No more muckin' about - Proppa Ork Tactics Thread [Lists in spoilers or we'll krump ya]

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**BaconCatBug**

PiñaColada wrote:
Wouldn't 5 MANZ and 10 grots work better? Then at least you could sorround the MANZ and grot shield them if the battlewagon blows up

I don't think 5 MANZ has enough punch to be worth it. You might as well just go full WAAC and take 5 grots in an Aux detachment.

**Tibs Ironblood**

BaconCatBug wrote:
PiñaColada wrote:
Wouldn't 5 MANZ and 10 grots work better? Then at least you could sorround the MANZ and grot shield them if the battlewagon blows up
I don't think 5 MANZ has enough punch to be worth it. You might as well just go full WAAC and take 5 grots in an Aux detachment.

Paying a command point and losing a whole detachment allotment for literally 5 grots is hardly WAAC.

**tneva82**

BAN wrote:
Yeh, just feels like it’s gotta be something melee orientated in transports as generally it’s the stratagems that make ork shooting dangerous.
Tankbustas are great but the range is too low to footslog and they get not stratagems in a transport so they become a suicide unit... that’s all well and good but Lootas can sit at the back with a grot screen and have all the stratagems they like

31.5" is short range? Enemy has to deploy pretty much far away to avoid that one.

**Vineheart01**

never unederstood why people think 24" is short.

The deadzone for deployment is 24". This literally means unless theyre opposite ends of the table you can move and hit them. 24" just means you cant shoot across the table, big deal how often do you have NOTHING to shoot in 24" without being on the verge of victory already, or someone is actively avoiding that 24" bubble?

**PiñaColada**

BaconCatBug wrote:
PiñaColada wrote:
Wouldn't 5 MANZ and 10 grots work better? Then at least you could sorround the MANZ and grot shield them if the battlewagon blows up
I don't think 5 MANZ has enough punch to be worth it. You might as well just go full WAAC and take 5 grots in an Aux detachment.

I dunno, 5 double-saw MANZ do some work. Problem is that you can't fit them, 10 grots and the waagh banner all in the same BW. Of course, you could just run a bonebreaka alongside it, since those are seriously good anyways. Considering many people are going to be running 2-3 weirdboys it's pretty likely you have warpath in there as well..

**Javadog**

G00fySmiley wrote:
I disagree about the Boomdakka Snazzwagon I would call it an average unit in the codex.

The native -1 to hit on top of T6, 8 wounds, and a 4+ save make it pretty survivable.

it has a big shoota hitting on 4's, 2d6 grenades ignoring cover on 5'6, a pistol hitting on 4's (nto much but might throw an extra wound on a random unit helping fail a morale) and a 9 shot str 5 ap-2 weapon

it also explodes on a 4+ which can be used to your advantage. charge in deep, make sure its in combat with a few things at least and then explode doing bonus mortal wounds, reroll the explode dice with cp if necessary.

it is not on the same level as the dragsta or scrap jet sure, but its way better than the squiggbuggy and all of the other stuff in the yellow field.

Does the big shoota hit on 4s though? I thought that was just the grot blasta.

**Straight_Memer**

Frowbakk wrote:
Ork Triple Battalion 1999 points, Battle Forged: + 3 CP (-3 CP for Extra Gubbinz) 13 CP left after list construction.

Spoiler:

Bad Moon Battalion (+5 CP)(-1 CP for Warphead) 772 points [Re-roll 1’s in Shooting Phase]

.120 HQ Deffkilla Wartrike (Warlord: Da Best Armor Dere Iz: 4++), Supa Cybork Body: 5+++

. 62 HQ Weirdboy Warhpead w/ Da Jump, Fist of Gork (Buff Da Warlord)

. 75 HQ Big Mek (Index) w/ Choppa, Kustom Force Field [20pts]

. 90 TROOP 3x 10 Grots (Grot Shields for Lootas, expect every single one of them to die in your opponents first turn)

