Necrons NEW 8th ed. Codex tactica - [please post lists under spoilers]

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**tneva82**

vict0988 wrote:
ImPhaeronWeasel wrote:
Does anyone have tips on how to deploy necrons?

Lets say a 2k points game using the new GW missions.

Are there any strategies when you know you‘re going first/second

You don't know whether you are going first or second in the new GW missions,.

I would say you know pretty well. He who deployes his army first goes first except for the 1/6 chance of seizing.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
BTW what are necron's tools of dealing with flyers in general? Ignore them as well as you can? Doomsday ark -1 to hit or not? Whatabout -2 to hit flyers?

**Shaelinith**

tneva82 wrote:
BTW what are necron's tools of dealing with flyers in general? Ignore them as well as you can? Doomsday ark -1 to hit or not? Whatabout -2 to hit flyers?

I have only played versus a couple of DE flyers, not the whole circus, and i ignored them. I field a lot of Tesla and they obviously don't work.
I am not sure i would shoot with the DDA too, random shots and the -1 strat is not that great.

Maybe destroyers with Extermination Protocol (and you can MWBD them to counter the first -1 to hit) ? But as usual, it will be difficult to keep them alive more that one turn.

Ctan could work if you manage to be able to charge. But you would need scarabs to shield the Overwatch of the Craftworld one.

If you play Sautekh, you can try to pile all the buffs and manage to take down one (MWBD, Methodical Destruction, Stalker for rerolls, ...), but you will probably commit a lot. I really don't know how we counter flyer heavy lists though.

**IHateNids**

Depends on your meta really

my local *only* has flyers taken from CWE lists, so taking them out is pretty difficult, at least where I am. Therefore, I personally try to ignore them.

I'd personally attempt to combo MWBD & Methodical Destruction, as a lot of flyers have fairly low Toughenss so sheer volume of Tesla will hurt of not cripple

Otherwise I would suggest just throwing high ROF mid-strength weapons at it. I would think this is one of the few areas where Annihilation Barges and Particle Blades might actually be helpful

**p5freak**

tneva82 wrote:

BTW what are necron's tools of dealing with flyers in general? Ignore them as well as you can? Doomsday ark -1 to hit or not? Whatabout -2 to hit flyers?

Place models in the flyers path, it cant move because it must stay away more than 1" from enemy models, or is forced to fly off the table, and is destroyed. Lots of necron units can move 10" and more.

**Red Corsair**

MWBD and the sahtek strat can get you to +2 to hit. Could also assault with a D-Lord or scarabs.

**drakerocket**

So! For my list construction to go as I'd like one of my detachments is spearhead with 1 cyptek, 9 tomb blades and 3x DDA. What dynasty should I use?

(For reference, the rest of the list is a novak outrider with 3x3 scarabs, a 6 man wraith blob, a CCB with relic and a aux super heavy with a seraptek)

**IHateNids**

if you want an Ordnance Battery, Sautekh would be useful. Take the extra relic, and give the Cryptek (who I assume is cloaked) the Abyssal Staff.

Highly efficient method of popping the Strat to Methodically Destruct something with 3 Doomsdays going ham on a target.

Nihilakh also works, to sit still and reroll ones to hit.
Also allows you to smash & grab an objective, and play their strat instead, which gives 9 guys with -1 to hit, T5, 2+ save, and 2 wounds reanimating (also doesnt need the relic)

YMMV, I would lean Sautekh, as then the Arks can move up as well if they need to

EDIT: I can grammar good....

**iGuy91**

I had two games over the weekend which I had some fun with, and I figured I'd share. 1 vs Raven Guard SM, 1 vs Tau Sept Tau at 1500 pts

Game 1 vs Primaris Raven Guard

Spoiler:

Game 2 vs Tau

Spoiler:

**Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll**

Honestly, I'd attack Flyers with Novokh Scarabs. They're small and don't SEEM like flyers, but they're close-combat flyers, and with a 10" move will likely be able to catch up with an catch most flyers. If you REALLY are having trouble catching, use the advance-and-charge CP. The -1 to hit is only for shooting, so just rip them to shreds.

