Delvarus Centurion wrote:
In the Leman Russ book, Leman Russ admitted that he got beat by the lion. I don't want this to turn into a pissing contest. If you are being totally fair, you'd have to say Russ and the Lion are completely evenly matched. They fought for weeks completely even matched and then the sucker punched ended it. I wish writers would take their ego's out of the writing. and I'm a world eaters player so 'I' am not biased here.

w1zard wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:
In the Leman Russ book, Leman Russ admitted that he got beat by the lion. I don't want this to turn into a pissing contest. If you are being totally fair, you'd have to say Russ and the Lion are completely evenly matched. They fought for weeks completely even matched and then the sucker punched ended it. I wish writers would take their ego's out of the writing. and I'm a world eaters player so 'I' am not biased here.

Wasn't there another occasion where there was some sort of war game exercise and the Space Wolves got soundly beaten by the Dark Angels, even though duel between Russ and the Lion ended in a tie?

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:
In the Leman Russ book, Leman Russ admitted that he got beat by the lion. I don't want this to turn into a pissing contest. If you are being totally fair, you'd have to say Russ and the Lion are completely evenly matched. They fought for weeks completely even matched and then the sucker punched ended it. I wish writers would take their ego's out of the writing. and I'm a world eaters player so 'I' am not biased here.

 Formosa wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:
In the Leman Russ book, Leman Russ admitted that he got beat by the lion. I don't want this to turn into a pissing contest. If you are being totally fair, you'd have to say Russ and the Lion are completely evenly matched. They fought for weeks completely even matched and then the sucker punched ended it. I wish writers would take their ego's out of the writing. and I'm a world eaters player so 'I' am not biased here.

Biased writing, it was a book about the space wolves, also the fight didnt last weeks, thats imperial "legend" not fact, primarchs leman russ shows what ACTUALLY happened, yes Russ got beat, soundly, but Lion didnt take the killing blow so it degenerated into a brawl, which Russ still didnt win, THEN the "sucker punch" happened.

The Irony of the whole thing is the Lion was trying to teach Russ the EXACT thing that Russ attacked Angron over, that he could be more than "just" a killer, guess its at least consistent that Russ is a hypocrite of the highest order.

 Formosa wrote:
...Russ is a hypocrite of the highest order.

w1zard wrote:

 Formosa wrote:
...Russ is a hypocrite of the highest order.

I wish I could give some sort of dakka dakka gold for this comment. It is just so true on so many levels that I could spend days giving examples of why it is true.

I don't hate Russ, although I will say that the whole Prospero thing left me with a sour taste in my mouth and made me seriously question the content of his character. But even for people who love Russ and the Space Wolves, you cannot deny that they are absolutely MASSIVE hypocrites, in addition to being extremely arrogant.

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:

 Formosa wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:
In the Leman Russ book, Leman Russ admitted that he got beat by the lion. I don't want this to turn into a pissing contest. If you are being totally fair, you'd have to say Russ and the Lion are completely evenly matched. They fought for weeks completely even matched and then the sucker punched ended it. I wish writers would take their ego's out of the writing. and I'm a world eaters player so 'I' am not biased here.

Biased writing, it was a book about the space wolves, also the fight didnt last weeks, thats imperial "legend" not fact, primarchs leman russ shows what ACTUALLY happened, yes Russ got beat, soundly, but Lion didnt take the killing blow so it degenerated into a brawl, which Russ still didnt win, THEN the "sucker punch" happened.

The Irony of the whole thing is the Lion was trying to teach Russ the EXACT thing that Russ attacked Angron over, that he could be more than "just" a killer, guess its at least consistent that Russ is a hypocrite of the highest order.

It did last weeks, unless you can quote a source that says otherwise. Yeah Leman Russ shows what actually happened, hence the biased writing lol, rather than actual lore. Thats exactly what I'm talking about. I never said Russ won, I'm saying the Lion didn't. The Lion wasn't trying to teach him anything, it had nothing to do with the Angron situation. Again now its you that is just making up gak because you don't like Russ. Again this is what I'm talking about.

