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ESB (10/10)
ANH (9/10)
RotJ (6/10)
TFA (5/10)
R1 (4/10)
RotS (4/10)
TLJ (2/10)
TPM (1/10)
AotC (1/10)

R1 and RotS are more of a tie. I can think of reasons why each should be ranked above the other. I put AotC rock bottom because even Jar Jar is preferable to whining Anakin.

 LunarSol wrote:
I'd probably rank them something like this:

1. The Empire Strikes Back
2. A New Hope
3. The Last Jedi
4. The Return Of The Jedi
5. The Force Awakens
6. Rogue One
7. The Phantom Menace
8. Revenge Of The Sith
9. Attack Of The Clones

But I've honestly never found much value in ranking the Star Wars films. Almost all of them have caveats. Empire is only best in context of 4 and 6. Rogue One is only as low as it is because I don't care for more or less the entire second act but I have on multiple occasions jumped to Act 3 before watching A New Hope as one of the best standalone battles in the franchise. RotJ's ranking corresponds more or less directly with how recently I've seen it. After watching it usually ends up on the top of the list for a while until I decide it deserves to be lower for reasons I never agree with when its actually on the screen. The Top 5 are more or less inseparable for me, with parts of Rogue One being better than the whole list.

You're right, of course. It's in one way senseless to rank anything above Star Wars when none of the sequels can exist without the original starting film.

That said, the first three, (4,5,6) the second three (1,2,3) and hopefully the last three form complete narrative structures.

It's interesting to ponder if Rogue One and Han Solo could work as standalone films without any previous knowledge of Star Wars. My guess is they could, with some modest alterations to the script.

Any way, here are my picks:

1. The Empire Strikes Back
2. The Last Jedi
3. Star Wars original
4. Han Solo
5. Return of the Jedi
6. The Force Awakens

I haven't seen any of the others.

One takeaway from this thread already would be that people have pretty ambivalent feelings toward RotJ.

I've been back and forth on this, too. The Ewoks are, frankly, terrible. But the adventure at/around Jabba's palace is wonderful. The space battle is visually exciting and, rare for a large battle sequence, narratively coherent. And the final confrontation between Luke, Vader, and the Emperor, provides an extremely satisfying conclusion to the trilogy. In terms of fantasy cinema, RotJ is much more imaginative than any of the Disney films.

To me, ESB and RotJ share the same space in my head as Final Fantasy IV and VI. I'm fully aware that ESB/VI are the "best" entries in their respective franchises, but RotJ/IV are my "favorites".

Every time I watch RotJ I expect to hate the Ewoks but I never actually do. I used to think that was a nostalgia thing, since I'm repeatedly told to hate them, but where most nostalgia things evaporate when confronted as an adult, I just.... don't hate them like I'm supposed to.

I don't hate the Ewoks, either. But I do think they are totally inappropriate in RotJ.

I know what you mean. While Return goes a little off track (Ewoks, a second Death Star and Leia turning out to be Luke’s sister), what it gets right it gets very right.

Had they went with the idea of having Wookiees instead of Ewoks well...who can say?

The real problem is that Leia and Han have nothing to do in the second half of the movie. So replacing Ewoks with Wookies but keeping the same kind of sequence wouldn't help that much.

I think the sequence was written to begin with because they needed to show that the Empire was completely defeated - militarily, ideologically, and spiritually.

The space battle covers the military part and the Luke/Vader/Emperor confrontation covers the spiritual part. The last piece is the ideological component introduced in ANH, that the Empire rules through brutal oppression. Having "elite" storm troopers defeated by plucky teddy bears is supposed to demonstrate how ruling through fear ultimately fails because even teddy bears can find the pluck to stand up for themselves. And that's cute, which is probably why some of us don't out-and-out hate Ewoks (contrast Jar Jar).

Plus, Ewoks did not make terrible jokes with borderline racist speech patterns.

Am I the only one who thought Rogue One was middling at best? I mean visually it's one of the best but the characters in it are so dull that I just don't care for any of the action scenes. I'm largely baffled by the praise it gets other than maybe people like some of it's nostalgic imagery but I don't

think that's a strong enough reason to think something is great.

For me, it goes something like:

1) Star Wars/Empire. Both have strengths and weaknesses, with the main thing being quality of plot (Empire) vs launch of Franchise (Star Wars). Empire has a better Lightsaber Duel, Star Wars has better space fights, etc. Which film is best really depends on what I am feeling like on the day.

2) Jedi/Rogue One. Both are flawed, with some pacing issues, but overall deliver movies that are still good. I would say that Jedi is better overall (just not as good as the previous two), while Rogue One struggles to get going but delivers one of the best final acts of any Star Wars film, and makes the best use of effects of any non original trilogy movie.