**torblind**

Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll wrote:
Honestly, I'd attack Flyers with Novokh Scarabs. They're small and don't SEEM like flyers, but they're close-combat flyers, and with a 10" move will likely be able to catch up with an catch most flyers. If you REALLY are having trouble catching, use the advance-and-charge CP. The -1 to hit is only for shooting, so just rip them to shreds.

Will they though. 9 scarabs rerolling to hit do 36/2 + 36/2/2 hits = 27. 1/3 wound = 9 , 1/3 unsaved = 3 damage. If you sacrifice one you get 2.7+D3 wounds.

10 Tesla immortals proc'ing on 6s do ~2.2 wounds

It's not too far off.

This is hardly shredding. And you're not fitting another unit of scarabs into that CC.

6 destroyers unbuffed are already better than this.

**Shaelinith**

p5freak wrote:
tneva82 wrote:

BTW what are necron's tools of dealing with flyers in general? Ignore them as well as you can? Doomsday ark -1 to hit or not? Whatabout -2 to hit flyers?

Place models in the flyers path, it cant move because it must stay away more than 1" from enemy models, or is forced to fly off the table, and is destroyed. Lots of necron units can move 10" and more.

Doesn't work with Craftworld flyers, or Stormraven (which are played) and as we are not exactly playing a fast horde army, i don't know how you can consistently apply that in actual games against a skilled opponent. Honestly, how many times have you actually destroyed a flyer with this (genuine question) ?

**iGuy91**

Shaelinith wrote:
p5freak wrote:
tneva82 wrote:

BTW what are necron's tools of dealing with flyers in general? Ignore them as well as you can? Doomsday ark -1 to hit or not? Whatabout -2 to hit flyers?

Place models in the flyers path, it cant move because it must stay away more than 1" from enemy models, or is forced to fly off the table, and is destroyed. Lots of necron units can move 10" and more.

Doesn't work with Craftworld flyers, or Stormraven (which are played) and as we are not exactly playing a fast horde army, i don't know how you can consistently apply that in actual games against a skilled opponent. Honestly, how many times have you actually destroyed a flyer with this (genuine question) ?

I have seen it happen....literally one time. To one flyer...in one game. Its impossible vs Eldar, they get 2 90 degree pivots.

**Draco765**

p5freak wrote:
tneva82 wrote:

BTW what are necron's tools of dealing with flyers in general? Ignore them as well as you can? Doomsday ark -1 to hit or not? Whatabout -2 to hit flyers?

Place models in the flyers path, it cant move because it must stay away more than 1" from enemy models, or is forced to fly off the table, and is destroyed. Lots of necron units can move 10" and more.

The Fly keyword lets them move over models as if they are not there.

You have to have models where they intend on stopping, that is where they must stay out of 1 inch.

Big hoard armies can pull that off, not Necrons.

**tneva82**

Yeah seems like not going to work that easily with necrons. What we have? Crapload of scarab swarms? Guess that MIGHT work against non-eldars(no way we can cover 360 degree path...) but seems awfully lot of points to invest.

(also I might be facing one in sub-2k list making points spent feel even more)

**IHateNids**

1750 Points

Seraptekh/Deciever Bomb being the biggest lump of anything in the list.

What else should I try and shoehorn in?

I'm thinking two units of 10 Teslas for backfield, and then some other stuff to teleport in around the big guy to make a massive one-flank shove (or put him on one side and everything else on the other, not decided yet)

Also, what guns on Sera?

**Techpriestsupport**

torblind wrote:
Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll wrote:
Honestly, I'd attack Flyers with Novokh Scarabs. They're small and don't SEEM like flyers, but they're close-combat flyers, and with a 10" move will likely be able to catch up with an catch most flyers. If you REALLY are having trouble catching, use the advance-and-charge CP. The -1 to hit is only for shooting, so just rip them to shreds.

