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Hi Dakka.

I have a doubt. When I play with a frien, in my shooting phase if for example I shot my bolters on a enemy squad with units with 2 wounds and make 2 wounds. Can he allocate this 2 wounds on two different units of this squad? I know model with damage must be the first ones. But I mean if this enemy unit is unwounded

Sorry if this is a stupid question, but I want to play well.

From 'Fast Dice Rolling', page 179 of the main rulebook:

Your opponent can then allocate the wounds one at a time, making the saving throws and suffering damage each time as appropriate.

Your scenario can never happen as wounds are allocated and resolved one at a time.

Under wound allocation the BRB clearly states that if there is a wounded model then any more damage must be allocated to the wounded model until it has no wounds left.

Ghaz is correct. Infact, RAW, you should be firing each gun one a time, resolving each hit one at a time. and allocating any damage cause by unsaved wounds one at a time.

It's impossible for your friend to allocate both wounds at the same time to 2 different models.

 Lance845 wrote:
Ghaz is correct. Infact, RAW, you should be firing each gun one a time, resolving each hit one at a time. and allocating any damage cause by unsaved wounds one at a time.

It's impossible for your friend to allocate both wounds at the same time to 2 different models.

RAW includes fast-rolling of all attacks on a given unit from a given gun from the whole unit at once; making all to-hits, and then all to-wounds. Wound allocations, saves and damage are still 1-at-a-time.

 Kommissar Kel wrote:

 Lance845 wrote:
Ghaz is correct. Infact, RAW, you should be firing each gun one a time, resolving each hit one at a time. and allocating any damage cause by unsaved wounds one at a time.

It's impossible for your friend to allocate both wounds at the same time to 2 different models.

RAW includes fast-rolling of all attacks on a given unit from a given gun from the whole unit at once; making all to-hits, and then all to-wounds. Wound allocations, saves and damage are still 1-at-a-time.

A side bar offering a optional rule of fast rolling does that. It's a more or less universally used optional rule. But it IS optional. The basic game rules do not in any way include fast rolling.

How you achieve the wounds isn't the OP's question the question is how his opponent allocates the wounds so fast roll no fast roll doesn't matter. I have already stated the RAW about wound allocation.

Leo_the_Rat wrote:
How you achieve the wounds isn't the OP's question the question is how his opponent allocates the wounds so fast roll no fast roll doesn't matter. I have already stated the RAW about wound allocation.

I think you actually just rephrased what the OP said he already knew

 Lance845 wrote:

 Kommissar Kel wrote:

 Lance845 wrote:
Ghaz is correct. Infact, RAW, you should be firing each gun one a time, resolving each hit one at a time. and allocating any damage cause by unsaved wounds one at a time.

It's impossible for your friend to allocate both wounds at the same time to 2 different models.

RAW includes fast-rolling of all attacks on a given unit from a given gun from the whole unit at once; making all to-hits, and then all to-wounds. Wound allocations, saves and damage are still 1-at-a-time.

A side bar offering a optional rule of fast rolling does that. It's a more or less universally used optional rule. But it IS optional. The basic game rules do not in any way include fast rolling.

It is an option in a side-bar; of RAW. Or is the measuring distances not a basic rule?

If all his units have the same saving then he can make fast roll. But or he was cheating or he really don't know. He can do fast rolls but knowing that he has to allocate wounds same as rolling one by one. For me it was clear. Just wanted to confirm it.

Alex_85 wrote:
If all his units have the same saving then he can make fast roll.

No, he can't. You're not able to fast roll saves, ever.

 BaconCatBug wrote:

Alex_85 wrote:
If all his units have the same saving then he can make fast roll.

No, he can't. You're not able to fast roll saves, ever.

Not by RAW, no.

But many player's HIWPI often fast roll saves and allocation on 1W models with identical wargear (for speed, of course). Say you have a 10 man tac squad, batch roll the first 7 saves on regular bolter-marines, then remove all failed(since damage doesn't carry), then batch roll the remaining bolter marines, etc.

Same goes for vehicles/other single-model units; just fast-roll the saves and apply damage as appropriate since it makes no difference.

Obviously it can only be done in those 2 ways without seriously messing up the game.

 BaconCatBug wrote:

Alex_85 wrote:
If all his units have the same saving then he can make fast roll.

