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 BrotherGecko wrote:
Trading camo and ARM for engineering I skeptical of it being a good trade. Engineer doesn't help a kurgat autocannon.

If no Haris, then I think Sapper and minelayer for no engineer. Sapper is a combat engineering skill so I think it would at the very least keep with fluff. Then with minelayer it could be a fairly solid defensive position.

I can't see them losing Engineer. It's part of the basic profile.

So separate it out. Operative Group gets engineer and Support Group gets Sapper. Because any additional rule outside of Haris will make the kurgat with autocannon more points and more points just makes the kurgat autocannon what it is now, a novelty model.

 BrotherGecko wrote:
So separate it out. Operative Group gets engineer and Support Group gets Sapper. Because any additional rule outside of Haris will make the kurgat with autocannon more points and more points just makes the kurgat autocannon what it is now, a novelty model.

Honestly, it seems like you want the Kurgat to be something other than they are.

The Support Group model is a 'firebase' piece. It still has Engineer, which inflates its points cost slightly but gives it a thing it can do as part of its toolkit--but it's still a 28 point model in comparison to the Tankhunter(the only other model featuring a Portable Autocannon in the whole game) which is 34pts thanks to its Camo.

 Kanluwen wrote:

I can't see them losing Engineer. It's part of the basic profile.

Repeater used to be part of the basic profile of the Securitate. I could see them doing something similar to what happened there, where it was pulled out of the basic profile and added as an optional one.

 LunarSol wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

I can't see them losing Engineer. It's part of the basic profile.

Repeater used to be part of the basic profile of the Securitate. I could see them doing something similar to what happened there, where it was pulled out of the basic profile and added as an optional one.

Difference being that Kurgat aren't likely becoming the linkable and AVA Total Line Infantry for a Sectorial.

Securitate lost their Repeaters and Sixth Sense and Light Shotguns. Their profile was held up as one of the biggest examples of bloat for quite some time and anyone who didn't expect significant changes was deluding themselves.

By comparison, Kurgat are AVA3 with 4 profiles. Two of their profiles(the Mark 12s) are the exact same barring the addition of Haris.
Because right now, it feels like the reasoning behind wanting the Autocannon to be Operative Group is simply so that you can make the Haris a full one rather than an undergunned one.

 Ronin_eX wrote:
The Mowang is a big dude with big guns. Could be interesting (the art implies some level of CH, possibly Mimetism, but maybe higher), but IA isn't hurting for heavy hitters. Images are too blurry for me to glean much else from it. But it will obviously be our big, punchy S5 HI. Hopefully it is good (but doesn't obviate the rest of our punchy HI).

I'm waaaaaaaaay more interested in the Daoying. Those legs imply augmentation to its speed (same general artificial leg structure as the Hollow Men) and the name (Mirror Image/Reverse Image/Inverted Image... something along those lines) implies some kind of funky defensive ability (if I had to guess it is Holo2, but I'm hoping it will be something funky like Impersonation). It is really hard to tell if it is HI or not, though. The legs are obviously mechanical, but the upper torso looks like an LI or SK body. I'm kind of hoping it is something lighter since IA is starting to look a bit top heavy and needs some infusion of non-hackable troops in there with a cheaper price tag.

Either way, a lot of the new IA reveals have implied mobility rules, making me think that that may be their "thing". I certainly wouldn't mind an army with a lot of quick-moving and maneuverable hard-hitting troops. So far they have access to AD, likely some forward deployment, and at least two troops that look like they have Climbing Plus as well as a new one that is either rocking at least 6-2 movement and possibly Super Jump. If they have the low-end point support to allow them to actually field good mixes of this stuff then I am expecting to be in love with the IA. But there are still a lot of if's in that, since a list that is only high-end choices without an efficient low-end to support it won't get far.

If you’re all done gushing over one model coming for MAF ...
Can we get more specifics on what was presented for IA?
Were these new dossiers? I assume no renders/profiles dropped.
I’m kinda surprised IA will add so many new units. Yu Jing already has a bunch of stuff with no sectorial home outside of ISS.

These were a mix of new and previously seen dossiers. I haven't seen high quality photos so haven't posted them.

Also, you're kind of reaching saying that they "have a bunch of stuff with no sectorial home". We know there's two Sectorials that are in the pipeline for Yu Jing. Their Svalarheim sectorial("Army of the Banner" IIRC) is slated to bring the Guilang, Daofei, Zhanshi, Tiger Soldiers and Shaolin Monks at least into a Sectorial.

Invincible Army on the otherhand is basically seeming to be a 'fresh start'. Originally we were told Zhanshi would be in there--but it might very well be the case they're not. We're also seeing what might be some 'support' troops to replace the standard Engineer/Doctor choices.