 Formosa wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:

 Formosa wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:
In the Leman Russ book, Leman Russ admitted that he got beat by the lion. I don't want this to turn into a pissing contest. If you are being totally fair, you'd have to say Russ and the Lion are completely evenly matched. They fought for weeks completely even matched and then the sucker punched ended it. I wish writers would take their ego's out of the writing. and I'm a world eaters player so 'I' am not biased here.

Biased writing, it was a book about the space wolves, also the fight didnt last weeks, thats imperial "legend" not fact, primarchs leman russ shows what ACTUALLY happened, yes Russ got beat, soundly, but Lion didnt take the killing blow so it degenerated into a brawl, which Russ still didnt win, THEN the "sucker punch" happened.

The Irony of the whole thing is the Lion was trying to teach Russ the EXACT thing that Russ attacked Angron over, that he could be more than "just" a killer, guess its at least consistent that Russ is a hypocrite of the highest order.

It did last weeks, unless you can quote a source that says otherwise. Yeah Leman Russ shows what actually happened, hence the biased writing lol, rather than actual lore. Thats exactly what I'm talking about. I never said Russ won, I'm saying the Lion didn't. The Lion wasn't trying to teach him anything, it had nothing to do with the Angron situation. Again now its you that is just making up gak because you don't like Russ. Again this is what I'm talking about.

Its didnt last weeks

Ref: Primarchs Leman Russ.

There you go.

What you have is the Index Astartes fluff, fluff written from the perspective of someone 10k years after the events in question and is basically a legend, when the same index astartes states that Russ chopped the head off a warlord titan we know its not quite true, its exagerated, something the Wolves are well known for doing.

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:

 Formosa wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:

 Formosa wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:
In the Leman Russ book, Leman Russ admitted that he got beat by the lion. I don't want this to turn into a pissing contest. If you are being totally fair, you'd have to say Russ and the Lion are completely evenly matched. They fought for weeks completely even matched and then the sucker punched ended it. I wish writers would take their ego's out of the writing. and I'm a world eaters player so 'I' am not biased here.

Biased writing, it was a book about the space wolves, also the fight didnt last weeks, thats imperial "legend" not fact, primarchs leman russ shows what ACTUALLY happened, yes Russ got beat, soundly, but Lion didnt take the killing blow so it degenerated into a brawl, which Russ still didnt win, THEN the "sucker punch" happened.

The Irony of the whole thing is the Lion was trying to teach Russ the EXACT thing that Russ attacked Angron over, that he could be more than "just" a killer, guess its at least consistent that Russ is a hypocrite of the highest order.

It did last weeks, unless you can quote a source that says otherwise. Yeah Leman Russ shows what actually happened, hence the biased writing lol, rather than actual lore. Thats exactly what I'm talking about. I never said Russ won, I'm saying the Lion didn't. The Lion wasn't trying to teach him anything, it had nothing to do with the Angron situation. Again now its you that is just making up gak because you don't like Russ. Again this is what I'm talking about.

Its didnt last weeks

Ref: Primarchs Leman Russ.

There you go.

What you have is the Index Astartes fluff, fluff written from the perspective of someone 10k years after the events in question and is basically a legend, when the same index astartes states that Russ chopped the head off a warlord titan we know its not quite true, its exagerated, something the Wolves are well known for doing.

You have an actual quote?

 Formosa wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:

 Formosa wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:

 Formosa wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:
In the Leman Russ book, Leman Russ admitted that he got beat by the lion. I don't want this to turn into a pissing contest. If you are being totally fair, you'd have to say Russ and the Lion are completely evenly matched. They fought for weeks completely even matched and then the sucker punched ended it. I wish writers would take their ego's out of the writing. and I'm a world eaters player so 'I' am not biased here.

