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They put those ork units in the FW FAQ but they are NOT worth it.
They are really, really overpriced. To the point of even in a casual game you are screwing yourself using one.

 flandarz wrote:



Automatically Appended Next Post:

jseverin wrote:
Playing league games at my LFGS, and bringing a kan wall. Index allowed, so taking a few with KMB's. 12 kans, Bike Mek with KFF, Wartrike with Surly like a Squiggoth. Not meta by any means, but hoping the KFF and fearless keep them around a little longer. Got a Meka-dread with KFF to hopefully draw fire and help shield as well.

Wondering if I should take the toughness 7 wartrike for survivability or the buzzbomb :/.

If you can, add a couple of Dreadz. They're more of a threat (especially if you can manage to get them in charging range), so they'll draw a lot of fire that would have been meant for the Kanz. As for the Trike: you're better off with Supa Cybork than the +1 Toughness, if you want survivability. And if you're close enough to throw the Buzzbomb, you're close enough to hit with all of his guns, which is a much better option.

The Trike also has a 5++ on it, and you already get a 6+++ from Snakebites, so a little better I think. Also, can't throw a Buzzbomb (a grenade) and shoot :(. But it's a league, so I can try both different games . Trike means I have the kult of speed strats as well, so can double move. I'll see if I can fit dreads in my other detachment, though it's a relic sag, some boyz, weirdboy, boss, and a mekadread right now.

For the record, i would throw a buzzbomb over shoot the trikes weapons any day.
It has possibly the worst weapon loadout for its cost in the core codex. Even the Stompa can at least hit/kill something, that trike NEVER kills more than a random infantry for me in shooting.

Well, if you're in grenade range, you're in half-range of everything but the Killa Jet. That's 6 shots with your Twin Boomsticks, hitting on 4+ with S5. Another 3.5 with the Burna profile of the Jets, which automatically hit with S5, AP-1. And 1 S4 shot with your Snagga, that rerolls Wounds. Against T4 Infantry, you should kill at least a handful of them.

Buzzbomb will get you 10.5 autohits with S5 and AP-1, then another 7 autohits against a different unit.

Buzzbomb wins out, but it's also a once per battle item and requires that you got two infantry units placed closely enough together to make it work, whereas Supa Cybork lasts until the Trike finally goes down.

Will say that if you can find a bubble-wrapped character, a Buzzbomb would make for a very effective "snipe" on it.

Up to you which you prefer, but I generally go with more survivability in my Wartrike. Run him up to the front lines and let him draw aggro as the rest of my army pushes forward.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
As an aside, I'd put Surly on an Index Mek, so he can go with your Kanz. Kind of a waste on your Trike, since he's so much faster than the things you'd want Surly for.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
They put those ork units in the FW FAQ but they are NOT worth it.
They are really, really overpriced. To the point of even in a casual game you are screwing yourself using one.

We must be the only faction with overpriced FW models

Fw is full of overpriced models

Which perfectly fine for me, having underpriced and thus mandatory units coming from FW also isn't great.

Oh no a lot of FW is overpriced.
Really the only thing that ISNT overpriced is the Leviathan and the recent releases. The rest are either salvagably priced (gargsquig for example) or just outright terrible for the cost.

FW's current rules werent intended to be permanent, but the guy writing them kinda died. I heard a rumor awhile ago they were starting back up to rewrite rules but i havnt heard anything since so take that rumor with a grain of salt.

MekaDread is alright. Like a cheaper Mork.

Oh yeah spaced that one out. I actually want to get one of those at some point.
No idea which way i'd load it out though. Not that im gonna get one any time soon so lot of time to think about it and if any changes occur.

Interesting thing I hadn't seen mentioned before - using the buzzbomm to snipe characters.

We're sorely lacking in units which can put hits on shielded characters - my best option thus far has been charging with anything that puts mortal wounds when you do so.

Has anyone used the Buzzbomm for sniping before?

Wondering about tellyporting in a transport with a cheap character with the buzzbomm inside (perhaps a morkanaught).

Haven't got the 'dex to hand, but is it feasible (with the extra gubbins strat) to give the buzzbomm to a runtherd or a mekboy? could be a cheap suicide unit. And if you don't want to use the tellyporta for anything else (and have CP spare) you could use a trukk with a mekboy in it, and watch as the opponent either ignores it or puts too much into killing it.

Well, I brought it up like 5 posts above this one, but it's really not a good idea for a number of reasons.

1) You gotta take Snakebitez, which (in my opinion) is the least competitive Kultur we got. A Snakebite Battalion might be cheap enough, however, if you have nothing better to spend the points on.

2) you gotta get to 6" away from your opponent. That means you won't be sniping anything until at least Turn 2, unless your opponent is bringing the character you want to kill to you.

