get around to doing Terra & Mars.
When I like a setting I'll happily read/buy content I find to be "peripheral" to my primary interest(for example, I own and have read all the BL novels related to WHFB Elves, despite finding them stupendously unappealing in general, because I want to have as complete an understanding of that setting as I can), but only if I'm also getting the stuff I really care about at a reasonable pace. At one book a year, almost nobody will be getting their primary interest at a reasonable pace, and if that state of affairs is likely to last years & years with no real end in sight, I think that'd be more of a drain on the playerbase(ie, people who play 30K, rather than those who played 40K with 30K lists) than 40K 8th was.
"Your society's broken, so who should we blame? Should we blame the rich, powerful people who caused it? No, lets blame the people with no power and no money and those immigrants who don't even have the vote. Yea, it must be their fething fault." - Iain M Banks
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"The language of modern British politics is meant to sound benign. But words do not mean what they seem to mean. 'Reform' actually means 'cut' or 'end'. 'Flexibility' really means 'exploit'. 'Prudence' really means 'don't invest'. And 'efficient'? That means whatever you want it to mean, usually 'cut'. All really mean 'keep wages low for the masses, taxes low for the rich, profits high for the corporations, and accept the decline in public services and amenities this will cause'." - Robin McAlpine from Common Weal
queen_annes_revenge wrote: they mentioned a unit thats coming that could represent sanguinary guard, but nothing solid.
From what I have read, they stated that if you want to use the Sanguinary Guard models, then you should use the Command Squad rules.
BrookM wrote: Oh wow, I think they're putting a bit too much faith into the Horus Heresy as a whole carrying them for the coming years.
As awesome as the models are, there is fatigue and the trickle at which things are rolled out. They can never manage to hold attention for so long, especially not when the main event over at BL will be over in two or so years.
This is probably the silliest opinion of I have seen all day. The release schedules for BL and 30k have little to do with one another. Which is how it should be. A series of novels should have a strict end point. A game should be more open ended. Plus there is a ton of stuff that 30k hasn't even gotten a chance to deal with yet. So I am perfectly content for the 30k team to go at their own pace and not worry about BL wrapping the series HH series up (and, even then, the BL teams has left the door open to telling more stories in the HH era, so realistically the door is not really closed, just the main story). .
All true, but personally I'd prefer FW took the same approach - get the "main plot" laid out in broad strokes, including the finale, then go back and fill in the best of the rest. The idea we might not even start to get the FW books to fight the Solar War/Siege for another five or ten years is actually a bit depressing, especially since my favourite faction(Iron Hands) was basically written out of the series fairly early on(the subsequent Shattered Legions stuff is less IH content and more the BL team berating IH fans for liking them), and my second favourite faction(loyalist Mechanicum) will likely only get their next big feature when FW get around to doing Terra & Mars.
When I like a setting I'll happily read/buy content I find to be "peripheral" to my primary interest(for example, I own and have read all the BL novels related to WHFB Elves, despite finding them stupendously unappealing in general, because I want to have as complete an understanding of that setting as I can), but only if I'm also getting the stuff I really care about at a reasonable pace. At one book a year, almost nobody will be getting their primary interest at a reasonable pace, and if that state of affairs is likely to last years & years with no real end in sight, I think that'd be more of a drain on the playerbase(ie, people who play 30K, rather than those who played 40K with 30K lists) than 40K 8th was.
I agree in so far as I think they made a mistake in not pushing out at least the basic rules for all of the legions as early as possible.
I do not believe the 30k crew were allowed (or at least did not desire) to touch the Siege until after the BL team did it. That way there would be minimal contradictions between the two in terms of fluff.
Heresy World Eaters/Emperors Children 
