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2019/10/03 20:56:50
Subject: Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
Ymargl will probably be saved for a genestealer reboxing for the GSC. I’m more expecting the pyrovore and/or lictor (because they are EXISTING finecast) to be the models Tyranids get, if any at all. Don’t have much hope for a new Red Terror, and I very much doubt we’ll get returned culled models anytime soon.
It never ends well
2019/10/03 21:03:32
Subject: Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
Expecting a bio/pyrovore dual kit or a Lictor with Deathleaper bits. A reimagined Red Terror closer to Mawloc size would be cool but is more likely dropped.
BlaxicanX wrote: A young business man named Tom Kirby, who was a pupil of mine until he turned greedy, helped the capitalists hunt down and destroy the wargamers. He betrayed and murdered Games Workshop.
2019/10/03 21:14:19
Subject: Re:Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
regarding marines always winning in their boxed sets, I do feel obligated to note that shadowspear saw the marines all die save one who escaped. Although they managed to cripple the deamon forge. Also it sounds like all the space wolves died fofilling their objectives in Tooth and claw. So GW's gotten a liiiitle better in that regard at least
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
2019/10/03 21:45:07
Subject: Re:Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
BrianDavion wrote: regarding marines always winning in their boxed sets, I do feel obligated to note that shadowspear saw the marines all die save one who escaped. Although they managed to cripple the deamon forge. Also it sounds like all the space wolves died fofilling their objectives in Tooth and claw. So GW's gotten a liiiitle better in that regard at least
The noble sacrifice for the greater goal, or to win the day, is a classic trope. They count as heavy losses, but do count as wins.
2019/10/03 21:53:05
Subject: Re:Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
BrianDavion wrote: regarding marines always winning in their boxed sets, I do feel obligated to note that shadowspear saw the marines all die save one who escaped. Although they managed to cripple the deamon forge. Also it sounds like all the space wolves died fofilling their objectives in Tooth and claw. So GW's gotten a liiiitle better in that regard at least
Dude we're not on about the boxed sets, we're on about the campaigns.
2019/10/03 21:57:10
Subject: Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
or make a general discussion thread about it, because at this point, people offering to fight GW for marines existing is derailing pretty much every news/rumor thread.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/10/03 22:04:05
Efficiency is the highest virtue.
2019/10/03 22:06:54
Subject: Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
Personally I'm happy with everything not being equal, it makes things boring. The Greater Daemons, Avatar of Khaine, Ctan they are on Primarch level imo.
The Beast would be Primarch level, Ghaz is Chapter Master level or slightly above.
Nids shouldn't really have anything quite on that level until we start talking about beasties bigger than Hive Tyrants and Carnifexes as they are essentially mass produced bio materials and we're talking about characters fused with the power of God's or at least a portion of that God's power. It's no slight to not be on their level.
If there is to be inequality, it should be completely against the Imperium. That's kinda the whole point of the 40k setting - humanity is well and truly fethed.
Either way - it's not about what happens in the black library collection (because we know that any named marine will beat anything else), it's about their relevance in the faction. The "main" character of the faction should absolutely be Primarch level, if not in terms of fighting ability then in terms of tactical prowess and accolades.
Take the Swarmlord. This monstrosity is supposed to be the pinnacle of designed evolution and contains all the knowledge of an entity that is potentially older than anything else in existence. If it fights with something and loses, it comes back with all the memories of its past loss and integrates those memories into its tactics. It constantly learns and constantly adapts. It does not stop until it has killed everything it needs to kill, then it is reborn wherever the hive mind needs it to do the same thing again. This thing, in all honesty, should be far superior to any Primarch. It lost to bloody Marneus "number 2, gauntlets of chumptramar" Calgar of all things. A man born to be number 2. Beat an entity that has existed for presumably millennia in a constant state of bloodshed and battle, that cannot be killed permanently and learns from every loss. How does this make sense?