3) it's one time use, so if you whiff the hits, or just fail to kill the character, you don't get a second chance to try again. And a fair number of characters will be able to tank the Buzzbomb anyway.

Honestly, you have better options for your Relic and 1 CP than the Buzzbomb. Like the SSAG, Supa Cybork, Killa Klaw, etc. Even if you're looking to snipe, you'd be better off using an SAG with Deathskullz trait.

 flandarz wrote:
Well, I brought it up like 5 posts above this one

Sorry, should have clarified, that was what made me wonder if it was viable. I'd not heard anyone mention it before, wondered if it was an old discussion or an untapped taktik.

Agree with Flandarz here. The average damage of 3.5 done to a space marine character or eldar psyker with 4++ are not impressive, considering you are trowing away a relic and a character.
If you have character within 6", might as well be a warboss with klaw.

 Jidmah wrote:
Agree with Flandarz here. The average damage of 3.5 done to a space marine character or eldar psyker with 4++ are not impressive, considering you are trowing away a relic and a character.
If you have character within 6", might as well be a warboss with klaw.

Jid and I agree, be afraid. Generally speaking, on those rare occasions when Jid and I agree, it usually means either we are so far off base that we should be institutionalized OR it means its spot on

https://www.reddit.com/r/WarhammerCompetitive/comments/dejz1g/pandas_weekend_rundown_10051006/

Aaaaaaaaand GW fethed up again. Beating Marines is the new game, both IH and Ultramarines seem to be dominating tournaments.

Yeah there was competive tournament here on weekend as well. 24 players, 3 ih, all in top 4. Only ultramarines prevented top3 for all with 2nd place. Not looking good.

Sole ork player was way down. Necron list ended 5th crushing chaos(also way down), being annihilated by ih and then vaporising orks.

edit: 3 iron hand players scored combined 7 20-0 wins. Only reason no more was that 2 of them fought 11-9 between them on final round...

I'm taking pause from competive tournaments before they fix marine supplements. Good thing there are casual tournaments here where players self policy nicely.

 Jidmah wrote:
https://www.reddit.com/r/WarhammerCompetitive/comments/dejz1g/pandas_weekend_rundown_10051006/

Aaaaaaaaand GW fethed up again. Beating Marines is the new game, both IH and Ultramarines seem to be dominating tournaments.

Yeeeep. The writing has been on the wall for a while on this one for me. People on the playtesting team have literally said things like; "is it such a bad thing if Space Marines are OP? They are the protagonists." Also unless things are really broken we won't see any changes in CA this year. Hopefully every other faction gets a buff in CA and SM don't, or SM get a nerf.

IH are our new lords and masters.

So, how do we beat them but still have a list that can function against other lists? Are Traktor Cannons about to make a comeback? Badmoonz Tankbustas?

 An Actual Englishman wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:
https://www.reddit.com/r/WarhammerCompetitive/comments/dejz1g/pandas_weekend_rundown_10051006/

Aaaaaaaaand GW fethed up again. Beating Marines is the new game, both IH and Ultramarines seem to be dominating tournaments.

Yeeeep. The writing has been on the wall for a while on this one for me. People on the playtesting team have literally said things like; "is it such a bad thing if Space Marines are OP? They are the protagonists." Also unless things are really broken we won't see any changes in CA this year. Hopefully every other faction gets a buff in CA and SM don't, or SM get a nerf.

IH are our new lords and masters.

So, how do we beat them but still have a list that can function against other lists? Are Traktor Cannons about to make a comeback? Badmoonz Tankbustas?

We don't see changes to SM in CA anyway. The book is already written. There would not be time to fix anything.

Unless they nerf them in the 2 week faq then either spring faq or emergency out of order errata(which gw have yet to do I think).

And yes it's bad thing if anybody is op. Did playtesters really say so?

Bad moon tank bustas firing twice don't QUITE average IH executioner averaging bit over 14 wounds. But at least you could get 1 dealt with. Also 3 invictors seems to be very likely to be coming up.

 Jidmah wrote:
https://www.reddit.com/r/WarhammerCompetitive/comments/dejz1g/pandas_weekend_rundown_10051006/

Aaaaaaaaand GW fethed up again. Beating Marines is the new game, both IH and Ultramarines seem to be dominating tournaments.

Japp, they just fethed up the game again ✌️
I think Steven's list is gonna be ever more relevant. Or Nick's . Flood the board with boyz or grots, play the mission and hope for the best. But yeah, the people play testing deserve to be bludgeoned after every match untill they fix this gak

So with the create your own approach expanding to include craftworld attributes and kabal obsessions, it seems likely that we would get a custom kulture option. Anyone up for wild speculation on what our choices might be for a custom kulture?

Kustom kulture really doesn't make much sense for orks though, as the clans are pretty much set in stone. There are no successor clans or similar, like there is for Craftworlds or Chapters.