Biased writing, it was a book about the space wolves, also the fight didnt last weeks, thats imperial "legend" not fact, primarchs leman russ shows what ACTUALLY happened, yes Russ got beat, soundly, but Lion didnt take the killing blow so it degenerated into a brawl, which Russ still didnt win, THEN the "sucker punch" happened.

The Irony of the whole thing is the Lion was trying to teach Russ the EXACT thing that Russ attacked Angron over, that he could be more than "just" a killer, guess its at least consistent that Russ is a hypocrite of the highest order.

It did last weeks, unless you can quote a source that says otherwise. Yeah Leman Russ shows what actually happened, hence the biased writing lol, rather than actual lore. Thats exactly what I'm talking about. I never said Russ won, I'm saying the Lion didn't. The Lion wasn't trying to teach him anything, it had nothing to do with the Angron situation. Again now its you that is just making up gak because you don't like Russ. Again this is what I'm talking about.

Its didnt last weeks

Ref: Primarchs Leman Russ.

There you go.

What you have is the Index Astartes fluff, fluff written from the perspective of someone 10k years after the events in question and is basically a legend, when the same index astartes states that Russ chopped the head off a warlord titan we know its not quite true, its exagerated, something the Wolves are well known for doing.

You have an actual quote?

The entire book is the quote, want me to quote the entire book??

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:

 Formosa wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:

 Formosa wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:

 Formosa wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:
In the Leman Russ book, Leman Russ admitted that he got beat by the lion. I don't want this to turn into a pissing contest. If you are being totally fair, you'd have to say Russ and the Lion are completely evenly matched. They fought for weeks completely even matched and then the sucker punched ended it. I wish writers would take their ego's out of the writing. and I'm a world eaters player so 'I' am not biased here.

Biased writing, it was a book about the space wolves, also the fight didnt last weeks, thats imperial "legend" not fact, primarchs leman russ shows what ACTUALLY happened, yes Russ got beat, soundly, but Lion didnt take the killing blow so it degenerated into a brawl, which Russ still didnt win, THEN the "sucker punch" happened.

The Irony of the whole thing is the Lion was trying to teach Russ the EXACT thing that Russ attacked Angron over, that he could be more than "just" a killer, guess its at least consistent that Russ is a hypocrite of the highest order.

It did last weeks, unless you can quote a source that says otherwise. Yeah Leman Russ shows what actually happened, hence the biased writing lol, rather than actual lore. Thats exactly what I'm talking about. I never said Russ won, I'm saying the Lion didn't. The Lion wasn't trying to teach him anything, it had nothing to do with the Angron situation. Again now its you that is just making up gak because you don't like Russ. Again this is what I'm talking about.

Its didnt last weeks

Ref: Primarchs Leman Russ.

There you go.

What you have is the Index Astartes fluff, fluff written from the perspective of someone 10k years after the events in question and is basically a legend, when the same index astartes states that Russ chopped the head off a warlord titan we know its not quite true, its exagerated, something the Wolves are well known for doing.

You have an actual quote?

The entire book is the quote, want me to quote the entire book??

A no would suffice.

 greatbigtree wrote:
Page 187, "The bastard beat me bloody. I have no doubt he could do it again." - Russ

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:

 greatbigtree wrote:
Page 187, "The bastard beat me bloody. I have no doubt he could do it again." - Russ

Exactly, unbelievably bias lol. They fought for weeks or days they would both have to be handling each other for that length of time and then the suckerpunch happened to end it. The writer is so biased it isn't funny. If he wrote that about Angron then okay but the Lion, pure fantasy.

 Formosa wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:

 greatbigtree wrote:
Page 187, "The bastard beat me bloody. I have no doubt he could do it again." - Russ

Exactly, unbelievably bias lol. They fought for weeks or days they would both have to be handling each other for that length of time and then the suckerpunch happened to end it. The writer is so biased it isn't funny. If he wrote that about Angron then okay but the Lion, pure fantasy.