How pathetic would the Swarmlord be if it fought against Guilliman? Would it even be a fight? How about Primarchs that are greater fighters than Guilliman? There's enough of them. Frankly it'd be embarrassing, one can assume. Perhaps so embarrassing that the Hive Mind would recoil in shock and implode upon itself, thus killing all of the Tyranid Swarms instands
Now I'm not a Nid player, I have no vested interest in this, but doesn't it seem a bit freaking stupid that the pinnacle of all the Tyranids are about, the creature that epitomises the entire faction, is beaten by a bloody number 2 chump?! Well it does to me.
The same should be true of any character that fulfils this role for their faction, we know each has one - Ghazzy for Orks, Eldrad for Eldar, Vect for DE, Farsight for Tau, Cawl for Admech, Yarrick for IG etc etc
Just my thoughts anyways.
Norn Queen
Dominatrix
Might bring back the Doom of Malantai
All 3 of these have heavy Pyschic Powers and would fit the narrative well. ALso, Tyranids are the only faction without a non FW lord of war. Could be nice to get one of these as a LoW.
Or bring back Parasite of Mortex
Ygmarl broods could come back as well.
Or...maybe they could actually use some creativity and just make a new unit/model. Gasp.
Drukhari don't have any LoW units at all.
2019/10/03 22:34:11
Subject: Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
To be honest , loyalist primarchs aren't at primarch level anymore.
Chaos Primarchs are more powerfull in 40k than in 30k, they are all ascended demon primarchs now.
But Guilliman is weaker than his 30k counterpat. Ok, he has the Emperor's Sword, but at the same time he has died, been resurrected, and now is inside a life-support armor. And that doesn't make him useless, but hes something like Darth Vader, hes still very powerfull but not what he had been or could had been.
Dakka does have White Knights and is also rather infamous for it's Black Knights. A new edition brings out the passionate and not all of them are good at expressing themselves in written form. There have been plenty of hysterical responses from both sides so far. So we descend into pointless bickering with neither side listening to each other. So posting here becomes more masturbation than conversation.
ERJAK wrote: Forcing a 40k player to keep playing 7th is basically a hate crime.
2019/10/03 22:41:15
Subject: Re:Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
BrianDavion wrote: regarding marines always winning in their boxed sets, I do feel obligated to note that shadowspear saw the marines all die save one who escaped. Although they managed to cripple the deamon forge. Also it sounds like all the space wolves died fofilling their objectives in Tooth and claw. So GW's gotten a liiiitle better in that regard at least
Dude we're not on about the boxed sets, we're on about the campaigns.
Didn't the Blood Angels Loose shield of Bhaal?
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
2019/10/04 03:48:09
Subject: Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
My main concern for Psychic Awakening is that we're going to get more stalemate situations like Vigilus.
"Oh snap, Abaddon and Calgar are finally facing off! It's the fight of a lifetime, you don't want to miss it! Anything could happen when these two legends take the field!"
Actually Abaddon had Calgar's balls in a blender and forgot to turn the blender on. Yep. This is the guy that's supposed to be the biggest bad of the 40k universe. One bullet, one slash of a claw, that would have ended Calgar forever. Would have taken him one extra millisecond. Nope, stalemate. A draw. Everyone goes back to their ships and then leaves and Vigilus might as well not exist from here on out.
2019/10/04 04:10:28
Subject: Re:Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
But Guilliman is weaker than his 30k counterpat. Ok, he has the Emperor's Sword, but at the same time he has died, been resurrected, and now is inside a life-support armor. And that doesn't make him useless, but hes something like Darth Vader, hes still very powerfull but not what he had been or could had been.
Except didn't the more recent fluff say he was fully healed and didn't need the armor anymore?
"Oh snap, Abaddon and Calgar are finally facing off! It's the fight of a lifetime, you don't want to miss it! Anything could happen when these two legends take the field!"