Will they though. 9 scarabs rerolling to hit do 36/2 + 36/2/2 hits = 27. 1/3 wound = 9 , 1/3 unsaved = 3 damage. If you sacrifice one you get 2.7+D3 wounds.

10 Tesla immortals proc'ing on 6s do ~2.2 wounds

It's not too far off.

This is hardly shredding. And you're not fitting another unit of scarabs into that CC.

6 destroyers unbuffed are already better than this.

If you replace the scarabs with 6 wraiths how does it go? 6 wraiths get less attacks than 9 scarabs but have a higher WS, higher str and a nasty save mod.

6 wraiths attack, 18 attacks. 12 hit, say 4-5 wound. The wraiths could have had ranged weapons and fired before going into combat. Maybe add a wound of two for that.
if they have the particle beam they can add an attack in close combat with them and maybe add a hit or two.

That's unbuffed with no novokh strategem.

**Shaelinith**

Techpriestsupport wrote:
If you replace the scarabs with 6 wraiths how does it go? 6 wraiths get less attacks than 9 scarabs but have a higher WS, higher str and a nasty save mod.

6 wraiths attack, 18 attacks. 12 hit, say 4-5 wound. The wraiths could have had ranged weapons and fired before going into combat. Maybe add a wound of two for that.
if they have the particle beam they can add an attack in close combat with them and maybe add a hit or two.

That's unbuffed with no novokh strategem.

Wraiths don't have the keyword Fly sadly, they can't engage flyers

**torblind**

Techpriestsupport wrote:
torblind wrote:
Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll wrote:
Honestly, I'd attack Flyers with Novokh Scarabs. They're small and don't SEEM like flyers, but they're close-combat flyers, and with a 10" move will likely be able to catch up with an catch most flyers. If you REALLY are having trouble catching, use the advance-and-charge CP. The -1 to hit is only for shooting, so just rip them to shreds.

Will they though. 9 scarabs rerolling to hit do 36/2 + 36/2/2 hits = 27. 1/3 wound = 9 , 1/3 unsaved = 3 damage. If you sacrifice one you get 2.7+D3 wounds.

10 Tesla immortals proc'ing on 6s do ~2.2 wounds

It's not too far off.

This is hardly shredding. And you're not fitting another unit of scarabs into that CC.

6 destroyers unbuffed are already better than this.

If you replace the scarabs with 6 wraiths how does it go? 6 wraiths get less attacks than 9 scarabs but have a higher WS, higher str and a nasty save mod.

6 wraiths attack, 18 attacks. 12 hit, say 4-5 wound. The wraiths could have had ranged weapons and fired before going into combat. Maybe add a wound of two for that.
if they have the particle beam they can add an attack in close combat with them and maybe add a hit or two.

That's unbuffed with no novokh strategem.

You could just punch the numbers into www.dice-hammer.com

The scarabs are cheaper, sure, but keep in mind how you plan to fit the units into CC. 9 scarabs could hit one flyer each, doing 3W to each, but they may not fit both on the same target. And it's not just the space around the target, there's the traffic congestion to get them both to charge range.

Wraiths offer higher damage output with a more condensed foot-print (6 instead of 9 bases), but they don't have Fly. Ignoring terrain doesn't help when you need to charge up into the air.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
EDIT: Ah wraiths lacking Fly was already mentioned.

**p5freak**

Shaelinith wrote:
p5freak wrote:
tneva82 wrote:

BTW what are necron's tools of dealing with flyers in general? Ignore them as well as you can? Doomsday ark -1 to hit or not? Whatabout -2 to hit flyers?

Place models in the flyers path, it cant move because it must stay away more than 1" from enemy models, or is forced to fly off the table, and is destroyed. Lots of necron units can move 10" and more.

