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 ServiceGames wrote:
I think Tyranids, Poxwalkers, Nurgle daemons, etc. are all fine. They Nurglings, for example, are very cartoonie. A friend of mine actually laughed at the Nurglings when I showed him a picture. He mentioned that he definitely wouldn't be scared of those and they didn't look scary. If there's any kind of concern for younger kids especially, at least in my opinion, it's models like Slaanesh Daemonettes and pretty much the entire Daughters of Khaine line. I have literally zero problem with having my entire Tyranid, Death Guard, and Magotkin of Nurgle armies on display for my two year old stepson to see. BUT, I started a thread about Daughters of Khaine to see if others thought they were kid friendly... after reading several responses and talking with my fiancee at the time (wife now), I decided against buying any Daughters of Khaine models until he's grown up a good bit more.

If there are any specific models that I think some younger players probably shouldn't see, I'd go with Daughters of Khaine and probably the vast majority of the rank and file of Slaanesh daemons (though I do understand why they are sculpted that way)

Just my $0.02

SG

I agree non are scary, they look like disease infest crap however... ye I totally want to spend my money on the horseman of disease (sarcasm). The daughters of Khaine tbh I don't mind them, the models I use them in my 40k Inquisitor army (they represent an aesthetic, look at marauder barbarians same aesthetic). Younger players??? TBH the games premise is racism on a galactic scale, young minds should not be exposed to this, period (From a fluff perspective).

One thing that i think has been missing from this discussion is the fact that the things that scare children can be... very different from what adults think.

I mean, you know what terrified me as a little girl? Squirrels. And large dogs. And the hefflelumps and woozles cartoon. Meanwhile, my sisters and I would run around the backyard fighting orcs, because my parents read the lord of the rings books to us as bedtime stories.

Kids are wierd. My nephews have seen some of my death guard guys, and while they don't really like them, it's just because they like my skeleton figures more. I'm not sure why, but they love those guys.

Again, kids are wierd.

nurgliings are fine. Death Guard and Great Unclean Ones with entrails hanging out etc..........yuck.

And yeah. Slaanesh models (Daemonettes etc, and some of the Drukahri now) are crossing from "They fight with little clothes to be totally unimpeded on the battlefield" to "They fight with little clothes on so the boys will buy them!"

 amazingturtles wrote:
One thing that i think has been missing from this discussion is the fact that the things that scare children can be... very different from what adults think.

I mean, you know what terrified me as a little girl? Squirrels. And large dogs. And the hefflelumps and woozles cartoon. Meanwhile, my sisters and I would run around the backyard fighting orcs, because my parents read the lord of the rings books to us as bedtime stories.

Kids are wierd. My nephews have seen some of my death guard guys, and while they don't really like them, it's just because they like my skeleton figures more. I'm not sure why, but they love those guys.

Again, kids are wierd.

It's not that its weird or scary it's the perception that it is us vs them that is disconcerting to younger players.

 Corennus wrote:
Recently picked up the new First Strike box which contains 3 Intercessor space marines, 3 reiver space marines, 3 poxwalker death guard and 3 Death Guard tac squad.

And it hit me that Games Workshop has (actually for a while) really gone overboard on making Plague Marines (AND TYRANIDS) almost too disgusting.

Now, i KNOW this is just a game, and part of the "allure" of the Death Guard (apart from FRICKING DISGUSITINGLY RESILIENT!!!) is their bloated disgusting nature. But you get all ages playing this game....and some of the stuff shown is definitely rated Mature...


Do you think GW goes too far on some of its Death Guard and Tyranid models as far as gore and digustingness goes? or do you think i'm just overthinking.

Lets take a look at how this game introduces itself.

Every Warhammer 40,000 Rulebook Intro wrote:To be a man in such times is to be one amongst untold billions. It is to live in the cruelest and most bloody regime imaginable. These are the tales of those times. Forget the power of technology and science, for so much has been forgotten, never to be re-learned. Forget the promise of progress and understanding, for in the grim dark future there is only war. There is no peace amongst the stars, only an eternity of carnage and slaughter, and the laughter of thirsting gods.

This is a game universe centered entirely around being dysoptianly horrifying and over the top, dark, depressing, brutal, violent and insane.

Nothing about the Death Guard or Tyranids has gone too far, and the game has, if anything, reduced much of its "mature" content over the years, especially relative to the original Slaves to Darkness and Realm of Chaos books (which did actually have mature content warnings).

Definitely overthinking this one.