A bunch of colour coded "Banner" armies appeared in Uprising. the Green Banner Army was their army on Paradiso, and on another planet they had the Orange Banner Army.

Think we originally heard "White Banner Army" was the Svarl one?

 Bladerunner2019 wrote:

 Ronin_eX wrote:
*snip*.

If you’re all done gushing over one model coming for MAF ...
Can we get more specifics on what was presented for IA?
Were these new dossiers? I assume no renders/profiles dropped.
I’m kinda surprised IA will add so many new units. Yu Jing already has a bunch of stuff with no sectorial home outside of ISS.

There were a couple of new dossiers shown alongside the ones from GenCon, but the photos are all super low-res and hard to make out more than basic shapes on.

No renders or profiles (although apparently some folks managed to glean some extra details, but either they're keeping exact things close to their chest or CB is right now).

As for the number of new units as opposed to using old ones, that is down to two factors. First, they're actually utilizing (as far as we can tell) a fair few existing profiles. The Guija, Hac Tao, Zhanshi (ugh), and Tiger Soldier all look to be in the lineup. This will leave the Guilang, Daofei, and Shaolin as our only orphaned profiles at that point (and White Banner has basically claimed those, as well as some StateEmpire overlap with IA).

The bigger thing to keep in mind is that CB's whole excuse for removing JSA was to "make room". Now, as an army with one sectorial when some are now on #4, this would only even partially make sense if the IA replaced the stuff they lost with the JSA departing. The JSA contained over a dozen unique profiles (characters included), gutting vanilla by 1/3rd. If they are gone to make room for our second sectorial, then that second sectorial has some big shoes to fill with regards to unique profiles, because right now, the only faction with less units than Yu Jing is the Tohaa.

Kanluwen wrote:These were a mix of new and previously seen dossiers. I haven't seen high quality photos so haven't posted them.

Also, you're kind of reaching saying that they "have a bunch of stuff with no sectorial home". We know there's two Sectorials that are in the pipeline for Yu Jing. Their Svalarheim sectorial("Army of the Banner" IIRC) is slated to bring the Guilang, Daofei, Zhanshi, Tiger Soldiers and Shaolin Monks at least into a Sectorial.

Invincible Army on the otherhand is basically seeming to be a 'fresh start'. Originally we were told Zhanshi would be in there--but it might very well be the case they're not. We're also seeing what might be some 'support' troops to replace the standard Engineer/Doctor choices.

Basically this. IA sort of needs to be, well, what they are in Yu Jing's background; that is, a reboot and a facelift for the faction as a whole. Rumblings from some folks that talked to them a bit has also suggested that we haven't seen all the IA units yet either, so while I'm still averse to getting excited, that at least hopefully means the IA will be a proper replacement for what we lost. But we'll have to wait and see.

Micky wrote:A bunch of colour coded "Banner" armies appeared in Uprising. the Green Banner Army was their army on Paradiso, and on another planet they had the Orange Banner Army.

Think we originally heard "White Banner Army" was the Svarl one?

Yeah, the Banner Armies are basically the forces that the IA are being poised to replace. They're the main-line Yu Jing regional StateEmpire armies and the reason Zhanshi are called what they are called (Troops of the Banner). Huangdi (the contintent Yu Jing control on Sval) is the home of the White Banner, and otherse are situated about the sphere. My guess is that most banner armies are fairly standard and that at most we'll only ever see a couple of them become sectorials (with White Banner being first as it is likely the one with the most unique feel). I am kind of also hoping that with Japan out of the way, we finally start seeing some actual backing behind the whole "Yu Jing is super multi-cultural!" bit of background that has never materialized. That is, I want my Korean and Thai sectorials damn it! And if the latter doesn't come with a unit whose EXP CCWs are its knees, I will be disappoint.

 BrotherGecko wrote:
Trading camo and ARM for engineering I skeptical of it being a good trade. Engineer doesn't help a kurgat autocannon.

If no Haris, then I think Sapper and minelayer for no engineer. Sapper is a combat engineering skill so I think it would at the very least keep with fluff. Then with minelayer it could be a fairly solid defensive position.

Well, I didn't mean good for the Kurgat so much as "more than fair". Camo and +2 ARM are way more valuable than Engineering and Mines, so I assume the change I proposed is balanced on the side of overcosted.

Unfortunately we already know the unit won't get Sapper (we've seen the model). I think Minelayer would be an excellent skill for Kurgats in general, but it does nothing to help the autocannon profile become worthwhile.

 Kanluwen wrote:


Because right now, it feels like the reasoning behind wanting the Autocannon to be Operative Group is simply so that you can make the Haris a full one rather than an undergunned one.