.170 HEAVY 10 Lootas (Turn 1: 1 CP to Mob Up with other Lootas AFTER Finkin Kap deployed to get 6+ CP Farm’n)

.255 HEAVY 15 Lootas

[b]Evil Sunz Battalion[/b] (+5 CP) 907 points [+1” to Charges, +1” to Move (2” iff Speed Freeks)]

. 91 HQ Warboss on Warbike (Index) w/ Big Choppa = Headwoppa’s Killchoppa

.120 HQ Zhadsnark Da Ripper (Forge World) w/ Da Beast: 2x Big Shoota

.215 TROOP 30 Shoota Boyz, Big Choppa Nob, 3x Tankbusta Bombz (Turn 1: Da Jump’d/3CP to Unlimited Greed Tide ‘recycle’ in Turn 2)

.223 TROOP 30 Choppa Boyz, Power Klaw Nob, 3x Tankbusta Bombz (Turn 2: Da Jump’d after Mob Up)

. 75 TROOP 10 Choppa Boyz, Big Choppa Nob, Tankbusta Bomb (Turn 2: 1 CP to Mob Up w/above)

.103 ELITE Painboy on Warbike (Index) w/’Urty Syringe, Power Klaw (1 CP to throw a Medi-Squig at Warlord)

. 40 FAST Deff Kopta w Twin Big Shootas (One to fly ahead with 3 Bikes & a Trike to keep them untargetable)

. 40 FAST Deff Kopta w Twin Big Shootas (Also a good source to buff Mob Up’d Choppa Boyz with Loot It! later in the game)

Blood Axe Battalion (+5 CP)(-1 CP for Warphead) 320 points [Counts as in Cover > 18”, may Shoot OR Charge after Falling Back]

. 62 HQ Weirdboy Warphead w/ Da Jump & Warpath

. 75 HQ Big Mek (Index) w/ Choppa, Kustom Force Field [20pts], Finkin Kap: I’ve Got a Plan, Ladz! (CP Farming on a 6+)

. 90 TROOP 3x 10 Grots (Can’t be used for Grot Shields due to <CLAN> mismatch, therefore Objective Grabbers)

. 93 HEAVY Mek Gunz: 3x Smasha Kannons

The Evil Suns are there to charge, as supported by their Kulture.

The Bad Moons are there to shoot, as supported by their Kulture (I'll need to get a dice-rolling app to be kind to my opponents).

The Blood Axes are there to be sneaky gits. (Tactics ain’t a breath mint, y’all…)

Spoiler:

Everything should be deployed under a KFF's 5++ protection so no need to waste CP on Prepared Positions even if going second. So much better than trying to improve 6+ saves which can still be whittled away by AP.

For the Evil Sunz Battalion: 3 Bikes & a Trike (OK, so he’s a Bad Moon, but still…) should get off a first turn charge on something, Biker Painboy should keep 'em in combat a little longer. 30 Shoota Boyz can get Warpath’d and Da Jump’d into a first turn multi-charge into units weak enough in close combat (Tanks/Artillery/etc.) so a few survive in order to be recycled with 3 CP the next turn where the reappear 'Outflanking' and able to shoot away again. Turn 2 the 10 Choppa Boyz can Mob Up with 30 Choppa Boyz, and get Warpath'd and Da Jump'd into probable charge range of whatever the Bikes & Trike didn't kill and Heroically Intervene into during my opponent's turn.

As for the Bad Moonz, the Big Mek with the KFF is there to hide behind the Choppa Boyz mobs and be untargetable while KFF escorting the Evil Sunz boyz and both Weirdboyz. Good thing KFF's and Psyker shenanigans don't care about <CLAN> mismatches. The Lootas are to find anywhere (preferably in cover) with good lines of fire, Mob Up into a unit of 25 first thing and Dakka ad infinitius, uber alles, ad nauseam.