Perhaps a vividly detailed model might scare some kids, but I think too much of parenting is hiding facts and not enough discussion. Some parents would seriously get upset if their child was even exposed to a game like 40k because it "promotes violence" and thus they shield their kid from that exposure. Really what ought to happen when a kid gets traumatized by a particularly detailed model is the parents should sit them down and explain what the game is about and perhaps touch on the reality of life a bit.

I say let the kids see the scary things and then TALK TO THEM ABOUT IT!!!!!! We are startlingly ready to blind our children for their own perceived good and we really are just shooting ourselves in the foot.

 vipoid wrote:

 Galef wrote:
I does kinda annoy me that GW can focus on super disgusting decayed models and/or hyper violent themes, but heaven forbid they put out attractive half (or all) naked female figures.
Don't get me wrong, I like the plastic Daemonettes ok, but I wish some of them looked more like the old Diaz metal ones. Daemonettes are supposed to be alluring right up until it's too late, but the models seem to all represent that "Bilbo/Gollum" moment of their transformation.

I will never understand why violence is more ok to portray than sexuality. Especially in a miniature game that emphasizes aesthetics.
I don't know about any of you, but I'd rather look at (and spend time painting) an attractive female figure over some gross half-rotten corpse or bloody rage monster.

If I had to hazard a guess, I'd postulate it has to do with the current feminist movement, which puts huge emphasis on dressing modestly - to the point where they've driven women out of work because their job required them to dress in skimpy clothes (that those women nevertheless enjoyed their job was considered irrelevant).

I really don't want to turn this into a political discussion, but my point is that there isn't any comparable group protesting against violence in games. This isn't to say that no such groups exist, but rather that they lack the political clout and media attention available to the feminist movement.

I'm no feminist, but people has always been a big hipocrite in relation to violence vs sex. And it is nothing new.

 darkcloak wrote:
Definitely overthinking this one.

Perhaps a vividly detailed model might scare some kids, but I think too much of parenting is hiding facts and not enough discussion. Some parents would seriously get upset if their child was even exposed to a game like 40k because it "promotes violence" and thus they shield their kid from that exposure. Really what ought to happen when a kid gets traumatized by a particularly detailed model is the parents should sit them down and explain what the game is about and perhaps touch on the reality of life a bit.

I say let the kids see the scary things and then TALK TO THEM ABOUT IT!!!!!! We are startlingly ready to blind our children for their own perceived good and we really are just shooting ourselves in the foot.

Yeah, try explaining 40K or even AoS and what it is about to a two year old. Doesn't really work.

SG

I think I might have a phobia when it comes to Nurgle. I dislike the look so much, I dare say I would actually refuse to play against an army due to looks alone.

Spectral Ceramite wrote:
It's not that its weird or scary it's the perception that it is us vs them that is disconcerting to younger players.

Well, yeah, that is a different thing. Guess i lost track of where the discussion had gone! I am tired.

 ServiceGames wrote:

 darkcloak wrote:
Definitely overthinking this one.

Perhaps a vividly detailed model might scare some kids, but I think too much of parenting is hiding facts and not enough discussion. Some parents would seriously get upset if their child was even exposed to a game like 40k because it "promotes violence" and thus they shield their kid from that exposure. Really what ought to happen when a kid gets traumatized by a particularly detailed model is the parents should sit them down and explain what the game is about and perhaps touch on the reality of life a bit.

I say let the kids see the scary things and then TALK TO THEM ABOUT IT!!!!!! We are startlingly ready to blind our children for their own perceived good and we really are just shooting ourselves in the foot.

Yeah, try explaining 40K or even AoS and what it is about to a two year old. Doesn't really work.

SG

These big dudes in shiny armour are protecting all the good people and are going to win the war against all the nasty evil devil monsters!

I mean lets face it that's what is boils down to pretty much. Ok so that's a gross simplification, but in general terms you don't have go go on about how marines use peoples heads converted into hovering mechanical skulls for computers etc... You can tame introduce it on so many levels and a lot of stuff in the fluff and lore never makes it tabletop side etc.... I honestly think a lot of people get so wrapped up in the grimdark that they get lost in it.

Heck to me my intro to Warhammer/40K was Titan Legions and at 8 years old mostly all I cared about was big robots with huge guns fighting orks with big guns and lots of tanks!

 vipoid wrote:

 Grimtuff wrote:
Mine go in the complete opposite direction. In the interest of tooting one's own horn- https://dj1066.imgur.com/.

Your army looks phenomenal.

You do a hell of a lot more justice to Nurgle than the GW paint team.

