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So im running the BA (smash capts)/IK (Castellian)/ AM (?) in a GT. I want to run Cadians with alot of Morters and Commanders for orders, i run a 10 man unit of buffed Crusaders .

Am i being silly ? I know Catachan is the way to go, they hit like autocannons. Board control is important.....however.... I really want to use them. I think they should work due to orders and the doctrin they have. The Cadian Strats are good. but am i kidding myself into believing that if i go against a mirror force of Catachan that i get beat ?

Convince me either way ?

Without vehicles catachans don't shoot that well. Infantry gets extra s. Vehicles gets reroll. Those mortar teams have s4 in h2h

My favourite point about Cadians is simply their re-roll 1's ability. It doesn't sound like much but it's just how it's freely available to most of your units. Other armies usually only get the buff through aura effects, yet we have it naturally, we just have to stand still. It's a great little boost to Guard shooting, and can be combined with orders to put a pretty decent dent in enemy units. I'm quite fond of using it along with Grenadiers and Take it Down! for 10D6 Lasgun shots rerolling 1's to hit and wound.

HEY. RUN CADIANS.

did that work?

If you're mostly shooty with your IG, Cadia works better than Catachan, unless you have vehicles. As the crusaders don't get any benefit from a doctrine, it makes no difference to them.

Vostroyan gives you a touch more range, so that may also be good to get those mortars farther back out of harms way for longer. If they are only there as objective holders, Valhallan works well too, making them harder to budge.

But Cadia with the Take Aim order and re-rolling all misses from the mortars (if they don't move) is pretty decent. A catachan force could probably beat you, if they get into close combat quick enough, but if you have enough officers to order your troops to Get Back in the Fight, even then you still have an edge.

Why would I convince you to run Cadians? They're already everywhere, it's hardly a risky venture. Why not give Tallarn or Vostroyan a go?

If you're running a lot of russes and Infantry teams with lascannons then cadians are pretty good. Pask is a nice 10 pt boost to 1 russ's orders and BS.

If you're bringing lots of random shot weapons that aren't russes, like basilisks and tons of mortars, then catachans are better.

If you're running a ton of tanks and can't bring enough cadian tank commanders for the reroll # of shots then catachans are better.

Cadians aren't bad at all, but you need to match your faction to the strengths of your list. If you're running a lot of random damage weapons, then Catachans are exactly what you want to run.

The main buffs for guard are Reroll 1's to hit, and roll an extra die for # of shots. Cadians Reroll all 1's to hit if they don't more, and can order tanks to roll # of shots on the turret. Catachans roll # of shots on everything and have to use an order to reroll 1's to hit. Which of the two buffs is better to have on every model while using orders on some for the second. Pick whichever one fits.

yea ive tried Valhallan and Vestroyan. While they do have things that work in certain instances. Valhallan i have run with lots of Conscripts.. works decent. Distance on Vestroyan is only good in Hammer and Anvil deployments.

Ive tried them and yea they work. However ive found that Cadia and Catachan seem to work better in all around.

I dont have any Vehicles in the army to take advantage of Catachan rerolls on the shots and Morter teams cant reroll that as far as i understand. FA is rough riders

No lascannons or tanks for Cadian orders. I am primarily Morter and dudes.

I have been testing Cadia and they work well for what i seem to want to do.

I am running 5 commanders for Take Aim and get back in the fight. I built the list to have access to orders.

Cadia Strat overlapping fields of fire seem to work well. especially if i sit still.. but it works good if i move as well.

Relic of lost cadia works great no matter what. 1round of rolling 1 to hit and 1 to wound even if i move is solid. I tend to use this first round so i can move up for some board control. But if im up against chaos even better.

However i keep hearing...bah ditch Cadia and go Catachan..




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 vaklor4 wrote:
HEY. RUN CADIANS.

did that work?

cmspano wrote:
If you're running a lot of russes and Infantry teams with lascannons then cadians are pretty good. Pask is a nice 10 pt boost to 1 russ's orders and BS.

If you're bringing lots of random shot weapons that aren't russes, like basilisks and tons of mortars, then catachans are better.

If you're running a ton of tanks and can't bring enough cadian tank commanders for the reroll # of shots then catachans are better.

Cadians aren't bad at all, but you need to match your faction to the strengths of your list. If you're running a lot of random damage weapons, then Catachans are exactly what you want to run.

