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A character is not equal to a UNIT always, at least they are not always interchangeable. A Unit can be made up of characters, but you can't have multiple characters be a single model. So each character exists on their own. The unit differentiates each is a separate character, in a unit. You are not targeting a unit, you are targeting a character. You can target ANY character.

This is RAW.

However, the second character has an ability that basically allows it to become a Ogryn Bodyguard. Which is fine. So the oiler takes the wound. But you cannot tell a Sniper which character he targeted.

I am agreeing with you, but saying for the purposes of the Vindicaire, you can't tell it which CHARACTER it targeted. You can intercept the shot, but you can't change the target. Symantics, but important due to issues with character shielding, which the Vindy is purposely created to over-rule.

Few flaws in that - what you posted isn’t quite RAW.

It’s a unit with the CHARACTER Keyword, whether it’s one modeL or a multi-model unit as is being discussed.

You target units, not models. The owning player gets to allocate wounds within their own units as per the Core Rules.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
A character is not equal to a UNIT always, at least they are not always interchangeable. A Unit can be made up of characters, but you can't have multiple characters be a single model. So each character exists on their own. The unit differentiates each is a separate character, in a unit. You are not targeting a unit, you are targeting a character. You can target ANY character.

This is RAW.

However, the second character has an ability that basically allows it to become a Ogryn Bodyguard. Which is fine. So the oiler takes the wound. But you cannot tell a Sniper which character he targeted.

I am agreeing with you, but saying for the purposes of the Vindicaire, you can't tell it which CHARACTER it targeted. You can intercept the shot, but you can't change the target. Symantics, but important due to issues with character shielding, which the Vindy is purposely created to over-rule.

Oh, please.

Exact rule:

Deadshot: This model can target a CHARACTER even if it is not the closest enemy unit. In addition, each time an unmodified wound roll of 6 is made for an attack with a ranged weapon by this model, the Damage for that attack is D6.

CHARACTER written like that is a keyword. All keywords are linked to datasheets, which always describe units, not models. A single model cannot have the character keyword unless it is represented by a datasheet that has the CHARACTER keyword.
In addition, you must chose units as target in the shooting phase, not models, so the rule allows you to pick a unit as a target which you could otherwise not picked.

So "targeting a CHARACTER" means targeting a unit with the CHARACTER keyword, no matter how many models make up that unit.

 Jidmah wrote:
CHARACTER written like that is a keyword. All keywords are linked to datasheets, which always describe units, not models..

Datasheets can and do give different models in the unit different keywords. For example, the 'Big Mek with Shokk Attack Gun ' datasheet has a line for 'KEYWORDS (BIG MEK)' and a line for 'KEYWORDS (GROT OILER)'

It's still a single datasheet, and therefore a single unit unless bespoke rules say otherwise.

You guys are attacking a point I'm not making. I agree that an assasin can't choose who takes the wound on th Big Mek.

My point was that you cannot choose which model the Assasin targets, as they are both characters. Thus, the assasin could target either one. One has an ability that lets the other take the wounds. Fine. My point is, he could target the Oiler, and it would be impossible for the other player to say, no, the Big Mek takes the wound. Because Character targeting is a character, not A unit.

 Jidmah wrote:
It's still a single datasheet, and therefore a single unit unless bespoke rules say otherwise.

And the part I quoted from your post was incorrect. All keywords are not always linked to the unit presented in the datasheet. Sometimes they're only for specific models.

Deadshot: This model can target a CHARACTER

Target a character means target a unit with the character keyword.

 Ghaz wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:
It's still a single datasheet, and therefore a single unit unless bespoke rules say otherwise.

And the part I quoted from your post was incorrect. All keywords are not always linked to the unit presented in the datasheet. Sometimes they're only for specific models.

A datasheet always represents a unit though. Models inside a unit can have different keywords, but they will always gain those from being part of the unit the datasheet describes, not by being a certain model.

For example, a spanner model may or may not have the LOOTA or BURNA BOYZ keyword, depending on which datasheet is used to represent the unit of that spanner model.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
You guys are attacking a point I'm not making. I agree that an assasin can't choose who takes the wound on th Big Mek.

My point was that you cannot choose which model the Assasin targets, as they are both characters. Thus, the assasin could target either one. One has an ability that lets the other take the wounds. Fine. My point is, he could target the Oiler, and it would be impossible for the other player to say, no, the Big Mek takes the wound. Because Character targeting is a character, not A unit.

Actually, we can. Let's look at the rule again:

"Deadshot: This model can target a CHARACTER even if it is not the closest enemy unit. In addition, each time an unmodified wound roll of 6 is made for an attack with a ranged weapon by this model, the Damage for that attack is D6."

The Deadshot rule itself makes it clear the assassin is targeting a unit.

This really doesn't need to be addressed, right? Can you think of a time when you would choose for the Big Mek to take the shot over the oiler?

Arguing I CAN throw my model into the air and hit it with a baseball bat in order to see if I will use it in the shooting phase isn't addressed in the rules, because they aren't going to assume someone would do that. They assume you prefer to loose the oiler over the Big Mek. Do they really need to write in:

"If you so choose, you can elect to have the sniper target the model with all the abilities and stuff, over the grot oiler"

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
This really doesn't need to be addressed, right? Can you think of a time when you would choose for the Big Mek to take the shot over the oiler?

No, but I can think of plenty of times where the player of the Vindicare would want the Big Mek to take the shot. With you saying you can target ANY character someone would say you could specifically target the Big Mek model, and we're saying that's not possible.

Are people still saying it can’t be the GROT to fake the wound? It’s clear RAW. People are grasping at straws

Pain4Pleasure wrote:
Are people still saying it can’t be the GROT to fake the wound? It’s clear RAW. People are grasping at straws

Haven't you heard? Playing by the rules makes you a bad man!

Does it make sense that the Grot Oiler can, with 100% success rate, block the shot of a Vindicare Assassin? No, but the rules say it can.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
You guys are attacking a point I'm not making. I agree that an assasin can't choose who takes the wound on th Big Mek.

My point was that you cannot choose which model the Assasin targets, as they are both characters. Thus, the assasin could target either one. One has an ability that lets the other take the wounds. Fine. My point is, he could target the Oiler, and it would be impossible for the other player to say, no, the Big Mek takes the wound. Because Character targeting is a character, not A unit.

If they were separate units, sure, but they are a single unit so you can not target an individual model within a unit.

There is no explicit rule that allows you to target a specific model in a unit.

Sniper rule allows you to bypass the character targeting restrictions, nothing more.

Wound allocation is up to the defending player.

The player controlling vindicare assassin cannot delegate which model in a multi-model character unit takes the wound.

 BaconCatBug wrote:

Pain4Pleasure wrote:
Are people still saying it can’t be the GROT to fake the wound? It’s clear RAW. People are grasping at straws

Haven't you heard? Playing by the rules makes you a bad man!

indeed...

It can target characters but it still follows the other rules for shooting sequence.

As such it still picks units to shoot at, it just has a special rule that let's it pick units with the character keyword.

There is no explicit permission for it to target models character keyword or not.