Awwww shucks.... Thankyou. This army is a bit of a labour of love.

 Galas wrote:


To be honest with Plague Marines it is not a problem. The problem comes with terminators. With how charactefull they are, when you have 2-3 Fly-nators with each other, it looks weird. Unless you have a full unit of Fly-nators, then they become their own uniform and theme.

Grimtuff's got you covered fam.

The Blightking models are surprisingly easy to convert into Nurgle Terminators. I've just finished painting mine so I've just uploaded them.



Full album at https://imgur.com/gallery/3A9ufwr because I'm gak at taking photos and some of those didn't come out too great and the aforementioned conversions are mixed in there too.

 Galas wrote:

 vipoid wrote:
If I had to hazard a guess, I'd postulate it has to do with the current feminist movement, which puts huge emphasis on dressing modestly - to the point where they've driven women out of work because their job required them to dress in skimpy clothes (that those women nevertheless enjoyed their job was considered irrelevant).

I really don't want to turn this into a political discussion, but my point is that there isn't any comparable group protesting against violence in games. This isn't to say that no such groups exist, but rather that they lack the political clout and media attention available to the feminist movement.

I'm no feminist, but people has always been a big hipocrite in relation to violence vs sex. And it is nothing new.

I feel like it goes back much further than that and is really on the old christianity. Back when the crusades were going on. Crusades and the inquisition were glorified while showing an ankle was sacrilege. Over time it's become a lot more relaxed but it's still not entirely gone from modern society.

 IronBrand wrote:

 Galas wrote:

 vipoid wrote:
If I had to hazard a guess, I'd postulate it has to do with the current feminist movement, which puts huge emphasis on dressing modestly - to the point where they've driven women out of work because their job required them to dress in skimpy clothes (that those women nevertheless enjoyed their job was considered irrelevant).

I really don't want to turn this into a political discussion, but my point is that there isn't any comparable group protesting against violence in games. This isn't to say that no such groups exist, but rather that they lack the political clout and media attention available to the feminist movement.

I'm no feminist, but people has always been a big hipocrite in relation to violence vs sex. And it is nothing new.

I feel like it goes back much further than that and is really on the old christianity. Back when the crusades were going on. Crusades and the inquisition were glorified while showing an ankle was sacrilege. Over time it's become a lot more relaxed but it's still not entirely gone from modern society.

US society.

In the UK it's flipped thanks to Mary Whitehouse. Violence is the devil and nudity is the lesser of two evils.

If you're not cool with snot and boogers . . . Don't have kids.

The most offensive thing I find about Nurgle is people justifying zero effort paint jobs "cause Nurgle."

The reality is painting decent Nurgle schemes is quite technical, and sticking random blobs of green stuff on, before dipping your Plague Marine in some variation of camo green then dumping a bucket of Athonian Camoshade over it with head to toe Blood For The Blood God to finish doesn't comsititute a good paint job just because it's Nurgle!

 Corennus wrote:
I wasn't referring to the fact they have tiny pieces that get damaged Ironbrand. I was referring to the fact some of them really need to come with a 15 certificate.

I'm guessing this is a cultural thing, but here in the good ol' US of A, violence is pretty fine to show to kids. Heck, even zombies are pretty fine to show to kids (though they recommend 13 and up for the more gruesome stuff). But if a Daemonette shows one nipple then the moral police show up to throw you into the Eye of Terror (this is what happens when you allow Puritans to form a large chunk of your country).

I mean, I get your concern, but honestly I don't see it as an issue. Yes, they are disgusting, but that's rather the point. I'd be more confused if they weren't disgusting.

 Overread wrote:
These big dudes in shiny armour are protecting all the good people and are going to win the war against all the nasty evil devil monsters!

I mean lets face it that's what is boils down to pretty much. Ok so that's a gross simplification

Yeah, considering there are no "good people" in 40K... at least no good armies, it makes that explanation a little more difficult. Imperium is trying to expand and get all worlds into compliance or kill everyone who doesn't want to be in compliance. Chaos is well... chaos. And, Xenos can range from being very similar to the Imperium (T'au) to being either extremely sadistic torturers (Drukhari) to hyper aggressive, blood hungry insects (Tyranids). So, saying that these big dude sin shiny armor are protecting the good people... not really true on any level in 40K.

SG

Y'all have some very interesting theories as to why GW isn't making skimpy models anymore.

A lot of pearl-clutching going on in this thread...