3) Any scene from the Prequels/Sequels with Ewan McGregor or Adam Driver. If the rest of the films were on par with them, this list would be a lot harder to write.

4) The Force Awakens. On its own, not a bad movie. Problem is, it feels like a version of A New Hope that replaced the back seats with sub-woofers, and added a ton of other bling. Looks cool, but give me the original.

5) Revenge of the Sith. The best of the Prequels. Less said, the better, but I don't hate this one.

6) The Phantom Menace. Darth Maul was cool. Podracing would have been a great subject for some sort of expanded universe film. Jar-Jar is no longer my most hated character.

7) Attack of the Clones. The good news is that it doesn't make anything else seem worse simply by existing.

8) The Last Jedi. When the best thing about the movie is "Good for internet/drunk fights" and "makes the prequels look good", you know I'm reallytrying to stay positive.

9) Ewok Movies. I had forgotten these things for years, and now I yearn for that blissful state.

10) The Holiday Special.

1. Star Wars - still a classic
2. Return of the Jedi - Jabbas palace, space battle, resolution, evil space Emperor gloating, good despite the Ewoks
3. Empire Strikes back: Great story, thrilling
4. Rogue One: Well the second half - the first half is pretty bad but the second half is fantastic
5. Force Awakens: It was a pale shadow of Star Wars but its quite a fun ride,
5. Attack of Clones; Really only for Natalie in her white outfit
6. Phantom menance and Revenge - both equally bad
7. The last Jedi - terrible plot, lack of characters, lazy writing, shockingly pad pace - truely awful film. not just a bad Star Wars film but a bad film in every conceivable way

 Cheesecat wrote:
Am I the only one who thought Rogue One was middling at best?

 Manchu wrote:
R1 (4/10)

For me it is pretty simple:

Best= New Hope/Empire

Worst= The Phantom Menace/The Last Jedi.

All the rest are muddled up in the middle.

 Cheesecat wrote:
Am I the only one who thought Rogue One was middling at best? I mean visually it's one of the best but the characters in it are so dull that I just don't care for any of the action scenes. I'm largely baffled by the praise it gets other than maybe people like some of it's nostalgic imagery but I don't

think that's a strong enough reason to think something is great.

I think the third act leaves a good impression. I mean, a really, really good impression. I think the opening act is strong and entertaining. I think the entire middle is the worst kind of terrible though. There's nothing wrong with it, but its just dull and ultimately kind of pointless. It feels like filler on rewatch and actively dissuades me from rewatching the whole film and generally opting to skip to the end instead.

To me, the only interesting things in R1 happen in the middle of the movie:

(1) Krennic confronts Jyn's dad while Capt Mustache considers assassinating the latter, leading to an argument between Jyn and Cpt Mustache

(2) Krennic goes to see Darth Vader, which provides a nice emotional bridge between the prequels and OT

The third-act battle scenes provide nice eye candy, which would be fine if we were talking about video game cut scenes. The lack of characterization through the entire film leading up to the climax makes it hard to care about what happens to these people.

RotJ was always a movie that I wanted to like more than I do. It has some awesome stuff in it, but just falls flat. A phoned in performance from Harrison Ford (who really didn't want to be there, and it showed), the last minute decision to turn Leia into Luke's sister because they hadn't bothered to cast any other women, the pointless side-trip back to Dagobah just for Yoda to tell Luke that he doesn't need any more training despite having run off and ruined everything before completing his training, Ewoks (which I don't specifically have a problem with, but Wookies would have been so much cooler), and the nonsensical plan at the start. Not to mention that Lucas's replacement of the original puppets with a cartoon song-and-dance routine rather spoils the atmosphere of the Jabba intro. And the Emperor never becomes anything more than a cookie-cutout villain.

That's why it rates about the same as the prequels, for me. They're entertaining for the cool bits, but not as well crafted as the other movies.

 Manchu wrote:
The real problem is that Leia and Han have nothing to do in the second half of the movie. So replacing Ewoks with Wookies but keeping the same kind of sequence wouldn't help that much.

I think the sequence was written to begin with because they needed to show that the Empire was completely defeated - militarily, ideologically, and spiritually.

The space battle covers the military part and the Luke/Vader/Emperor confrontation covers the spiritual part. The last piece is the ideological component introduced in ANH, that the Empire rules through brutal oppression. Having "elite" storm troopers defeated by plucky teddy bears is supposed to demonstrate how ruling through fear ultimately fails because even teddy bears can find the pluck to stand up for themselves. And that's cute, which is probably why some of us don't out-and-out hate Ewoks (contrast Jar Jar).

I still can't see them as being anything other than cutesy cartoon characters designed to appeal to toddlers whilst making a clumsy statement about the Vietnam War. It's all very 'Saturday Morning Cartoon'. I accept that Star Wars is made for kids but at least the other two were 'mature' in a way.