The only fantasy here is your perception of Bias, this was a space wolf book about space wolves and showed them in both a positive and negative light, yes Russ lost to the Lion, but Lion has been shown to be a top tier CC primarch for quite some time now, this should not be a surprise.

As you think its Bias, please explain EXACTLY why you think its bias, as you are coming across as a wolf fanboy that is upset that Russ got beat.... again.

 greatbigtree wrote:
The book also points out Russ's overconfidence. Pg 42, "I'll draw the fool into a trap..." in which he expected to defeat the Lion quickly.

Also, the beat me bloody part is where he points out the fight was over quickly. Not days or weeks.

You are the one emotionally invested in fiction. I'm not a Space Wolves fanboy at all, Russ crawled away from Angron on his hands and knees and that was a good day for me. You are obviously just as biased as the author. I explained exactly why its biased but a biased person isn't going to be swayed by logic. I don't care about Russ I care about the lore and accurate writing. And I'm not anti-Lion, I loved decent of angels and fallen angels.

You are quoting a book on which we are debating the biased nature of the book, quoting it is irrelevant unless you quote things that show that its not biased.

 Formosa wrote:

You are the one emotionally invested in fiction. I'm not a Space Wolves fanboy at all, Russ crawled away from Angron on his hands and knees and that was a good day for me. You are obviously just as biased as the author. I explained exactly why its biased but a biased person isn't going to be swayed by logic. I don't care about Russ I care about the lore and accurate writing. And I'm not anti-Lion, I loved decent of angels and fallen angels.

You are not using logic Delvarus, you are making sweeping statements with no substance, you claim the author is biased and refuse to accept examples that show that the story is infact consistent with the old one, just with more detail is its not a legendary look back but actually the event itself as it happened.

You are quoting a book on which we are debating the biased nature of the book, quoting it is irrelevant unless you quote things that show that its not biased.

And this is a perfect example of what im talking about, you claim that the author is biased but provide no proof or anything really to support your statement, I have asked you twice now to explain EXACTLY why you think they are biased, so explain.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
Is anyone noticing a very continuous pattern to these threads? Or is it just me.

Anyways, the book shows that Russ got beat and the Lion could do it again. The book is an example, and you are ignoring said example why exactly?

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
Is anyone noticing a pattern that continues again and again to these threads or is it just me?

Anyways, the book shows that Russ got beat and the Lion could do it again. The book is an example, and you are ignoring said example why exactly?

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
And the lore before was biased by being created by some imperial servant some tens of thousands of years down the line as a legend. The specifics of the book clarify things, and shows things did not occur specifically as you mentioned.

The bias would be thinking that every primarch is somehow equal to each other, which the Imperials of the future would think. The legends won't say that Russ was a hypocrite, or that Lion had issues trusting people and socializing. They'll mention that they were the greatest heroes of the Imperium ind that they could do groundbreaking feats of power that no mortal man could hope to accomplish in their lifetime.

To think otherwise is to insult the legacy of the Emperor and his own personal sons, many of which gave their lives over to fight against evil. It would be quite heretical as well to many scholars of the Imperium, well known for altering data or changing words to fit their own narrative rather then any sort of factual nature.

 Formosa wrote:

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
Is anyone noticing a pattern that continues again and again to these threads or is it just me?

Anyways, the book shows that Russ got beat and the Lion could do it again. The book is an example, and you are ignoring said example why exactly?

Thats my question too, he claims bias... cos bias!!! while utterly ignoring context.

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
And the lore before was biased by being created by some imperial servant some tens of thousands of years down the line as a legend. The specifics of the book clarify things, and shows things did not occur specifically as you mentioned.

The bias would be thinking that every primarch is somehow equal to each other, which the Imperials of the future would think. The legends won't say that Russ was a hypocrite, or that Lion had issues trusting people and socializing. They'll mention that they were the greatest heroes of the Imperium ind that they could do groundbreaking feats of power that no mortal man could hope to accomplish in their lifetime.