To the original topic: shock of shock, kids like gross stuff. Entire industries are built in this. It bothers you as an adult because it reminds you of your mortality.

 Azreal13 wrote:
The most offensive thing I find about Nurgle is people justifying zero effort paint jobs "cause Nurgle."

The reality is painting decent Nurgle schemes is quite technical, and sticking random blobs of green stuff on, before dipping your Plague Marine in some variation of camo green then dumping a bucket of Athonian Camoshade over it with head to toe Blood For The Blood God to finish doesn't comsititute a good paint job just because it's Nurgle!

A frikkin men. I mean, sure Nurgle (and I argue Orks) forgive a person for not being as good at painting, but being lazy just wrecks otherwise well detailed models that look good regardless how much time you put into them. You can make them look good with a basecoat, wash, drybrush approach, or get really technical and make them look even better without either approach being punished (other than hand cramping).

On the other hand I've always been a bit of a painting elitist. Like I don't care if you aren't a great painter, but at least try to do your best. Not only does your army look better for it, it makes the game more fun to play for everyone.

On the other other hand, I am the same idiot who will spend like six to twelve hours working on a single model who isn't even a character model. Less because of the technical detail involved but more because I seem to insist on having too many steps for every color involved. At least my use of weathering and use of weathering powders has reduced my highlights from two to one per color to try and not clutter the model with too much detail since that can look really muddy from across the table.

On the other other other hand, they aren't my models so paint them how you want, even if you're going to lazy paint them by priming them that Death Guard green color and dip them in floor polish. I mean, I'm still going to judge you a bit inside, but you at least did more than the guy on the next table who is rocking the green plastic Death Guard and makes a million excuses why he won't give them the most basic of paint jobs.

 Azreal13 wrote:
The most offensive thing I find about Nurgle is people justifying zero effort paint jobs "cause Nurgle."

The reality is painting decent Nurgle schemes is quite technical, and sticking random blobs of green stuff on, before dipping your Plague Marine in some variation of camo green then dumping a bucket of Athonian Camoshade over it with head to toe Blood For The Blood God to finish doesn't comsititute a good paint job just because it's Nurgle!

I hope you're not talking about mine there Az....

Thing is, at it's most basic broken down form, that essentially is the scheme on mine, although mine start out with a coat of warboss green (the final main stage after blocking in the colours is to wash the whole model in vallejo smokey ink), though this is a scheme developed over years (this is my fourth DG army, and sixth Nurgle affiliated one as I used to have Nurgle Daemons and LATD) and is quite technical in places.

I see far too many gakky modelling and painting jobs on Nurgle stuff that you simply cannot comment on as this hobby is far too false in places and people cannot take criticism (same goes for Slaanesh too. Slapping a pair of tittays on a DP does not a good conversion make) of their work.

 Captain Joystick wrote:
Y'all have some very interesting theories as to why GW isn't making skimpy models anymore.

A lot of pearl-clutching going on in this thread...

I think it's more likely a design philosophy change because GW doesn't want Slaanesh to be the sex god of their universe. I mean, hedonistic pleasures of the flesh are very Slaanesh, but they clearly don't want that to be the only thing Slaanesh is known for, hence a likely choice to tone down the nipples. At least that would be more logical than it being them caving to moral police in other countries during a time when Kirby was saying "feck the customers, we tell them what to want".

Mortarion is still one of the bestsellers no?

Each to their own. I think they were better in the olden days, mostly because I think they've become more cartoony and less grisly.

If one does not like it, don't buy it. No need to be offended on other's behalf or go on a morality crusade. There is enough of that.

I was a little turned off by the Nurgle look when they first got released, but after painting a squad of Blight Kings for WHQ I love how much you can do with all the details.

 ServiceGames wrote:

 Overread wrote:
These big dudes in shiny armour are protecting all the good people and are going to win the war against all the nasty evil devil monsters!

I mean lets face it that's what is boils down to pretty much. Ok so that's a gross simplification

Yeah, considering there are no "good people" in 40K... at least no good armies, it makes that explanation a little more difficult. Imperium is trying to expand and get all worlds into compliance or kill everyone who doesn't want to be in compliance. Chaos is well... chaos. And, Xenos can range from being very similar to the Imperium (T'au) to being either extremely sadistic torturers (Drukhari) to hyper aggressive, blood hungry insects (Tyranids). So, saying that these big dude sin shiny armor are protecting the good people... not really true on any level in 40K.

SG

IDK if bloodhungry is the right description for tyranids. They're not so much hungry for blood, more hungry for anything even remotely edible. Omni-hungry is probably a better description.