The Blood Axe Big Mek with the Finkin Kap will cover the Lootas under his KFF umbrella and keep the CP farm going as long as possible. He can also repair the Smasha Guns, and for his graduate studies project in sneaky-gitted-ness; have the Mob Up’d Lootas use Loot It! on a destroyed Smasha Gun, have the Lootas refund the CP for it on a 4+ AND farm the CP on a 6+. Remember the (preferably in cover) from just above? That way the Lootas can get a 4+ regular save to help them stick around even longer once all of those Gretchin have been used up by Grot Shields, so deploy those Smasha Guns nearby.

Extra sneaky git shenanigan-ness: The Deffkilla Wartike can move again at the end of the Shooting Phase (your own, not your opponents… don’t be THAT guy…) with the Stratagem: Drive By Krumpin', but is not allowed to charge. However, as a Character the Defkilla Wartrike may still Heroically Intervene its' way into combat. A loophole in the rules big enough to drive a Defkilla Wartike through, conveniently enough.

Your opponent have an annoying Character buffing nearby units? Consider sniping with Deff Koptas by either moving close enough so that character is the closest target, or by using Ramming Speed and putting some Mortal Wounds on ‘em.

I'm really looking forward to playing Orks.

What’s the point of the blood axes, why not make that battlion mixed so the different units can be used with different strats (such as grots >>> bad moons) otherwise looks pretty good overall, maybe make the killchoppa into the Killa Klaw?

**Dr.Duck**

I get that bone breakers are good but better than Gorknauts in cqc?

How are people running them? I kinda want to run them independently without filling them with stuff but not sure if optimal.

**addnid**

Grimskul wrote:
BaconCatBug wrote:
Meks are cheaper than Kommandos for Brigades and able to hide behind Mek Gunz due to CHARACTER. They can also fix up the Gunz.

Tellyporta has basically made Da Jump redundant. I'd rather a guaranteed placement on Turn 2 after clearing out bubble wrap than risking a whiff on Turn 1 and only being able to charge screens.

I feel like T1 Da Jumps are definitely not a strong tactic anymore due to how exposed they are when they arrive. However, I think it doesn't invalidate T2 usage of Da Jump to supplement the units that you decide to tellyport, for one it doesn't cost CP's, and you still need some form of backfield presence anyways for a lot of objectives (at least in Maelstrom), so keeping a mob of boyz behind to jump T2 isn't terrible.

Da jump is crucial to my freebooters army as my40 shoota boys need to be in range of squishy stuff for that sweet aura. For close combat boyz, only bad players will be bothered by da jump.
Da jump is also the only means of properly playing meganobz I thinks

**Vineheart01**

major difference between a gork and bonebreaka is the strength, which unless youre against T5+ doesnt mean much.
Bonebreaka being S9 means it wounds on 3s against anything that isnt T4, while the Gork can still wound on 2s being S16.

But, were talking WAAAAAY less attacks. Gork has what 5 attacks base? If it uses the S16 profile, 5 attacks hitting on 3s wounding on 2s.
Meanwhile the Bonebreaka (if it charged) gets 7-12 attacks that are hitting on 2s and wounding on 3s. Doesnt have the massive AP or Damage stat, but doesnt really need it either with that number of attacks. Oh and this is for about half the price.

Bonebreaka duo is definitely better at melee than a Gork, but its not a completely better trade. Gork still shoots pretty good.

**Dr.Duck**

Vineheart01 wrote:
major difference between a gork and bonebreaka is the strength, which unless youre against T5+ doesnt mean much.
Bonebreaka being S9 means it wounds on 3s against anything that isnt T4, while the Gork can still wound on 2s being S16.

But, were talking WAAAAAY less attacks. Gork has what 5 attacks base? If it uses the S16 profile, 5 attacks hitting on 3s wounding on 2s.
Meanwhile the Bonebreaka (if it charged) gets 7-12 attacks that are hitting on 2s and wounding on 3s. Doesnt have the massive AP or Damage stat, but doesnt really need it either with that number of attacks. Oh and this is for about half the price.

