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after seeing them get nerfed with random strength shots. how are obliterators still viable option for most armies?

Obliterators are one of the most hard hitting consistent choices in the chaos book. You get to choose your target after rolling for their random stats and even at worse they're a unit of 4 shot autocannons (and that's assuming you roll 1 all 3 times). With access to great buffs and the ability to shoot twice they're a fantastic choice as well as being native deepstrikers that aren't actually super vulnerable to screening.

You can use some of the best Chaos strategems on them, Endless Cacophony (assuming they're Slaanesh marked of course) and Veterans of the Long War. Also, as Farseer mentioned, even at worst their guns are decent (and assault rather than heavy, so no penalties to hit after deep striking). For maximum dakka, you can cast Prescience on them. With the above mentioned strategems, that's 24 shots hitting on a 2+ and wounding even the heaviest targets on a 4+; and that's assuming you roll poorly for their guns! If you're bothering to spend the CP, you've probably rolled better for the guns, meaning you're wounding heavy tanks on 3s and lighter tanks/monsters on 2s.

It's a lot of points and a lot of CP, but they should pretty reliably delete just about anything you point them at.

They also pair quite nicely with a Nurgle Loci, with VotLW active they do an additional wound on 5+.

Oblitreerator's a fun tactic. Yes, I insist on calling it that.

For those uninitiated, that's the Feculant Gnarlmaw from the Chaos Daemons book, which buffs the durability of any Nurgle Daemon model nearby (aka, all the good units in your army anyway).

0+ saving Obliterators that can fall back and shoot? Yes, please.

They also have great synergy with Cultists. Use Tide of Traitors to create an instant screen for your best shooting unit on any table edge.

They just have so much flexibility with 12 mid-high strength shots that get lots of tasty buffs.

I so want to use Obliterators but the three CSM armies I have are:
World Eaters - as far as fluff is concerned, you could maybe make a case but the MoK makes them lose out on most of the tasty buffs you can give them.
Night Lords - I'd have more flexibility game wise but this would be such a fluff contradiction.
Thousand Sons - my new army, which can't take Obliterators.

 Farseer_V2 wrote:
Obliterators are one of the most hard hitting consistent choices in the chaos book. You get to choose your target after rolling for their random stats and even at worse they're a unit of 4 shot autocannons (and that's assuming you roll 1 all 3 times). With access to great buffs and the ability to shoot twice they're a fantastic choice as well as being native deepstrikers that aren't actually super vulnerable to screening.

Explain? I was under the impression you chose target, THEN rolled stats.

 JNAProductions wrote:

 Farseer_V2 wrote:
Obliterators are one of the most hard hitting consistent choices in the chaos book. You get to choose your target after rolling for their random stats and even at worse they're a unit of 4 shot autocannons (and that's assuming you roll 1 all 3 times). With access to great buffs and the ability to shoot twice they're a fantastic choice as well as being native deepstrikers that aren't actually super vulnerable to screening.

Explain? I was under the impression you chose target, THEN rolled stats.

It says when a unit of Obliterators is chosen to shoot roll 3 D3. You don't select a target prior to selecting a unit to shoot per the rulebook - the first step is to choose a unit to shoot THEN choose a target.

Explain? I was under the impression you chose target, THEN rolled stats.

Without having a codec in front of me I think it says ”when they are selected to shoot” so step 1 of a the shooting process. Selecting target is step 2. So yes, you roll the stats first

Holy poop, you're right!

THAT'S AWESOME!

If they were stuck at Assault 2 like the index, they probably would have been outclassed by Terminators, and Tanks.

But with Assault 4, they are pretty hearty.

I have used Oblits in every edition since 5th This is the best iteration weve gotten. No more deepstrike failures. No more annoying bookkeeping of what weapons you fired.

Kinda miss T5, but more wounds is fair in my book.

Assault 4 was really the clincher between them being useless and awesome

Still feel like the Index entry for them was full of typos, and a lot of people got confused about the rules. But yeah, Obliterators are awesome.

And even with the WORST roll one every D3, the gun's stat still looks like this:
Assault 4, S7, AP-1, Damage 1. That's basically a Reaper Autocannon, right? Except NOT Heavy.