 IronBrand wrote:
IDK if bloodhungry is the right description for tyranids. They're not so much hungry for blood, more hungry for anything even remotely edible. Omni-hungry is probably a better description.

So what you're saying is that the Hive Fleets hit the space bong one too many times and now have a galactic case of the munchies?

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 Captain Joystick wrote:
Y'all have some very interesting theories as to why GW isn't making skimpy models anymore.

A lot of pearl-clutching going on in this thread...

I think it's more likely a design philosophy change because GW doesn't want Slaanesh to be the sex god of their universe. I mean, hedonistic pleasures of the flesh are very Slaanesh, but they clearly don't want that to be the only thing Slaanesh is known for, hence a likely choice to tone down the nipples. At least that would be more logical than it being them caving to moral police in other countries during a time when Kirby was saying "feck the customers, we tell them what to want".

I always think the above image is kinda what GW wants the Chaos gods to ultimately be like (plus that's a nice in-universe hook of how someone could easily get lured in).

Slaanesh is about extremes, it is the pursuit of perfection. There are beautiful examples of this in the Fabius Bile novels, such as a CSM drawing a portrait of one of his slaves on its own flayed skin as a canvas. He is drawing it with char made from the creature's own bones. That, and almost literally everything the Radiant King does in the first novel. He specifically teleports in and waits until the opportune moment to make his entrance as grandiose as possible. Even Bile himself is subtly influenced by Slaanesh in his relentless pursuit of perfection in his New Men.

But no, Slaanesh is all about sex, drugs and sausage rolls.

 Grimtuff wrote:

Spoiler:

I always think the above image is kinda what GW wants the Chaos gods to ultimately be like (plus that's a nice in-universe hook of how someone could easily get lured in).

Slaanesh is about extremes, it is the pursuit of perfection. There are beautiful examples of this in the Fabius Bile novels, such as a CSM drawing a portrait of one of his slaves on its own flayed skin as a canvas. He is drawing it with char made from the creature's own bones. That, and almost literally everything the Radiant King does in the first novel. He specifically teleports in and waits until the opportune moment to make his entrance as grandiose as possible. Even Bile himself is subtly influenced by Slaanesh in his relentless pursuit of perfection in his New Men.

But no, Slaanesh is all about sex, drugs and sausage rolls.

To be fair sausage rolls are delicious. Can't really blame Slaanesh for enjoying them.

 IronBrand wrote:

 Grimtuff wrote:

Spoiler:

I always think the above image is kinda what GW wants the Chaos gods to ultimately be like (plus that's a nice in-universe hook of how someone could easily get lured in).

Slaanesh is about extremes, it is the pursuit of perfection. There are beautiful examples of this in the Fabius Bile novels, such as a CSM drawing a portrait of one of his slaves on its own flayed skin as a canvas. He is drawing it with char made from the creature's own bones. That, and almost literally everything the Radiant King does in the first novel. He specifically teleports in and waits until the opportune moment to make his entrance as grandiose as possible. Even Bile himself is subtly influenced by Slaanesh in his relentless pursuit of perfection in his New Men.

But no, Slaanesh is all about sex, drugs and sausage rolls.

To be fair sausage rolls are delicious. Can't really blame Slaanesh for enjoying them.

Slaanesh is the patron saint of Greggs.

But there, we have another example of Slaaneshi influence (a theme on extremes again), gluttony. Eating so much you're this fat hedonistic chaos worshipper that has beautiful Daemonettes prancing around them (I think I've just described a certain corner of the internet's fantasy there...).

I've only ever seen one fat Slaaneshi mini which was made from a Judge Dredd fatty and it looked great.

 Grimtuff wrote:

Spoiler:

I always think the above image is kinda what GW wants the Chaos gods to ultimately be like (plus that's a nice in-universe hook of how someone could easily get lured in).

Slaanesh is about extremes, it is the pursuit of perfection. There are beautiful examples of this in the Fabius Bile novels, such as a CSM drawing a portrait of one of his slaves on its own flayed skin as a canvas. He is drawing it with char made from the creature's own bones. That, and almost literally everything the Radiant King does in the first novel. He specifically teleports in and waits until the opportune moment to make his entrance as grandiose as possible. Even Bile himself is subtly influenced by Slaanesh in his relentless pursuit of perfection in his New Men.

But no, Slaanesh is all about sex, drugs and sausage rolls.

That's a really cool representation of the pantheon.

Also, nice army pics. That Great Unclean one is awesome.