It's the stone weapons defeating futuristic armor that really bugs me. And should military attack vehicles explode when they trip up or get hit by logs? Sorry, I'm overthinking it.

About Rogue One: The first act(s). Are they too slow? I've only seen it once and my memory is hazy due to the Vader corridor scene. Which by the way, although it's sometimes dismissed as just being pure fan service pandering, actually gave the original trilogy a new significance for me. Having watched that, and then going back to watch the original trilogy, Vader's threat level is quadrupled. He was intimidating enough mind choking people and lifting them up with one hand and gunning down enemy fighter pilots. But now, you know that if he wanted to he could easily and horribly butcher everyone in the room without a sweat. And it ties up the originals with the mythology too. It's good seeing an original era character matching the power we've seen in the prequels.

 Formosa wrote:
force awakens better than return of the jedi..... yep.. nope

TFA is basically ANH done over again. They're effectively the same movie.

But hey, that's just my opinion. Obviously you have a different opinion. Don't let me tell you what your opinion should be.

 Cheesecat wrote:
Am I the only one who thought Rogue One was middling at best? I mean visually it's one of the best but the characters in it are so dull that I just don't care for any of the action scenes. I'm largely baffled by the praise it gets other than maybe people like some of it's nostalgic imagery but I don't

think that's a strong enough reason to think something is great.

Nope, not the only one. It's a middling movie (and in the middle of my list). It has its good points and its bad points, and overall it falls solidly into "entertaining, but not a Great Movie" territory. The only reason it appears at the top of Star Wars lists is that a grade of "middling" is a major accomplishment compared to the utter trash that clutters up the franchise. Three of the eight Star Wars movies are near-universally agreed to be terrible, and the two sequel-era movies are controversial at best. Minimal competence at making a movie gets you into the top half of the franchise by default.

 LunarSol wrote:

 Cheesecat wrote:
Am I the only one who thought Rogue One was middling at best? I mean visually it's one of the best but the characters in it are so dull that I just don't care for any of the action scenes. I'm largely baffled by the praise it gets other than maybe people like some of it's nostalgic imagery but I don't

think that's a strong enough reason to think something is great.

I think the third act leaves a good impression. I mean, a really, really good impression. I think the opening act is strong and entertaining. I think the entire middle is the worst kind of terrible though. There's nothing wrong with it, but its just dull and ultimately kind of pointless. It feels like filler on rewatch and actively dissuades me from rewatching the whole film and generally opting to skip to the end instead.

I really disliked the start - the incredibly stupid "er duh I have come to capture someone so bring a death squad who don't have a stun setting", the weird bloke with the tentacle mind sucking alien was annoying and seemed pointless. Really liked the "not jedi" guy and the robot was probably one of the best characters - as usual in SW we ignore the fact that apparently sentient robots are basically slaves subject to mind wipes and everyone in universe is fine with that.

The last third is pure fun and great action and ties in beautifully to a New Hope.

You will enjoy the bit in Han Solo where

 Kilkrazy wrote:
You will enjoy the bit in Han Solo where

Spoiler:

L3-37, the "girl" robot co-pilot of Lando Calrissian, goes on an unauthorised freedom rampage, sparking a robot and slave revolt at the Kessel Spice Mine.

Sounds fun - will catch it when it comes to Sky. Not spending money and time at the cinema after both were wasted on the Last Jedi.

Gotta resist the urge to click on that spoiler tag...

How do you guys feel about the aesthetics of the new films? For me, Disney has gotten it mostly right. One of my (many) bugbears with the prequels is that they just don’t match up with the “later” movies, due to CGI and the “cosmetically advanced prequel” conundrum. But the new trilogy and the stories movies fit in much better looks wise. I’m interested in gak like this you see.

I agree with you. It was noticed at the time of release that the quality of design and modelling had declined compared to the original trilogy.

Speculation was that the relative low power CGI available at the time limited what could be done in terms of detail and complexity.

The new films look great, though, in their different ways.

1 - TESB
2 - ANH
3 - tie - Rogue One/RotJ. Reason being is that while Return was ultimately a satisfying finish it also got too much wrong. Rogue One deepened the setting and showed a darker side to the Rebellion. I think it's a good companion piece to the series.
5 - Solo - Why? Like Rogue One it deepens the mythology without detracting from it.
6 - TFA
7 - TLJ
8 - RotS, I might be willing to rewatch scenes from RoTS, but not the entire movie. The other two prequels are complete garbage.
9 - AotC
10 - TPM

Or in another variation

Prequels suck. Lucas is a terrible director and screenwriter. Great world builder, but he pretty much flew his creative load on 1.5 good movies (ANH/RotJ) and was carried in TESB by more talented individuals.

OT is good until Ewoks appear.