No, he can't. You're not able to fast roll saves, ever.

As RAW, you can only fast roll if all the pertaining stats are identical as well.

 skchsan wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:

Alex_85 wrote:
If all his units have the same saving then he can make fast roll.

No, he can't. You're not able to fast roll saves, ever.

As RAW, you can only fast roll if all the pertaining stats are identical as well.

As RAW you can only Fast-roll to-hits and to-wounds. You can never fast-roll saves.

The to-hits require same BS/WS, and a long-form of saying the same weapons(S AP D, but since abilities are not on the list you could chuck a weapon with triggered on 6 abilities, or heavy weapons after movement to legally cheat)*, and attacking the same target.



*In all seriousness; don't ever do this. Just because the rules allow it doesn't mean you should take advantage of that.

Fast rolling only get tricky when dealing with units with multi-wound models being hit by multi-damage weapons. You can still roll all your saving throws, but you end up having to allocate damage model to model.

For example: 5 WraithGuard get hit and wounded 5x by a Quad Autocannon Dread.
The WG can roll all 5 saves at once, but need to allocate damage per model.
Let's say the WG player fails all 5 saves. Now you must allocate each failed save 1 at a time to resolve damage.
The 1st WG would take 2Ws from the 1st failed save, then die to the next.
A 2nd WG would take 2Ws form the 3rd failed save and die to the next
A 3rd WG would then take 2Ws from the final failed save.

You do not have to roll the saves 1 at a time for this, but when you start allocating damage, you do have to slow down a go model per model.

-

You should re-read fast rolling.

It specifies that wound allocation and saves are still one at a time.

There is no rules-allowance for fast-rolling saves; and if you have a houserule to allow it you should still be allocating random-damage wounds individually to multi-model, multi-wound units.

The only times it does not matter are as follows:
1) single-wound identical models in a unit (and only fast rolling saves for the number of identical models remaining in the unit)
2) single-model units.
3) identical multi-wound, multi-model units wounded with set-damage weapons(value does not matter).

 Kommissar Kel wrote:

 Lance845 wrote:

 Kommissar Kel wrote:

 Lance845 wrote:
Ghaz is correct. Infact, RAW, you should be firing each gun one a time, resolving each hit one at a time. and allocating any damage cause by unsaved wounds one at a time.

It's impossible for your friend to allocate both wounds at the same time to 2 different models.

RAW includes fast-rolling of all attacks on a given unit from a given gun from the whole unit at once; making all to-hits, and then all to-wounds. Wound allocations, saves and damage are still 1-at-a-time.

A side bar offering a optional rule of fast rolling does that. It's a more or less universally used optional rule. But it IS optional. The basic game rules do not in any way include fast rolling.

It is an option in a side-bar; of RAW. Or is the measuring distances not a basic rule?

Does the measuring distance side bar say it's an optional rules? No? Then it's not an optional rule. Fast rolling specifically says it's optional.

To be technical, Fast Rolling is not an optional rule. You don't need to decide with your opponent whether or not you will use Fast Rolling in your game. It is a rule you have the option to use, or not use, as you wish.

Conversely, the Advanced Rules for Terrain are Optional Rules. You must decide to either use them or not use them in your game. You do not have the option of using them in only when yo feel like it during the course of the game.

 alextroy wrote:
To be technical, Fast Rolling is not an optional rule. You don't need to decide with your opponent whether or not you will use Fast Rolling in your game. It is a rule you have the option to use, or not use, as you wish.

Conversely, the Advanced Rules for Terrain are Optional Rules. You must decide to either use them or not use them in your game. You do not have the option of using them in only when yo feel like it during the course of the game.

Reread what you wrote. It is a rule you have the option to use. That is the actual definition of optional. Measuring distances is not optional. It's how the actual game works. Just because you do or do not have to get your opponents permission to use the optional rule of fast rolling doesn't make it any less optional.

There is a difference between an Optional Rule and a rules option. They are not equivalant.

For example, some models have Invulnerable Saves. When making your Save, you have the rules option of using your Invulnerable Save instead of using your Armor. It is a rules option. It is not an optional rule.

This is frankly a semantic cul-de-sac and not entirely relevant to anything, guys... the key point is you don’t have to use the Fast Rolling Rules. Everything else isn’t adding anything to the thread.