Doesn't work with Craftworld flyers, or Stormraven (which are played) and as we are not exactly playing a fast horde army, i don't know how you can consistently apply that in actual games against a skilled opponent. Honestly, how many times have you actually destroyed a flyer with this (genuine question) ?

Why doesnt it work with craftworld flyers ? They rotate up to 90 first, then move, then rotate again up to 90. Stormraven can hover, that doesnt work. I killed a hemlock wraithfighter once that way. No need for a fast horde army. 9 nephrekh scarabs and 9 nephrekh tomb blades auto advance 16 and 20".

**Shaelinith**

p5freak wrote:
Why doesnt it work with craftworld flyers ? They rotate up to 90 first, then move, then rotate again up to 90. Stormraven can hover, that doesnt work. I killed a hemlock wraithfighter once that way. No need for a fast horde army. 9 nephrekh scarabs and 9 nephrekh tomb blades auto advance 16 and 20".

You can rotate at the end of your movement too, so if your opponent is not an idiot he rotate and the end of his movement to a position you cannot reach.

**tneva82**

p5freak wrote:
Shaelinith wrote:
p5freak wrote:
tneva82 wrote:

BTW what are necron's tools of dealing with flyers in general? Ignore them as well as you can? Doomsday ark -1 to hit or not? Whatabout -2 to hit flyers?

Place models in the flyers path, it cant move because it must stay away more than 1" from enemy models, or is forced to fly off the table, and is destroyed. Lots of necron units can move 10" and more.

Doesn't work with Craftworld flyers, or Stormraven (which are played) and as we are not exactly playing a fast horde army, i don't know how you can consistently apply that in actual games against a skilled opponent. Honestly, how many times have you actually destroyed a flyer with this (genuine question) ?

Why doesnt it work with craftworld flyers ? They rotate up to 90 first, then move, then rotate again up to 90. Stormraven can hover, that doesnt work. I killed a hemlock wraithfighter once that way. No need for a fast horde army. 9 nephrekh scarabs and 9 nephrekh tomb blades auto advance 16 and 20".

90 degree left or right, then 20 or more, 90 degree and what up to 40" more ? That's hell of a area to cover.

**p5freak**

tneva82 wrote:
p5freak wrote:
Shaelinith wrote:
p5freak wrote:
tneva82 wrote:

BTW what are necron's tools of dealing with flyers in general? Ignore them as well as you can? Doomsday ark -1 to hit or not? Whatabout -2 to hit flyers?

Place models in the flyers path, it cant move because it must stay away more than 1" from enemy models, or is forced to fly off the table, and is destroyed. Lots of necron units can move 10" and more.

Doesn't work with Craftworld flyers, or Stormraven (which are played) and as we are not exactly playing a fast horde army, i don't know how you can consistently apply that in actual games against a skilled opponent. Honestly, how many times have you actually destroyed a flyer with this (genuine question) ?

Why doesnt it work with craftworld flyers ? They rotate up to 90 first, then move, then rotate again up to 90. Stormraven can hover, that doesnt work. I killed a hemlock wraithfighter once that way. No need for a fast horde army. 9 nephrekh scarabs and 9 nephrekh tomb blades auto advance 16 and 20".

90 degree left or right, then 20 or more, 90 degree and what up to 40" more ? That's hell of a area to cover.

A flyer cannot always turn 90 left or right, at one point in the game he will be close to the table edge. A flyer with minimum move cant stay in the middle for the entire game. Also, a flyer cant move like you describe it, not even eldar ones. He rotates up to 90 first, then makes his entire movement, then rotates again, and stands still. No more moving after the second rotation.

**Shaelinith**

p5freak wrote:
A flyer cannot always turn 90 left or right, at one point in the game he will be close to the table edge. A flyer with minimum move cant stay in the middle for the entire game. Also, a flyer cant move like you describe it, not even eldar ones. He rotates up to 90 first, then makes his entire movement, then rotates again, and stands still. No more moving after the second rotation.