To think otherwise is to insult the legacy of the Emperor and his own personal sons, many of which gave their lives over to fight against evil. It would be quite heretical as well to many scholars of the Imperium, well known for altering data or changing words to fit their own narrative rather then any sort of factual nature.

What are you on about lol


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Formosa wrote:

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
Is anyone noticing a pattern that continues again and again to these threads or is it just me?

Anyways, the book shows that Russ got beat and the Lion could do it again. The book is an example, and you are ignoring said example why exactly?

Thats my question too, he claims bias... cos bias!!! while utterly ignoring context.

And you claim 'not biased' while ignoring lore. I'm ignoring the context of the book because its hard to debate whether the book itself is biased if you are using the book for the context. Give me some context other than the 'actual' book lol Plus you make stuff up.

 Formosa wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
And the lore before was biased by being created by some imperial servant some tens of thousands of years down the line as a legend. The specifics of the book clarify things, and shows things did not occur specifically as you mentioned.

The bias would be thinking that every primarch is somehow equal to each other, which the Imperials of the future would think. The legends won't say that Russ was a hypocrite, or that Lion had issues trusting people and socializing. They'll mention that they were the greatest heroes of the Imperium ind that they could do groundbreaking feats of power that no mortal man could hope to accomplish in their lifetime.

To think otherwise is to insult the legacy of the Emperor and his own personal sons, many of which gave their lives over to fight against evil. It would be quite heretical as well to many scholars of the Imperium, well known for altering data or changing words to fit their own narrative rather then any sort of factual nature.

What are you on about lol


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Formosa wrote:

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
Is anyone noticing a pattern that continues again and again to these threads or is it just me?

Anyways, the book shows that Russ got beat and the Lion could do it again. The book is an example, and you are ignoring said example why exactly?

Thats my question too, he claims bias... cos bias!!! while utterly ignoring context.

And you claim 'not biased' while ignoring lore. I'm ignoring the context of the book because its hard to debate whether the book itself is biased if you are using the book for the context. Give me some context other than the 'actual' book lol Plus you make stuff up.

Me Ignoring lore hahahahhahahhahahahahh, your funny, your the one dismissing a whole book because you think its "biased", so far your entire argument basically resolves around "nuh uh, you are", you see both I and Zebio have told you why one story is incosistent with the other, but you are choosing to Ignore it, so much for "following the lore"




"You do not have to play to this reputation brother, you can drop the pretense at anytime you choose" Lion El'Johnson

"all I see is delusion brother, so much energy so poorly directed" Lion

"you treat all as a game, that is why malcador sent for me, malcador cannot trust you, no one can trust you, your legion is a rabble that would brawl among themselves if you were not there to smack their heads together" Lion

"If only they were more like yours" Russ

"yes!, Yes is that so hard to imagine"

Hmmmm sounds very familiar, almost like what Russ said to Angron, so much for making stuff up eh, seems like Lion was trying to teach Russ a similar lesson to the one that Russ was trying to teach Angron.

 Formosa wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
And the lore before was biased by being created by some imperial servant some tens of thousands of years down the line as a legend. The specifics of the book clarify things, and shows things did not occur specifically as you mentioned.

The bias would be thinking that every primarch is somehow equal to each other, which the Imperials of the future would think. The legends won't say that Russ was a hypocrite, or that Lion had issues trusting people and socializing. They'll mention that they were the greatest heroes of the Imperium ind that they could do groundbreaking feats of power that no mortal man could hope to accomplish in their lifetime.

To think otherwise is to insult the legacy of the Emperor and his own personal sons, many of which gave their lives over to fight against evil. It would be quite heretical as well to many scholars of the Imperium, well known for altering data or changing words to fit their own narrative rather then any sort of factual nature.