Actually Abaddon had Calgar's balls in a blender and forgot to turn the blender on. Yep. This is the guy that's supposed to be the biggest bad of the 40k universe. One bullet, one slash of a claw, that would have ended Calgar forever. Would have taken him one extra millisecond. Nope, stalemate. A draw. Everyone goes back to their ships and then leaves and Vigilus might as well not exist from here on out.
It is Abaddon, he only ever gets to fail.
2019/10/04 06:32:50
Subject: Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
drbored wrote: Actually Abaddon had Calgar's balls in a blender and forgot to turn the blender on. Yep. This is the guy that's supposed to be the biggest bad of the 40k universe. One bullet, one slash of a claw, that would have ended Calgar forever. Would have taken him one extra millisecond. Nope, stalemate. A draw. Everyone goes back to their ships and then leaves and Vigilus might as well not exist from here on out.
But then what would they do with my half brother's shiny new Primaris mini?
If we don't get a new Dante/Mephiston/Corbulo, maybe they'll die only to be replaced by... I dunno... a resurrected (Primaris) Captain Tycho!
drbored wrote: Actually Abaddon had Calgar's balls in a blender and forgot to turn the blender on. Yep. This is the guy that's supposed to be the biggest bad of the 40k universe. One bullet, one slash of a claw, that would have ended Calgar forever. Would have taken him one extra millisecond. Nope, stalemate. A draw. Everyone goes back to their ships and then leaves and Vigilus might as well not exist from here on out.
But then what would they do with my half brother's shiny new Primaris mini?
If we don't get a new Dante/Mephiston/Corbulo, maybe they'll die only to be replaced by... I dunno... a resurrected (Primaris) Captain Tycho!
I hope Tycho stays dead. He died in Armageddon 3. It has been a few centuries since then. I hope Primaris can't resurrect that.
2019/10/04 07:17:35
Subject: Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
drbored wrote: Actually Abaddon had Calgar's balls in a blender and forgot to turn the blender on. Yep. This is the guy that's supposed to be the biggest bad of the 40k universe. One bullet, one slash of a claw, that would have ended Calgar forever. Would have taken him one extra millisecond. Nope, stalemate. A draw. Everyone goes back to their ships and then leaves and Vigilus might as well not exist from here on out.
But then what would they do with my half brother's shiny new Primaris mini?
If we don't get a new Dante/Mephiston/Corbulo, maybe they'll die only to be replaced by... I dunno... a resurrected (Primaris) Captain Tycho!
It does mention that Calgars wounds healed but he wasn't fit to return to field duties, so don't be shocked if his next mini is a dread.
2019/10/04 07:34:13
Subject: Re:Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
BrianDavion wrote: regarding marines always winning in their boxed sets, I do feel obligated to note that shadowspear saw the marines all die save one who escaped. Although they managed to cripple the deamon forge. Also it sounds like all the space wolves died fofilling their objectives in Tooth and claw. So GW's gotten a liiiitle better in that regard at least
Dude we're not on about the boxed sets, we're on about the campaigns.
Didn't the Blood Angels Loose shield of Bhaal?
Nah, specifically they cite it as yet another one of those 'we won, but at what cost' moments and it's called a pyrrhic victory for the Blood Angels.
Also Shadowspear still sees the Marines win. It literally says they won the battle, but at great cost. Same for Tooth and Claw. The Vigilus Campaign book still says they win. Again. At great cost, sure, but there isn't a narrative event in 40k's history that isn't 'at great cost'. The term is meaningless in 40k cause it gets strapped on to every single battle and has no actual impact on the setting. Why not let someone other than the Marines win the Starter Box story event for a change? Orks and Eldar have been kicking around for decades and not managed to win a single one!
Doesn't seem like Phoenix Rising is gonna be providing any LoW for the Deldar though, pretty sure Drazhar+Incubi is all we're gonna see for Spiky Elves. They haven't actually shown off the Incubi kit though so I'm desperately hoping that at least the Incubi main kit will get something new or different! Not just literally be the exact same unit but in plastic with no rule changes or equipment changes.