A craftworld flyer can stay in its deployment zone all the game if it needs to. The hemlock with its flamer don't do this because of its range, but the other ones can.

You can also pivot 180° between the end of your movement and your next movement so again, with your huge movement, it is more a mistake from the flyer player to be catch by this trick. Even Nephrek advancing Tomb Blades are slower than the most degraded movement of the Craftworld flyer.

You can't do this T1 or T2 (again if your opponent has half a functionnal brain), so it is a legitimate question to ask how Necron handle flyers during the most deadly turns of the game especially as the flyers are making a comeback in the meta.

**iGuy91**

I'd suggest a Gauss Pylon. Its +1 to hit flyers naturally. Which helps counteract their hard to hit nature.

Also, at STR 16, AP-4 it wounds them on 2s, gives no saves, and gets you 6+d3 damage per hit, killing in 2 unsaved wounds.

Also at T8 with an invuln its not the easiest thing ever to kill.

**Draco765**

Shaelinith wrote:
p5freak wrote:
A flyer cannot always turn 90 left or right, at one point in the game he will be close to the table edge. A flyer with minimum move cant stay in the middle for the entire game. Also, a flyer cant move like you describe it, not even eldar ones. He rotates up to 90 first, then makes his entire movement, then rotates again, and stands still. No more moving after the second rotation.

A craftworld flyer can stay in its deployment zone all the game if it needs to. The hemlock with its flamer don't do this because of its range, but the other ones can.

You can also pivot 180° between the end of your movement and your next movement so again, with your huge movement, it is more a mistake from the flyer player to be catch by this trick. Even Nephrek advancing Tomb Blades are slower than the most degraded movement of the Craftworld flyer.

You can't do this T1 or T2 (again if your opponent has half a functionnal brain), so it is a legitimate question to ask how Necron handle flyers during the most deadly turns of the game especially as the flyers are making a comeback in the meta.

Just to support this: I have a Chaos list that uses Xiphon Pattern Interceptors (sniped off ebay before forgeworld prince increase) that either never leave my deployment zone or just get to the center of the board and fly back and forth from table edge to table edge, since their guns are 48" and 60" with ignore heavy penalty (also with +1 vs FLY) along with the extra 90 turn at the end of move they will never be in danger of being forced off the table or blocked by models on the ground.

Now, our flyers, yes, they have that chance. Night Scythes can be tricky as you want to drop off units in certain places, those places might not be the best for the Flyer to be though. Doom Scythes can also be tricky to keep in range to use the Stratagem more than once.

**IHateNids**

Xiphons dont have Vector Dancer?

**Facisminthe41m**

Tomb Stalker and Tomb Sentinel really don't seem so bad for the points, and they offer something different to the army. Am I missing something with these guys?

**IHateNids**

Sentinel is pretty good, Stalker is a little under-gunned for the cost

However, the issue with them is:
- Stalker: as stated, doesnt have the firepower to be a "good" pick given a DDA is 30(iirc) points more
- Sentinel: is FA. Therefore, never going to be taken

**IanVanCheese**

Red Corsair wrote:
MWBD and the sahtek strat can get you to +2 to hit.

This has always been my solution.

**torblind**

IHateNids wrote:
Sentinel is pretty good, Stalker is a little under-gunned for the cost

However, the issue with them is:
- Stalker: as stated, doesnt have the firepower to be a "good" pick given a DDA is 30(iirc) points more
- Sentinel: is FA. Therefore, never going to be taken

Add to it the range of the gun (!2"), motivating entering via deep strike, giving it -1 to hit (Heavy) unless Sautekh, and the enemy may or may not have screened his valuable targets from deep strikes.

But if you can teleport in on an unexpecting gunline, shoot to cripple and charge in to tag, then you could situationally make good use of it. Or better yet, teleport in 2-3 of them, but now you're seriously sacrificing other parts of your army.