What are you on about lol


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Formosa wrote:

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
Is anyone noticing a pattern that continues again and again to these threads or is it just me?

Anyways, the book shows that Russ got beat and the Lion could do it again. The book is an example, and you are ignoring said example why exactly?

Thats my question too, he claims bias... cos bias!!! while utterly ignoring context.

And you claim 'not biased' while ignoring lore. I'm ignoring the context of the book because its hard to debate whether the book itself is biased if you are using the book for the context. Give me some context other than the 'actual' book lol Plus you make stuff up.

"You do not have to play to this reputation brother, you can drop the pretense at anytime you choose" Lion El'Johnson

"all I see is delusion brother, so much energy so poorly directed" Lion

"you treat all as a game, that is why malcador sent for me, malcador cannot trust you, no one can trust you, your legion is a rabble that would brawl among themselves if you were not there to smack their heads together" Lion

"If only they were more like yours" Russ

"yes!, Yes is that so hard to imagine"

Hmmmm sounds very familiar, almost like what Russ said to Angron, so much for making stuff up eh, seems like Lion was trying to teach Russ a similar lesson to the one that Russ was trying to teach Angron.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Formosa wrote:

 Delvarus Centurion wrote:

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
And the lore before was biased by being created by some imperial servant some tens of thousands of years down the line as a legend. The specifics of the book clarify things, and shows things did not occur specifically as you mentioned.

The bias would be thinking that every primarch is somehow equal to each other, which the Imperials of the future would think. The legends won't say that Russ was a hypocrite, or that Lion had issues trusting people and socializing. They'll mention that they were the greatest heroes of the Imperium ind that they could do groundbreaking feats of power that no mortal man could hope to accomplish in their lifetime.

To think otherwise is to insult the legacy of the Emperor and his own personal sons, many of which gave their lives over to fight against evil. It would be quite heretical as well to many scholars of the Imperium, well known for altering data or changing words to fit their own narrative rather then any sort of factual nature.

What are you on about lol


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Formosa wrote:

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
Is anyone noticing a pattern that continues again and again to these threads or is it just me?

Anyways, the book shows that Russ got beat and the Lion could do it again. The book is an example, and you are ignoring said example why exactly?

Thats my question too, he claims bias... cos bias!!! while utterly ignoring context.

And you claim 'not biased' while ignoring lore. I'm ignoring the context of the book because its hard to debate whether the book itself is biased if you are using the book for the context. Give me some context other than the 'actual' book lol Plus you make stuff up.

Me Ignoring lore hahahahhahahhahahahahh, your funny, your the one dismissing a whole book because you think its "biased", so far your entire argument basically resolves around "nuh uh, you are", you see both I and Zebio have told you why one story is incosistent with the other, but you are choosing to Ignore it, so much for "following the lore"




"You do not have to play to this reputation brother, you can drop the pretense at anytime you choose" Lion El'Johnson

"all I see is delusion brother, so much energy so poorly directed" Lion

"you treat all as a game, that is why malcador sent for me, malcador cannot trust you, no one can trust you, your legion is a rabble that would brawl among themselves if you were not there to smack their heads together" Lion

"If only they were more like yours" Russ

"yes!, Yes is that so hard to imagine"

Hmmmm sounds very familiar, almost like what Russ said to Angron, so much for making stuff up eh, seems like Lion was trying to teach Russ a similar lesson to the one that Russ was trying to teach Angron.

 Void__Dragon wrote:
Chris Wraight wrote that book, and Chris Wraight is a huge Space Wolf fan lmao. He writes about them more than pretty much any other Legion.

 greatbigtree wrote:
Don't worry, I'm just making gak up.

"For I was gullible, and my brother taught me the error of my ways." - Russ, pg 231


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Pg 116: "... there it was, mounted to the wall. A most heinous depiction of the ice world's second most feared monster. The Trollsquared. It was as though a troll had consumed another, and their digestive and regenerative might was playing out in horrid splendor within the carving." - Russ