It would make much more sense to have additional traits for splinter groups like Speed Freeks, The Great Waaagh! or Rebel Grots.


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tneva82 wrote:
We don't see changes to SM in CA anyway. The book is already written. There would not be time to fix anything.

Unless they nerf them in the 2 week faq then either spring faq or emergency out of order errata(which gw have yet to do I think).

They are in the same spot we were last year though - Ork codex got released and then the entire game but orks got a point drop. It might not fix them, but it might slightly mitigate some impact.

 Jidmah wrote:
Kustom kulture really doesn't make much sense for orks though, as the clans are pretty much set in stone. There are no successor clans or similar, like there is for Craftworlds or Chapters.

It would make much more sense to have additional traits for splinter groups like Speed Freeks, The Great Waaagh! or Rebel Grots.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

tneva82 wrote:
We don't see changes to SM in CA anyway. The book is already written. There would not be time to fix anything.

Unless they nerf them in the 2 week faq then either spring faq or emergency out of order errata(which gw have yet to do I think).

They are in the same spot we were last year though - Ork codex got released and then the entire game but orks got a point drop. It might not fix them, but it might slightly mitigate some impact.

Gonna agree with Jidmah here, at most we might see some revision to the existing klan kulturs, but its likely more Tribal Kulturs where its a tribe/WAAAGH!/warband mixed with different klans. That or fringe stuff as mentioned like Speed Freeks.

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
So, how do we beat them but still have a list that can function against other lists? Are Traktor Cannons about to make a comeback? Badmoonz Tankbustas?

Invictors and Stormhawks can be shredded by tank bustas, smashas and lootas. But I really don't know how and ork player is supposed to handle three 5++/6+++/Ironstone Repulsor Executioners and/or Leviathans when the scout wall keeps you inside your deployment zone and denies all deep strikes. You can't even tripple gorkanaut that.

They must reduce that dude's Aura and fix his cost of at least 40 points. Double the price of some strat, than we are talking. The immortal Leviathan MUST be fixed asap. For the rest, I guess is all about screening and focusing gunz and SAG on aggressors and HB. No idea what else to do.

***OBS!!!*** Scout warsuits are NOT dreadnought. Do not get fooled . I lost a tournament bc of that BS... Repeat , they are NOT dreadnought***

The leviathan was a problem even before all this stuff popped up. I know of several marine players that even felt like it was over the top.
It simply fires too many powerful shots for its cost. 20 AP2 autocannons with marine shenanigans pretty much means guaranteed 20 hits, maaaybe 1 miss, and most of them wounding. It wasnt THAT big a problem before because leviathans were tanky but not unkillable. Now theyre unkillable for the same price.
GJ GW.

Kustom kulture really doesn't make much sense for orks though, as the clans are pretty much set in stone. There are no successor clans or similar, like there is for Craftworlds or Chapters.

It would make much more sense to have additional traits for splinter groups like Speed Freeks, The Great Waaagh! or Rebel Grots.

I think I remember reading in the fluff that there are other Klanz but they are so small that they never really get noticed.

Regardless, with SM's having to suffer a full year of not being the most OP faction in the game we all knew it was coming, but with sisters coming out soon and how bad most of the ork codex is compared to the current meta, I HOPE, but don't expect, a large points change for orkz. Add into the equation the fact that competitive orkz are probably the hardest hit by the removal of index options from competitive play and you realize we will need a HEAVY buff in order to continue to be competitive at all.

 Jidmah wrote:

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
So, how do we beat them but still have a list that can function against other lists? Are Traktor Cannons about to make a comeback? Badmoonz Tankbustas?

Invictors and Stormhawks can be shredded by tank bustas, smashas and lootas. But I really don't know how and ork player is supposed to handle three 5++/6+++/Ironstone Repulsor Executioners and/or Leviathans when the scout wall keeps you inside your deployment zone and denies all deep strikes. You can't even tripple gorkanaut that.

Not really with lootas. -1 damage makes lootas rather inefficient vs ih vehicles

And I really hope GW finds a way to unfeth the Ork Fast attack slot. I have so many warbikes and deff Koptas waiting for action.

tneva82 wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
So, how do we beat them but still have a list that can function against other lists? Are Traktor Cannons about to make a comeback? Badmoonz Tankbustas?

Invictors and Stormhawks can be shredded by tank bustas, smashas and lootas. But I really don't know how and ork player is supposed to handle three 5++/6+++/Ironstone Repulsor Executioners and/or Leviathans when the scout wall keeps you inside your deployment zone and denies all deep strikes. You can't even tripple gorkanaut that.

Not really with lootas. -1 damage makes lootas rather inefficient vs ih vehicles

The -1 damage is a 3" aura that comes from a relic and thus is very unlikely to affect infiltrating units or fliers. It's mostly used to protect a parking lot somewhere, usually leviathans and repulsor executioners.