2019/10/04 07:38:20
Subject: Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
Somehow the Marines will still win, albeit at great cost.
fething marines, especially the red ones, allways stealing your gak or kicking your teeth in.I tell you!
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
2019/10/04 08:26:39
Subject: Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
Somehow the Marines will still win, albeit at great cost.
It's especially handy to cull the old marines, between the casualties and the rubicon, and the infinite generation of primaris from Cawl (seriously this guy had what ? more marines than a space marine legion in his secret closet ? ). Great cost doesn't seem that grim.
2019/10/04 10:42:01
Subject: Re:Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
BrianDavion wrote: regarding marines always winning in their boxed sets, I do feel obligated to note that shadowspear saw the marines all die save one who escaped. Although they managed to cripple the deamon forge. Also it sounds like all the space wolves died fofilling their objectives in Tooth and claw. So GW's gotten a liiiitle better in that regard at least
Dude we're not on about the boxed sets, we're on about the campaigns.
Didn't the Blood Angels Loose shield of Bhaal?
The Imperial Guard had lost before the Blood Angels ever turned up, then the Necrons blew up the whole system.
2019/10/04 12:12:50
Subject: Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
Stormonu wrote: Has no one considered the BA vs. ‘Nids will be a “back in time” book instead of a rematch?
BA didnt have primaris "back in time", so no, they will not touch that subject.
There is no way to make sense of a BA vs. Nids setup.
Also that won't give us resolutions or progression to any plot points - something GW have said these campaigns will give us so it's even less likely.
Honestly, its hard to use Tyranids in any kind of deeper plot or narrative. The recent run in with BA is a good example of how horrible the tyranids are for an overall narrative.
What could possibly make for a good tyranid plot in a larger campaign?
Part of the problem is that the official fluff for the Tyranids sucks. If they were extra-galactic predators, enslavers, and flesh-crafters like they were in Rogue Trader they could have character and motivations and so on.
2019/10/04 12:59:11
Subject: Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
Stormonu wrote: Has no one considered the BA vs. ‘Nids will be a “back in time” book instead of a rematch?
BA didnt have primaris "back in time", so no, they will not touch that subject.
There is no way to make sense of a BA vs. Nids setup.
Also that won't give us resolutions or progression to any plot points - something GW have said these campaigns will give us so it's even less likely.
Honestly, its hard to use Tyranids in any kind of deeper plot or narrative. The recent run in with BA is a good example of how horrible the tyranids are for an overall narrative.
What could possibly make for a good tyranid plot in a larger campaign?
Hive Fleet Tiamet would be an interesting plot in a campaign.
'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'
- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
2019/10/04 13:03:33
Subject: Re:Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
BrianDavion wrote: regarding marines always winning in their boxed sets, I do feel obligated to note that shadowspear saw the marines all die save one who escaped. Although they managed to cripple the deamon forge. Also it sounds like all the space wolves died fofilling their objectives in Tooth and claw. So GW's gotten a liiiitle better in that regard at least
Dude we're not on about the boxed sets, we're on about the campaigns.
Didn't the Blood Angels Loose shield of Bhaal?
The Imperial Guard had lost before the Blood Angels ever turned up, then the Necrons blew up the whole system.
Sisters of Battle were there too - loads of cool pics, stories etc - guess which Sub-sub faction got all the rules....
I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
Stormonu wrote: Has no one considered the BA vs. ‘Nids will be a “back in time” book instead of a rematch?
BA didnt have primaris "back in time", so no, they will not touch that subject.
There is no way to make sense of a BA vs. Nids setup.
Also that won't give us resolutions or progression to any plot points - something GW have said these campaigns will give us so it's even less likely.
Honestly, its hard to use Tyranids in any kind of deeper plot or narrative. The recent run in with BA is a good example of how horrible the tyranids are for an overall narrative.