I feel like thats been the central and stated point of the argument from the beginning. The Kurgat Autocannon profile is awful. It either needs to be able to join the link or receive some kind of buff. There's literally no other reason to want it to be part of the operative group. Really, the only reason the Operative and Support groups even exist is to keep the Autocannon profile out of the Haris.

HQ images finally!




First up, Hollow Men and Cube Jager painted:


PanO:

They didn't show off the Kamau with HRL, which is a bummer. Model was rendered sliding to one knee with the HRL readied and firing.

Ariadna:


ALEPH:


Combined Army(it's just the Kurgat):


Yu Jing:

All the links are broken. Rehost?

 TigerMafia wrote:
All the links are broken. Rehost?

Uuuuuuuuuughh...it's not they're broken it's them requiring being signed in to the CB forums. Gah hold on.

And I can't rehost them easily it seems.

They're rehosted on Dakka. Should be good now.

Thanks! The Kurgat looks nice. The old autocannon mini is still one of my favourites and has held up well imo, though the scale discrepancy is a bit noticeable. I like that they basically just updated the existing one.

Kurgat w/ bro-fist mode is a weird pose, but should be a solid model in the end.

 Mysterio wrote:
Kurgat w/ bro-fist mode is a weird pose, but should be a solid model in the end.

Because of how the hand is shaped I am very confident that a little bit of bending on both arms and a small amount of GS you can get the model to two hand fire that cannon. I still think it would also be better off putting the cannon arms on the awkwardly kneeling kurgat and then the sword/gun arms on the standing kurgat.

 BrotherGecko wrote:

 Mysterio wrote:
Kurgat w/ bro-fist mode is a weird pose, but should be a solid model in the end.

Because of how the hand is shaped I am very confident that a little bit of bending on both arms and a small amount of GS you can get the model to two hand fire that cannon. I still think it would also be better off putting the cannon arms on the awkwardly kneeling kurgat and then the sword/gun arms on the standing kurgat.

I'll be curious to see if anyone can pull it off.

I really don't like the fist on this one. What is he supposed to be doing? I really prefer the classic model's firing pose. The armor and mask looks pretty nice though. I wish he kept more of the poches and the pack from the old model though.

Clearly he's supposed to be fistbumping another Kurgat, since he just scored a sweet 360 noscope.

This isn't hard people!

 Kanluwen wrote:
Clearly he's supposed to be fistbumping another Kurgat, since he just scored a sweet 360 noscope.

This isn't hard people!

Maybe I can replace the kneeling one's knife with a fist. That would almost make the poses make sense.

I wonder how delicate, or robust, those "heels" on the Dakini will be.

Pre-order those hollow men, Tunguska fans.

Some interesting concepts for Yu Jing. I do want to see the HI AD mini, the Liu Xing. Poncho on the Xencha is sad.

Lets play, Rock, Paper, Autocannon, yo!

And Aida Swanson the new ITS model

Whew!

Do not want!

Not like that damn sniper bounty hunter model from...all those years ago!

 Mysterio wrote:
Whew!

Do not want!

Is it the tactical poncho? It's got to be the tactical poncho, right?

Hey, you leave the Tactical Poncho out of this.

More things need them!

Uhm, no. It is a sign of laziness. The sculptor is not doing his job and sculpting a detailed mini. He is 'hiding' everything under the TP. CB tends to overuse things because they looked good once, the first time. See: Rage Fist and Tactical Debris. We're seeing more than a few hooded short jackets too.

 Red Harvest wrote:
Uhm, no. It is a sign of laziness. The sculptor is not doing his job and sculpting a detailed mini. He is 'hiding' everything under the TP. CB tends to overuse things because they looked good once, the first time. See: Rage Fist and Tactical Debris. We're seeing more than a few hooded short jackets too.

Ragefist and tactical debris is a bit of a different quandry. It was because they didn't want to be bothered making more unique poses or messing around too much with the detailing.

Plus ponchos are cool.

Not every tactical poncho can be as cool as the Ayyar's.

Aida Swanson is interesting. A Shasvastii that is helping humans? The only sectorials able to take her are Shasvastii, which is obvious, and Neoterra. What? I'm down for more Shasvastii human infiltrators, I just wish she didn't look so much like a Tohaa instead of a human.

Well she is the smuggler who infiltrated Shasvastii on Nomad ships and started the Wotan conflict, she is the one who initiated the Treason crisis and she is the one who was seen on Dawn before the Kurage Crisis happened, so helping humans may be a stretch.

For sure this is a character that was on the Human sphere as mention for a long time.

 Red Harvest wrote:

 Mysterio wrote:
Whew!

Do not want!

Is it the tactical poncho?

Combat mumu(tm).