The chances of rolling 1s on all three D3 rolls is rare to say the least. If at least 1 roll is higher, you instantly have a superior weapon.
Getting S8 or 9 means wounding Marines on 2+ and 95% of vehicles on 3+.
AP -2 strips cover and makes you armour save worse
Damage 2+ instantly makes the gun viable against multi-wound model units

What makes Oblits good is that even the worst roll for them is an ok option that can cause reliable damage. Any roll higher is a straight bonus.

-

The actual question is: are termy a viable choice?

They are so badly outclassed by obliterators that there is no point in fielding them.

I believe CSM termies can bring combi-weapons which is really good for spamming plasma and flamers.

 brugner8 wrote:
The actual question is: are termy a viable choice?

They are so badly outclassed by obliterators that there is no point in fielding them.

Terminators are still pretty good in melee as a whole, though less effective against large targets (but that was everyone for the most part). I can probably count on one hand how often I used a Chainfist to any effect in 6th or 7th.

Being able to stack on Combi-Weapons is cool too.

Thunderhammers and chainfists are good but you a character to buff your terms and they might not make the charge.

What's all this talk of chainfists? They are way worse now than they were in 7th.

In 8th they should be 15pts Sx2 AP-4 Dd3, Dd6 vs units with the vehicle keyword, but instead they're just unusable vs powerfists.

A unit of nurgle obliterators running around a tree has a 0+ save from shooting, can have either a -1 to hit or ignore cover from chapter tactic, be buffed to t5 by epidemius, fall back and fire and deal an extra wound on 5+ with VOTLW. Man I love soup lists

Gremmer wrote:
A unit of nurgle obliterators running around a tree has a 0+ save from shooting, can have either a -1 to hit or ignore cover from chapter tactic, be buffed to t5 by epidemius, fall back and fire and deal an extra wound on 5+ with VOTLW. Man I love soup lists

Which isn't really too helpful if the enemy doesn't run at you since you only have 24" range.

 mrhappyface wrote:

Gremmer wrote:
A unit of nurgle obliterators running around a tree has a 0+ save from shooting, can have either a -1 to hit or ignore cover from chapter tactic, be buffed to t5 by epidemius, fall back and fire and deal an extra wound on 5+ with VOTLW. Man I love soup lists

Which isn't really too helpful if the enemy doesn't run at you since you only have 24" range.

The smart move is to use Slimux to drop the tree near the mid field so you've got a much better threat bubble.

 mrhappyface wrote:

Gremmer wrote:
A unit of nurgle obliterators running around a tree has a 0+ save from shooting, can have either a -1 to hit or ignore cover from chapter tactic, be buffed to t5 by epidemius, fall back and fire and deal an extra wound on 5+ with VOTLW. Man I love soup lists

Which isn't really too helpful if the enemy doesn't run at you since you only have 24" range.

Slimux advances, drops a tree (those bases are damn long) and you ds the obliterator down. It’s really not hard and you don’t have to waste a detachment slot. Questions?

Obliterators have been one of the most consistent performers in the Chaos army for 20+ years.

Man, I wish their models were good...

 brugner8 wrote:
The actual question is: are termy a viable choice?

They are so badly outclassed by obliterators that there is no point in fielding them.

Other than being able to take them from a completely different category, but that doesn't mean a lot these days.

Terminators have issues currently, I just don't see any reason to field them currently.

Death Guard Terminators are pretty good, but then again, that could be because DG don't have Obliterators.

The problem is not really Obliterators vs Terminators, it's just Terminators, period.

im not sure mark them Nurgle and get extra durability is better than mark them slaanesh for extra shots and you need to spend a detachment (fortification network) to get the tree, am i right or using Slimux ability wont let you spend that extra detachment?

It probably isn't but it is an interesting option to try something outside the norm or to try to play more to a theme.

Of course a 0+ save still wounds on a saving throw of one, and the base save is 2+ which fails saving throw on a roll of one. If they bring heavy AP against the oblit maybe useful, but then again you are investing in a slimux and the tree in addition. Its good but far from broken .