What could possibly make for a good tyranid plot in a larger campaign?
Hive Fleet Tiamet would be an interesting plot in a campaign.
Yeah. I think Tyranids would be a great plot point for a campaign. The problem is the writers. Think of the Tyranids like the Joker, "some men just want to watch the world burn". In this case its the galaxy. A foe with no motivation other than pure, total destruction. They could have a lot of stuff happen with nids that could do any of the following:
1.) Multiple hive fleets attack from several points along the galaxy (rather than a single)
2.) all the Hive fleets so far have been splinter fleets for the main actual tyranid force, and have a full scale invasion that drives all the way to Terra
3.) Force unlikely allies to join up (Imperium, Eldar, Tau) for the survival of all. Hard to see if Drukhari, Orks would be so willing, but maybe... Chaos definitely not.
4.) Tie in the Necrons (Old Gods/C'tans) fall with the Tryanids; thus this is why they became non edible machines and chose to go dormant and hide underground to live and fight again another day. Perhaps have the Necrons/C'tan "join" the Imperium to fight this great invasion which was foreseen.
5.) A MASSIVE Shadow in the Warp that severs the Emperors Psykic connection affecting the entire Imperium. Not a complete "off" but more like a sputtering effect, where he is constantly fighting it.
6.) Tyranids invade the Eye of Terror (chaos tyranid biomorphs).
7.) Tyranids integrate Primaris Gene Seed into new Biomorphs.
8.) The Imperium sends extra Galactic scouts/strike forces to scout out more about the Tyranids.
9.) Have it end with a Battle of Wills where the Eldar and Emperor (and other Pyskers) have to mind meld to attempt a "Sundering" of the Shadow of the Warp to cut of the Hive Minds ability to control the swarm. This works, but creates a massive Psychic backlash that kills millions of pyskers (maybe a main character), opens new portals/gateways around the galaxy that spawns more daemons. Think, mini "eye of terror" black holes popping up all across the galaxy.
10.) After the Sundering you now have pockets of all factions who were temporary allies spread all across the galaxy. The imperium is pockets of systems without a strong connection and a new "Great Crusade" to Re-unify the Imperium.
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Dynas wrote: Yeah. I think Tyranids would be a great plot point for a campaign. The problem is the writers. Think of the Tyranids like the Joker, "some men just want to watch the world burn". In this case its the galaxy. A foe with no motivation other than pure, total destruction.
I would tend to think of the Tyranid as Hobbesian "State of Nature" nightmares. That is, the terrifying state of "naturalistic" intentionality, bent on sole survival. I wouldn't, personally, give the Hive Mind a sociopathic bent, because, well, I wouldn't really care to either anthropomorphic something so "alien" but also, not dilute the naturalistic biological "evolutionary" horror of it. But that is me personally. I don't see Tyraids as "destruction" rather, another force of "differential" Order, one of less of a less human seeming "intentionality" and more of brute, evolutionary, biological determinism. That is, "survival of the fittest," taken it a nightmarish, brutal, extreme.
In that sense, well, they would be, to me, distinctly at odds with every other faction and I'd be OK with that. Then again, I am not a Tyranid player though.
"Wir sehen hiermit wieder die Sprache als das Dasein des Geistes." - The Phenomenology of Spirit
2019/10/04 13:59:18
Subject: Psychic Awakening N&R - rough new info re contents of books p40
The ultimate problem with tyranids is that they cannot win. As in, if the writers acknowledge their victories, they will also have to acknowledge the fact that they cannot be stopped at that point with conventional means, because every time they win, they essentially regenerate their numbers and grow more troops, while every other faction loses troops, and cannot replace those losses as quickly.
So instead we have the tyranids be punching bags, which robs them, or any xenos, of any menace.
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3500+ IK Plus 1x Warhound, Reaver, Warlord Titans