Bonebreaka duo is definitely better at melee than a Gork, but its not a completely better trade. Gork still shoots pretty good.

Ok I was thinking yall were saying per single model. Ya 2 breakers for a gork is fine. I was confused cuase gork with the other profile gets like 18 attcks at a similar weapon stat line difference being S8 vs S9.

Ya was feeling uncomfortable putting gorks in lists due to it being so expensive and sometimes jsut disappearing the turn it hits the board. Breakers feel a bit better.

**Grotrebel**

Great Job Jidmah, I agree almost a 100% with your rainbow table.
Would only have changed the following:

Wyrdboy: Green - Still awesome, is popping a lot less then with the index boost, on the other side D6 smite got more rare as well. But the cheap costs combined with warphead and the psychic powers really makes up for it.

Painboy: Blue or even turquese - Adds a good potion of durability for your hordes of grotz and boys, and just one or two safed flash gitz, nobs or whatever get his points instantly back; and you can heal those popping warpheads, with strategem even twice or help some warboss or Ghazgkull if things get ugly. He was worth his points every single game for me, yellow is a bit harsh imo.

(Runtherd): Maybe yellow? There are a lot of grots around these days, so i can see his use somewhere. Have to admit i just let my grot die instead of getting him, but i am not spamming them as much as some other lists i`ve seen around.

(Mini Mek) Yellow as well? Cheap slot filler for the brigade or relict bearer (evil sunz), otherwise i use him for camping and backyard screening, if my model count goes low. Maybe not enough for yellow, but I felt is was worth noting.

And, for the remaining stuff:

Buggies: Red - more expensive then koptas, which are also better. Only advantage over the kopta is the additional wound and the vehicle keyword, to trigger "loot it" or the mortal wound charge strategem.

**Pandabeer**

Dr.Duck wrote:
I get that bone breakers are good but better than Gorknauts in cqc?

How are people running them? I kinda want to run them independently without filling them with stuff but not sure if optimal.

He probably means point for point (you can get 2 Bonebreaka's for the price of a single Gorkanaut). Then again, the Gorkanaut as a bunch of guns strapped to it, can fall back + shoot & charge, has 3+ armor instead of 4+ and has +2W.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Vineheart01 wrote:
major difference between a gork and bonebreaka is the strength, which unless youre against T5+ doesnt mean much.
Bonebreaka being S9 means it wounds on 3s against anything that isnt T4, while the Gork can still wound on 2s being S16.

But, were talking WAAAAAY less attacks. Gork has what 5 attacks base? If it uses the S16 profile, 5 attacks hitting on 3s wounding on 2s.
Meanwhile the Bonebreaka (if it charged) gets 7-12 attacks that are hitting on 2s and wounding on 3s. Doesnt have the massive AP or Damage stat, but doesnt really need it either with that number of attacks. Oh and this is for about half the price.

Bonebreaka duo is definitely better at melee than a Gork, but its not a completely better trade. Gork still shoots pretty good.

It's 6A.

**CthuluIsSpy**

You know, I feel really stupid, because I read the deff rolla rule as "add 3 hit rolls" instead of "add 3 to hit rolls"

So I was playing a Battlewagon as if it had 9 attacks at WS5+.
Whoops.
Hearing that it hits on a 2+ makes it feel a lot better.

**JimOnMars**

I'm going to put mini-meks in my smasha/loota blob, next to the 3 mek guns. They are untargetable without first killing all of the lootas, which won't be reduced much until all of the grot screens go.

Since the meks can fix the mek guns, it provides almost Tau-like synergy: The grots shield the lootas, which hide the meks, which fix the smashas, which (on death) arm the lootas.

Annoying little blob, that.

**CthuluIsSpy**

JimOnMars wrote:
I'm going to put mini-meks in my smasha/loota blob, next to the 3 mek guns. They are untargetable without first killing all of the lootas, which won't be reduced much until all of the grot screens go.