Standalone films add to the OT without hurting it.

Sequels suck, but less than the prequels. JJ Abrams is a decent director and a terrible screenwriter. In a fight for biggest hack I think I'd give Abrams the title over Whedon. The lack of overall planning for the sequels and Abrams asking questions with no answers has doomed it to mediocrity. I don't see how 9 can save it.

 Manchu wrote:
ESB (10/10)
ANH (9/10)
Solo (8/10)
RotJ (6/10)
TFA (5/10)
R1 (4/10)
RotS (4/10)
TLJ (2/10)
TPM (1/10)
AotC (1/10)

Edited to include Solo.

 Future War Cultist wrote:
Gotta resist the urge to click on that spoiler tag...

How do you guys feel about the aesthetics of the new films? For me, Disney has gotten it mostly right. One of my (many) bugbears with the prequels is that they just don’t match up with the “later” movies, due to CGI and the “cosmetically advanced prequel” conundrum. But the new trilogy and the stories movies fit in much better looks wise. I’m interested in gak like this you see.

One thing to remember about George Lucas, SW, and why the originals were so successful was not that Lucas was a good writer or director, he was fantastic at FX and set design though. The original trilogy were visually what Avatar was a few years ago. Not to say that his writing and directing were bad compared to the Sci-Fi movies of the time either, I've seen some where the most entertaining part was that they used close up shots of a lava lamp to simulate FTL travel, but mostly you went to Lucas for ILM and not to direct your blockbuster. Remove nostalgia from the equation and the originals were a fairly generic story, kind of like how many people see Avatar as a very pretty version of Dances with Wolves. It was the state of the art special effects of the time that had people thrilled along with the fact that Lucas did a really good job making his scenes seem more like a planet with X hat. Yes you got a desert planet but you also got a look at Jawas, Sand People, Moisture Farmers, Bantha, Dew Backs, and of course the cantina. It actually made the setting feel lived in and vast and I do think Lucas did manage to carry that over into the prequels at least.

Going to the prequels, you need to keep in mind that Lucas is an FX guy first and foremost. CGI was still the big craze, the next big thing, and still has a lot of potential even now even though the prequels helped lead to a call back to practical FX. Is it really surprising that an FX guy really wanted to pursue and try to push the envelope with CGI? I don't think so and I can forgive him for trying to push the envelope before the actual capability was there. I can also forgive him for marketing the prequels even more for kids. When I actually saw Lucas's daughter actually pointed out in her role in TPM, I had to realize that she was the exact age that the movie was made for and that Lucas was making SW movies he thought his kid would like. The thing is, I've met people who grew up with the prequels and have a higher opinion of those movies than they do of the original because it was what they grew up with and to them, the originals look dated. I myself rate RotJ higher than many people here because it was the only movie I had on VHS as a kid and I watched it over and over (it still has the best space battle of the originals).

Now personally, of the 8 core movies and Rogue 1 I rank TFA at the very bottom of the list because for the first time viewing all the movies, I felt the setting was very a small and claustrophobic retelling of ANH that took no time to establish the setting and forced you to run from place to place to try to keep you from looking at all of JJ Abrams mystery boxes too closely. One of the things that really bugs me about TFA is that Rei and Finn find the Falcon and escape Jakku only to randomly bump into Han and Chewy almost immediately in the vastness of space. Why not just make it so Han still has the Falcon, happens to be on Jakku while Rei and Finn are fleeing the FO, have a scene where they slip pursuit and are trying to negotiate passage with a certain difficult captain, only to have Storm Troopers show up and Han tells them to just get on board. It's only one big coincidence instead of two. Oh right, they need space monsters because SW has them and the Falcon really wouldn't be big enough for them. Then again, someone managed to find Anakin's light saber which was heavily implied to have been lost in the depths of a gas giant. Luke's light saber from RotJ would have been a much easier sell though.

Still, as much as I dislike TFA and as many people dislike TLJ, kids who grow up with it will probably think the new ones are the best and all the old ones are dated.

totally IMHO and not quality wise:

A new hope
The last jedi
The force awakens
Empire strikes back
Revenge of the sith
Return of the jedi
TPM/attack of the clones

Both ESB and RotJ are low because I tend to skip huge parts of the ,especially return on rewatch. So if you cut most of the ewoks and the Han rescue Return would be way higher.

I also didn't include rogue one since it is pretty much its own thing and I don't really like comparing it to the other SW movies. In terms of enjoyment it would be around TFA tough.

I don't really care enough to weigh in with my own order with explanation except to say I honestly think Spaceballs is a better Star Wars movie than TFA and TLJ.
I'm on the fence with it in regards to the prequels.

Empire
Return
Hope
Rogue 1

I won’t list the prequels or sequels. If I did, the Droids cartoon would be ahead of them though.