The main buffs for guard are Reroll 1's to hit, and roll an extra die for # of shots. Cadians Reroll all 1's to hit if they don't more, and can order tanks to roll # of shots on the turret. Catachans roll # of shots on everything and have to use an order to reroll 1's to hit. Which of the two buffs is better to have on every model while using orders on some for the second. Pick whichever one fits.

Alternatively use Catachan LR Conquerors. Reroll number of shots and full rerolls to hit on anything within 24". Since youre already getting 2 dice when determining shots for a basilisk I think Cadians are better for that

You're not good enough to run cadians.

Pask in an executioner tank for 235 pts. 2D6 re-rollable number of shots plus 2D3 sponson shots, hitting on 2s, re-rolling 1s. You can safely overcharge all plasma guns, because you re-roll 1s when standing still. Even if you roll double 1s its only 1 MW.

If you run primarily infantry Cadians are a great choice because of take aim! Re-rolling all hits boosts your hit rate by 25% and on plasma models you don’t even need orders to prevent those gets hot rolls. It’s also useful on wyvrens and basilisks where re-rolling a single D6 for number of shots isnt that useful. It’s great for mortars. Just take 1 company commander per 2 squads.

Same reason I do, the Relic of Lost Cadia. It's reroll 1's to hit and wound for basically your whole gunline T1, and if you run into a Chaos player...

IMO Catachans are better in the Aliatoc matchup, but I think Cadians are better against Chaos and really basically everything where you hit at full BS.

 koooaei wrote:
You're not good enough to run cadians.

Spoiler:

In case HEY, RUN CADIANS didn't work

You should know that I overheard that one person you really fancy saying that they are really into Cadian players...

 Valkyrie wrote:
My favourite point about Cadians is simply their re-roll 1's ability. It doesn't sound like much but it's just how it's freely available to most of your units. Other armies usually only get the buff through aura effects, yet we have it naturally, we just have to stand still. It's a great little boost to Guard shooting, and can be combined with orders to put a pretty decent dent in enemy units. I'm quite fond of using it along with Grenadiers and Take it Down! for 10D6 Lasgun shots rerolling 1's to hit and wound.

Sorry but you can't combine Grenadiers stratagem with any order. Grenadiers is usable only on overwatch, so not at a time when you could put an order. It's a niche stratagem really. Sure it combines with rerolls of provided by the cadian trait, but it is not powerful. Lots of dice rolling for usually a slim result. It works best on mordians, who successfully pass overwatch on 5+ when bunched up.

 Ravajaxe wrote:

Spoiler:

 Valkyrie wrote:
My favourite point about Cadians is simply their re-roll 1's ability. It doesn't sound like much but it's just how it's freely available to most of your units. Other armies usually only get the buff through aura effects, yet we have it naturally, we just have to stand still. It's a great little boost to Guard shooting, and can be combined with orders to put a pretty decent dent in enemy units. I'm quite fond of using it along with Grenadiers and Take it Down! for 10D6 Lasgun shots rerolling 1's to hit and wound.

Sorry but you can't combine Grenadiers stratagem with any order. Grenadiers is usable only on overwatch, so not at a time when you could put an order. It's a niche stratagem really. Sure it combines with rerolls of provided by the cadian trait, but it is not powerful. Lots of dice rolling for usually a slim result. It works best on mordians, who successfully pass overwatch on 5+ when bunched up.

was there a FAQ on this? My Codex say when the unit shoots or overwatches

vindicare0412 wrote:

 Ravajaxe wrote:

Spoiler:

 Valkyrie wrote:
My favourite point about Cadians is simply their re-roll 1's ability. It doesn't sound like much but it's just how it's freely available to most of your units. Other armies usually only get the buff through aura effects, yet we have it naturally, we just have to stand still. It's a great little boost to Guard shooting, and can be combined with orders to put a pretty decent dent in enemy units. I'm quite fond of using it along with Grenadiers and Take it Down! for 10D6 Lasgun shots rerolling 1's to hit and wound.

Sorry but you can't combine Grenadiers stratagem with any order. Grenadiers is usable only on overwatch, so not at a time when you could put an order. It's a niche stratagem really. Sure it combines with rerolls of provided by the cadian trait, but it is not powerful. Lots of dice rolling for usually a slim result. It works best on mordians, who successfully pass overwatch on 5+ when bunched up.

was there a FAQ on this? My Codex say when the unit shoots or overwatches

Seriously ?
Crap !
Another lost in translation rule. It says "use this stratagem before an unit shoots on overwatch ..." in my french codex.