Since the meks can fix the mek guns, it provides almost Tau-like synergy: The grots shield the lootas, which hide the meks, which fix the smashas, which (on death) arm the lootas.

Annoying little blob, that.

Cool. Now use that against the Tau, to reenact the War of Dakka.

**greggles**

Bone breakers also hit on 2+ vs the 3+ of the gork. So even though the gork has more attacks (with the second profile), it's hitting less often, and at less str then the bone breakers.

(Mini Mek) Yellow as well? Cheap slot filler for the brigade or relict bearer (evil sunz), otherwise i use him for camping and backyard screening, if my model count goes low. Maybe not enough for yellow, but I felt is was worth noting

I'd move mini mek's to green for death skulls. Give them a kustom mega blasta, and you've got a cheap character, that is objective secured, with triple re-rolls for dishing out the pain. I use mine to work with mek guns and also to move along the grots/boyz mobs on the table to provide ranged anti tank. (Pretty high hit % with death skulls and dakkadakka).

**CthuluIsSpy**

greggles wrote:
Bone breakers also hit on 2+ vs the 3+ of the gork. So even though the gork has more attacks (with the second profile), it's hitting less often, and at less str then the bone breakers.

(Mini Mek) Yellow as well? Cheap slot filler for the brigade or relict bearer (evil sunz), otherwise i use him for camping and backyard screening, if my model count goes low. Maybe not enough for yellow, but I felt is was worth noting

I'd move mini mek's to green for death skulls. Give them a kustom mega blasta, and you've got a cheap character, that is objective secured, with triple re-rolls for dishing out the pain. I use mine to work with mek guns and also to move along the grots/boyz mobs on the table to provide ranged anti tank. (Pretty high hit % with death skulls and dakkadakka).

I don't think you can give mini-mek those. They have kustom mega sluggas anyway.

**Grimskul**

CthuluIsSpy wrote:
greggles wrote:
Bone breakers also hit on 2+ vs the 3+ of the gork. So even though the gork has more attacks (with the second profile), it's hitting less often, and at less str then the bone breakers.

(Mini Mek) Yellow as well? Cheap slot filler for the brigade or relict bearer (evil sunz), otherwise i use him for camping and backyard screening, if my model count goes low. Maybe not enough for yellow, but I felt is was worth noting

I'd move mini mek's to green for death skulls. Give them a kustom mega blasta, and you've got a cheap character, that is objective secured, with triple re-rolls for dishing out the pain. I use mine to work with mek guns and also to move along the grots/boyz mobs on the table to provide ranged anti tank. (Pretty high hit % with death skulls and dakkadakka).

I don't think you can give mini-mek those. They have kustom mega sluggas anyway.

They have access to them through the index.

**greggles**

Aye, it is an index option.

**gungo**

I’m not a fan of lootas but so far thier results should at least move them up to good rankings.

Kommandos with index options should go up one. It’s basically the same as precodex except they got Tankbusta Bombs and +1 to wound and access to kulturs. Dunno maybe they are fine where they are since most stratagems dont synergize w them.

Looks good though.

**Madmacs**

Is there a breakdown of the color codes for good/meh/bad? I may have missed it. Thanks in advance.

**whembly**

greggles wrote:
Bone breakers also hit on 2+ vs the 3+ of the gork. So even though the gork has more attacks (with the second profile), it's hitting less often, and at less str then the bone breakers.

(Mini Mek) Yellow as well? Cheap slot filler for the brigade or relict bearer (evil sunz), otherwise i use him for camping and backyard screening, if my model count goes low. Maybe not enough for yellow, but I felt is was worth noting

I'd move mini mek's to green for death skulls. Give them a kustom mega blasta, and you've got a cheap character, that is objective secured, with triple re-rolls for dishing out the pain. I use mine to work with mek guns and also to move along the grots/boyz mobs on the table to provide ranged anti tank. (Pretty high hit % with death skulls and dakkadakka).

"triple re-rolls"???

What's the 3rd one? Further, I didn't think you could re-roll the re-roll... right? o.O

**Madmacs**

Think he means you can re roll their to hit roll, to wound roll, and their damage roll.

**Rismonite**

gungo wrote:
I’m not a fan of lootas but so far thier results should at least move them up to good rankings.

Kommandos with index options should go up one. It’s basically the same as precodex except they got Tankbusta Bombs and +1 to wound and access to kulturs. Dunno maybe they are fine where they are since most stratagems dont synergize w them.

Looks good though.

Lootas certainly do need a nod as a right proppa place to dump CP. The Bad Moon/Deff Skull/More Dakka! stratagems turn their output up a lot. A unit that can be 48 inches away has an area of influence from a relatively safe spot. Grot Shields keep them safe in a way that was unheard of until the Codex dropped and the Mek Gun rules shenanigans may well show up time and again this edition until it gets errata.

It also makes me wonder, can you deepstrike Lootas and put More Dakka on them and hit on 5's and 6's no matter what? like turn three you are low on CP and need a last ditch effort to take on an enemy that is obscured from the Lootas's LOS so you Jump them to achieve LOS on said enemy unit then enhance them with Moar Dakka to get essentially full BS Lootas on the move?

**whembly**

Madmacs wrote:
Think he means you can re roll their to hit roll, to wound roll, and their damage roll.

Thanks!

Index Meks with KMB as dethskulls seems dope.

**Quackzo**

RE: Da Jump vs Tellyporta
There's some key differences between the two abilities that make them both worth while.

Tellyporta is a bit more clear cut in that you guarantee a turn 2 deep strike with your one or two huge threats. With these threats you will tend to have a pre-game plan for their purpose.

To contrast, Da Jump provides you with a much more flexible manner of deep striking your troops. The fact that it works on T1 is a bonus. The main appeal is that each turn you get to relocate a unit of infantry to where they are needed. You can perform some power plays of T1 bomb of MANz, zapping grots to a neglected objective, or position tankbustas to take down your opponents armour.

I think we'll see Tellyporta used to drop bonebreaka, 'nauts, and MANz to punch holes through our enemies army. Da Jump will be used to either supplement this or provide more strategic relocation of units to gain better control of the board.

**buddha**

New to orks. Kommandos seem great but I'm curious if you need a Nob and if so what kit to give them?

**gungo**

buddha wrote:
New to orks. Kommandos seem great but I'm curious if you need a Nob and if so what kit to give them?

What’s your roll for them in your list?
Are they small MSU for ruin campers
Large assault blob
Extra hidden power klaws

Then do you play in the US, England or Europe that allows index or the few areas that don’t allow index units? Which will limit your options.
If you are in an area where index units are not a problem take the free nob upgrade.
Personally I take mine in 2x 5 man units with a nob with big choppa and 2 free burnas kommandos and a tank bomb kommando, and a regular commando. But there is something to be said about using them in larger units so they can survive overwatch! However I use them to clear ruins as that where they excel. They have better cover saves in terrain and better wound rolls in terrain. They are also good at taking out artillery. Keeping the unit small helps w thier deepstrike placement too. Set up like this they almost always make thier points back. Forgeworld sells an upgrade sprue that you can make a big choppa kommando with.

**Quackzo**

the_scotsman wrote:

Supa Cybork Body: Situational

That situation is: I have a Deffkilla Wartrike and I want him to be more durable. The Supa-Cybork is worth an extra CP to make your Deffkilla somewhat harder to (deff) kill. If you don’t have your heart set on a second relic then you won’t be sad if you throw this on your wartrike. Combines extra nicely with the Bad Moonz warlord trait giving you a surprisingly tanky trike!

I've been experimenting with this relic a fair bit. It also performs great on a Warphead when you don't have access to a Painboy. It's a great way to mitigate the inevitable perils and allows it to live for an extra turn or two before it explodes. Without the Supa Cybork body you would expect the Warphead to explode after 2 perils, with it you would expect 3 perils to kill it.